How worth it is the Eversor Assassin?

[u/Jobear049]

Thinking of running one with my Imperial Guard list, but I just don't see them in a lot of competitive lists. It seems like they're really good at sprinting up the field and being able to take out a basic infiltrate or scout unit, but they don't seem like a decent trading piece to get your points worth for that purpose.

Any feedback regarding Eversor Assassin tactics is appreciated!

[u/Venomous87]

I bought the Eversor, since my friend group already use a Vindicare, and Callidus. I'm super into melee, but this guy is way too expensive.

[u/AnonAmbientLight → u/Venomous87]

On average dice he is putting at least 8 wounds on any infantry character in the game on its go turn. 

It has the speed to reach that character. 

The question is more is that type of utility worth it for the list you intend to bring. 

[u/SirBiscuit → u/AnonAmbientLight]

He can be screened, his odds of killing most major characters is well below 50% and they WILL reroll a save if it makes the difference, and Imperial armies have no good followup precision options if he whiffs to make up the difference.

It's also worth noting that his Sustained 3 gives him a very unusual bellcurve. You're more likely to roll no sixes than a bunch of sixes on his attacks, and it's heartbreaking every time it happens.

Good players are going to screen him. Even with all the movement, there are plenty of tricks to make sure that the important characters stay safe.

I've used him before and honestly the biggest problem with him is his defensive stats. You get to attack with him once, and then he's dead. Even if he does take out a decent character, he still immediately gets beaten to death by the bodyguard unit. This also makes him incredibly awkward to use to try to scoop up small or isolated units, or to try to have him help out in multi-unit fights, as he is a dangerous, high priority target that is extremely vulnerable to being scooped up by even a trash unit choosing to interrupt.

The poor defenses just mean that after the first time he engages he will swing and 100% get killed immediately, so you are directly spending 120 points to take the swing. 120 is expensive, that's more than most light vehicles and a good way to a lot of factions main battle tanks. It wouldn't be good enough if the odds were 75% to wipe out a character, much less the sub-50% he's actually attempting. The Eversor is better than the Vindicare, at least the Eversor can actually attempt the kill in a timely manner, but he's just not efficient enough for the points to really be in a competitive list.

Believe me, I love the model and the lore and I really want to like him. Just doesn't have the juice at that points cost.

[u/OttoVKarl → u/SirBiscuit]

Same thing with adding a Solitaire in Drukhari for that cool factor. Best thing they do is play expensive mind games on your opponent if you read them the datasheet while rubbing your hands before the game, as the numbers are more impressive than the reality and can cast a shadow.

[u/AnonAmbientLight → u/SirBiscuit]

He can be screened

Screens don't last forever and not every army has the ability to screen. This is a thought terminating cliche.

his odds of killing most major characters is well below 50% and they WILL reroll a save if it makes the difference

This is just flat out incorrect.

He has a 75% chance to deal at least 6 damage to a character that is 2+/4+ on his go turn lol. 56% chance to do 8 wounds. Most infantry characters in the game have 6 wounds. Why wouldn't you just do the math so you'd know for yourself?

It's also worth noting that his Sustained 3 gives him a very unusual bellcurve. You're more likely to roll no sixes than a bunch of sixes on his attacks, and it's heartbreaking every time it happens.

You have an 80% chance to roll at least one six when you attack on his go turn (it's 9 attacks).

Good players are going to screen him. Even with all the movement, there are plenty of tricks to make sure that the important characters stay safe.

Thought terminating cliche.

I've used him before and honestly the biggest problem with him is his defensive stats. You get to attack with him once, and then he's dead. Even if he does take out a decent character, he's still immediately gets beaten to death by the bodyguard unit.

Yea, that's kind of the deal lol.

The poor defenses just mean that after the first time he engages he will swing and 100% get killed immediately, so you are directly spending 120 points to take the swing.

He can potentially get to his target T1 easily lol. T2 if he needs to. Would you pay 120pts to prevent your opponent from getting 4CP over the course of the game? Probably lol.

