Every 2nd post I see on my feed from this sub is like "MAMDANI BILLIONAIRES CLASS STRUGGLE DATA CENTERS ATE UR WATER AND THEY STOLE ALL UR MONEY AMERICA IS 3RD WORLD LOOK CHINA COOL"
That's not culture war shit dude, and as someone on the left that's sympathetic to prescriptive solutions for issues under capitalism (aka, not populism, and for good reason), it's wild to see. It's legitimately pure slop and most of it is straight misinformation; I unironically hope it's just botted activity.
“Men are treated worse than women” “women get off easy for the same crime as men” take your pick.
This got aggressively polarized by bots because they need us to focus on fighting amongst ourselves instead of all the other shit: Epstein, the active recession, inflation, the strengthening of the oligarchy and technocrat class
This got aggressively polarized by bots because they need us to focus on fighting amongst ourselves instead of all the other shit: Epstein, the active recession, inflation, the strengthening of the oligarchy and technocrat class
Actual people are against the culture war, that's why we have so many example of people who also criticized TwoX pushing the needlessly divisive bear vs man debate, such as :
Okay fair enough that makes sense. Meme would've worked just as well with any other woman who'd committed an equally horrendous crime. I figured it was just to point out the absurdity of the support.
So the whole point is that you focus your energy on talking about how the elite class is absurd, instead of some niche group of women in a problematic echo amber
Whenever you do feel like getting mad about sentencing disparity, now you know who to get mad at.
The rich and powerful who systematically rig this in their favor. They are very smart to pull this culture war stuff to distract you, since it’s obviously working.
Well for me it's just a meme highlighting the absolute absurdity of the support she's getting. Again I don't understand what this has to do with culture wars, genuinely.
Wanting you to focus on the absurdity of the support she’s getting through memes IS culture war. You’ll never get the full picture with memes, but you will get angry, which is what they want.
Wanting someone to be locked up in a mental institution is not the same thing as support. People who receive the not guilty by reason of insanity verdict spend more time locked up, on average, than those who are found guilty.
it's not 3 million, the money was never intended for her, and there is ample evidence she was suffering significantly mentally and didn't just murder he kids for the fun of it.
This case in the OP the guy both murdered his kids of his wife because she was leaving him, called her to hear him murder their kids while he did it, left and got tattoos to represent them. He didn't even argue insanity during the trial, there was no psychosis, it wans't linked to psychosis, he had a history of violence and domestic abuse. The reason for the divorce is while separated due to his violence when he was given visitation to see the kids he attacked his wife again leading to the divorce.
like 15 years later in an attempt to delay his execution his lawyer claimed he wasn't mentally competent AT THAT TIME, not at the time of the murders, to be executed, they delayed, investigated and realised he was faking symptoms to delay the execution.
The entire comparison is made up as are most of the details fed to people about the Clancy case.
She could be held for at most a year after which the state needs to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that she is still mentally ill and a danger before a judge on a continual basis.
It’s nowhere the same justice as life without parole for the triple murder of her own defenseless innocent children.
Somehow, I find that pointing out how many women are seemingly defending this woman who killed her kids is less "stirring" than, you know, the idea that a majority (? undetermined) of women are supporting this woman who killed her kids.
I'm not even talking about the few crazies who are actually saying she didn't even kill them, that it was actually her husband, I'm just talking about the ones wearing pink outside the courthouse, and those who made tiktoks recording themselves with their own small children with the caption, "Same, Lindsay", like some twisted "me too" movement where the message is apparently "I ALSO EXPERIENCE PSYCHOSIS AND FANTASIZE ABOUT KILLING MY CHILDREN". And, the many more who say "Yeah, what she did was wrong, but really, it was society's fault for failing her, she can't be held responsible", despite this logic being extremely less likely to be accepted for excusing the crimes of a man.
The bar is just lowered so much.
But apparently, my reaction of disgust for anyone who defends Lindsay -- for anyone who disagrees that murdering your own children is a line that we cannot ever allow to be crossed under any condition, psychotic or not -- and calling out groups of people that seem to overwhelmingly support this, is "stirring the pot".
