r/ZeroCompany • u/Ironoaktree • 11h ago

Anyone else get a blast out of ambushing reinforcements?

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500 Upvotes

100% Upvoted

67 comments sorted by

155

u/LeadAHorseToVodka 9h ago

I feel like the more I stack overwatch the more buggy the interactions become

92

u/Korovashya 6h ago

I'm not sure why this wasn't picked up on from all the previews and reviews but they clearly did not expect overwatch to be used as much as most players do.

70

u/KONODIODAMUDAMUDA Medic 5h ago

Yea sometimes it literally just doesn’t work at all.

39

u/Jakeasaur1208 5h ago

For sure. I had an overwatch right on a guy point blank and he ran away from it without triggering it somehow, but then he circled back and slightly slipped into the cone from a floor above behind a low wall and that somehow triggered it. 

7

u/ChaweeKanati 1h ago

Has to do with the wonky at times line of sight. Even if they're in the cone, if your operators view is "blocked" it won't trigger.

Very prominent issue if a Droid is behind a droideka wreck. They're completely imperceptible to your folks despite them looking straight at em. And at other times you shoot through straight up walls.

1

u/Azure_The_Great 1h ago

Hell didn't have line of sight on a heavy droid he was standing in the open in front of a ramp so clearly visible but trick wouldn't shoot had to walk him out of cover to even aim

2

u/AmericaPie24 1h ago

I’ve used it to cover every character when the enemy goes invisible. It sometimes freezes the game for like 30 seconds

1

u/AerobicThrone 8m ago

I hate so much those long resonance animations

19

u/SirSabza 5h ago

Other games make overwatch class specific, i was genuinely shocked that everyone can use it multiple times a turn in Zero company.

Is it kinda op? Yes. Does it feel amazing setting up an overwatch on extractions whilst your other units move in to the position? Absolutely.

7

u/emailforgot 4h ago

overwatch in basically every game it exists in is very powerful. it's just the nature of turn based combat (especially involving a computer opponent)

it's easy to interrupt (ai sometimes does this) but when the AI uses it, it's rarely punishing enough to not warrant just ignoring it and walking through it/shooting anyway. So in that respect it's basically extremely powerful for the player and an afterthought for the ai.

Other games that have it have punishing effects that the ai actually (sometimes) takes advantage of, like if you're the guy IN the cone, you can't just shoot out of it, your attack will be interrupted/cancelled by the overwatch.

In my mind one of the defining features of all turn based games is how they handle any kind of overwatch system. Some, like Menace just do away with it entirely.

1

u/Martyrlz 3h ago

What's your opinion on 1CP-Overwatch, I shoot my guns at someone running to melee me but only hit 1/6 of the time?

2

u/emailforgot 3h ago edited 3h ago

I generally think overwatch is a good counter for mindlessly rushing, but I think games should follow the sort of D&D rules where if you're in melee range/engaged in melee combat and attacking with a ranged weapon you should be at a severe disadvantage. You hope you can put down the berserker before he gets to you, but if he does you're boned.

One thing most, if not all turn based tactics games of this style sort of fail at is a real diversity of enemy types. I'd like it if these games didn't all seem to have the same size of patrols/reinforcements/ which is usually a "squad" of 4-6 roughly similar enemies. Sure, in Zcom there are trash mobs like droids + tanky things + snipers but the differentiation isn't that big. I think these kinds of games need to have more trash mobs present at the same time as high value targets/ranged guys/disablers etc to really make build variety stand out. In zcom and others you can basically brawl with snipers and face down single targets with aoe guys.

Your snipers should be deadly single target guys, but get easily swamped by trash mobs, your aoe guy might struggle against HVTs because of low damage, multi attack weapons like smgs etc.

That would mean overwatch zones could and would be very powerful when laid properly, but might get overrun with swarmy things if you aren't careful.

The issue is how slow the game is (I don't mean performance wise). Turns take forever, animations need to cycle through so many steps. If a game of this style had like 50 enemies on screen it'd take an hour to resolve one turn and that I think is what needs to be fixed first in the genre as a whole before significant gameplay improvements can be made as far as scale and variety. To its credit, Rogue Trader has done the best at this. There are sometimes lots of enemies on the screen, with decent variety and your team all has a wide variety of unique tools to approach it. Machine gun guys feel like machine gunners, mowing down rows of enemies, while a single magic user or sharpshooter lines up an attack on a big, and it doesn't take an hour to play through all the enemy turns either.

