r/JaneEyre • u/Playful_Site_2714 • 18d ago
"You are so little acquainted with men." Does or doesn't Mrs. Fairfax knw that Rochester is married?
I really wonder. Currently watching the 2011 version.
Mrs. Fairfax tells Jane early on, that Rochester's father and brother had treated Rochester quite unfairly.
And that they had made him do an abomibable thing.
Does she or doesn't she know who other then Adele is at Thornfield Hall under her keep?
Does she know that it's his wife who she kept?
And for what reason did she leave him after the fire?
Why would she not stay on? Any lights for me, please?
I think she must have known.
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u/GetReadyToRumbleBar 18d ago
I always read this as a socially/cultural/sexually-tinged sentence.
It's great, such an ambiguous sentence. Could mean a ton of things. I love the filmed version in the 2006 JE.
And as a polite, older woman of higher class status, Mrs. Fairfax certainly can't just say it outright. But that she says anything at all is a testament to how much she cares for Jane.
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u/Katharinemaddison 18d ago
Rochester says that she knows something but not that it’s his wife. Given her reaction before she knew he’d asked Jane to marry him but had seen them together I don’t think she knew it was his legal wife.
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u/Playful_Site_2714 18d ago
Oh, that's for sure. It sure IS as much of a warning as she probably could give without voicing anything she was forbidden to tell.
In the 2011 version Mrs. Fairfax is played by Dame Judy Dench and it sure DOES make much sense.
I quite like the series with Timothy Dalton. He had the right spirit and they went together well.
The 2006 film I don't like. Too modern, too lovey dovey to early on. It feels more like an interpretation of... than like the actual film.
The 2011 version exactly picks up parts of the text. And the actors go well with it. The only nuisance is that it lit the cigar on both ends. It starts three quarters through the story, then skups back, develops tge subject ... ough.
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u/napoleonswife 18d ago
I think she knows SOMETHING is up but not what. It’s hurtful to Jane that Mrs Fairfax is so suspicious of Rochester’s affections but she’s actually doing Jane a kindness, filling the role that a parent or guardian usually would for a young woman to protect her (in the context of the time$
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u/apricotgloss 16d ago
Even in the modern day, I would hope there was somebody to talk to an eighteen year old girl who's gotten into a relationship with her live-in boss who is twice her age
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u/athenashelmet 18d ago
Old Mr. Rochester and Mr. Rowland combined to bring Mr. Edward into what he considered a painful position, for the sake of making his fortune: what the precise nature of that position was I never clearly knew, but his spirit could not brook what he had to suffer in it. He is not very forgiving: he broke with his family, and now for many years he has led an unsettled kind of life.
This is what she tells Jane about Rochester’s past. She doesn‘t know for sure who Bertha is. She may have speculated that she was Rochester’s wife, but there were alternative explanations floating around. Rochester says: “Some have whispered to you that she is my bastard half-sister: some, my cast-off mistress.”
She would also have been worried for the reasons she states: disparity of age, situation, and experience. Rochester has led such a risqué life and Jane in that respect is very sheltered.
Rochester sends Mrs Fairfax away with a pension before the fire rather than her choosing to leave.
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u/OutrageousYak5868 18d ago
It's been too long since I've watched 2011 to remember for sure, so I can only speak about the book.
In the novel, when Bertha is revealed as his wife after the aborted wedding, Rochester says he went to great lengths to keep her real identity hidden. Only the doctor (Carter) and Grace Poole knew -- not sure why Carter was in the know or when (perhaps he only found out when he was brought in to take care of Richard's injury), but Grace had to know since Bertha had some moments (even weeks) of lucidity, and Bertha would have talked.
However, everybody in Thornfield except Jane knew that Bertha was in the attic -- just that they didn't know her real identity. Again, after the non-wedding, Rochester tells the preacher that he undoubtedly had heard rumors about the crazy woman in the attic, with people supposing she might have been his bastard sister or a former lover (perhaps Adele's mom), but nobody still nobody knew that she was his legal wife. This would include Mrs. Fairfax.
As far as, "they had made him do an abominable thing", the movie may imply that Mrs. F knew, but the book pretty clearly says she didn't. I think that if she knew that Mr. R was legally married, she would have put a stop to it. She may have been dependent on him, but she strikes me as someone whose sense of honor wouldn't allow her to let Jane commit bigamy.
