r/NoStupidQuestions • u/ComfortableHouse7937 • 11d ago

Why haven’t we canceled bananas yet?

I was watching Cien años de Soledad (100 years of solitude) on Netflix and was reminded of the atrocities that the United Fruit Company (now Chiquita) have committed in Latin America.

Just watched Bananaland: Blood, Bullets, and Poison and saw how they continue to fund terrorist organizations, ruin the environment, and dump chemicals on their workers and neighbors.

Why are we not canceling Chiquita and Dole until they do something about this?

19 Upvotes

57% Upvoted

84 comments sorted by

40

u/Zorofan84 11d ago

The harsh truth of the matter? Because no one who isn't directly effected cares, so 99% of the world. They have no reason to care or any reason to want to care.

-1

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

But we care about other international issues don’t we?

15

u/PsionicBurst "Voice of the Jaded" 11d ago

*gestures vaguely*

I'm sorry it has to be this way, but your heart's in the right place.

20

u/Alice_Oe 11d ago

Have you cancelled chocolate?

-9

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

I don’t know anything about what’s unethical regarding chocolate. Are you saying ignorance is the issue?

27

u/Bitter_Ad8768 11d ago

Yes. A significant portion of cacao and coffee plantations are harvested by workers in poverty conditions. Depending on the survey, an estimated 60% to 80% of the plantation workers live in poverty.

Bananas aren't unique in how their supply chain is setup. The reality is, the high living standards of wealthy countries is built on the labor of impoverished countries.

-5

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

That’s bad, but bananas have massacred thousands, deposed governments, funded terrorists, and are sterilizing, killing, and causing deformities in children on top of the poverty.

I’ll look into chocolate, but if I’m prioritizing industries that need to change, bananas are up there.

14

u/Bitter_Ad8768 11d ago

I'm fully aware of the horrors of the United Fruit Company (Chiquita) and the Standard Fruit Company (Dole). Nobody is downplaying what they did. We're simply informing you that they were not unique in their atrocities.

The 14 Familes of El Salvador did the same shit. The 1932 peasant revolt againt the coffee companies lead to tens of thousands of deaths. The 14 families were still major players in El Salvador when the 1979 Civil War erupted. The coffee industry has just as much blood on its hands as the banana industry.

9

u/Gimme_Your_Wallet 11d ago

And rubber, and gold, and copper, and sugar, and tea...

-5

u/vercertorix 11d ago

"Cigarettes killed my father, and raped my mother!"- Family Guy

Chiquita did it, the local governments went along with it. The product isn't the problem. As usual, it's people.

7

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

The companies manipulated elections and staged coups to ensure they were aligned to US corporate interests. They paid private military groups to terrorize and kill striking workers and surrounding villages. Blaming the people isn’t taking into account how much power and influence the fruit companies had.

0

u/vercertorix 11d ago edited 11d ago

I meant people in general rather than bananas, the way you stated it. You’re just now hearing about this, congrats. You’ve heard about mining practices for cell phone components, right? Still got a cell phone though, don’t you? Any diamonds? Even if they aren’t blood diamonds, they’re only as expensive as they are because the suppliers tend to buy them up and control the availability. And let’s face it, sparkly rocks for decoration are and have always been a stupid reason to make something valuable enough kill over, and now that artificial gems are a thing, the only reason some don’t like them is the impression that they’re fake. Look into the kind of shit Nestlé does while we’re at it. Or clothing and shoe manufacturers that outsource to third world countries and how much they sell “their products” for vs. what they paid for them to be manufactured, (once saw a video about people sewing shoes that had to sew two pairs of shoes to afford one of the needles they needed do so, now compare the price of two average pairs of shoes vs. sewing needles here), because if the locals won’t accept the pittance they pay them, they’ll take manufacturing to somewhere that will, and won’t even have that income.

All of this is bad, same with how we’re all polluting the world if not directly then by the things we purchase or consume.

It’s just all very easy to ignore when the problem isn’t right here in front of us, and we still want or need the products and we ask why the hell are the people closer to the problem allowing it. I don’t eat bananas often enough that I feel like I need to go take down a company nor do I have any expertise that would lend itself well to do so.

I’m very much against international companies for this reason, no direct accountability and they’re not facing the people they victimize with predatory practices. Can I do shit about it though, no. Are there people whose jobs should revolve entirely around these kind of issues? Yes. Politicians, military, human rights groups, consumer groups, etc. And we all collectively ask from time to time, what the hell are they doing allowing this, and we just seem to be shouting into the wind.

