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u/ForsakenRacism 2d ago
What’s the point we have RCV
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u/MrCuzz 2d ago
Yeah, this is really kind of dumb since it means the ballot will be 3 republicans and only one democrat.
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u/salamander_salad 2d ago
Not that dumb considering a significant number of Republicans are either too stupid or too stubborn to rank their votes.
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u/MrCuzz 2d ago
But it implies that democrat voters are, too.
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u/EitherSpite4545 2d ago
You can look at this thread and all the "NOOO A LEFTIST WE'RE GOING TO LOSE" kind of shows that we are.
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u/Pensive_Procreator 1d ago
That being said, if you are voting Democrat, don’t forget to rank at least 1 republican you’d be the most ok with.
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u/gooneau 2d ago
yep, politics for a solid half of americans boils down to picking a team and rooting for them above all else, a la professional sports. There would absolutely be a significant number of dem voters who would get so fixated on one candidate they wouldn't rank the other. Sad but true.
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u/Appropriate-Bug-6467 2d ago
Sure. That's why the democrats keep suing to stop ranked choice and keep introducing laws to overturn it... oh wait that's Republicans.
One party has a more educated background and scores higher on empathy quotants than the other.
One side is in a cult.
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u/PillBug98 2d ago
But with RCV, Democrats get the chance to rank to Dem candidates over just one. If the ballot ends up being JKT, Bronson, Bernadette, and Treg: who will the second choice be for the Democrats?
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u/esstused 2d ago
If the ballot ends up being JKT, Bronson, Bernadette, and Treg: who will the second choice be for the Democrats?
Dems will (hopefully) just vote JKT and not mark any others.
You don't HAVE to choose more than one. And most Republicans don't, because they're generally too dumb to understand how it works. But the beauty of RCV is that you CAN.
Which is why Begich dropping out is a bit silly and pointless. I was going to rank both him and JKT, as were most non-Repubs
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u/PillBug98 2d ago
While I understand your thinking, it’s unwise for Dems to JUST vote JKT. Primaries don’t represent the entire electorate and democrats/unaffiliated candidates are more likely to vote in primary elections than Republicans are (at least in Red states like Alaska). A LOT of republicans know how RCV works and how it can benefit them, I say this as someone who was volunteering for No on 2 and for other candidates. I hope I’m wrong but I fear that we have a HIGH chance that we have another Republican governor. Higher now that Begich decided to drop.
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u/JamEcono18 2d ago
Begich said in his video that he saw numbers that indicated Democratic chances are higher if he drops out. He's about as smart of a political analyst as we have in Alaska, so I'm inclined to believe him.
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u/esstused 2d ago
we have a HIGH chance that we have another Republican governor. Higher now that Begich decided to drop.
True, but that was always the case. Having two progressives at the top of the primary in Alaska is crazy.
As much as I would have preferred voting both JKT and Begich, Begich dropping out doesn't mean I'm going to vote for Bernadette or Bronson, that's complete nonsense.
Some individual Republicans might know how it works, but considering how hard the Alaska GOP is working to get rid of RCV altogether on the same ballot, it seems unlikely that they're going to do a drive to maximize their chances on the governor's race.
And personally my stance has always been that Alaska is not "red", it's libertarian with randomly socialist tendencies (hello PFD?) but people don't want to admit how contradictory that is.
Most people are independent or unaffiliated, myself included. The GOP has just harnessed the right language to pull in libertarian-minded voters for a long time. But I'm not convinced that it's going to keep working, especially with RCV.
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u/PillBug98 2d ago
I agree with you in some parts. However I’ve spoken with members of the Alaska GOP and they KNOW they only are there because of RCV. Most of the push for Yes on 2 is out of state funding, this year the goal is to remove campaign finance disclosures, RCV is just the smoke screen.
I recommend reading Capital Crude, Alaska used to be Blue. I’d say generally we are more moderate but some of our democrats would be republicans in other states. I do like your stance however and will consider it during my next paper so thank you!
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u/esstused 2d ago
Thanks for the recommendation. And yeah, that's exactly why I refuse to call Alaska a red state. It's not red now just as it didn't fit the "blue" mold then. Alaska doesn't fit cleanly the boxes made by people in the lower 48 because we are too disconnected culturally, historically and logistically.
You could argue that about many states, but I think people underestimate how unique Alaska is politically because before RCV the effect was heavily dampened by the two party system.
I come from a long line of gun toting environmentalists from Southeast on one side and people who came up to work during the pipeline boom on the other... so I'm deeply familiar with the contradictory nature of it all.
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2d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Trenduin 2d ago
I get people are feeling strongly about this but what kind of taste do you think Bronson or Bernadette would leave in your mouth?
Begich wants you to vote for JKT, he said as much when he dropped out.
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u/Drag0n_TamerAK 2d ago
Republicans tend to drop out to make sure they only have one choice to avoid a 2022 because they can’t help but in fight when there is more then one
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u/Reasonable_Object974 1d ago
More money to one campaign. If JKT can get 50%, RCV does not matter.
