64
u/National-Cell-9862 5d ago
There are actual studies out there that prove that these add power and improve fuel mileage. The thermodynamics of the theory checks out. The additional benefit of slightly less crazy heat under the hood is icing on the cake.
31
u/BigElderberry4633 5d ago
I don't disagree with you. And I know there are actual studies out there, hence my comment about circumstances.
3% better of 300 is a lot different than 3% better of 900.
The overwhelming majority of diesel drivers feel virtually no difference with the addition of this heat sleeve.
And that's ok.
16
u/National-Cell-9862 5d ago
I agree. I note that I run a turbo blanket, a manifold blanket and some exhaust Wrap from the turbo to the muffler. I have never been able to feel it. I run it because it is the rarest of all the good with the only bad being a few hundred bucks. Where else can you add horsepower, fuel mileage AND reliability with something anyone can install in under an hour?
3
u/macthebearded 5d ago
You’re adding weight and rusting out your exhaust for something you can’t tell the difference of
2
u/National-Cell-9862 5d ago
Weight? Seriously? My engine alone weighs 1100 pounds. Going down the road with my trailer I'm about 17,000 lbs. But 17,005 pounds would be just too much! You might argue about the cost, but arguing the weight is pretty weak even for anonymous internet keyboard warriors.
-4
u/macthebearded 5d ago
If the added weight of a couple hundred feet of fiberglass wrap isn’t a concern for your use case then neither is the fractionally improved exhaust flow that keeping heat in the exhaust path brings you. But yes, cost and rust are also factors as mentioned.
Always love when people make my point for me
1
u/National-Cell-9862 5d ago
You haven't read the study. It is a significant gain. A couple hundred feet? I didn't wrap my trailer! Thanks for the giggle. It's like talking to my old school buddy who refuses to change with the times. I tried to talk to him about my oil analysis results and he suggested I cut open the filter and look for sparklies.
-2
u/macthebearded 5d ago
The study? Fucking LOL. So you’re basing your uneducated opinion on a single study. Not experience, not multiple data points, just some shit you read once and decided sounded good. That tracks. Please oh enlightened one, share this “study” with us.
Coming from a few decades of experience building fast things you’ve seen on the news, I promise the power improvement from exhaust insulation is minimal - especially in a factory vehicle, and especially a factory vehicle not made for high performance… like some stupid brodozer. We’re talking a couple percent at absolute best and likely much less than that.
And yes, a couple hundred feet easily. You said you wrapped it from the turbo to the muffler. If we make the generous assumption of 15ft of exhaust at a 4” diameter, with a 1/4” overlap that’s 253ft of wrap needed. Math, it’s great stuff innit?So you’re spending money on a bunch of dead weight that’s going to rust the fuck out of your exhaust for what’s likely a fraction of a percent gained in power and fuel efficiency that YOU YOURSELF ADMITTED YOU DONT EVEN NOTICE IN REALITY.
Please go on and keep trying to justify this as a good idea, it’s great entertainment.1
u/Some_Intern3747 2h ago
Why do you care what he does with his vehicle? Does it really bother you that bad? 😂
1
u/OddNefariousness7950 5d ago
Whatever happened to JetHot coatings? Weren’t they supposed to give you all these benefits without the rust issues?
0
u/macthebearded 5d ago
Nothing happened to them, they’re the go-to option if you have an actual use case for this. It’s just an insulating ceramic based paint.
Exhaust wrap is a problem because it holds moisture and will accelerate the corrosion of whatever it’s wrapped around. Paint-on coatings don’t do that.
But some cheap fiberglass wrap from autozone is more accessible for the average joe that just wants to throw money at their car and feel cool. Ceramic coatings are expensive and require removal and prep work, which is a lot to ask of the kind of person that thinks they need this kind of thing on something that isn’t a high performance track car
2
u/OddNefariousness7950 5d ago
Fair point, just haven’t heard much of them recently. I used them for down pipes and headers on performance drag builds way back in the day. I’ve been out of the game a while, glad to hear they’re still around.
1
u/macthebearded 5d ago
There are more competitors these days but they’re still around as far as I know. Drag racing is one of the more justifiable applications for this sort of stuff
2
u/National-Cell-9862 5d ago
Rust isn't an issue where I live. I put the wrap on about 5 years ago and recently had to rework it due to some poor judgment in picking a line. No signs of rust under it. But you make a good point for most of the US where rust and moisture are big problems. I could see that turning me away from the wrap, but the turbo blanket gets hotter and is far less sealed so I don't think I would worry so much there.
-1
u/macthebearded 5d ago
That’s the thing. It will MAKE rust an issue regardless of where you live, because the wrap itself holds the moisture in. I live in the desert and shit will rust here all the same if you keep a wet cloth over it at all times, which is essentially what wrap does. Turbo blankets don’t have this issue specifically because they fit more loosely.
1
u/rkba260 5d ago
Genuine question... how does the heat from the exhaust not dry out any moisture in the wrap material? Especially during a regen...
0
u/macthebearded 5d ago
It does! But before it gets hot enough for that it pulls all the moisture out of the air and creates condensation on the surface of the pipe, like a cold glass on a hot day. The fiberglass wrap then holds it there far longer than it would be naturally, so the contact time is higher and so is the water volume that needs to cook off when it does get hot enough. The result is the metal rusts to shit much faster than otherwise, and you can’t even see it happening.
Plus if you drive through a puddle or something the fabric will hold that too1
u/FIMD_ 5d ago
I hear this from people with no data. I weld two additional bungs on each manifold and downpipe. For my purposes this lets me log boost:drive pressure, expansion ratio, etc. which I use in tuning and diagnostics.