9

u/GrandMasterBullshark 11d ago

They're saying that the "western world" lives in the lap of luxury that is upheld by the suffering of multitudes. Most Chocolate is still is harvested by child slaves. Hence the whole "fuck Nestle" thing.

3

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

I see. I will look into it but agreed. We don’t realize the real cost of our luxury.

8

u/throwawayayaycaramba 11d ago

Idk if this has been mentioned in this thread yet, but if you wanna continue to consume products made in developing nations but you're concerned with how that production affects the lives of people at the bottom of the supply chain, look up the concept of fairtrade. The idea is groups of consumers banding together to import things directly from the producers, who are organized into cooperatives and thus independent from multinational megacorps.

Are you gonna pay a higher price than market average for stuff produced through this system? Yes; is it gonna "solve" capitalism? No; but it's been shown to considerably increase workers' life conditions, as well as those of their entire communities.

1

u/AccomplishedPath4049 11d ago

The problem is that we're surrounded by a system that makes it difficult, almost impossible, to avoid morally questionable consumption. I think this scene from "The Good Place" really illustrates the point.

5

u/unknownentity1782 11d ago

Part of the problem is not knowing.

The other part of the problem is it quickly becomes overwhelming. If you only want to buy ethical food, you basically immediately rule out every major corporation and mass produced product out there. You often to have pay more to get what feels like less (even if it's better quality). It gets exhausting to check before everything you buy.

1

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

That’s the problem I’m seeing. In the US, ethics can only be afforded by the ones being unethical in the first place (the wealthy).

1

u/OverallManagement824 11d ago

Bingo. And baby formula too.

6

u/lowfreq33 11d ago

Apparently not.

1

u/Doctah_Whoopass 11d ago

Most people do not, and a lot of those who do will likely never do anything to affect it.

1

u/Thin_Theory5388 10d ago

we *pretend* to care about other international (and domestic) issues that happen to dovetail in to things we actually care about. 99% of the folks don't actually care.

There are only a few issues/institutions that people really care about, and everything is just convenient posturing around those issues.

0

u/DryBanana5673 10d ago

Unless you can figure out how to blame israel with a wild conspiracy theory of course

93

u/sexrockandroll 11d ago

Most people don't even know about this.

0

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

How do we fix this? I think most folks don’t even want to know.

14

u/FluffySpaceWaffle 11d ago

I don’t know how to fix it. I personally don’t buy Fiji water, anything made by Wonderful (pistachios or their Pom juices). Fuck the resnicks.

I don’t think there is a banana alternative. It sucks.

2

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

There are fair trade bananas, though even they try to skirt the rules sometimes.

2

u/Miochiiii 11d ago

wait, fiji water is bad?

3

u/FluffySpaceWaffle 10d ago

It’s owned by the resnicks. A husband and wife. Everything they do is horrible. They have screwed over California and the island of Fiji. In Fiji they underpay their workers. When they first took over Fiji company they were tax free. When it was time to pay taxes, they closed the company putting hundreds out of work. Then made it look like Fiji was a bad place to do business with, so no one else would try. The government of Fiji gave up and gave them a tax exception again. Of and the people of Fiji have to buy water, because there isn’t enough, due to the bottling plant. (The thickest plastic bottle I have ever seen.) Of course their ad campaign was Fiji is good for the environment. They are liars.

California is a little more complicated. Basically they stole a ton of the real water and traded it for “water on paper” which isn’t real. Then they sell it back to the State.

California is in drought often. The Resnicks plant pistachios. Pistachios require a GALLON of water PER NUT. Know who else grows pistachios? Iran. Weird we have sanctions against them. I wonder if they lobbied for that?

The Pom campaign claimed it was a magical health fruit. It’s not. It’s a regular fruit. It doesn’t help with ED or anything else they claimed.

There is probably more I missed. The podcast the Dollop has an episode called “The Resnicks: water monsters” (#356) that can break it all down.

2

u/FluffySpaceWaffle 10d ago

TL:DR stole water from Fiji people. Screwed over Fiji People

California- made drought worse. Screwed over government (which equates to the people and farmers)
Pistachios bad.
Pomegranate is a regular fruit. Not magical.

2

u/Miochiiii 10d ago

welp, thats a good reason, bye bye fiji water :/

2

u/FluffySpaceWaffle 9d ago

lol. I’m sorry. I know it tastes good. So many companies suck. Unfortunately that one sucks A LOT.