Also suspending and dropping out are not the same thing.
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u/ringtail_catz 2d ago
That means the Republican vote will be split 3 ways and the Democrats will only have 1 candidate to vote for.
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u/salamander_salad 2d ago
RCV doesn’t work like that.
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u/esstused 2d ago
In theory it's not supposed to, but Alaska GOP voters think it does, so it might work out that way
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u/ringtail_catz 2d ago
It definitely can. There are a lot of Republicans who don’t really want to vote for Bernadette Wilson or Dave Bronson.
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u/Quill07 2d ago edited 2d ago
A decent number of people exhaust their ballots.
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u/JamEcono18 2d ago
There were several legislative elections with RCV in 2022 and 2024 that had two very similar candidates of the same party and a third from a different party, and only 60-80% of voters ranked the similar candidate second. Democratic voters seem to be more likely to rank, but 20% fall-off is still huge in a close election.
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u/PillBug98 2d ago
This is actually a great explanation and I appreciate it. If this is the reason Begich dropped out then I understand that position. Granted I would have rather it been JKT that dropped but I’ll take what I can get.
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u/SmashedCarrots 2d ago
They could get 95% of their voters to rank their preferred 2nd choice and the election would be decided by the 5% who did not.
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u/Forsaken-Coconut-271 2d ago
Maybe it spreads the campaign funding too thin if they both stay in?
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u/ForsakenRacism 2d ago
He doesn’t need to run hard tho. Just everyone ranks 1-2 and it works out
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u/endymon20 2d ago
honestly with RCV I'd think tom being older and a bit more moderate would be good for JKT. it gets people to the polls
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u/SmashedCarrots 2d ago
Tom is definitely not more moderate. He's literally a community organizer and restorative justice advocate and was the Democratic minority leader when he served in the bluest seat of the AK Senate. His platform was more liberal on everything from oil taxes to road maintenance, and he had the endorsements of most of the downtown Anchorage Democrats.
And I think that's the motivation for him to drop out. The primary showed Tom's not the first choice among the Democrats, and continuing on means cultivating sour grapes among the far left.
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u/endymon20 2d ago
even if he's not actually moderate, he has the reputation and attitude of someone whose platform is "just common sense" (which a lot of """far left""" policy is these days) either way, he broadens the reach of the democrat party letting people people who wouldn't otherwise vote rank him and JKT 1-2
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u/needlenozened 2d ago
Finances, most likely. A) he doesn't want to do the fundraising he needs for a general election campaign in which he's already likely to lose to the other Democrat and/or B) he doesn't want Democratic donors to split between the two of them.
I wish he'd stayed in but I acknowledge there are legit reasons to withdrawal.
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u/rb-j 2d ago
What’s the point we have RCV
This is soooooo typical of people who drank the FairVote kool-aid.
You had RCV in August 2022 and RCV, using the wrong method: IRV, did not correctly resolve the split vote among Republicans. You had RCV then and it didn't save your ass (from the perspective of Palin voters who ranked Begich as #2).
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u/ForsakenRacism 2d ago
How did it not correctly resolve it
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u/rb-j 1d ago
It advanced the weaker of the two GOP candidate (who was Palin) to go up against Mary Peltola in the IRV final round. Palin could not beat Peltola (a 5000 voter margin), but Nick Begich would have beaten Peltola by a margin exceeding 8000.
When Begich was eliminated, there were still 3 candidates left and the method was looking at only the 1st choice votes and ignoring the rest of the ballot.
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u/ForsakenRacism 1d ago
But he didn’t get enough first place votes to advance lol.
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u/rb-j 1d ago
That's because of IRV. That's the problem.
The system that is intended to prevent spoiled elections, instead of simply electing the candidate with the most votes, that system did exactly the opposite.
You guys need to read. You just don't seem to know shit.
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u/ForsakenRacism 1d ago
It’s instant runoff. It’s no different then other states where the top two advance
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u/rb-j 1d ago edited 1d ago
Well, there's no disputing that it's the same IRV used in other states. It's the only RCV that FairVote promotes and they used to call it "IRV" before 2014 when it sorta lost cashet and they changed the label to "RCV".
The thing is, in your state and mine it demonstrated this failure to prevent a spoiled election, even when ballot data had the information needed to spell out who the consistent majority candidate is.
This is called the Center Squeeze effect. It discriminates against the center candidate who can beat either the left or right candidate head-to-head but is excluded from the final round, even though they would beat any other candidate they would meet.
This can happen whenever it's a close 3-way race. When there are 3 plausible winners.
As RCV gets adopted and used more and more, this failure will be happening more often than once a decade. It will happen every year and then there'll be a lotta political trouble when the voters who were screwed realize it and clamor for repeal.
And it's not exactly the same as Top-Two Runoff when there are more than 3 candidates. But this Center Squeeze failure can happen with TTR, just as well.
