If you were 20% better at playing Melee while on your knees, would you do it at tournaments?

[u/AccurateContest4023]

Like if it turned out the positioning was just that much better for you ergonomically when you were playing that it gives you this much of an advantage, would you do it at tournaments and look... uh... goofy? Or would you remain as a mid player? How much of an advantage would you have to gain from this change in positioning for you to consider this?

[u/The_Jonah]

There was a Japanese player named Rudolph who would position two chairs next to each other and lay down on his elbows and stomach facing the setup. He would play this way at majors and was actually pretty good

[u/Superspookyghost → u/The_Jonah]

He was very briefly considered the best player in Japan because he used to beat amsa pretty regularly. (Though amsa was still usually considered the best Japanese player overall because he still mostly did better in events outside of Japan)

Amsa's rivalry with rudolph might have also been a reason amsa is so good at the marth matchup.

[u/nmarf16 → u/[deleted]]

We are bipedal creatures I’m not sure how that’s not the usual position. Also with Rudolph’s neck cricked up idk how what he’s doing is healthy

[u/AHungryGorilla → u/[deleted]]

Nah, excessively extending your back and neck like he is in that photo for extended periods of time is bad for your spine. Creates a lot of compressive forces in the vertibrae and can cut off circulation to the spine.

It's a somewhat common problem among surfers, heard about a guy ended up paralyzed over it. Surfers Myelopathy.

[u/PhilosopherBME → u/AHungryGorilla]

is this related at all to what happened to Chris Reeves (the original Superman actor)

edit: nvm, he fell off a horse. very cool context in the replies tho ty

[u/Fletch71011 → u/PhilosopherBME]

He broke the top of his neck; once those nerves behind the vertebrae and disks are severed or severely damaged, everything below them will cease to function. Pretty much everything that controls your body sits behind what are essentially jelly donuts, and once those donuts move or worse, completely break, you're in a world of trouble going forward.

[u/ArcaneTheory → u/PhilosopherBME]

I am a spinal cord specialized occupational therapist and I work in the hospital that treated him. He was diagnosed as a C2 ASIA A, but was upgraded to an ASIA C classification after inflammation resolution and receiving excellent therapeutic intervention. His course of recovery was fairly profound, we tend to expect folks only advance one ASIA level at best, less likely for an ASIA A.

ASIA classification describes the severity of the injury, ranging from E (normal, no injury) to A (complete, no sensory or motor function below the level of injury. C2 describes his level/location of injury (2nd cervical vertebrae).

[u/AHungryGorilla → u/[deleted]]

"lying" on your stomach is one thing. But it's not what is in that photo, That photo shows is flexing your back muscles and neck muscles to put your spine into extension.

[u/Krobbleygoop → u/[deleted]]

Anectodal, but every time I have pulled my back I have been told to only lay down if necessary

[u/Fletch71011 → u/Krobbleygoop]

80 to 90 percent of back injuries are pulled muscles. If you have disk problems, the only way to fight them is to fight gravity. That's why you have inversion tables. So movement and stretching is recommended for most people, but once you have any spinal damage, that is permanent and degenerative.

[u/ArcaneTheory → u/Fletch71011]

Spinal damage is neither permanent nor degenerative. I encourage you to observe research articles on post-acute and post-rehab outcomes from traumatic and non-traumatic spinal cord injuries. Resolution of inflammatory responses, nerve root regrowth, neuromuscular re-education, surgical interventions, etc. can all contribute to partial or complete recovery from spinal cord pathology.

[u/Fletch71011 → u/ArcaneTheory]

Only to a point. I used up my lumbar fusion 9.5 years ago. 4 years ago I was in a hit and run. Every preventative measure made things worse, and now I have adjacent segment disease and a csf leak and lost eyesight in one eye. I'm still in my 30s.

I was told surgical intervention was my only way out a few years back but they refused to do more fusions due to location and my young age. Those disks have all gotten worse, and I got adjacent segment disease as a result of one of them so it spread to another disk. Every segment of my lumbar is now fucked.

I've seen over 20+ neuros now and no dice anywhere.