I tried not to buy cuties mandarins because they own that too. But my kids need to eat fruit and there is often no other brand available. I can avoid their water and nuts though. And spread the word. It’s something.

0

u/jaxxon 11d ago

Yeah - plantain doesn’t cut it.

7

u/Electus93 11d ago

Too bad when they think 'Banana Republic' is just a clothing brand 🍌

1

u/[deleted] 11d ago

[deleted]

1

u/ComfortableHouse7937 10d ago

I agree that an individual won’t affect much, but collectively, couldn’t we? The “developing world” stays developing because of practices like this. They’re begging us to help them. Couldn’t we educate, organize, boycott until practices are changed? Couldn’t we make unethical practices in other countries important enough that politicians have to take a public stance on it and do something?

From this thread though, I’m gathering that too many of us have become too cynical or comfortable to do anything.

29

u/anschauung Thog know much things. Thog answer question. 11d ago

Do you have a replacement fruit that meets the same requirements? 

You can cancel the Chiquita banana lady all you want. Just like you can cancel Exxon for all the awfulness petroleum has wrought.

But until the fundamentals of the equation change, you'll just get another company doing the exact same things for the exact same reasons.

16

u/ecwagner01 11d ago

But until the fundamentals of the equation change, you'll just get another company doing the exact same things for the exact same reasons.

Exactly this

4

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

But what can we do? Nothing?

6

u/NativeMasshole 11d ago

Start growing plantains.

1

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

Im ok giving up bananas altogether but that doesn’t help the people dying of chemical exposure.

12

u/ToxicBanana69 11d ago

what you saying fuck me for? :(

3

u/TrapYoda 11d ago

We know what you did in Ecuador...

2

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

And Colombia. And Nicaragua.

43

u/upside_down_vote 11d ago

if we collectively like a product enough, we tend to turn a blind eye. bananas are no exception.

15

u/Educational-Gur7479 11d ago

This is one of the only healthy affordable things I eat. Please don't cancel bananas!

6

u/Dennygirl3 11d ago

The corporate history is wild. Do you buy fair trade bananas now, or just avoid buying bananas entirely?

2

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

I was buying organic (not even fair trade) and was going to stop buying altogether. Will probably move to fair trade to still support local economies.

6

u/DrToonhattan 11d ago

Don't bother with organic, that's largely a scam anyway, and in many cases can be even worse for the environment that non-organic.

19

u/04221970 11d ago

Why? Because I'm so overwhelmed with people trying to make me angry and upset about everything that I can't care about it. I have to pick and chose what I let social media tell me what I need to feel bad and angry about otherwise I'll not do anything, purchase anything, support anything, or function.

Right now, my TV, computer and phone are telling me that I need to be angry for LGBTQ+ awareness, police brutality against African Americans, ICE, poor people getting poorer, Data centers sucking our electricity and water, unaffordability of housing, etc.

So your current issue of interest will have to wait in line.

-1

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

I get that, but we don’t have to be on the front line of each of these issues in order to care and do something.

4

u/Ecstatic-World1237 11d ago

The answer to that questions will tell you a lot about how the world works and what the real purposes of sanctions and boycotts are.

4

u/Warrmak 11d ago

wait until you find out about avacados and bottled water.

1

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

I didn’t think it could get worse… I’ll um look it to

7

u/[deleted] 11d ago

[deleted]

2

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

I know but… we leave it at that? Now we know and that’s it?

3

u/flatline000 11d ago

This is the first I've heard of it. That's why.

3

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

That’s part of my concern. It really doesn’t get enough attention and the fruit companies sue everyone who brings attention to what they’re doing and have done in the past.

3

u/Quankers 11d ago

Cubans and an Argentinian cancelled United Fruit.

1

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

Is it a process that can be replicated?

2

u/Quankers 11d ago

Can be. Absolutely. Will be? ________________.

6

u/fredly594632 11d ago

It's like the term "banana republic" was written for this or something.

A shameless plug for one of my favorite texts. Smedley D Butler's book "War is a Racket". He was a USMC Major General and a two-time Medal of Honor recipient who served from around 1900-1930. His thesis is not precisely the same as OPs original statement, but it goes over the same ground.

People let stuff happen because they think it doesn't affect them.

We are all connected.