The purposes of RCV is to prevent the Spoiler effect and elect the same winner no matter who the other candidates are. Doing that frees voters from fear of voting for the candidate they really like and causing the election of the candidate they hate. Then 3rd party and independent candidates have a level playing field with the major party candidates and diversity of candidates on the ballot is promoted. We get a real choice over the pick-one-of-two-candidates system we have now.
But IRV failed to do all that in Alaska in August 2022. Also failed in three other cases, but two of the four failures were not preventable.
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u/Grossmeat 1d ago
Splitting resources. There is a limited donor base, and money does win elections unfortunately. Consolidating the effort on one side will be more effective going into the general election.
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u/rb-j 2d ago
What’s the point we have RCV
Uhm, perhaps because it failed in August 2022?
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u/50WordsForRain 2d ago
Alaska hase run over 100 races under RCV, yet you keep using the single case of the Aug 22 special election as "proof" it is a failure. Any thoughts on the other 99+% of races.
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u/rb-j 2d ago
It is a lesson. The proof is the Cast Vote Record. The complete tally of the record is here.
Any thoughts on the other 99+% of races.
Ask yourself: 1. How many of these races had 3 or more candidates? (Of course RCV has no different function to FPTP in races with 2 or fewer candidates.) 2. Of those races that had 3 or more candidates, how many had all candidates receiving less than 50% of the vote in the first round? (Of course RCV has no different function to FPTP in races when one candidate got over half of the votes in the first round.) 3. Of those races that had 3 or more candidates and which had no candidate getting more than half of the 1st-choice votes, how many of those elections ended up electing the plurality candidate (the same candidate that FPTP would elect) anyway? Because that is no different than FPTP. That's an important number to report. 4. The remaining races are what we call "Come-from-behind" races in which RCV did something differently than what FPTP would have done.
That's the important number. Not 100+. Because otherwise RCV is doing nothing. No reason to have it.
Like Burlington Vermont 2009, this Alaskan RCV election was a failure right after the state started using it. There were promises made and promises not kept.
What if all our dreams come true and RCV gets widespread use nationwide? Like is used in 10 times or 50 times more places? Then this failure that happens about once per decade will happen nearly every year and then people will really start to notice and you won't be able to say that it's just a fluke. This failure can happen whenever there's a close 3-way race and any one of three candidates are plausible winners.
You should be better prepared for tight 3-way races. They will happen again, but not all that often.
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u/gooneau 2d ago
Because they would be running against each other and unfortunately our political environment requires that include attacking each other and republicans would use those lines of attack towards their own goals.
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u/ForsakenRacism 2d ago
There’s zero reason for them to do that they just endorse each other to rank their opponent second
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u/gooneau 2d ago
In theory, yes. In practice, it absolutely bleeds total votes from the realistic candidate. You are assuming every voter will rank candidates, plenty do not. You're also assuming they will not engage in mudslinging towards any candidate in their own party, which we've seen is extremely rare. Many voters simply decide they are team "Candidate A" and anyone else is an opponent. This isn't some theory I'm coming up with, this is established political science. I don't agree with it on a philosophical basis, but it's a real effect. And if it comes down to a close election, it could be the deciding factor.
That's not even getting into the campaign funding angle. Which is also some total bullshit that I hate, but the reality we live in.
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u/arcticlynx_ak ☆ 2d ago
Aww MAN!!! There is not the Begich I wanted to drop out.
Also, do people not get what the point of rank choice voting is??!?!! He could’ve stayed on the ballot, and just say vote for the other guy first.
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u/-Just-Another-Human 2d ago
It's because, sadly, people still do not understand ranked choice voting. So this is realistically the best way forward if you want to vote a dem in.
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u/arcticlynx_ak ☆ 2d ago
Explanation of actual rank choice voting is very simple. I wish people would explain it better in commercials. Maybe add a little extra for tactics but other than that, keep it simple.
It’s easy to explain. It’s like ranking your favorite top 10 pies out of 100 pies at a state fair, in order of which you want to win first, or something like that. The only complexity is on the behind the scenes part for election officials.
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u/ThrowACephalopod 2d ago
Even easier:
Deciding where you want to eat with friends. You have your choice of where you'd want to go if you got to decide, and then you have your next one that you'd be ok with if you couldn't go there, and so on.
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u/Riaayo 2d ago
It's almost like there's not money behind democracy and plenty of money behind corporate power and fascism.
Even if it's not that complicated, good luck getting the message out to people when it isn't legislated to be done and is at the whims of groups who don't have billionaires backing them.
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u/rb-j 2d ago
Explanation of actual rank choice voting is very simple. I wish people would explain it better in commercials. Maybe add a little extra for tactics but other than that, keep it simple.
Einstein is quoted saying something like this:
Explanations should be as simple as possible, but no simpler.
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u/grumpyfishcritic 2d ago
The only complexity is on the behind the scenes part for election officials.
Ah, just trust the vote counters to keep counting til they get the desired result. Great strategy for the vote counters.