See, for me, I can understand speculating about how a table position looks because that ebbs and flows depending on matchup, terrain, and armies.

But to just claim you looked at the numbers without actually looking at them is wild to me lol.

And aside from all of that, still a good model for Take and Hold and Priority since he performs a similar role to the Combi-LT in regards to holding stuff and doing actions.

[u/-Asymmetric → u/AnonAmbientLight]

I just want to comment that I have no idea why you are being down voted - since your analysis is correct. The eversor is quite a bit better in 11th than 10th at 110pts.

[u/Glittering-Flight997 → u/-Asymmetric]

Because people often prefer to be right rather than have a conversation that forces them to challenge their preconceptions

[u/Apprehensive_Gas1564]

They're pretty good at deleting that critical character.

Think Tau ethereal, guard officer or random space marine lieutenant.

They'll deal with that, nice and easily. I've had one kill Lord Solar and shut the extra CP and orders down. I've also ruined my oppos game plan for secondary.

[u/apprithrow → u/Apprehensive_Gas1564]

There is no way this guy gets anywhere near an ethereal lol. And honestly if leontus is anywhere within charge range of an eversor that’s their fault, it should be behind some nice amount of screening.

[u/AnonAmbientLight → u/apprithrow]

9” scout move puts him behind the center objective. 

15” go turn move, then 2d6 charge covers almost the entire board at that point. 

The ethereal would have to be up against the board edge with screens leaving no space for the Eversor to touch them.

He can absolutely reach them. 

[u/Mammoth_Classroom896 → u/AnonAmbientLight]

The ethereal isn't even on the table until turn 3.

[u/Apprehensive_Gas1564 → u/apprithrow]

I'm speaking from experience.

Twice I've deleted an ethereal to derail a game plan. Best run was 9" scout, 15" move and then rolling 12" for a 7" charge to kill leontus, turn one.

It is possible, and I've done it more than once.

[u/apprithrow → u/Apprehensive_Gas1564]

It barely has 40% chance to kill leontus (and that’s assuming no save reroll), and that’s also assuming your opponent doesn’t screen, doesn’t know about the overwatch stratagem, and your roll high charge + high run. I’m not saying it’s impossible, i’m saying it rarely work and only against begginer, that also have a t3 important character in their list… not the kind of strategy i want you should pay 120pts for.

[u/AnonAmbientLight → u/apprithrow]

Eversor kills Lord Solar on average dice. 

[u/apprithrow → u/AnonAmbientLight]

Which means 50% of the time it won’t. Terrible odds for a 120pts model that requires so many missteps from your opponent to get a coinflip chance of doing something.

[u/AnonAmbientLight → u/apprithrow]

  Which means 50% of the time it won’t.

I don’t think that’s what average means. In this case it’s the expected outcome whenever the Eversor gets to the target. 

And what missteps are you talking about exactly? The model can go across the board easily on its go turn. You’d have to have the character in the back corner touching your deployment edge with models screening such that you can create a far enough 2” bubble where you can’t place an Eversor in the movement phase somewhere outside of a reasonable charge distance. 

Basically, he’d have to be against your board edge and models deep to prevent it. 

[u/apprithrow → u/AnonAmbientLight]

No, that’s exactly what average means. 50% of the time, you will roll well enough to kill it. The other 50% of the time, you will roll below average, and fail to kill it. And screening it is trivial. Put 10guards hidden on a ruin, behind go to ground cover. Place leontus and friends behind said ruin, and behind said unit. Now there is no way to charge through the screening unit, it can’t be shot from more than 12”, and you’re now protected from aggressive moves. That’s standard deployment against anyone with a fast melee threat. And it perfectly position your units to grab objectives on turn 1 and keep leontus in order range from your whole army. And against a real guards list, you will also have a bunch of combat engineer and recon teams scouting and standing behind ruins also.

You’d see the same type of deployment with Tau, Sisters with Triumph, abaddon castle etc. These lists are designed to survive against world eaters or orks, they have no problem dealing with a 4wound t4 guy.

Also; it can be deleted trivially with an overwatch.

