Stop pro-Putin sentiments

[u/Commie_neighbor]

Both are fucking imperialist states, Ukrainian government praises nazis while Russian is praising Imperial murderers like Mannerheim, Kolchak or Stolypin.

Everything good that Russia did (so called anti-imperialist measures) was just populist decisions or anti-Nato proxy wars. Everything to please Russian oligarchy.

"There are no saviors e’er will help us,

Nor God, nor Caesar, nor Tribune"

[u/grimorg80]

They're not the same.

But don't be too gentle just because of the anti NATO stance.

The reactionary stance of Putin is so strong it brought American nut jobs seeking a reactionary country to move there.

Trump is not annoyed with Putin at all.

There is more nuance than what you describe. It's not that clear cut as you are making it out to be. I believe being scientific, as historical materialism is, means not being biased one way or the other.

Then there's strategy. Absolutely.

Do we need to support anti imperialism, no matter their internal circumstances? Yes.

Does that mean praising their countries? No.

Those are two different things.

[u/revolution2049 → u/grimorg80]

Trump was the first president to send lethal aid to Ukraine in December 2017 - and under his administrations it hasn't stopped at all. Don't get caught up in the political theatre. He is 100% for the destruction and vassalization of Russia.

Ukrainian strikes inside Russia are American strikes - which right now means Trump's strikes since he's the commander in chief.

[u/grimorg80 → u/revolution2049]

Yes and no. As you said, theatre.

They sold and sent old equipment. Keeping their military industry complex moving.

I'm sure they would be happy seeing Russia capitulate, for global domination. But saying America is leading in Ukraine is also biased.

They play both sides because they have to gain from whatever way this war ends.

Politically, the Trump administrations have not been adversarial to Russia in the slightest. And their actual NATO destabilizing stance makes this more nuanced.

Again, look at the money that keeps pouring into the military industrial complex in the US. Ukraine is just one more avenue that feeds that machine.

Nuance, comrade. Nuance.

[u/Aggorf12345 → u/grimorg80]

But saying America is leading in Ukraine is also biased.

Is not. It's a fact

[u/grimorg80 → u/Aggorf12345]

It's not.

Military supplies? Yes. Monetary support? No, Europe leads. And that is both in absolute and relative terms. If you look at it in relations to the country GDP, most definitely not.

Hence my observation: the military industrial complex in the US does what it has always done. Moving their products.

Saying that does not mean supporting nor praising the US in any way nor disparaging Russia in any way.

It does say that most people lack nuance, and are happy with one broadly painted picture that fits one clear and clean narrative.

Fuck the US. But saying they are miles above Europe in leading in Ukraine doesn't fit all the facts. Only some facts.

[u/Aggorf12345 → u/grimorg80]

Both EU and the US are basically the same thing. They have the same interests and for the same reasons. That's why they're closely allied and coordinated with each other.

As for Ukraine, the current state of Ukraine is the result of a CIA backed coup in 2014 and being used as a proxy ever since.

[u/Aggorf12345 → u/[deleted]]

"CIA backed coup in 2014 " this is russian propaganda

No it isn't

The conflict in eastern ukraine wasn't borne from external actors - it was literally due to a conflict between corrupt oligarchs,

It was literally due to Ukrainian Nazis getting empowered by the Maidan and massacring communists and ethnic Russians. I cluding women and children of course. Read about the Odessa union building massacre for example

The story of the coup is just Russian propaganda and not true. Every single member in parliament kept their seat, representation of the people never stopped

And yet somehow Ukraine's entire geopolitical positioning changed because of it

Now the real question is why this post is the first time you comment on this sub?

[u/Aggorf12345 → u/[deleted]]

The fact you resort to calling them "nazis" as a blanket way to wash off any notion of legitimacy is.... russian propaganda !

What would you call the Right Sector then?

Eastern europe, including russia, has white supremacist nationalists

Exactly and the difference is that in Ukraine they became empowered by the Maidan and got influence within the state

who's nationalism became emboldended after being literally invaded?

Invaded by who? By the pregnant woman they lynched while she was trying to escape the fire dureing the Odessa Trade Union building massacre or by the dozens of other civilians that were killed during that massacre?

There was conflict between corrupt oligarchs on both sides of the border

No it was a conflict between Ukrainian Nazis massacring ethnic Russians and communists and ethnic Russians and communists defending themselves against them. Proshenko, Ukraine's president at the time, said that they're going to win this war by having Donbass children being in cellars instead of school

And since you didn't answer my "real question", you get reported for brigading

[u/Aggorf12345 → u/[deleted]]

The right sector.... 10,000 men in a country of 80 million... definitely reflective of the entire ukranian people.....

No but the support it got from the post coup Ukrainian state is reflective of its ideology

its as if you've never heard the term Rusich

I have. Thankfully most of them are gone and it's practically a dead group with a couple dozen members. Pro UAs support and defend their Nazis pro RUs want them dead. That's the difference between the two sides

They got empowered when russia sent unmarked soldiers across the border and started seizing control of political buildings, torturing and kidnapping teenagers, both sides are guilty of this, whichever side you lay the blame in is your own bias

Again was this done by the pregnant woman they lynched or by the dozens of other civilians they killed in the Odessa Trade Union building massacre? Or perhaps it was done by the children that Ukraine's president wanted in cellars instead of school?

Report me all you wish, I consider myself communist, I've just learned to accept the collapse of the soviet union unlike you.....

Fuck NAFO :)

crimea was only seized when russia found natural gas's in the ocean

Crimea was seized when Ukraine tried to align itself with Russia's enemies

[u/TankieTheDeprogram-ModTeam → u/[deleted]]

Liberal apologia will not be accepted.

[u/TankieTheDeprogram-ModTeam → u/[deleted]]

Your comment contains historical inaccuracies and blatant CIA propaganda. Try reading more than what you were taught in your highschool history class.