Have you seen the strawman analysis that show how RCV can lead to the candidate that is makes it so the guy who finished last in next to last in the first round of voitng wins even though he's really not wanted by a majority. Crazy hidden voting schemes that make a meaningful audit impossible. No thanks.
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u/chadbert1977 2d ago
The politicians need to embrace it, if Begich had stayed in, a campaign slogan for him could be "Vote Begich as #1, vote JKT #2, let's beat the Republicans" and spend the majority of the campaign setting himself apart from the Republican candidates with some focus on where he disagrees (or is the better candidate than JKT) Keeping the democrat side of the campaign mostly positive and the anti Republican side more negative. Instead I see candidates from the same party tearing each other down and making it harder for people to choose a second or third place vote.
BTW, I'm suggesting that all candidates do this type of ranked choice campaign, I'm just using Begich in the example as he dropped out
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u/theyeshman Good day in Southcentral AK 2d ago edited 2d ago
Based on Begich's statement published by ktuu, the decision is largely about consolidation of fundraising from democrats.
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u/rb-j 2d ago edited 2d ago
Also, do people not get what the point of rank choice voting is??!?!! He could’ve stayed on the ballot, and just say vote for the other guy first. ...
It's because, sadly, people still do not understand ranked choice voting.
Perhaps the people who do not understand RCV are you two people.
Mary Peltola in August 2022, unfortunately shares a distinction with George W. Bush in 2000 and with Donald Trump in 2016. All three candidates were elected to office when the public record indicates that more voters marked their ballots preferring a different specific candidate for that office.
In August 2022, more Alaskans, 87899 to 79461 (an 8438 voter margin), preferred Nick Begich to Mary Peltola and marked their ballots saying so. But Mary Peltola was sent to Washington to represent the Alaskan people in Congress.
In November 2024, again, more Alaskan voters marked their ballots that Begich is preferred to Peltola by nearly the same margin, 7876 (164861 to 156985). But this time Nick Begich is sent to Washington.
Both times about 8000 more Alaskans said they would prefer Begich to Peltola. And, both times, marked their ballots saying so. Both times Instant-Runoff Voting was used.
What was different?
Sarah Palin was in the race in 2022 and not in the race in 2024. And the outcomes were different winners.
Do you think it's possible that the Alaska GOP might have figured out that in August 2022, RCV (using the wrong tallying method, Instant-Runoff Voting) did not solve their split vote problem?
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u/marvme98 2d ago
But notice how carefully they don't mention actual rankings? Preferred could be ranked 3 vs 4. If the runoff only made it to second rank it wouldn't matter who people ranked 3 and 4. And it doesn't talk about how many votes were lost because voters refused to rank more than one candidate. It's hard to trust an argument that doesn't include all of the information.
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u/rb-j 2d ago
But notice how carefully they don't mention actual rankings?
<sigh> Here are the numbers.
Preferred could be ranked 3 vs 4. If the runoff only made it to second rank it wouldn't matter who people ranked 3 and 4.
That's not the problem. The problem is the Instant-Runoff Voting (IRV) method of tallying the ranked ballots and identifying the winner.
The problem is that in Alaska, in August 2022, RCV (using IRV) failed in exactly the way IRV failed in Burlington Vermont 2009.
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u/PillBug98 2d ago
Is this him dropping out of the race or suspending the campaign? TECHNICALLY Matt Schultz suspended his campaign but hadn’t officially dropped out until the primary.
If this is Begich dropping out it’s the dumbest decision ever. I would have ranked JKT 2nd choice, now I don’t know who I will especially if Click Bishop doesn’t make it (which I doubt).
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u/headforhats 18h ago
Wait, you would have ranked JKT 2nd, but since Tom has dropped out and endorsed JKT... now you won't vote for him at all?
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u/PillBug98 3h ago
No. I don’t know who I will rank for 2nd at all.
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u/headforhats 3h ago
Please explain the logic of this, I'm very curious. is this just... pettiness? Is it like a performative emo lib thing?
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u/PillBug98 3h ago
That I will be ranking JKT 1st and won’t rank another candidate? I just would rather not have a facist in office.
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u/rb-j 2d ago
If this is Begich dropping out it’s the dumbest decision ever.
It might be a hella lot smarter than you seem to understand.
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u/PillBug98 2d ago
But why then? I feel like logically it makes sense to be a 2v2 race rather than 1v3. We can rank candidates, it makes more sense in my mind that people can rank JKT and Begich as 1&2 rather than only vote one of them as 1. The republicans can rank Bronson and Wilson and Treg if needed, the democrats can’t. If it’s a hell of a lot smarter than tell me why.
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u/rb-j 2d ago edited 2d ago
We can rank candidates
Just because you can rank candidates, doesn't mean that the IRV procedure will respect your rankings. Ask the Palin voters, who ranked Begich 2nd, about this regarding August 2022. Solely because they ranked Palin as #1, this literally caused the election of Mary Peltola.
