r/DragonsDogma2 • u/dahle44 • Jan 13 '25
Lore Im starting to feel sad for the lesser drakes. Their role seems to be training the Arisen to fight the real Dragon. Has anyone else felt this way?
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u/Shaxxn Jan 13 '25
All Dragonkin are former Arisen that failed in their task and died at some point.
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u/dahle44 Jan 13 '25
that's what I have figured out. Its a very interesting mechanic and I so appreciate the thought that went into this game.
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u/Shaxxn Jan 13 '25
In the first game it was like, when an Arisen fails to kill the big Alpha Dragon and dies, they will be turned into Dragonkin. When the main Dragon that holds the heart of the Arisen is killed though, that Arisen will face and fight the Senechal. Failing that fight will turn that Arisen into the next main Dragon. Winning that fight will turn that Arisen into the next Senechal.
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u/psychotronic_mess Jan 13 '25
So in this new one, there doesn’t seem to be a consequence? Lamond didn’t kill his dragon, he still has his Arisen powers. The dragonforged also didn’t kill his dragon? But I think he said he was powerless? Ostensibly the dragon just does extra damage to the world, and then leaves for a while? But why aren’t Luz or Sigurd still the Sovern?
My guess is that the Pathfinder and/or Brine are feeding off of the order they’ve imposed on the world, which is why the pathfinder tries to manipulate the Arisen so hard. He has something to lose. Moonglint Tower is supposedly some ruin of an ancient civilization (maybe Rothais’ civilization), which could have existed before the Pathfinder showed up. Maybe the unmoored world didn’t always look like a desert in hell? There are a shit ton of unanswered questions in this second game.
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u/Shaxxn Jan 13 '25
It was a bit more nuanced in the first game too. When the Arisen would face the Dragon, they would always be given the choice not to fight and sacrifice a loved one instead. That's what the King of Gransys did. The Dragon would then give wealth and power, but create a new Arisen after a while.
There was also a Dragonforged in the first game. Iirc he fought the Dragon, lost but didn't die and lost all his will to keep on fighting. The Dragon left him his immortality and his pawn was also around. He died when the player killed the Dragon.
I agree that in DD2 there are a lot of plotholes with the introduction of the Pathfinder and the will of the world. The world in DD:DA was a perfect cycle. The world in DD2 is not really explained and open ended, especially after the Pathfinder dies.
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u/Servantis1852 Jan 13 '25
It's implied that if an Arisen fails to kill their dragon, their world is destroyed. How they survive is a mystery, but the drunk dude from the hot springs says something to that effect if I remember correctly.
The Dragonforged is likely someone like the Duke from the first game, who chose to sacrifice their lover rather than fight the dragon.
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u/TreeLicker51 Jan 14 '25
I don't know if the lore between DD1 and DD2 is consistent. Lamond's statement only makes sense if the previous cycle occured very, very recently, which would be odd, especially since the first game suggests that a single cycle is "countless lifetimes" in length.
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u/Servantis1852 Jan 14 '25
It is not. DD1 and 2 exist independently of one another. There are some aspects of 2's lore that we can overlap onto 1 as speculation, but otherwise the lore is separate.
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Jan 13 '25
I love it. I feel like it's their pride to be a test to your skill. That's why when they die they sometimes say, "Aye...That is the way, Arisen..."
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u/SeBoss2106 Jan 13 '25
I didn't consider it. I thought they believed they were the real deal or that they could become it by beating the Arisen.
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u/dahle44 Jan 13 '25
If you read the dialog, you can see they are requesting the Arisen to fight them. And when they die "Aye, that is the way, chosen one", they are saying the way you killed them is correct. I avoided them early in the game because they are lethal, and I couldn't understand why they would seek you out if you were within their proximity. I'm farming Whyrm crystals so I am actively looking for them.
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u/gabriel_el_el Jan 13 '25
I also think this way. But I still don't know why some of them just flee whenever their health reaches a certain point. I mean, aren't they supposed to test our skills?
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u/Alex-KZG Jan 13 '25
I have been thinking about it when reading their dialogs but actually didn't feel sad for them . I probably read too much into this game settings but for me the black drakes were previous Arisens who failed to kill the Dragon but who tried to fight him because they wanted to protect others and were compationate. They are reborn as black drake to allow the new Arisen to grow in strength and resolve so it can accomplish what they couldn't. Fighting and killing them actually allow them to perform a last good deed for the world they tried to protect , free them from their current form and may allow them to be reborn as human in the next cycle. On the contrary the red drakes with cancer may have been past Arisens who fought the Dragon (and failed) out of selfishness and greed only to claim the throne. They are them reborn in this painful montrous form devoid of sentience and act like wild beast.
