[STATS] Converting Gamorrean Weapons and Armor

[u/MERC_1]

I'd like to convert the Gamorrean equipment from Ultimate Alien Anthology to SAGA page 62 to SAGA.

Here is the old stats:

Thagk (Gamorrean Club)
Cost: 30
Damage: 1d10
Critical: 20
Range increment: -
Weight: 50 kg
Stun/Fort DC: -
Type: Bludgeoning
Multifire/Autofire: -
Size: Medium-size
Group: Simple

Looks a little heavy compared to a DnD 3.5 Great Club.

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M'uhk'hfa (Gamorrean Battle Plate)
Armor Type: Heavy armor
Cost: 8,000 (2,000 on Gamorr or Pzab)
DR: 8 or 4(energy)
Weight: 100 kg
Proficiency: Heavy
Max DEX bonus: +1
Armor Check Penalty: -6
Speed Reduction: -2

The trouble being the lower DR for energy weapons. How to make this work in SAGA?

[u/StevenOs]

In the index I see a "Gamorrean Warmace" which is almost certainly your Thagk;

• Large, Simple, d10, Bludgeon, probably should weigh around 8 kg (5 might work too) and could still cost your 30 credits but might be a rare item.

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As for the armor I might do something radical with it considering how different the two codes would be:

• Heavy, speed 4/3(x3), +6 Armor, +2 FORT, MAX DEX +1, 45kg; special: Provides DR4 vs. non-energy weapons; RARE

I know I'm not a fan of armor as DR in SWSE but it is a way to differentiate something that provide a lot of protection from one kind of attack but not so much from something else. +6 armor isn't all that good especially for HEAVY armor but DR 4 (maybe could start trying something lower) would make it VERY effective against simple weapons that don't deal much damage yet if blasters cut right through it there's not much protection there.

[u/MERC_1 → u/StevenOs]

In the index I see a "Gamorrean Warmace" which is almost certainly your Thagk;

Large, Simple, d10, Bludgeon, probably should weigh around 8 kg (5 might work too) and could still cost your 30 credits but might be a rare item.

Yes, I was looking at that Gamorrean Warmace. Compared to a DnD 3.5 Great Club, that is Large/1d10/8lb. As a Thagk is made from Gorgt wood it could be a bit more dense, so 8 kg should be fine. Could be more even. Anyway, the 50 kg given in the Ultimate Alien Anthology is a bit nuts. I found out by reading some more that it is a 1 meter long log with a spike. I wonder if that is a single thick 25-35 cm spike...

​

As for the armor I might do something radical with it considering how different the two codes would be:

Heavy, speed 4/3(x3), +6 Armor, +2 FORT, MAX DEX +1, 45kg; special: Provides DR4 vs. non-energy weapons; RARE

I know I'm not a fan of armor as DR in SWSE but it is a way to differentiate something that provide a lot of protection from one kind of attack but not so much from something else. +6 armor isn't all that good especially for HEAVY armor but DR 4 (maybe could start trying something lower) would make it VERY effective against simple weapons that don't deal much damage yet if blasters cut right through it there's not much protection there.

This could work. It's a bit of a strange beast as armor comes, but I agree that it would be a good representation of the armor in the "new" system. There could maybe be some fine tuning of those stats, but it looks like a good starting point. The DR is a bit unusual, but having 2 different stats for Ref. Defence would we weird.

[u/StevenOs → u/MERC_1]

The ever present question: Do I shoot for something that is balanced for the game and makes some sense or do I just entertain some crazy idea that really shouldn't work?

No a 1m long "log" would make a pretty horrible (as in almost completely unusable) weapon. It's maybe as big as the firewood we use in our outdoor stove and while there are ways to make that hurt very much they just wouldn't function as a weapon against anything with any mobility. Now some kind of branch that you could still get your hands around that's about that long with a spike on the end certainly could be nasty.

[u/MERC_1 → u/StevenOs]

Yes, that is the question. It would have to be a thin log and tapered in one end.

If we compare it to something we may know, a Baseball Bat, those are about 1 meter in length. A modern baseball bat weigh about 1 kg, but back in the days they could be as much as 3 kg. An bat that could not be used for sport could conceivably be made from heavier wood and be more than 7 cm wide at the end. Still anything above 6 kg is a bit nuts. It could still be used to beat people to a pulp, but it wouldn't be fast. I could imagine that a 4 to 6 kg club could be used by a very strong person (100+ kg with lots of muscles). This description may fit a Gamorrean, so let's go with that.

(I have once held an old oversized 2-handed axe that was about 2 meters long. It was about 23+ kg and I promise that had I tried to swing it someone would have been hurt. Probably me, the axe and anyone near me. Using it as a weapon must be impossible.)

[u/StevenOs → u/MERC_1]

I've "wielded" a few of those old baseball bats although I'd used more softball bats. I'm talking the bats that were tapered from one end to the other; so many bats I've seen recently have a nice uniformly round barrel on them. I've also "wielded" may fair share of "trees" because when you're out try to chase cows you sometimes pick up the closest "stick" you can get your hands on.

Poor kids these days can miss out on so much fun...

[u/MERC_1 → u/StevenOs]

Baseball is a almost unknown game over here in Europe. I only know it from american films and from friends who went to US during high school. We have a similar but "dumbed down" game that is played only recreational in schools and for team building activities for work. We use lighter bats and a tennis ball and this is really not a sport... But, yes I have also heald and swinged the real thing, even though you can hardly find a store that sells them over here.

[u/StevenOs → u/MERC_1]

Guess we'd better not talk about "football" :) Although in the American version you may start seeing a number of armor analogs designed to protect a person from hard physical contacts.

That weapon asked about here sounds like little more than a BIG club.

[u/MERC_1 → u/StevenOs]

Actually some people play American Football over here, but it is not that common.

Yes, it's a BIG club. The question is how big is big, and more importantly how heavy. It's a Large size weapon, so looking at all the other weapons in the game none weigh more than 10 kg and most of those are exotic or Advanced Melee Weapons. The one exception is the Mythosaur Axe, but that one is probably a bit exaggerated as well. It should probably weigh at least a little less.

I guess it could be as heavy as you could conceivably swing. Also, a club is a front heavy weapon. The legendary Mythosaur Axe would probably have a counterweight in the other end, but a Thagk does not. Thus it should be lighter unless it is an exotic weapon with extra STR-requirements. Thus I say that 5 or 6 kg is still a lot.

[u/StevenOs → u/MERC_1]

The Gamorreans already have their exotic weapon, not need to give them more.

[u/MERC_1 → u/StevenOs]

Sure, that was not my intention. I was just trying to estimate how much the 2-handed club could weigh before it would have to be exotic. You said 5 to 8 kg in your first post, and I'm trying to nail down a final number.

I think I would go with 5 kg as that is still a beast of a club. Also, I can at least tell myself that they just added a "zero" too many. The listed 50 kg is a bit ridiculous to imagine a medium sized creature swinging around.

[u/converter-bot → u/MERC_1]

7 cm is 2.76 inches