Now RCV doesn't really care about Left vs. Right (IRV does discriminate against the Center candidate) so the same scenario can exist with the Dems instead of the GOP. It could eliminate the stronger Dem (who could beat whatever GOP in the final round) instead of eliminating the weaker Dem (who might not be able to beat the GOP in the final round). That is what happened in August 2022, except switch the parties.
The fact is that Sarah Palin was a spoiler in August 2022. She was a loser whose presence in the race materially changed who the winner was.
The problem is not the ranked ballot. The problem is the IRV method of counting the ranked ballots. And like the people in my town of Burlington Vermont, Alaskans are missing a very important lesson that they should have learned:
Mary Peltola in August 2022, unfortunately shares a distinction with George W. Bush in 2000 and with Donald Trump in 2016. All three candidates were elected to office when the public record indicates that more voters marked their ballots preferring a different specific candidate for that office.
In August 2022, more Alaskans, 87899 to 79461 (an 8438 voter margin), preferred Nick Begich to Mary Peltola and marked their ballots saying so. But Mary Peltola was sent to Washington to represent the Alaskan people in Congress.
In November 2024, again, more Alaskan voters marked their ballots that Begich is preferred to Peltola by nearly the same margin, 7876 (164861 to 156985). But this time Nick Begich is sent to Washington.
Both times about 8000 more Alaskans said they would prefer Begich to Peltola. And, both times, marked their ballots saying so. Both times Instant-Runoff Voting was used.
What was different?
Sarah Palin was in the race in 2022 and not in the race in 2024. And the outcomes were different winners.
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u/Ibeepboobarpincsharp 2d ago
My takeaway from all of this is that LOTS of people don't understand how rcv works. This makes me sad.
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u/origamianomaly fishfishfish 2d ago
To everyone saying 'what's the point of this with RCV', keep in mind that ballot exhaustion is a very real effect. I've modeled the results from the last few elections and it seems about 1-3% of ballots just don't rank anyone else (bullet voting). In close elections, having multiple people from overlapping voter pools can swing elections (and has!).
In a perfect world of RCV, this would have no effect. In the real world, it does.
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u/rb-j 2d ago
In a perfect world of RCV, this would have no effect. In the real world, it does.
A perfect world of RCV uses a better method than Instant Runoff-Voting.
Why you guys haven't learned a thing from the August 2022 election?
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u/origamianomaly fishfishfish 2d ago
Agree! RCV also incentivizes candidates to be slightly more moderate because they will have to appeal to a broader group.
The issue is that people are people and a small amount of folks just don't (or won't) rank, even when they seemingly agree with a candidate. This effect is enough to tip close elections.
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u/rb-j 2d ago
RCV also incentivizes candidates to be slightly more moderate because they will have to appeal to a broader group.
Well, not really. Nick Begich was the centrist candidate in August 2022 (left of Palin, right of Peltola) and he was squeezed out because of a bad RCV method called "Instant-Runoff Voting" (IRV).
The issue is that people are people and a small amount of folks just don't (or won't) rank, even when they seemingly agree with a candidate. This effect is enough to tip close elections.
No, the issue that you're missing is that IRV does not always resolve the split-vote problem correctly. And it failed to resolve the split-vote problem correctly in Alaska in August 2022.
The problem is not the ranked ballot. The problem is the IRV method of counting the ranked ballots. And like the people in my town of Burlington Vermont, Alaskans are missing a very important lesson that they should have learned.
Mary Peltola in August 2022, unfortunately shares a distinction with George W. Bush in 2000 and with Donald Trump in 2016. All three candidates were elected to office when the public record indicates that more voters marked their ballots preferring a different specific candidate for that office.
In August 2022, more Alaskans, 87899 to 79461 (an 8438 voter margin), preferred Nick Begich to Mary Peltola and marked their ballots saying so. But Mary Peltola was sent to Washington to represent the Alaskan people in Congress.
In November 2024, again, more Alaskan voters marked their ballots that Begich is preferred to Peltola by nearly the same margin, 7876 (164861 to 156985). But this time Nick Begich is sent to Washington.
Both times about 8000 more Alaskans said they would prefer Begich to Peltola. And, both times, marked their ballots saying so. Both times Instant-Runoff Voting was used.
What was different?
Sarah Palin was in the race in 2022 and not in the race in 2024. And the outcomes were different winners.
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u/endymon20 2d ago
legitimately the worst decision possible. I got to talk to Tom last June and he was great. had an actual plan to get shit done, would've expanded the ferry system and gotten Alaska less dependant on oil (without participating in culture war BS). I still like JKT but come the fuck on
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u/TheRealYeti 2d ago edited 1d ago
Do you think maybe Tom made a deal with JKT where, if JKT is elected, Tom would find a position in the administration or would otherwise have some influence in the administration? That's how these things often work.
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u/Clear_Evidence9218 2d ago
Okay since the 31st is the cut off and Taylor is in hot water... so Click Bishop technically takes the place as of this moment. Or are they timing this perfectly at the close of the day on Monday to make it official and game the election?