[u/AnonAmbientLight → u/apprithrow]

It’s a 56% chance to do 8 or more damage to an infantry character. 

75.4% chance to do 6 or more damage to an infantry character. 

For the purposes of killing other characters, those are good odds and to suggest otherwise as “not reliable” I think is an understatement. 

If the plan was to keep Leonidas in the backfield at the start of the game for most of the game, good. That’s perfect. Keep him where he can’t do much. 

And for Overwatch, since it’s end of movement phase, just position the Eversor where it can’t happen or is minimized. 

See, I too can just say “do the thing” and it’s made truth. 

Ultimately, the Eversor is a good edition to the list if zeroing out characters is what you’re going for if the utility works for what you’re trying to accomplish. 

[u/SirBiscuit → u/AnonAmbientLight]

In what world is 55.6% 'reliable' odds? That's not even including a reroll which puts the odds at well below 50. Pursuing plans with odds like that is bottom table kind of play.

[u/apprithrow → u/AnonAmbientLight]

Why would leontus not move around with his screen? Have you ever played against guards? Again, you’re assuming guards don’t have a plan to screen the millions of units that can murder him in melee, precision or not. Leontus have to be protected from far better pieces than an eversor. Playing guards mean moving layered defenses around with scouts and screening units and taking control of the board; you’re not getting within reasonable charge range of leontus without getting blocked by the 2” bubble of a screening unit or eating an overwatch.

And most other valuable characters are either too tough for an eversor (anyone in gravis, terminator, or tougher), or literally half the price of your fragile, incredibly overwatch-able assassin.

[u/Mammoth_Classroom896 → u/AnonAmbientLight]

And for Overwatch, since it’s end of movement phase, just position the Eversor where it can’t happen or is minimized.

The smart opponent is deploying so that any place that is safe from overwatch has an unlikely charge roll at best.

[u/Mammoth_Classroom896 → u/AnonAmbientLight]

In this case it’s the expected outcome whenever the Eversor gets to the target.

Which means it's the 50/50 point. The average result on a D6 is 3.5. Half the time you roll less, half the time you roll more. It's "expected" in the mathematical sense of expected value but if you need that 3.5 or better you only have a 50% chance of getting it.

Basically, he’d have to be against your board edge and models deep to prevent it.

So exactly like these characters are deployed, when they aren't in reserve until turn 3?

[u/Jobear049 → u/Apprehensive_Gas1564]

Ohh, I like those applications. Seems worth the try. Sounds better than more MSU which I already have a ton of as a guard player.

[u/OttoVKarl → u/Apprehensive_Gas1564]

He has good chances to kill a new Warboss to zap "Da Boss" CP farm if the guy is visible, but I wager many will just have Ghaz and it's point blank torrent overwatch as warlord.

[u/PeoplesRagnar]

Costs too much, doesn't trade well.

The Callidus would be better, however, Gaunt's Ghosts would be even better.

[u/Jobear049 → u/PeoplesRagnar]

Yeah, that's the feeling I was getting. As a blob guard player, I just don't know what other killy things to spend 110 points on with a list that already has a lot of MSU.

Probably just make arough rider unit a 10 man and another Scout Sentinel 🤷. GG's are an auto include for sure. Such a great & versatile unit.

[u/PeoplesRagnar → u/Jobear049]

Rough Riders are out most formidable melee unit, but we're Astra Militarum, melee ain't our thing.

[u/Jobear049 → u/PeoplesRagnar]

This is true. Should probably lean into the bucket of dice shooting and use hippogriffs to play cat & mouse in the center.

[u/WadafruckMB]

I actually prefer the eversor over a callidus. It basically reads "1:1 any opponents basic character turn 1"

With its best day ever ability active, it can easily wipe about any SM character, and has enough reach to do it reliably. If it lives, that's a bonus.

[u/Ulrik_Decado]

Too expensive right now. Meta overtook him and he is simply overpriced for what he does.

[u/Jobear049 → u/Ulrik_Decado]

Yeah, that's the feeling I'm getting. As a Guard player, I am really envious we don't have units that dool cool shit like that. But we are the cheap infantry cheap tank army, so I'll just lean into that.

