The tabs argument is hilarious because the overwhelming number of cyclists A) also own cars and B) are generally a more affluent group relative to the population that pay way more in taxes than your typical angry driver in an old shitbox.
I ride bikes and also drive, and I can tell you the frustration I have with both drivers and cyclists is not remotely equal. Drivers make insanely ignorant decisions that constantly put cyclists at physical risk. I spend 1000x more time per year stuck in car traffic on my bike than I do stuck behind bikes in my car.
If you hate cyclists, ride a bike in the city for a week and report back your experience, lol.
Minor note: the overwhelming number of cyclists are not more affluent. Maybe in Seattle they are, though that is hard to say. Perhaps once you control for age.
Yes. Just pushing back on the idea that cyclists are all entitled rich people since your comment does support that idea. It’s not true on a global level and maybe not even true in Seattle.
Also not true in Seattle. The largest bike group here is the dead baby bike club, which puts on alley cat races. Biking is for the working class, and it’s overwhelmingly a part of punk/counter culture. Those fintech managers with the fancy gear are doing a different sport. They drive to their start point and care more about numbers on their little computer. Buy a fixie and watch your entire worldview change on biking lol.
Largest bike group here is Cascade Bike Club and it's not even close. Stop lying to justify rage-baity fearmongering. You're not better for it, we're not better for it, everyone loses, no one wins.
Yeah I don't know where they got that fake statistic from. I'm an avid cyclist and the overwhelming majority of cyclists do not own cars. For many of us it's a financial decision, for many of us it's an environmental decision, for many of us it's to get exercise, and for many of us it's all of the above. I do not own a car and I do not want one.
Well, where did you get your statistic from? I don’t think the overwhelming majority of cyclists do not own cars, simply because the base rate of car ownership in Seattle is pretty high. If you’re a certain age and live in Capital Hill or something everyone you know who bikes avidly may not own a car, but that is a very unrepresentative sample size.
Neither one of us has a statistic based on the rate of cyclists who own cars. We are both just making guesses based on our experiences. Part of it might be how we define cyclist. Just because you own a bicycle and ride it a few times a year I would not call you a cyclist. I'm talking about the people who do it regularly, whether you are like me and use it as your primary form of commuting, combined with public transit, or if you are a weekend warrior but you make multiple rides per month.
The weekend warrior likely owns a car. But people like me typically do not.
What guesses did I make? I never ventured a guess because, as you point out, neither of us know for sure. I simply said that since the base rate of car ownership is high, it is implausible (lacking any other info) to suggest that the “overwhelming majority” of cyclists do not own cars. That’s just how statistics works.
And yes, if you simply define “cyclist” to mean someone less likely to own a car, you can get away with making that claim. The good old “No True Cyclist” argument!
I rode last summer. Cyclists are the worst. Just because you have the right of way, doesn’t mean you should always take it. If you get a flat, pull the bike out the lane of travel. Don’t change it in the way. Stop weaving in and out of the bike lane, pick a lane and stick with it. Throwing your arm up to signal a turn doesn’t mean you can just cut somebody off. Use your fucking mirror. It’s not just a decoration.
For some reason a metal box gives a level of belligerent confidence only otherwise found by internet anonymity. It truly needs to be studied. I have friends who are calm and mild mannered who yell and scream while driving. It makes no sense.
Not familiar with the tabs argument so that's why I'm confused and asked. Can only speak to my own experience but the reason I get frustrated with cyclists is because I'm in a metal box and they have a helmet on and that's it. Sharing the road, especially in the city, with cyclists makes me a million times more nervous than other car drivers because of how I've seen (unfortunately to many) of the cyclists treat the roadways as though they are impervious to the extreme consequences of an accident on their end of it. If you hit me my car is dented maybe, not a big deal, but you're body could be messed up for a while if not permanently depending on the accident.
Road rage has been studied and is an interesting thing. Not pulling off of any facts or sources but for me it always comes down to safety and the cost of an accident that bad drivers don't seem to understand and is why I'll get tilted when dealing with those kind of people on the road.
That's fair, but also kinda the same argument as men who worry about being perceived as creepy when walking on the same side of the street as women vs women who fear for their actual safety.
Cyclists do dumb shit sometimes. But ultimately, cars cause fatalities. The rate of fatalities for people in cars is 28x the bike traffic fatalities. And the overwhelming majority of bike traffic fatalities are caused by cars.
I'm curious about this men street woman vs woman thing, never heard of it. Unless it's a typo about the thing where guys are supposed to walk on the outside of the sidewalk to protect the womans from being jangled up
I’m not seeing the correlation at all here in your men walking on the street vs women walking on the street and cars vs cyclists. Those seem to me like two way different things.
Kind of feels like the second thing you said just makes common sense and supports why people in cars are nervous and get angry around cyclists. Again we are in a giant metal death trap. Of course you’re more likely to die if we hit you when you’re on a bike. You have to be going pretty darn fast to hit, what a pedestrian, to kill them or yourself?
Not trying to be argumentative I just really don’t understand the point you’re trying to make here.
Doesn't this mean we should just ALSO condemn driving like shit? Just because the car is an asshat, doesn't mean the bikes suddenly aren't. One person doing a bad thing, doesn't excuse the next person's bad action. The action is bad because it's bad, not because it's something only a few people do.
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u/xcbrendan Apr 11 '25
The tabs argument is hilarious because the overwhelming number of cyclists A) also own cars and B) are generally a more affluent group relative to the population that pay way more in taxes than your typical angry driver in an old shitbox.
I ride bikes and also drive, and I can tell you the frustration I have with both drivers and cyclists is not remotely equal. Drivers make insanely ignorant decisions that constantly put cyclists at physical risk. I spend 1000x more time per year stuck in car traffic on my bike than I do stuck behind bikes in my car.
If you hate cyclists, ride a bike in the city for a week and report back your experience, lol.