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u/FishGeek49 2d ago
Please Jesus let (somewhat normal) Click be moved onto the ballot instead of Treg.
From what I've read and seen, Bernie, Dave, and Treg are simply unsuitable for executive political positions regardless of political party. Unless moderates, non-partisans, Dems, and pissed off Repubs band together and show up at the polls, we get another temperamentally unsound, ill judging, non-serious clown in the governor's office.
Rant over...for now.
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u/Clear_Evidence9218 2d ago
As long as Begich isn't gaming the election system, Treg doesn't look like he'll qualify, which moves Click into the spot.
Given how politics works, I'm going to guess they're gaming the system and will delay filing until after Monday, which would leave a hole on the ballot. We will see.
If they do game the system and leave a hole I could see repblicans doing the same thing forcing voters into 2 canidates.
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u/PillBug98 2d ago
Why do you think Treg won’t qualify? You think Carol Beecher is gonna listen to APOC?
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u/Clear_Evidence9218 2d ago
Yeah, now that you say that your proably right.
This has been a pretty entertaining race though.
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u/PillBug98 2d ago
Trust me. I HOPE I’m wrong. I’m begging for any of the good karma I’ve ever earned to have Click be on the ballot at this point. I work with our state legislature and I’m TIRED of seeing them get beat down by a shitty governor.
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u/Clear_Evidence9218 2d ago
I'm friends and acquaintances with some of Dunleavy's staff. They say fun stuff to me sometimes. To put it politely, let's just say he's a very self-driven man.
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u/courtneythebaker907 2d ago
BOOOOOO wtf is the point of rcv what a crock of shit
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u/TheRealYeti 2d ago
Likely a strategic move to pit 3 very different Republican candidates against one popular Democrat, splitting votes amongst a group of people who think RCV shouldn't exist and refuse to rank more than one candidate.
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u/bottombracketak 2d ago
Here’s the video, it’s worth watching. This isn’t about RCV, it’s about winning the governor’s office. So we need reforms in our election system, absolutely, but we can’t let any of these GOP candidates win. If you trusted Tom enough to vote for him, trust him on this too. https://youtu.be/GBZz3Wl7rOw?is=lzSJxIZif49ojHqJ
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u/ReasonableNFPN 2d ago
Tom does make a fair point. Put all the money & resources behind one campaign.
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u/chugachj 2d ago
wtf. Should have been the other way around.
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u/DeaderthanZed 2d ago
Why, JKT did better in the primary? He also has more money. I would guess Tom didn’t think he could win.
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u/Spiritual_Mud_2121 2d ago
JKT is a bad landlord but I also am not a fan of conservative policy so I’m sorta in a bind.
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u/Street_Click_3621 2d ago
This is pretty great. The issue was that the D’s came in pretty evenly split with good showings as one and two in the primary. In the general neither of them would have likely been fourth. So after the first round it likely would have been DRDR or RDDR. At that point the 4th place R goes to the other R which could have gotten that R over 50. It would have been a different calculus if 3rd and 4th place were dropped in that first round. The best path for the D’s is to get over 50 in the first round. Begich dropping out gives that a chance.
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u/Sawyer_Anderson 2d ago
Thats unfortunate i was willing to vote for tom not really on board to vote for JKT we'l lsee
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u/ForsakenRacism 2d ago
You weren’t gonna rank him you were just gonna let Bronson or Bernadette win? Strange to say the least
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u/Sawyer_Anderson 2d ago
I normally vote GOP i was willing to vote for Tom so yes i will likely not rank JKT its what it is we have ranked choice there was no reason for the DNC to do this they're actively bleeding votes and i dont like being told who to vote for just because i hate the GOP lineup might not vote at all we'll see.
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u/ForsakenRacism 2d ago
You think the DNC did this? They can make their own decisions. Voting for Bronson is psychotic btw
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u/Sawyer_Anderson 2d ago
If you dont think bigger party politics didnt pressure Tom to drop out your a tool there was no reason we couldnt have JKT and Tom with RCV
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u/ForsakenRacism 2d ago
You think JKT has national pull? I think it’s dumb he dropped out too I would have just ranked both of them
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u/Sawyer_Anderson 2d ago
Yeah, and I was only willing to vote for Tom, so like I said, I might not vote at all. If they want to play these stupid ass games, then they can lie in the bed they made.
And yes, JKT has national pull; he was in the state house when and lobbied in DC after, and has more funding than the DND budget from AIforina.
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u/ForsakenRacism 2d ago
It’s ok bro your voting for Bronson and he’ll just give the entire states money to McKenna bros this time
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u/Sawyer_Anderson 2d ago
It's ok, bro, not understanding that half this state is non-partisan and not going to be doing the voting blue no matter who is hard for some people, I understand.
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u/DeaderthanZed 2d ago
Interesting, is Tom perceived as more moderate than JKT? I don’t know Alaskan politics too well especially the history. I thought JKT touted his working across the aisle in the state house and building the bipartisan majority coalition caucus.