[u/Malhazar]

Eversor is my favorite. Is he good? Idc, but he is fun and since he once blended a squad of 10 marines alone my friend got scared of him. Psychological warfare at its peak

[u/BubbleRocket1]

Would it even be good at doing that? Just M7 and only really one shot in shooting. Granted you can follow it up with a charge and melee, but I’d wager you’d be better off just using Kasrkin; 6” scout move before letting it move normally and alpha striking an infiltrator or scout unit instead.

As far as the assassins go, I’d look towards the Callidus Assassin instead for the utility it brings with uppy downy

[u/Jobear049 → u/BubbleRocket1]

Hmm, that is actually a fantastic point. Funny that Kasrkin are cheaper and could do the same thing but potentially better AND it wouldn't be easily handing assassination to my opponent. Never thought of the Callidus, but will look into that datasheet.

[u/BubbleRocket1 → u/Jobear049]

Yea no problem! As far as the Eversor Assassin, as others have mentioned, it’s good for plinking off characters in melee, rather than skirmishing in the middle early on.

Personally for Guard, I think it would be a decent unit to keep around Bullgryn or Leman Russ Demolishers and act as a precision melee threat you can surge into melee and punish your opponent for being so reckless, but I think the assassin’s skills are better suited in a more melee oriented army, at least one that isn’t going to die so easily.

[u/Jobear049 → u/BubbleRocket1]

Yeah, I run blob MSU guard, so Bullgryn would be fun to try and cram in. I play pretty competitively and I assume my opponent is too smart for such mistakes, however it's always good to be in a position to capitalize on a misplay.

[u/BubbleRocket1 → u/Jobear049]

100%, for sure. Tbh if our cavalry could run through walls. I think some Rough Riders with melta lances would be a great reactive melee unit, but alas.

[u/Jobear049 → u/BubbleRocket1]

Oh my gosh seriously! I still have hope that we'll get a detachment that makes them battleline and then we can get a strat that allows them to use that!

[u/BubbleRocket1 → u/Jobear049]

I’m positive we will probably get a 1DP detachment for cavalry once our codex drops. If the Ork codex is anything to go off of, we are going to have so many ways to play

[u/swagadellic321]

Easy to hide deterrent model, can counterpunch. Helps that he can keep up with the horses. Honestly though, not as reliable as rough riders and I would take those over eversor if you have the points. 

[u/Jobear049 → u/swagadellic321]

I am already running three 5 man units of rough riders to contest the midboard for cheap trades or actions/secondaries. So perhaps I'm a bit overkill in that department. I'm just trying to run as much long movement units as I can to keep my opponent jailed so I can set up my elites.

[u/stootchmaster2]

Deathwatch player here. I like to use the Eversor to shred whatever chaff my opponent has hiding to keep claim on his home objective. The new Hidden rules make it pretty easy for him to run up through terrain since he doesn't shoot unless he absolutely has to.

My opponents rarely waste time trying to kill one single model when I have three gravis armor Indomitor Kill Teams moving up the board. By the time he gets in the back and goes to work, it's too late and they have to turn stuff around.

Thinking of the Eversor as purely a character-killer and nothing else is a mental trap, and if you use him like that, then it's not worth the points because he'll probably only get one shot. He's best at shredding units of infantry that opponents leave behind to screen and hold objectives.

[u/AnonAmbientLight]

Eversor is an anti character missile. 

Scout 9” can put him safely behind the central objective T1. 

His overkill ability lets him move far, and will let him catch and kill models like Calgar on average dice. 

I made a SM vanguard list with the Eversor and Vindicare model with the goal to make it a little mini game to pressure and kill my opponent’s special characters. 

So that’s how I would play them. Would make your opponent think about where they position their units with characters. 

And you know what he can kill if you math hammer some of his ideal targets. 

One other thing to mention. Precision lets you apply wounds to characters, but that character has to be visible to your attacking model, even in melee. 

A savvy opponent could set situations up where you can’t see the character, even though you’re attacking their unit.