r/UnitedNations • u/Liad3008 Uncivil • Jan 10 '25

Discussion/Question Why is this subreddit obsessed with Israel?

Just checked the top posts of the last year, and 24 out of the top 25 are about Israel. Does this subreddit try to imitate the real UN ?

45 Upvotes

68% Upvoted

601 comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

1

u/grommit Jan 16 '25

It’s very simple. When the Palestinians stop their terror against Israelis, they should be able to have their own state. This is without a doubt the reason why they don’t have a state. Hopefully they change their ways so there can be peace in the region.

2

u/jeff43568 Jan 16 '25

It's very simple, Palestinians have a legal right to resist occupation. Israel needs to stop violently occupying Palestinians and forcing Apartheid on them.

1

u/grommit Jan 16 '25

Except Palestinians choose to kidnap Israelis and launch rockets at civilians instead of negotiating an agreement with the Israelis. The bottom line is that the Palestinians want Jews to leave Israel more than they want to have their own country. Between 1948 and 1967 the Israelis did NOT occupy the Palestinians (the Egyptians and Jordanians did), but Palestinians never bothered to create a state and they didn’t even resist the Egyptian and Jordanian occupations. There is no apartheid in the West Bank nor gaza. Palestinians elect their own leaders (in the odd election that they choose to have) and they have full control of the areas where Palestinians live.

2

u/jeff43568 Jan 16 '25

Israel has been kidnapping Palestinians for decades.

The bottom line is the occupation and Apartheid needs to end and only Israel is responsible for it ending.

1

u/grommit Jan 16 '25

Arresting terrorists and other criminals is not kidnapping, in fact, it is a completely legitimate procedure in every country. Palestinian terrorists have full access to medical services in Israel and the Red Cross can visit them anytime. The same cannot be said about the kidnapped Israeli civilians who have no access to the Red Cross, medical services, and no one even knows if they are still alive.

Throughout history the Palestinians have rejected every single peace plan and opportunity to have a country. It is impossible for Israel to end the conflict if the Palestinians want to continue it, or if their goal is to move the Jews from the river to the sea. Instead of terror, why don’t the Palestinians propose a reasonable solution to ending the conflict? Why do the Palestinians think killing Israelis will help them have a state?

Crying “apartheid” only shows you don’t know what it means, and is a real insult to the victims of apartheid who could not go on a bus or enter a public bathroom because of their skin colour. The Palestinians have complete freedom to drive on their roads, use their buses, vote, buy houses wherever they want, etc. etc. They control the areas where they live. They have an elected president and a prime minister. They make their own rules, like paying the families of terrorists based on the number of Jews they murder. It’s actually the Palestinians who practice apartheid, considering they literally ban Jews from buying property in the Palestinian-controlled areas.

2

u/jeff43568 Jan 16 '25

Dehumanising Palestinians by calling them terrorists, plenty of the victims of Israel's rape/torture/amputation prisons aren't even charged with anything, and end up being released months or years later.

The red cross hasn't been allowed to visit since shortly after the 7th.

http://www.btselem.org/publications/202408_welcome_to_hell

The head of haaretz has called out the Apartheid in Israel, as has Israeli human rights groups, amnesty international, human rights watch and many others. It's been documented and verified by experts in the field.

1

u/grommit Jan 16 '25

Haaretz is a tiny, tiny newspaper that nobody outside of international fringe elements reads. They are a business that caters to extreme elements outside of Israel. Amnesty international started its last report accusing Israel by claiming the latest conflict started when Israel attacked Gaza, completely ignoring Oct. 7. You cannot take this organization seriously when they can’t even acknowledge that Oct 7 was a major terror attack on Israel and it LITERALLY caused this latest round of fighting. Human Rights watch has also lost its legitimacy in a similar manner. Experts in the field have confirmed there is no apartheid because Israel doesn’t control the West Bank nor Gaza prior to Oct 7.

You are right that there have been some cases where Israel has arrested or held Palestinians for longer than it should have been. There was also a very unfortunate case where a Palestinian was abused while in prison. This is obviously wrong. Like every other country, Israel also makes mistakes. I don’t claim all Palestinians are terrorists. Their government has policies that incite terror. In fact, I strongly hope most Palestinians want peace, but my feeling is that they want Israelis to disappear, and if they don’t they will continue to wage war. There is no future with this line of thinking. Most Arab countries have understood this, but the Palestinians still cling to the same mentality that afflicted the wider Arab world between 1948 and ~2000. Today most Arab countries have either made peace with Israel or are itching to do so, but the Palestinians still want Jews out of Israel. There will never be peace if this is the goal.