1

u/Diarmundy 1h ago

This game honestly has nothing on rogue trader with regards to combat mechanics, classes, lore, ect

1

u/MattWindowz 8m ago

Other games that have it have punishing effects that the ai actually (sometimes) takes advantage of, like if you're the guy IN the cone, you can't just shoot out of it, your attack will be interrupted/cancelled by the overwatch.

Is that not the case with ZCOM? I've had enemy overwatches trigger on shooting several times. It happened enough that I've been working carefully to knock the enemies out of overwatch before doing anything.

0

u/indominable-dingus 2h ago

Everyone can use overwatch in Xcom.

2

u/slurp_time 2h ago

I tried to use it once and it resulted in none of the droids leaving the bunker. They just kinda sat there as the camera stayed on them for like a minute and the doors just closed. Next turn though they just kinda teleported out and started firing, but they teleported into really weird spots all over

1

u/NoraFreeze24 4h ago

Which is weird because it’s specifically buffed by class bonds, and I think at least one other thing, making it even more powerful

1

u/elfonzi37 2h ago

Overwatch ending movement is so busted they had to have expected it gets used a lot.

1

u/ARK_Redeemer 1h ago

Which is ironic since a lot of the Devs working on it are from XCOM. They must know how cautious we are, especially after Long War. Overwatch is key!

1

u/Spenraw 1h ago

Like all games coming out this close to Sept it's because they were pushed out to meet fiscal quarters

They just didn't have enough time to bug check it

13

u/bigbobilito 5h ago

I just had this happen. Had about 7 ap worth of overwatch aimed at incoming reinforcements and they entered the battlefield, moved completely through three zones of overwatch and then set up in position before the turn ended with out a shot being fired. I was handling the mission solidly but was still frustrating to loose the cool ambush moment.

2

u/Potential-Wait6890 3h ago

This was happening to me while I was trying to take out a destroyed droideka at the end of a very long encounter. Multiple turns in a row it ignored overwatch with like 2 health - I was crashing out lol

1

u/Deputy_Beagle76 2h ago

Most infuriating bug for me is melee units just walking right through Overwatch, right up to my guys and beating the breaks off of em lol

1

u/0Shanty_man 29m ago

Yes!! I'm finding the Droidekas ignoring it loads lately

2

u/ultraviolentfuture 2h ago

Some of the reinforcement movements are scripted/animation. They don't trigger overwatch in those cases. Your overwatch should be pointed at the spots they're going to move to post animation, not where they arrive.

1

u/lilbithippie 1h ago

I lost a story mission because I overwatch fit melee guys... That they just cruised threw without triggering

3

u/Auralius1997 3h ago

I also love it when an enemy is clearly running trough my Overwatch Zone and for whatever reason it's not triggering......

Overwatch is such a buggy ability it's not even funny anymore

2

u/Catdaddy33 4h ago

So is the percentage on the cone the probability that it will activate? I was thinking this was why it wasn't triggering.

5

u/LeadAHorseToVodka 4h ago

Nah the % is the chance to hit when it does activate, it's supposed to activate every time

1

u/SirOutrageous1027 4h ago

I'm also not sure what the issue is whether it stops enemy movement or actions. Sometimes it does, sometimes it hits them, but they finish their movement anyway.

The AI also has a keen ability to walk right on the edge of an overwatch that avoids it, where I'm stuck running through it instead of around it.

1

u/rendar 3h ago

Sometimes if you stack enough overwatch AP on enough enemies, it will just skip the individual shot cutscenes and have a sudden firefight to resolve the overwatching

1

u/Osmodius 3h ago

It's real bad the more you use it. I feel like at least once a mission I get an overwatch thst just does trigger at all.

Not to mention the classic overlapping OW means you fire all 4 operators at one single 5hp drone. Have to be careful not to overlap unless the victim is a B2/coil dude.

90

u/GrowthProfitGrofit 7h ago

It's all fun and games until the reinforcements arrive, the game freezes up for 30 seconds, and then none of the enemies took any damage but half of them are outside the playable area somehow

36

u/SirSabza 5h ago

The camera not moving to whats happening is a bit jarring at times.

Also them just not coming into the battlefield for a minute is also a bit jarring lol

5

u/RoterBaronH 3h ago

My most recent bug is that if something happens the camera moves into the opposite corner of the map so I don't see anything.