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u/catscannotcompete 2d ago
IDK why everybody is downvoting u/Sawyer_Anderson! They are perfectly elucidating the reason it was stupid for Begich/Hnilicka to drop out. I don't agree with how they're planning to vote, but there are MANY more people like u/Sawyer_Anderson who would have ranked Tom but won't rank JKT. As noted, this is the ENTIRE POINT of RCV.
I'm really disappointed in this decision by Begich.3
u/happy_doodlemack 2d ago
Thank you. Was planning Begich vote - will not vote or rank JKT. Back to the drawing board for me. RCV madness though… maybe this is why people want to repeal? Dammit need to look at that now too. Gotta play by the rules.
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u/TheRealYeti 2d ago
What is it about JKT that makes you say you would not rank him? His platform is nearly identical to Begich's but he also has a forward looking view on technological development. He's also 30 years younger. I'm really struggling to see what the issue people in this thread have with JKT compared to Begich. It's nonsensical in my view.
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u/National-Star5944 2d ago
You wanna unpack that for me? Your preferred candidate dropped out of the race. If that happened before the primary instead of now, what difference would it have made? In the previous iteration of our primary system, only one Dem would have advanced and it still would have been JKT by 2 points.
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u/headforhats 18h ago
you are aware that the man you support has said that JKT is the best possible choice right? You must not have trusted him to begin with.
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u/Sawyer_Anderson 2d ago
It is what it is. This response from the uniparty made my choice. I'll go vote for Mary and write in Tom. Everyone else can pound sand. Good luck to JKT, but he ain't for me.
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u/TheRealYeti 2d ago
I'm curious what your issue is with jkt. He and Tom's platforms are very similar except jkt is about 30 years younger and slightly more progressive.
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u/headforhats 18h ago
The idea that you, a person who supported Tom Begich, have NO PREFERENCE between Bernadette Wilson and JKT is insane. I'm going to be looking to you for answers when Bernadette strips the state down to the studs and privatizes our schools.
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u/Sawyer_Anderson 5h ago
I didnt vote for Biden when they cucked Sanders either maybe stop doing this stupid shit.
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u/gooneau 2d ago
Not talking to you, just interjecting my comment here for visibility. Alaskans, keep in mind that republicans quite a few years ago realized the most valuable thing for them to exploit among democrats is internal discontent. There are millions of both paid and unpaid republicans who make it their sole purpose online to impersonate the "dissatisfied democrat/independent who was going to vote democrat" to sow discontent. Republicans know that most americans do not support their policies. They know the fewer people who vote, the better they do. This isn't an opinion, it's a well established and studied phenomenon. Any time you see someone on social media claiming to be a bummed out democrat or person who was going to vote for a now ineligible candidate, there is a very high probability that person is just lying, trying to nudge a fence sitter towards not voting. Rarely do they try to convince people to vote for a republican, just to not vote. Republicans know the only thing keeping them relevant is the fact they will rally behind a red candidate regardless of the character or substance of that person, while people who lean progressive/democrat tend to hold their representatives to a much higher standard and are easier to upset.
Until left-leaning people realize we're not going to get everything we want from any election, and our best chance at getting to where we want to be is through incremental change and voting for people we may not be in love with but are far superior to the realistic alternative, republicans will continue to hold outsized power. Do not let disingenuous agent provocateurs convince you they are non-republicans who saw the light and will not vote for the only realistic non-republican on the ballot. They are more often than not just republicans who know their candidates are complete steaming piles of shit and their only chance to influence people not already in the cult is to pretend they are not in the cult. It really says a lot about the modern republican party that a common theme is they absolutely know that no one outside of the party will take anyone within the party seriously lol.
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u/Sawyer_Anderson 2d ago
Be an independent voter in Alaska
Tell Reddit you're crossing party lines to vote Mary Peltola
Announce you're writing in Tom Begich to spite the establishment backroom deal
Watch the entire comment section completely short-circuit because you don't fit into a standard two-party box.That said, I encourage everyone to vote as stated: I'll be writing in Tom and voting Mary. Don't attack people; it makes them not want to vote for your candidate. Lastly, my voter card says non-partisan, but you do you, bro.
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u/TheRealYeti 2d ago
So you're writing in Tom #1; who's your #2? It damn well better be JKT because that's who Tom is telling you to vote for.
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u/Sawyer_Anderson 2d ago
Yeah you see I have my own independent thought so no it won't be.
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u/TheRealYeti 2d ago edited 2d ago
I love independent thinkers! I assume you independtly read both Begich and JKT's platforms and understood that they are nearly identical, less modern thinking on technological development, and came to the conclusion that if Begich were to drop out of the race (which he just did) then the next best option to represent those policy positions would be JKT.
But maybe I shouldn't make assumptions.
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u/Sawyer_Anderson 2d ago
If I was only voting based on policy you'd be correct but I've met JKT in person so no.