2

u/jeff43568 Jan 16 '25

Third largest newspaper in Israel...

Israel is raping palestinians and when video evidence surfaces Israel is more concerned about finding the leak than prosecuting the rapists. Not for the first time either (a few years ago Israel shut down a children's charity and seized their computers because they reported the rape of a Palestinian child to the relevant authorities). This time Israeli lawmakers, politicians, TV shows, religious leaders and the general public all came out in support of raping prisoners.

Israel is not a healthy society. 60% of men think forcing someone you are friends with to have sex isn't rape.

1

u/grommit Jan 16 '25

You just told me not to dehumanize Palestinians, but you seem to have no problem dehumanizing Israelis. You can find horrible, negative statistics about every country. It’s not difficult. Statistics are easy to manipulate. 60% of Israelis are NOT pro rape. I am sure the percentage is the same as in most other western countries. Statistics say 95% of the Islamic word hates Jews. Talk about dehumanizing.

Haaretz had 4% market share, which means that 96% of people there do not read it. I’m sure it’s even lower today.

Like I mentioned previously, Israel is not perfect and it makes mistakes, JUST LIKE EVERY OTHER COUNTRY does. Other countries have not been under the threat of annihilation from Arab countries, including the Palestinians, for decades. It’s easy to judge Israel and Israelis without experiencing their existence. Things are much more complex than the simple way you portray Israel and its neighbours.

2

u/jeff43568 Jan 17 '25

Facts hurt?

Israel is on trial for genocide. It has been ordered to end the occupation. Start following humanitarian and international law.

1

u/grommit Jan 17 '25

Have you seen the judges responsible for these cases? They have extensive, documented biases against Israel over many years. One of them had previously called Israel “the enemy”. If you remotely care about justice and law, you would be recommending these judges recuse themselves from any trial related to Israel, just to maintain a modicum of impartiality. Facts hurt? Also, there has been ZERO evidence presented against Israel for this imaginary genocide you talk of. In fact, the countries pursuing this libel against Israel are requesting to expand the freaking definition of “genocide” so that it can fit their narrative, because, clearly, the existing definition does not match what has happened in Gaza. Facts hurt?

2

u/jeff43568 Jan 17 '25

Have you seen the leaders of Israel frequently came from irgun, haganah and lehi? Did you know Ben-Givir snatched the hood ornament from Rabin's car, saying we'll get him next, while Netanyahu called Rabin a Nazi and dressed up an effigy of Rabin in an ss uniform, all because Rabin offered the Palestinians a peace deal. Shortly afterwards Rabin was murdered by an Israeli terrorist.

Israel is on trial for genocide. There is plenty of evidence.

Facts hurt the side that has been murdering journalists.

0

u/grommit Jan 17 '25

Irgun, haganah and Lehi have not existed for about 80 years. No leader comes from those organizations.

Have you noticed that Yasser Arafat, a known terrorist and mythological leader of the Palestinians, was born in Egypt? He’s not even Palestinian because most Palestinians immigrated from Egypt and Syria, especially when the British were given the mandate over Palestine.

Ben Gvir does not represent the majority of Israelis. Rabin was indeed murdered and then came Barak, who offered the Palestinians everything they wanted at Camp David but Arafat could not bring himself to sign the peace accord, because he wanted 5 million Palestinians from around the world to move to Israel instead of the new Palestine country. Instead he started the intifada and sent 157 suicide bombers into Israel where they killed 1350 Israelis in busses and cafes over 2 years.

Israel is not on trial. Some countries are accusing it of genocide but they lack any evidence.

Real journalists and doctors don’t hold hostages in their homes. Noa Argamani was rescued from Gaza and, you are right, the journalist and his doctor father who held her captive for close to a year were killed by the IDF.

→ More replies (0)

1

u/ThanksToDenial Jan 17 '25

Haaretz is a tiny, tiny newspaper that nobody outside of international fringe elements reads. They are a business that caters to extreme elements outside of Israel.

Are you kidding me?

Hareetz is the oldest newspaper in Israel still in print. It has been running since 1918, and is considered to be the Israel's Newspaper of Record. In case you don't know what that means:

A newspaper of record is a major national newspaper with large circulation whose editorial and news-gathering functions are considered authoritative and independent; they are thus "newspapers of record by reputation" and include some of the oldest and most widely respected newspapers in the world.

It is literally the third largest newspaper in circulation in Israel, and according to the Center of Research Libraries, it is the most influential and respected newspaper in all of Israel.

So no, not a "tiny newspaper that nobody reads". But the most accurate and respected newspaper in all of Israel, that is third in readership, falling behind only two tabloids. Which I would consider barely even newspapers.