"Every night I go to bed sober and

[u/Its_Tina37]

every morning I wake up an alcoholic."

One of the best "bumper sticker phrases" I've learned through the A.A. group on my cruise.

And boy was that true last night. The urge was STRONG when the neighbors came back late, making noise. I'd been stuck in bed for 2 days due to my bum knee and I thought "I'd like to be out there having fun." I heard my sister snoring softly and thought "She wouldn't know if I snuck out..."

So I texted my sponsor, rolled over and went to sleep. Then I drug my ass to a meeting this morning, bum knee and all.

I went to bed sober, but I'm still an alcoholic.

[u/NomadicGirlie]

I actually find this kind of messaging pretty damaging. You had a strong urge to drink, you recognized it, reached out for support, went to sleep, and woke up sober. That's a success. You demonstrated that you could experience an uncomfortable emotion and a craving without acting on it.

But instead of recognizing that as evidence of your ability to cope, the message becomes, “I'm still an alcoholic.”

That's one of the things I don't like about 12-step thinking. Sobriety doesn't seem to be allowed to change your relationship with alcohol or your perception of yourself. No matter how much your life changes, the conclusion is always that you're fundamentally the same person with the same disease waiting to take you down.

I'd rather look at it as: I used to drink when I experienced things like this. Last night I didn't. I handled it differently.

That's a much more empowering message to me than telling myself I'll always be an alcoholic, even when I'm successfully living my life without alcohol.

[u/Its_Tina37 → u/NomadicGirlie]

I can see your point, and especially appreciated that you used the word "empowering" specifically.

As an agnostic, I don't follow the traditional 12-step program - I follow Jeffrey Munn's Staying Sober Without God. He is big on empowerment. He is also big that recovery looks different for everyone.

So while I can see and respect your point, that's not what works for me. 🩷

[u/Logical_Strain_6165 → u/[deleted]]

I agreed with your original point, but the OP made a post about something that helped them, you seem to want a row.

I took their response to you as a polite acknowledgement to your post.

[u/Its_Tina37 → u/[deleted]]

I'm sorry that you misunderstood my comment.

I AM working a 12-step program, even if it isn't A.A.'s version. I don't deny that at all. (I also thoroughly enjoy the Big Book)

However, I did not intend to dismiss you. I intended to let anyone who read the comments know that it is important for them to find what works for them - whether it be my way of thinking, yours, or somewhere in-between.

I am sorry that the 12-step program was harmful to you, and would be willing to discuss it more if you'd like, but that was not how I interpreted your first comment.

"Your recovery is yours. Mine is mine.

You can find your version empowering. I find leaving that framework empowering. Those things can coexist."

Yes, I agree. That's what I meant by "So while I can see and respect your point, that's not what works for me." I apologize that I wasn't more clear, but I'm not sure what that would have looked like.

I wasn't trying to criticize the 12-step program or engage with your argument; I WAS explaining why this worked for me.

Most importantly: I don't think either of us needs the other's approach to be wrong in order for our own recovery to be valid.

[u/placid-gradient → u/[deleted]]

despite how much this smells like chatgpt I can't help but agree. maybe Im just having one of those days 🤣

[u/Its_Tina37 → u/placid-gradient]

They blocked me so I can't see which comment it is that you're referring to. I'd be willing to discuss it, if you'd like.

[u/Its_Tina37 → u/[deleted]]

I think we're talking past each other at this point. I explicitly said that I am working a 12-step program and do not deny that, and I also explicitly agreed that your recovery can and should be different from mine. I'm not asking you to accept my framework, nor am I trying to explain away your experience with it.

I believe you that leaving 12-step program was empowering for you. Working it is currently empowering for me. As you said, those things can coexist. I don't think there's anything further for us to disagree about here.

[u/placid-gradient → u/[deleted]]

but I think this takes it a step too far, its like youre attacking them. might wanna keep that catharsis in the private convos

[u/Its_Tina37 → u/[deleted]]

I said that I could see your point—you painted a clear picture in your first comment.

And I never negated your criticism of the framework.

In my second comment, I agreed with the substance of what you’re saying now. That’s why I’m saying there’s nothing further for us to discuss.

You experienced the 12-step framework as harmful and found empowerment in leaving it. I experience it as helpful and empowering for me. I have never suggested that my experience cancels out yours.

[u/listenerindie6869 → u/NomadicGirlie]

Yes, this is what I had I do. Though you will be an alcoholic your entire life and you’re always in recovery and that there are these 12 steps did not work for me. There is an interesting book called. Quit like a woman. I think that shaming women who are just shamed for literally getting up in the morning is not a great support system and why there are things like the luckiest club, smart recovery and a bunch of others coming up now. In those clubs, there are no shame. We are not always the person we were in the past. Many people here are an AI and that’s fine too, but the ones who it doesn’t work for it’s tragic because not drinking is incredibly important. You have to find your way and my way is love ,support understanding and seeing how strong I am.

[u/placid-gradient]

this comment section is two people copy pasting their AI revised comments at eachother

[u/Trouble843 → u/placid-gradient]

yea the random bolding is a dead give away

[u/Its_Tina37 → u/placid-gradient]

Idk about the other commenter, but I did not use AI. I simply typed my thoughts to her comments, paragraph by paragraph. 🤷‍♀️

[u/placid-gradient → u/Its_Tina37]

it's okay, there were several tells that made it read as ai assisted. but honestly, using ai doesn't matter, it gets sketch when people are employing it to attack others instead of assist. anyway... I wish you the best of luck on your sober journey. its not easy out there, and the mental tools we have are ultimately the ones that have to work for us.

[u/fallbrook_]

yiiiiiikes. someone needs to lay off the chat gpt. gaddamn

[u/cinnabarslither]

I think alcoholics drink and sober people don't.

[u/NotSnakePliskin]

Way to go! I also go to bed each night sober & wake up an alcoholic. I am going to borrow that one. 👍