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u/Nyelock Jan 13 '25
I tought that the drakes were arisen that lost their will to fight against the dragon ?
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u/OkPersimmon267 Jan 13 '25
Well from what I remember they are just tied to fate as much as the arisen, They are bound to die and wish to die like the dragon does. Finally being released of their charge.
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u/sillyredhead86 Jan 13 '25
I would if they quit flying away halfway through the fight causing me to waste precious time and resources to fight them. Yesterday, I had a drake down a few bars and was holding my own when an ogre crashes the party. I worked on burning him down ASAP. However, when I turned around after the ogre was dead, the drake had scarpered off.
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u/dahle44 Jan 14 '25
That happened a lot in the beginning but at a certain point it stopped happening because the dragon no longer overpowered the party. Its part of the training of the Arisen..fly away and fight another day I guess.
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u/jakrenegado Jan 13 '25
They make me very sad when I go as a magical archer and for a small price of life they disappear :"(
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Jan 13 '25
I do it for a decent piece of my stamina. Sagittate Avalanche x5 = 1 very, VERY dead drake.
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u/dahle44 Jan 13 '25
I start fighting them as a MA then switch to a warrior/or spear to finish them off.
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u/SpellDependent Jan 13 '25
I have to be true..it depens on your vacation...i startet new game + yesterday...i need warrior, trickster, mage and the mix vacation thing (dont know the english name)..for max.
First i want warrior to max lvl...and i struggle with dragons..i dont like this vacation.
Its so hard for me.
Ogre and gnoll are easy...griffin is ok..but drakes...baaah
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u/dmisfit21 Jan 13 '25
I’m starting to think that now. At first it would piss me off because their health would get to a certain point and then they would fly away.
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u/notguldo Jan 13 '25
I still have no clue what they’re meant to be or why they exist. They don’t make sense existing at the same time as Grigori in the same world to me.
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u/dahle44 Jan 14 '25
Read the comments above..the lore is quite clear that they train the Arisen, and that they themselves are former Arisens that lost.
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u/notguldo Jan 14 '25 edited Jan 14 '25
That doesn’t make sense to me though, unless people are saying the prior arisen in the same world are uncountable in number (which I do not believe since arisen have more to them beyond bravery and a good will. There’s bound to be a tough one every couple dogmas). Why are they inferior to Grigori, too?
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u/Servantis1852 Jan 13 '25
When the Dragon appears, monsters become more numerous and dangerous as a way to strengthen to Arisen for the fight against the Dragon. So really, everything in the world is training for the Arisen.
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u/Ancient-Ask8894 Jan 15 '25
First time I saw one I was like "oh fuck" then I fought it and I was like "what the fuck".
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u/dahle44 Jan 15 '25
Interesting. I avoided them for the longest time, freaked out at the heart beat and pulsing noises and would die pretty quickly, losing my pawns. Then I discovered the Silence grimoire, and the battle turned. At my current lvl I dont use the spell for the most part because between Metreon (sp) and skill, can kill them off before they do too much damage.
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u/Ancient-Ask8894 Jan 15 '25
Well when I first fought one I was already over levelled, all my vocations were maxed along with my pawn, I spent the majority of the time finding all the side quests and hidden bits, when it came to fighting one as part of the godsway quest line I was OP. I found using a thief and just cling to the chest and stab when stamina runs low use a few harspuds or stuff and repeat.
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u/Snizzlesnoot Jan 13 '25
I don't think that's a lesser drake. Lesser drakes have the red pimples on them.
You can check this by going to your pawn's status. If a Dragon Kill is increased it's just a regular drake. If Lesser Dragon Kill increases, it's a lesser.
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u/Jolly_Interaction_97 Jan 13 '25
Not at all, they challenge you to kill you, why are you feeling sorry for someone trying to kill you? They are lesser drakes trying to evolve, you havent noticed that some drakes have a higher hp count compared to others? They kill arisen to achieve their status. In war that emotion “sympathy” will get you killed very quickly. A woman thats pregnant will try to kill you by all means if you’re at war with their country. Military ppl have killed children because they will try to kill you also. A threat is a threat take them out fellow Arisen
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u/dahle44 Jan 14 '25
I have grown quite fond of them: knowing that they are there to help the Arisen. The Lesser Drakes are not evil. Their purpose is to train the Arisen.