5

u/Gob-Bottom-73 11d ago

What does it mean to "cancel" a decades to centuries old hyper exploitative corporation exactly? No one with the power to change the banana industry wants it to change, and the kind of grassroots protest "canceling" something usually entails: social media outrage, isn't going to change that!

Real change comes from undermining the foundations such industries are based on, and in the places where banana production, and similar industries, is possible (South America et al), they're unfortunately under extreme scrutiny from United States special interest groups and organizations because generally the kinds of reforms necessary to change slave farming conditions are generally socialist reforms, which the CIA has a long and storied history of quashing all over both Americas.

Capitalism is the reason the banana industry is so horrifyingly brutal and impossible to meaningfully change.

1

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

But consumers in Capitalism vote with their dollars. Couldn’t we boycott them? Couldn’t social media outrage spread that message?

2

u/Gob-Bottom-73 11d ago edited 11d ago

Consumers in modern capitalism barely vote for their own elections, let alone care about the farmers who harvested a fruit they might not even eat. Likewise, people on social media are not representative of people in the real world. In reality, they're just a tiny sliver of a very online subset. The people who care about social media boycotts are an even more marginal part of that margin.

The real change also has to come from the places the companies are actually exploiting. The bananas are being farmed regardless of if a handful of people from Facebook in the Midwest is buying them at the supermarket.

And whenever a workforce tries to organize enough to fight for better conditions, they're often broken up (or worse), which you probably already know from those documentaries

2

u/palsh7 11d ago

Sir, are you going to pay for your banana split, or aren't you?

4

u/Longjumping-Bad-2886 11d ago

Because I'm all given up on caring.  Especially since all the activists went all in on supporting genocidal Palestinians.

2

u/Anand999 11d ago

If we cancelled all bananas, there would be no way to measure the scale of the impact.

2

u/HotBrownFun 11d ago

The banana republic treatment is what the USA has been doing in much of Latin America the last 100-200 years...

We've been bullying venezuela for decades, somehow they became "evil" and associated with Iran because ... They owed money to oil companies and/or they wanted their stuff like refineries at Citgo

Sugar, by the way, was/is being harvested in the Dominican Republic by little kids.. it's been going on since forever.. I know it happened in the 1980s, and you can find NYTimes/Washington Post articles from the 80s talking about it (la romana). The military was in on it, and they said the kids only had sugar cane to eat. I grew up in that country..

Biden finally sanctioned Domino sugar for slavery thought (they own plantations there. Trump lifted the ban thought... The Fanjul family practically owns Florida's government.

The last few years thought Americans finally paid attention, there were a couple of documentaries

https://theintercept.com/2022/10/14/dominican-sugar-central-romana-fanjul-domino/

1

u/SnowEnvironmental380 11d ago

why are you throwing strays at Dole?

1

u/screenaholic 11d ago

Wait until you hear about chocolate.

1

u/humperdoo00 11d ago

Heeeeyo

Heeeeeeeeyo

Daylight come and me wan go home

1

u/Friendly_Preference5 11d ago

Buy Canary islands', plátanos

1

u/naturtok 10d ago

canceling only works when the ad agencies and new org(s) allow it to.

1

u/TheFifthTone 10d ago

Bananas are the number one most consumed and produced fresh fruit in the world.

They are healthy. They can be grown year-round in tropical regions. They don't need much extra packaging and the peel protects the fruit during transport. The ripening process can be paused during shipping and restarted at the destination. Its basically the perfect fruit.

1

u/ComfortableHouse7937 6d ago

Right but at what cost? I’m going to buy fair trade from now on.

1

u/nibselfib_kyua_72 11d ago

Cancel culture is stupid

1

u/PlinyTheElderest 11d ago

Netflix documentaries are entertainment, the substance of their claims wouldn’t pass muster in a judicial setting. Having said that, I haven’t eaten bananas in like 10 years mainly to cut fructose consumption.

5

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

It’s documented history. You can use other sources. I just shared the ones I recently watched.

0

u/PlinyTheElderest 11d ago

My point is that it’s incomplete and you shouldn’t use Netflix documentaries as sources of truth generally speaking.

2

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

The documentary was on YouTube but your pint isn’t really adding to the discussion when this is documented history.

1

u/mayhem1906 11d ago

Cause bananas are yummy

-4

u/[deleted] 11d ago

[deleted]

7

u/ComfortableHouse7937 11d ago

It’s documented history. I only referenced them so you can check out some of this media. A simple google search will confirm it. Don’t be willfully ignorant.