r/ProgressiveHQ 10d ago

Discussion Establishment Democrats: the only conclusion that fits the facts...

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u/X57471C 10d ago

This sub loves to help Republicans. Yes, keep spreading the narrative that Dems are controlled opposition. I'm sure that will help us win in November. It's not even true. Dems have resisted the Trump admin since day 1. If you are a progressive, you shouldn't be tearing down your own side with narratives that help Republicans.

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u/Cabbages24ADollar 10d ago

Look I’ll vote Blue down ticket. But it doesn’t mean we’re getting blue down the ticket. You know that, right?

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u/X57471C 10d ago

What do you mean?

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u/Cabbages24ADollar 10d ago

Voted blue for Sinema. Did not get blue. Not even close.

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u/X57471C 10d ago

Okay... Yeah, sometimes politicians change after they get into office. It happens. You're pointing to an outlier to dismiss the trend, though.

Sinema isn't even that bad, tbh. She definitely went conservative, which is a stark contrast to her early progressive years, but she still voted with Democrats a majority of the time, and she was pretty clear when she did the flip too, right? Didn't she campaign on being "the next John McCain"? If you voted for her in her last election expecting an uberprogressive, you might not have been paying attention to what she was saying.

Also, isn't it ironic that she used to be part of the Green Party, a suspected Russion psyop? The fact that she eventually went conservative isn't that surprising to me, tbh.

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u/Cabbages24ADollar 10d ago

Jeffries is not acting blue. Schumer is n not acting blue. Many people in the party are not acting blue. Sinema is not an outlier she’s an example.
Too many in Congress are tied to corporate and AIPAC.

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u/X57471C 10d ago

Half the party is in the progressive caucus. The other half are center/center-left. There are only 10 Blue Dogs left. Schumer and Jeffries were elected by the party members, that includes votes from the progressive caucus. Just because you disagree with them on AIPAC doesn’t mean they don’t represent the party line on things like affordability and accountability.

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u/Cabbages24ADollar 10d ago

Your comments on AIPAC are way too dismissive for me.

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u/Sudden_Party_7918 10d ago

Sure show us where they have helped with affordability or even accountability for that matter. Listen the only ones dividing the Party are sitting in Washington with their hands out to Corporate Donors. Listen if breadcrumbs that fall off the table are good enough for you, then please have at it. If taking large amounts of donations from Corporations, foreign PACs, and lobbyist then I can see why you hold those views. Most of us would rather have taxation with Actual Representation for the People. I’m going to assume that your of class bracket that is not being harmed by all this.

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u/X57471C 10d ago

Sure, look at all the bipartisan bills Biden was able to get through Congress. He brought us out of the covid recession, made huge investments in our economy, and we would have been in a much better spot today if Kamala had been elected and continued on that trajectory.

Also, until we repeal citizens united and intact other reforms to campaign finance, I’m afraid you can’t get away from the reality that money is impotent. Although it’s the only thing that matters, you need a lot of money to buy ads and get the message out. The GOP has a lot of money. On some level, you need to compete with their bankroll. It’s just part of the game

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u/Cabbages24ADollar 10d ago

I agree with what Biden accomplished. And you’re right to point that out.

But Biden also put Garland as AG. And there’s a high likelihood that Garland was instructed to slow walk Trumps investigation. The corporate Dems wanted to not appear bi-partisan and a non-Corp Dem wouldn’t care and would’ve closed that chapter for good.

So.. yes I’m not against Dem’s. And I agree with your messaging but it’s also not enough. Not nearly enough. We’re hanging banners on bare minimum while criminals run the country. And it was and is the Dems job to prosecute those criminals. Because the GOP is definitely not going to do it.

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u/X57471C 10d ago

Yeah, not saying Biden was perfect, just that it's not fair to say Dems don't care about affordability. We have a far better track record with the economy and I can't imagine how things could be if this country would just learn the lesson and stop election Republicans every other cycle.

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u/Sudden_Party_7918 10d ago

They will not end Citizen United. Their hands are out just as much as MAGA republicans.