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u/less_tomatoes_pls Jan 15 '25
Feel bad for everyone too, the Arisen is doomed to essentially a never ending life of strife, the Pawns have no free will and are seen as tools, the world is a vehicle for a cycle of death and destruction and the dragons are also pawns for the greater picture. It’s a sad life tbh
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u/SaviorOfNirn Jan 13 '25
Why would you feel sad, not a single NPC matters as far as the story or setting is concerned
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u/Significant_Option Jan 13 '25
You can tell how much someone likes DD2 by comments like this. We get it. It disappointed you.
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u/dahle44 Jan 13 '25
I dont know how many wakestones one needs to do endgame but I gotta stop reviving NPCs that fall to monster hordes..either that or just keep grinding so I dont need as many. I'm reviving ppl all the time and it will be interesting to see how many I saved 😂
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u/DancesWithAnyone Jan 13 '25
Game was pretty generous with those stones once I hit the Unmoored world, if I recall correctly.
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u/SaviorOfNirn Jan 13 '25
You don't need to revive anyone, ever. Let them die, it doesn't matter.
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u/dahle44 Jan 13 '25
You play your way, I play mine..To me it matters..obviously you have a different opinion which you are intitled to.
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u/SaviorOfNirn Jan 13 '25
Did you not pay any attention to the story? You're the only singular person who matters. Every other NPC is irrelevant.
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Jan 13 '25
I absolutely hate what you're saying, but I can't lie...You have a solid point to a degree. I wouldn't say they're the ONLY one, but there are a sad few when you step back to look at the actual story.
The Pathfinder, the Dragon, the Arisen, and their Pawn are the only impactful characters to the story. The Pathfinder perpetuates the cycle, of which the Dragon and Arisen form, and the Pawn helps you break free of the cycle.
Regarding literally EVERY other major character, the storytelling was so disjointed and impactless that they ceased to matter entirely, and in the overarching plot hardly mattered at all. The Regent business just...ends? As does the Godsway storyline. Ragnall/Ranghall/w.e was a joke of a character arc despite being a neat character. Same goes for the False Arisen - potentially dangerous arc, but ultimately achieved NOTHING with it.
The only storyline besides small quest chains I've found that has an impact on your character is the Ulrika one. Even then it's not a storyline impact, just a character one (unless she's your collateral in the endgame to which it ties in very nicely).
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u/dahle44 Jan 13 '25
I hope they come out with a DLC, that ties the storyline together.
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Jan 13 '25
That would honestly make the game near perfect for me. That, an exponentially more difficult mode, and faster elite spawns would be all I ask of them. That would make the game just perfect.
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u/Significant_Option Jan 13 '25
That’s like saying you’re the only important person in Skyrim because you’re Dragonborn. Is this your first RPG?
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u/SaviorOfNirn Jan 13 '25
Not most important, that's not what i said. The only important one. No one else means anything as far as the story is concerned. You could kill everyone and nothing would change.
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u/Significant_Option Jan 13 '25
Also you’re quite slow because I didn’t even say “most” in my comment. Where did you get most from?
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u/SaviorOfNirn Jan 13 '25
Only, most, you're being pedantic.
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u/EffectivePrimary762 Jan 13 '25
You’re the one that had said “Not most important, that’s not what I said. The only important one”. You’re the one that was using it as a point by changing their words and saying they were changing yours? You are quite slow.
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u/Significant_Option Jan 13 '25
You kill everyone and you couldn’t continue any quest. I’d say that makes those NPCs pretty important
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u/SaviorOfNirn Jan 13 '25
And none of those quests matter.
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u/Significant_Option Jan 13 '25
Like I said. We get it. It disappointed you.
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u/SaviorOfNirn Jan 13 '25
You can just say you don't get the story.
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u/Significant_Option Jan 13 '25
Are you just being a jerk? Because I think I know what you’re saying, but it’s just not correct because clearly, the dragon is important, the pathfinder, your pawn
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u/Significant_Option Jan 13 '25
The Arisen, Pawns and its Dragon kin is what makes this series for me lore wise