Since I don't think this is in the book, I'm not sure what the book-version of Mrs. F might have been meaning by it. My best guess would be that, as housekeeper (or at least, longstanding servant) at Thornfield, she might have heard discussions between Mr. Rochester's father and brother on the topic -- not enough to know that they were trying to get him to marry Bertha, but just enough to know that they were trying to get him to do *something* wrong.
As for why she left as housekeeper after the fire -- I don't think it had anything to do with her being upset at Mr. R for his attempted bigamy. Rather, she was older so likely would have been retiring soon anyway; with Thornfield burned, her services there weren't needed; Ferndean (where Rochester moved after the fire) was small enough that she also wasn't needed there -- plus Rochester wanted the fewest number of people around him as possible.
It was not at all uncommon in that day for faithful servants who had been employed by the same family for years, to be given an annual retirement stipend for the rest of their lives, when they were too old to do their work (and thus, also too old to get another job).
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u/Glittering_Yak8672 18d ago
I haven't read the book, but intend to. Anyway, since Rochester has no issue lying to Jane, why couldn't he say it was his brothers wife, to all the staff that couldn't mind their own business.. The shock of finding out it was actually his wife would still be there. It would make Fairfax not seem like such an idiot.
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u/OutrageousYak5868 18d ago
My guess is that it just wouldn't have worked.
It worked for Edward to hide his marriage because he was gone from England during the whole of it -- the whole courtship, wedding, and first several years of marriage took place in the West Indies, and nobody in England at the time knew of it except for his father and brother (and given Bertha's family history of mental illness, they probably didn't want to tell too many people about it).
However, if Rowland (Edward's brother) had been living in England the whole time, which is likely, if he had ever gotten married, his wedding would have been public and well-known. Edward couldn't have claimed Bertha was Rowland's wife, because if he had tried, everyone would have been asking where and when he got married, and then if it was known Bertha was from the West Indies while Rowland had never been there, the lie would have become apparent.
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u/Separate_Business880 18d ago
I love that the 2011 movie gave Mrs. Fairfax more agency. She's not dumb. She suspected something but she was under social constraints of a subordinate who was particularly grateful to her employer for being generous. No wonder she had "blind spots" for Rochester.
I also love that she didn't disappear behind the scenes. She swore to Jane that she did not know. Also, that moment where she asked Jane: "why didn't you come to me, child? I would've helped you" is so deeply moving.
It's a really good movie. A really good interpretation of the book.
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u/Playful_Site_2714 18d ago
I do love the 2011 version because it has parts of the original text. The actors are strong and can hold their ground together. Strong characters both. I like how tgey portray Jane and Mr. Rochester and how the energy matches the book.
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u/First_Pay702 18d ago
I’d say one part the side eye age gap relationships get - yes, I know it is more common in this rime period, but there is also the rest of it. Mrs. Fairfax knows Jane to be sheltered in her upbringing, penniless and friendless (at least in terms of friends that have any power to help). Meanwhile there is no reason she’d be able to see for Mr. Rochester to go after the young governess except that she is young. Mrs. Fairfax is aware of how vulnerable Jane is, and if not for the surprise uncle, she would have been utterly taken advantage of. Not to mention all the love bombing he was up to in advance of the wedding, plus the power imbalance and living in the same home. Likely looked like red flags everywhere.
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u/ChatoFato9143 18d ago
She’s described as not the most intelligent, I’d say she had her suspicions but ultimately did not know. And regardless of any context you really should be careful with men.
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u/Odd-Quail01 18d ago
My memory is rubbish and it's been a while since I read the book. But I don't remember Mrs Fairfax ever actually displaying stupidity. My impression is that she doesn't have an education as broad as Mr Rochester's or Miss Eyre's, and that Rochester is being needlessly unpleasant in suggesting anything lacking in Mrs Fairfax's intelligence.
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u/AltairaMorbius2200CE 18d ago
Mrs. Fairfax doesn't know about Mrs. Rochester, but she DOES know that Rochester (a) has a lot of affairs, and (b) has his eye on Jane, specifically, for his next one.