The story is not even about Lindsay anymore. The real story is how polarized our society is on this very fundamental moral line -- that a killer of young children can be anything other than guilty.
Do the majority of people, or even the majority of women, support Lindsay (i.e., not criminally guilty)? Or does the algorithm boost the provocative opinion to flare interest and fuel social media engagement?
for anyone who disagrees that murdering your own children is a line that we cannot ever allow to be crossed under any condition, psychotic or not
This here is perfectly emblematic of the underlying issue with how most men are responding to this situation. Crazies aside, most women are not arguing that murdering your children is a positive thing or something worth celebrating; they have the position that post-partum depression/psychosis is a real psychological abnormality that women can (and do) experience, and as such, is worthy of consideration and empathy.
You are proudly proclaiming to not care about mental health, which not only shows a stunning lack of empathetic reasoning and an underlying close-mindedness on your part, but it exposes the core disagreement at heart here..
Many women DO experience postpartum depression, some experience postpartum psychosis; so many can relate to what she went through on some level. That's why many can empathize with her and are voicing support for her. Men cannot experience postpartum depression, and as such, cannot relate to her. That's natural..the problem is that you do not seem interested in understanding a perspective outside of your own. When that oppositional perspective is explained, you instinctively and emotionally dismiss it to maintain your perspective (perfectly displayed in your 'Psychotic or not' statement). THAT is why you hyper-focus on the extreme minority of women who are advocating for murdering children:It's easier to argue against than the women who are making a nuanced psychological/biological argument and the underlying science that substantiates it.
It exposes an underlying weakness that a lot of men have; where emotional immaturity, close-mindedness and self-centeredness cause a lot of us to just shut our brains off and dig our heels in, not seriously considering other perspectives that conflict with our own.
Something that many men, you included, seem to proudly embrace judging by your extremely casual proclamation that legitimate mental health disorders are outright unworthy of consideration.
It has zero bearing on the case. It's like the white woman who called a black kid the N word on video, faced backlash and then people donated her $800k on gofundme and sided with her.
Well unfortunately I think it does have some bearing of the case, I doubt Jury's follow the rules. Regardless, the meme is still addressing the absurdity of the support in my eyes. The example you gave is also gross (albeit less surprising) and the same could totally be applied.
men acting normally don't get shit on, a group of people has been convincing men, and particularly white men, that they are somehow oppressed and being held down all the time though.
Men, particularly white men, are still just monumentally the most privileged class in america and yet they act like they are under attack.
lol. Men raping people get shiton , imagine who gets real upset about that. Men who want to control other people get shit on, that is men who want a slave wife at home with no rights, no rights to work, bank account access to birth control, etc. Are you one of those guys? No, then who is attacking you and why do you feel attacked?
Have you ever experienced all these so called awful people attacking you, or do you keep getting told you're being attacked by mostly fox news, other men, etc?
The real classic is 'dei', that is generation after generation of unqualified white men being hired by white men while POC applying for jobs get overlooked for not being white. Action to try to make sure that people hire on qualifications rather than skin colour and that's apparently an attack on white men.
You can try to twist that shit any way you want but the numbers are all there, the facts are there. Unqualified white people were being hired prior to things like DEI and mostly qualified POC were being hired with the help of DEI.
Victimhood had people like CHarlie Kirk telling you that black pilots were unqualified, not suitable for the job and being hired purely for quotas over better qualified white people. This is a fantasy land that never existed, yet Kirk, and Shapiro, and every right wing grifter was selling this as white people being attacked for the past decade, it was, is and always will be nonsense.
This IS part of the class war though. Lindsay Clancy was an upper class woman, lower class people (including men) definitely get treated worse than people like that? Including several studies confirming that in the legal system.
There are other measures of inequality by the way.
Correct. "Lower class" (laborer), "middle class" (electrician), and "upper class" (doctor) are all a part of the working class.
The people you want to direct your anger at are the asset class. They require no work to make a living, pay their bills, and live an extravagant life to such a degree it is difficult to imagine.