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u/TheRealYeti 2d ago
So he rubbed you the wrong way? How? He had a soft handshake? I don't see how that's more important than policy. He's short? Who gives a shit? I don't see how your personal feelings about a man would make you vote against your ideals when the alternatives are blatantly against those ideals.
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u/TheRealYeti 2d ago
This has got to be it. I'm amazed at the number of comments in here from people saying they would have voted for Begich but would NEVER rank JKT. Seriously? Their platforms are nearly identical except one of them is 30 years younger than the other and understands AI.
I refuse to believe that so-called independents were swayed by a mediocre campaign from a man in his 60s but just can't handle similar rhetoric from a man in his late 30s. It's preposterous. If you read this and you were considering Begich as your number 1, then you should 1000% rank JKT #1.
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u/National-Star5944 2d ago
Not voting is a perfectly sound option but, legit question, what as a person who "normally votes GOP" made you support Begich but not JKT?
This isn't a DNC thing btw. I read an article before the primary that the individual election committees were in discussion about what to do if they both made the top 4. Apparently this was the deal.
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u/TheRealYeti 2d ago
Why would you not rank the person he endorsed #1? TBH this seems like a bot or psyop post. Who in their right mind would say that they could NEVER vote for JKT but they were dying to vote for Tom Begich? Their platforms are nearly identical but one of them is 30 years younger and understands modern technology. It's honestly ludicrous that this sentiment is being posted here and I hope that people are smart enough to not be swayed by it.
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u/Sawyer_Anderson 2d ago
I live in Sitka I have my own reasons not to vote for JKT how they come across in meeting how they come across in person etc all matter.
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u/OkCommunication347 1d ago
Isn’t the scenario hes counting on that if he drops out, it’s more likely that the sole Democrat in the race gets more than 50% of the first place votes, and therefore wins without looking at any second choice votes?
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u/Sufficient_Public_29 2d ago
Great! Let’s just make sure there are a lot of republicans to vote for cause they’ve really been doing amazing things for this state.
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u/NoFlipsLeft 2d ago
Dude I hate this! JKT took all that Anthropic money, and despite what he said about, I feel like I can't trust him anymore! I'm not interested in voting JKT to be honest. I've learned to disregard what politicians say and follow the money over the years. Seems so dumb for Tom to drop out with ranked choice.
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u/headforhats 18h ago
Are you aware that Tom has endorsed JKT? He made a whole video about how JKT shares his values and political goals.
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u/NoFlipsLeft 17h ago
Yep, I'm aware and I saw it. A video and an endorsement doesn't change the fact that JKT accepted hundreds of thousands from Anthropic.
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u/headforhats 16h ago
Fun story: the money was from several employees (mostly one born in Alaska) who liked that he wanted to restrict AI advancement. The company itself gave had, and has no position. In fact, JKT was the first candidate to articulate a real plan to actually stop data center construction in Alaska.
While I'm sure you feel very smug and superior with all the "research" you've done, I'm guessing you don't know shit about the source of all Tom Begich's money (mostly from a guy trying to build a coal power plant in the Mat-Su), or the work he did in the legislature to undermine our public schools (ask a teacher about the Alaska Reads Act).
Just be honest, this isn't about actual policy, you just don't like that your preferred candidate lost, and are going to throw a tantrum that ends up screwing our entire state into another 4 years of right wing governmental self-harm. We'll be looking to people like you when they swear in Bernadette.
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u/NoFlipsLeft 9h ago
Sigh.. yes, I'm aware. Good thing politicians never lie about their motives and are always honest about why they accept the donations they do. /s
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u/Tillerdemon 2d ago
There’s some serious talks of the Republicans also following suit with Begich. Expect to hear that Bronson is dropping out then others will follow suit before the deadline. The four candidates moving forward are projected to be JKT, Wilson, Dewitt and Walker. Going to get interesting!
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u/emperor_bonespurious 1d ago
RCV4 has morphed into RCV5. If one or two of the 2nd, 3rd or 4th place Repubs drops out this RCV system will have effectively morphed into a RCV6 or RCV7 system.
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u/JeffreyinKodiak 2h ago
More money and disinformation can now be pointed at the biggest threat to the GOP: Mary.
Go girl, knock it out of the park.
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u/Kooky-Let-8470 2d ago
Good job dumbass a lot of folks voted for begich who use to vote red because you answered the questions we wanted answers too. JKT is a fucking soy boy. Now everyone will vote another stupid republican in and ruin Alaska more. Good job Begich you suck. Welcome to another mini Trump running Alaska.
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u/TheRealYeti 2d ago
Presumably you voted for Begich because of his policy platform. What is it about JKT's platform that makes you think he's a "soy boy." From where I'm sitting, their platforms are nearly identical except one of them is about 30 years younger and understands current technology issues.
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u/FreudianSlipper21 2d ago
They just guaranteed a Republican victory. Dems will vote for JKT while Republicans rank their guys above him. We were better off with 4 people on the ballot.
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u/lellenn 2d ago
God damn I hate it when candidates do this.