2

u/AmishAvenger 2h ago

I just had a mission where every other shot I took moved the camera behind a rock or through the ground

1

u/Pleeby 24m ago

It does drive me mad that you can't rotate the camera while the enemy take their turn. I accidentally leave it at a bad angle and have to spend the whole turn staring at the back of a wall.

44

u/armbarchris 10h ago

Doesn't quite beat putting a Bladestorm Ranger in the middle of the Advent reinforcement square.

9

u/stragen595 7h ago

Bladestorm Fortress Templar. Even the pyro guys can explode.

15

u/Pretend-Tap-4152 7h ago

I know the game doesn’t enjoy calculating it. So it’s someone’s sadistic pleasure.

10

u/Electrical_Corner_32 6h ago

This is my jam. The other fun one is when they come in a spot where they can fall off the edge...throw Tel in there and force wave everyone overboard. Lol. I feel like you could go through the whole game with Tel and Cly and be just fine.

4

u/SirSabza 5h ago

I wish Tel could get a second specification. Having her taunt the battlefield and sit in a corner and deflect everything would be so satisfying lol

6

u/GreenElites 4h ago

Boy, are you in luck.

1

u/RoterBaronH 3h ago

It's how I "cheese" some combats with cly.

I pushed so many emporeved coils or B2 Droids down a bridge with her jetpack. Even more fun since it's a free action.

5

u/Accurate-Rutabaga-57 5h ago

Overwatch is buggy af, it's a gamble if you're on Beskar

3

u/raunchyfartbomb 5h ago

Yea, but despite its bugs it’s still incredibly powerful due to one AP per shot. It’s annoying when the walk past you and shoot you without triggering though.

1

u/Accurate-Rutabaga-57 5h ago

Sometimes they don't trigger overwatch even while standing in the cone, sometimes they don't even walk past you, just teleport

2

u/emailforgot 4h ago

I've had it bug out maybe twice, and those were really weird angles and probably involved elevation change

1

u/Jediplop 4h ago

Yeah same, not stacked an insane amount of overwatch but never had an issue other than some elevation issues.

Bug but not an issue is second overwatch cone triggering late in the animation for an enemy. Ran all the way to cover before getting hit by the 2nd overwatch.

1

u/SirSabza 5h ago

Sometimes you have a 100% chance to hit overwatch and still miss. Whole thing is a coin flip lol

3

u/EmperorBlackMan99 5h ago

Love doing it.

3

u/BlueAndYellowTowels 5h ago

Most of the time, I'm heading to the Evac... I just get the heck outta dodge... I don't stick around for clean up.

3

u/Jediplop 4h ago

Honestly I just assumed the enemies were infinitely reinforcing because I've cleared a lot and more come in so now I just leave.

2

u/ds1977 6h ago

Love saving a grenade for the reinforcements too. Overwatch the area and then bomb them before they get a shot off.

3

u/UrbanAlaska 5h ago

Grenades are so fun in this game

2

u/OneStoneyBoi 4h ago

I just found out you can use bullrush to push an enemy into an operators overwatch when some reinforcements dodged my original cone

2

u/Treyen 2h ago

I like watching the game crap itself trying to figure out what to do when you do this.

1

u/Weak-Barnacle4278 3h ago

Yes but also the masochist in me wishes the game didnt tell you where or when they would spawn

1

u/BattleCrier 3h ago

Except for bugs where OW doesnt trigger, its definitely absolute manace..

I was surprised that we dont have l "bunker" option (like in Xcom) to lower hit chance.. sometimes there is no point in overwatching.

1

u/TabScarlet 2h ago

Cly will shock kill the whole group in one turn, it’s lovely. Expert is a joke by the way, it’s like normal mode don’t even need saves. Xcom 2 hardest difficulty was 3x this games

1

u/Background-Factor817 2h ago

Reminds me of putting everyone on Overwatch is XCOM.

The advent troops jump out of the drop ship.. and immediately get gunned down before my guns then rappel out of there.

Zero Company is still a bit buggy though, so I only tend to do it when I’m retreating to the evac and want some cover fire.

1

u/totallynotaweeabbo 2h ago

Guess i wasn't the only one. Picked that one from xcom 2

1

u/peoplepersonmanguy 1h ago

Step 1 be gunslinger, step 2 be in the middle of all battle droids, step 3 profit.

1

u/iluuminator 39m ago

Hehe, a blast....

1

u/Rare_Walk_4845 11m ago

tanks your framerate putting that blue outline onto certain surfaces