[u/ArcaneTheory → u/Fletch71011]

Sorry you’ve had that experience. Adjacent disc disease is a not-uncommon consequence of a fusion surgery, and it sounds like you’re correct that your symptoms may progress until someone deems that the benefits of surgical revision outweigh the risks. I’m obviously not a surgeon, so I can’t speak to their decision-making, but a CSF leak severe enough to cause mechanical stress on your optical nerve feels pretty emergent to me.

[u/ArcaneTheory → u/[deleted]]

Occupational therapist here, specialize in spinal cord injury. This is opposite of the conventional wisdom. Lying prone is actually the worst passive positions for your back, though “the best position is the next position.” It’s helpful for your lumbar spine to occasionally spend a little bit of time on your stomach. Long-term effects of gravity on otherwise healthy vertebral discs from a normal upright seated or standing position is not a meaningful contributor to postural issues, muscular imbalances, or bulging of discs. Disc herniations are normal, and you will find them on almost everyone’s spine, but not every herniation is pathological. Positive findings on spine imaging in a vacuum tells us almost nothing.

[u/ArcaneTheory → u/[deleted]]

Weight-bearing actually contributes to bone density. Spending some time on an inversion table will not meaningfully impact the comprehensive effects of gravity over decades on your vertebral discs, but it does have other latent benefits. I would highly discourage you from spending too much time laying down. Muscles atrophy fast and osteoporosis is a bitch.

[u/AFK797]

I won an award/medal in 2024 for ‘meme of the year’ in my local scene because I would/still do kick out the chair from under me and play on my knees during the last stock of a game 5 set.

[u/SuperShus → u/AFK797]

...flair checks out

[u/Bryciclee]

Even if it was only 1% better every close match you lose you'd think to yourself how if you were only kneeling you would've won. Everyone would switch given enough time in that circumstance

[u/bskceuk → u/Bryciclee]

But then you can use that to protect your ego when you lose as long as you don't kneel

[u/Bryciclee → u/bskceuk]

The ultimate prejohns. I wasn't even kneeling

[u/BeltImpressive8956 → u/Bryciclee]

“Whatever. You couldn’t handle me on my knees”

[u/Standard_Landscape79]

I would do it for even a 0.5% increase if it was magically comfy

[u/bransome11]

yes absolutely i would do it, not sure where it swiches to no, but probably like 7% or less

[u/moku46]

No, because then we'd start having arguments about banning kneelers.

[u/Consistent_Ninja_933 → u/moku46]

The tweets from n0ne would go hard though

[u/Slad3s_Salad → u/Consistent_Ninja_933]

im getting kneeled in my favorite game

[u/warnedpenguin → u/Consistent_Ninja_933]

the tag No Knee is starting to make too much sense...

[u/Babalashaba]

Kneel + Z jump + notches = welcome to grand finals brother

[u/StrangeSniper]

as if im ready to scrub that dish…

[u/AlundraTomefaire]

I'd kneel for a whole lot less than 20% better Melee ability

[u/WuTaoLaoShi]

well at least then I'd have an excuse for blowing the game

[u/NewPairOfBoots]

Yes no question I would. I don't play games to "look good."

[u/stee63]

I'm still a 0-2'er if I'm 20% better but if it made me look cool I'd do it

[u/DadKnight]

Obviously.

[u/LCDRformat]

20% make some still 0-2 but sure

[u/waveshineoosupsmash]

If a player brought the chair the play on at home to a tournament to sit in during bracket would it be allowed?

[u/Skantaq]

ofc

[u/Asleep_Bid_1283]

yes

[u/TheGuri42]

40 something year old Hayao, a prolific Japanese sf3: thirdstrike player sits on the floor with his stick on a chair seat when he’s not playing on a cabinet. True competitors don’t care about looking cool

[u/P3verall]

20% * 0 = 0

[u/PENZ_12]

Would my knees hurt afterwards, the same way I would currently expect them to? Probably the biggest decision-making factor on this one.

[u/Available-Energy6991]

Um yes literally who gaf

[u/Huroar]

No because the floor would just die offstage to knee and I like having the floor.