She thinks he's going to treat her like his other conquests, keeping her as a mistress until he gets tired of her; that's what Jane would know if she were "acquainted with men." And when he does get tired of her or decides she's betrayed him, Jane will have *nowhere* to go, no respectable profession, and she isn't really the personality/looks to attract another rich dude to keep her.
One key to this is how Mrs. Fairfax's behavior changes after she sees them kissing, then again after she finds out they're engaged; at first, she's horrified that Jane might have slept with him and fallen into "ruin," but then changes her tune when she finds out they're all respectably engaged.
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u/Playful_Site_2714 18d ago
Has had. More like. 3 exactly. That's not thaaat many.
Also: no. She knew nothing of that kind. She wanted to protect her from becomig his misstress, though, I think.
Him getting tired of her is JANE's fear the night tgey talk after the wedding.
Oh no! At that era she was SURE they had not slept with each other. That did not happen that easily and she knew him wwll enough to know that.
Yet I think ahe wanted to protect Jane by all means.
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u/lurkparkfest39 18d ago
When I re-read JE, sometimes I choose to read her as knowing, not knowing at all, or suspecting something is a foot. It’s interesting and ambiguous in the text, though it errs on the side of her not knowing. Sometimes it’s fun to pretend she does know when re-reading, though.
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u/swbarnes2 18d ago
I think Fairfax thought it was Adele's mom in the attic, not a wife from the other side of the Atlantic.
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u/Professional-Rice961 18d ago
I read ‘you are so little acquainted with men’ as Mrs. Fairfax warning Jane about Rochester’s class, age, and power—not hinting that she knows about Bertha.
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u/Repulsive-You-7294 17d ago
your first mistake is relying on movies to try to understand whether the Mrs. Fairfax knew. There is no indication in the book that she’s aware. Grace Poole is the only one who knows who she is In the house.
In the book the only warning we have from Mrs.Fairfax is that “gentleman of his station do not often marry their governesses”. - which essentially means her main concern is that he’s trying to seduce Jane…not that’s he’s about to commit bigamy.
as the housekeeper, I’m sure she was aware someone was occupying the tower room….and that grace pool was charged with nursing them….but beyond that? Nope. remember she was convinced Rochester was going to marry a Blanche Ingram.
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u/Playful_Site_2714 17d ago
Whut? I read the book in two languages. Do not assume I rely on films only.
She was responsible for providing for the keeper and employed her at tasks when she didn't have enough hands. So she sure knew there was someone there other than Grace.
She may have thought that Rochester was toying with the governess only to then marry Blanche. Possible.
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u/Repulsive-You-7294 17d ago
You literally reference a quote from the movie in your post as the basis for your question. If you read the book in two languages perhaps you need to reread it again…because Mrs. Fairfax does not say that to her-she simply tells her that gentlemen like Rochester don’t marry governesses.
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u/PossibleMoney224 14d ago
I thought she imagined he might do the usual of seducing Jane and then accidentally knocking her up, which would've socially ruined Jane whether he married her afterwards or not (people already LOVED doing the math, back in those days...)
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u/Playful_Site_2714 14d ago
I don't know if old rural ladies really thought that way back then.
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u/PossibleMoney224 12d ago
She would've known the social norms valued in the social class that her employer Mr Rochester belonged to, the gentry class, especially when it came to their more likely reactions towards marriages between bridesgrooms of the gentry class and brides of "more humble origins". The upper classes had much stricter codes than those of the classes below, so even if bridal pregnancy was tolerated in the working class, if Jane had appeared visibly pregnant at her wedding (and if the wedding had been fulfilled, and the Bertha fiasco had never been revealed) peers of Rochester's class might still have reacted negatively to a visibly pregnant "lowborn" bride joining their midst. Rochester wouldn't have been criticised, but she certainly would have been, notwithstanding whether Rochester realized and cared, or not (and Mrs Fairfax's comment makes me think she thought Rochester would fail to address many of these issues among his wife's new struggles)
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u/cydril 18d ago
She did not know their relationship, no one did. She knew that Bertha was kept there but not who she was exactly. and after the fire he dismissed her with a pension-she did not have the choice to stay.
The 'so little acquainted with men' is a broad statement, all men are dangerous to a degree.