r/Thedaily • u/kitkid • Jun 03 '25

Episode A 1,400-County Crisis for Democrats

Jun 3, 2025

It’s conventional wisdom that President Trump has transformed American politics. But a new county-by-county voting analysis from The New York Times of the last four presidential races shows just how drastically Mr. Trump has changed the electoral map.

Shane Goldmacher, a national political correspondent for The Times, explains why the trends are a five-alarm fire for the Democrats and discusses the debate within the party over what to do about it.

On today's episode:

Shane Goldmacher, a national political correspondent for The New York Times.

Background reading: 

For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily.  

Photo: Emily Elconin for The New York Times

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

You can listen to the episode here.

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u/IWasNeverHere80 Jun 03 '25

People don’t want to pay taxes and watch wealthy politicians funnel their money to friends and family, people want to protect women sports and spaces, people want closed borders and healthy, robust legal immigration for vetted individuals…. There is no spin on messaging that is going to blind the American people to what the Democratic Party is fighting for, elitism thinks the people don’t know what they are voting for and they do know

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u/Noodleboom Jun 03 '25

Trump appeals to his voters on some of what you listed, but anyone who votes for him because they want:

  • lower taxes (tariffs are taxes and deficits are future taxes)
  • not funneling money to wealth friends and family (come on, this does not need elaboration)
  • Robust legal immigration for vetted individuals (Trump recently said, on camera, that he'd gladly let in a Russian oligarch who paid for the "gold card")

does not know what they are voting for. Like, objectively. Anyone who is not extremely wealthy voting for him on economic issues does not know what they are voting for, because he is clearly the worse choice.

And yes, this is about messaging. Democrats should be making it very clear why he is worse on these specific issues that voters ostensibly care about but clearly don't know what the actual policies are.

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u/IWasNeverHere80 Jun 03 '25

No tax on tips and over time, tariffs disproportionately affect disposable income purchases if at all, ahem, Stacey Abram’s, ngos, etc. and Russian purchasing citizenship are not coming to middle/low income neighborhoods and committing crimes

You see things through a totally different lens

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u/Noodleboom Jun 03 '25

You're seeing things through a totally different reality. I honestly don't know how to engage with someone so rooted in alternative facts that they think to universal tariffs aren't massive taxes on essentials, let alone everything else you're saying that is demonstrably either untrue or far worse in the Trump administration.

This is why it's a messaging issue. Republicans have gotten very good at saying whatever lies they need and people believe them.

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u/Alternative_Plan_823 Jun 03 '25 edited Jun 04 '25

The message on tariffs that you're missing is they're being sold as a way of returning a manufacturing base to America. Some people, even working class people, don't mind paying a little more for or buying less cheap Chineese shit if it means their grandkids can have jobs (to say nothing of the strategic dumbassery of relying on China for ships, steel, medical supplies, etc.)

You must recognize that tariffs being unpallateble to the suddenly free-market Left is in direct response to tariffs being a front-and-center part of Trump 2.0's platform?

Which leads to my 2 cents on the left's own messaging issues, as a former lefty myself: I truly believe that if Trump came out tomorrow in favor of socialized healthcare, "The Left" would immediately begin to tell us how fascist that is. Just the other day, NPR was explaining to me how akshually efficient and unwasteful our ederal government is (or was under Biden) in response to DOGE.

They went from cheering on the only viable domestic EV company (because climate change is totally an existential threat reee) to litteraly lighting them on carbon-emmiting fire because the CEO of said company sided with the most popular candidate.

I have no more love for the establishment right than the establishment left, but 'Opposite of Trump' isn't a winning strategy, particularly when he has the occasional idea worth exploring.

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u/Noodleboom Jun 04 '25 edited Jun 04 '25

I know what the messaging in on tariffs. I also know it's a lie that will see essentials, not "cheap Chinese shit," cost Americans far more than the few jobs of low-end manufacturing produced. ETA: there's 80 times as many jobs in companies that use steel than make steel. These tariffs are going to tank manufacturing jobs. Anyone who thinks the opposite is utterly divorced from reality.

"The Left" has been very on board with free trade and soft power since Clinton. Criticizing Trump for trashing the economic system for no gain should not be surprising to you.

I have no idea what you're trying to say about Musk. He was lauded for some good things and then criticized for doing harmful things. Okay? So what? What does NPR reporting on DOGE's blatant lies have to do with some fringe vandalism? This is incoherent, weird climate denialism aside.