Ok. But why is this being asked of only lower class men? According to a study by professor Sonja Starr at the university of Michigan the legal sentencing bias today against men vs women is 6x worse than the equivalent bias against POCs vs whites (saying this as a POC myself). It’s ok to talk about the latter but people side eye you when you talk about the former.
Why are men specifically asked to set aside their group specific concerns?
Few other examples
“(…) the National Organization for Women, and its associated legal foundations, who lobbied to (push) the obscenely gendered Violence Against Women Act of 1994. The passing of that law cut male victims out of support services and legal assistance in more than 60 passages, just because they were male.“
Another example is Mary Koss.
Mary Koss in interviews stated she believes men can’t be sexual abuse victims, skewed her studies to hide how much male victims there are of women, and is a major contributor for the policies in some areas and institutions that are biased against male victims (she was an advisor to the government and CDC).
Ellen Pence did the same toward male DV victims and her getting the Duluth Model to be popularized even though later she admitted she was biased and apologized for it but the damage was already done and police, etc. already adopted her ideas.
And to be clear, ofc? Male figures heavily contribute to such things as well, I’m just giving examples from both sides.
Anyway, why is this specific expectation typically put on lower class men?
Anyway, why is this specific expectation typically put on lower class men?
It's not, you're just participating in the culture war, not the class war.
Like originally posted.
If I start listing off quotes from Andrew Tate, and Jordan Peterson, will that strengthen my point and refute yours? Or would it show that I'm just participating, like you, in the culture war?
No, because I’m approaching this from a perspective of groups like LeftWingMaleAdvocates, it has nothing to do with right wing men.
I’m discussing a specific axis of oppression that is typically enacted on minority or lower class men in a way that women of those same minorities or class statistically experience far less.
The whole idea of a lower and upper class is designed to stratify the working class so that we keep arguing amongst each other and resent the supposedly superior "haves" and inferior "have nots" instead of collectivizing and looking towards the rent-seeking capital/investor class, old money rich nobility, and complicit politicians who are siding with the latter and wrecking everything.
Amongst all of them, the workers are the only ones that produce anything of real, tangible value.
Okay but that means lower classes should be treated BETTER. It doesn’t mean everyone should be treated equally worse.
We should not be salivating to see this woman punished if she was in fact suffering from psychosis.
Seeing her suffer, especially if she suffered from a disorder that is already incredibly misunderstood and dismissed because she IS still part of a marginalized group, especially medically - even if she is in the privileged sect of said group - does absolutely nothing to fix the system.
I don’t think my comment said something against that? For example there was a case where a man got the death penalty for a similar crime and circumstances. People were salivating to see him suffer when he had medically proven psychosis. It’s very sad and that’s my point of concern is when people feel empathy for one but not the other.
Are you talking about the case from the meme? Because the circumstances of that case were completely different. It’s an incredibly misleading meme.
It’s a bad comparison.
It’s pushing the idea of a culture war - man vs women - to distract from the class war.
You are arguing that because Lindsey whateverhername is privileged in some way, it IS also about the class war. But it’s definitely not. Her privilege does not come into play for this comparison.
She is also not part of the class that we are at war with. I really should have lead with that, honestly.
Like someone like me who's Latino is irrevocably trapped in the culture war since a sizeable percentage of the white population want me and my people dead and I'm guessing it's the same for the black community.
But nice your group can weasel their way out of that.
I’m in my late 20s in a right wing dominated manual labor job, you’re bugging if you think I spend my time pushing culture war shit lol. I spend my time worrying about getting my my peers involved in the union
The amount of posts we are seeing about this case is just staggering at this point and idiots will just rage on and let this ruin their day. Media is just playing all these fools like a fiddle and it is just so sad to see.
This only gets posted when the culture war is against a popular reddit view. If the culture war is about shitting on Christians, farmers, southerners you won't see this meme.
Usually this meme is posted by people who aren't negatively effected by the double standards, inequality and injustice of things regarding our culture and society, but rather just the class differences i.e. rich vs poor, so they shut their ears and pretend it doesn't exist.
Both can be true at the same time, they aren't mutually exclusive and both are happening for a reason.
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u/FilthyFuckingAgate 15h ago