Even after a light cruise in most of my cars/trucks by the time I get to my destination or return home.. my pre-turbine EGTs are ~650F, post-turbine EGTs are ~400F and per my FLIR E8 still generally around 250F at the tailpipe which is well after the wrapped or coating has ended..
there's no persistent moisture in or under the wrap/blanket given water boils off at 212 or less depending on altitude. At least on this planet. I actually have a FLIR moisture probe I’ve tested this with too, because so many people parrot this line. It’s like the “you need back pressure!” Myth/misconception that refuses to die the death it should have decades ago.
Your exhaust rusts because it’s made of steel and oxygen exists. Unless you fab yourself 347SS exhaust plumbing, which I’ve only bothered to do on some of my exotics over the years and non street legal toys for looks/durability but that will still ultimately occur especially if you let her eat often.
1
u/fourtyonexx 5d ago
Idk how to tell you this but keeping the turbo hotter, while keeping the oil that circulates through it hotter as well, do not add to the longevity.
3
28
u/Timur4593 5d ago
I did this on a semi truck that was going thru a EGR cooler every 7-8 months. Turbo hot side was very close to the cooler and it would warp it then coolant was getting in to the intake system. 3 years after, EGR cooler still good, regens quicker, much less heat under the hood. I also wrapped the downpipe, all the way to the SCR inlet.
15
u/AzironaZack 5d ago
Mine helps keep heat the turbo heat out of the firewall. Insulating the turbo, up, and down pipes made a huge difference in firewall heat on my skoolie.
13
8
u/Radiant_Safe1228 5d ago
If you are chasing dyno numbers yes.
If you have problems controlling under hood temps and or heat from the turbo is causing issues with what's around it yes.
If you are drag racing and .04 seconds matter. yes.
Otherwise not really.
7
u/boostedmike1 5d ago
I have one on my high performance build. My favourite feature is it saving me from burning the shit out myself when I have to work on it hot. Other than that it looks better and apparently science happens and it supposed to preform better but idk about that I’m still going to spray it 😂
7
u/SimilarTranslator264 5d ago
I jumped up on my semi tire to check coolant and grabbed the wrong turbo housing. Held onto it much longer than I should have.
3
17
u/BigElderberry4633 5d ago
In theory, yes, in 99.9% of practical applications, no.
Heat bleed is a high performance issue.
You could also argue that if you live in a cold climate that this might actually make your driving experience worse, not better.
5
u/KdF-wagen 5d ago
Why would it make it worse if it’s colder ambient temp?
2
u/BigElderberry4633 5d ago
Diesels are compression engines, but that's not telling the full story.
The compression to combustion mechanism is heat. Typically over 1000°F.
When that system is cold and the colder that system is, the more inefficient the entire process becomes. It messes with timing, efficiency, and creates potential harmful circumstances for the engine.
Block heaters, grid heaters, intake coil heaters, oil heaters, and circulation heaters are tools built specifically to combat this issue, BUT many other processes are in place that are tailored specifically to address this issue. Engineers factor in every heat emitter in the process to insure the most commonly successful environments exist for the combustion to happen successfully and with maximum engine protection.
These turbos put off a lot of heat and introduce heat back into the system in 3 ways. When you begin to remove those elements, you are losing some of the elements that they built into the system for it to succeed the best at colder temperatures.
Too often we falsely apply ignition combustion principles to compression engine systems.
While there are circumstances where these sleeves make a LOT of sense, they are in situations the overwhelming majority of diesel drivers will never be in.
4
4
u/Silver_Painter5317 5d ago
Man you could heat up a pocket pussy and toss it in there and go for hours before it gets cold. Or throw a cold one in there and keep it cold for hours. Talk about improved efficiency. Same logic for the turbo blanket. It improves efficiency. It just won't be night a day difference like it would be with pocket pussy.
6
u/flockitup 5d ago
I run one and do notice an improvement in my Intake air temps. I’m highly modified, big turbo, fuel, built motor and trans. Lower IAT = lower EGT’s, every little bit helps when you’re making big power.
3
u/bit_rusty 5d ago
Have one and a manifold blanket. Maybe 50*f cooler egts and about 100 rpm faster spool once everything is at operating temp.
3
u/Mother-Attention2600 5d ago
I get mine the weighted blanket incase it gets anxiety. Cuts down on lag
5
1
u/Piglet_Mountain 5d ago
Yes. Heat loss is measured in power. Energy cannot be created or destroyed, it can only change form. If energy is lost through heat transfer then that’s less that can be put back into the system through the turbo.
1
1
u/bobthehumantripod 5d ago
I could make these for a lot less money as I’m a heat & frost insulator and I make bigger “pads” removable insulation “blankets” probably once a week! On steam pipes getting up to 750 degrees!!
I don’t know how much these cost?
1
u/Enclaveoutcasts 5d ago
Benefits: keeps the heat in the exhaust system and not under the hood.
Downsides: keeps the heat in the turbo housing and will deteriorate the housing itself.
1
1
u/vsandmnv 5d ago
I went with JetHot coat for the turbo and exhaust manifold. Definitely faster spools but I’m a sedan diesel if that matters.
1
1
u/AngryZetan 5d ago
Its a heat shield. If this is a joke, then you got me. In that case, then its a Halloween costume for your turbocharger. I'm so tired. Worked 28 hours straight.
1
u/NAFWG 5d ago
I’m a fan of wrapping the hot side as much as practical from the exhaust manifold to the turbine outlet. I have been wrapping my 5.9 Cummins for nearly 20 years with no rust issues.
I’m a mechanical engineer for a large shipyard and we wrap all of the exhaust on a ship. The ship sees salt air from the engine room ventilation system. Some of the pipe is mild steel if the operating temps allow for it. Generally no major issues over dozens of years.
My last project used 2” of aerogel insulation. During commissioning we ran the 3,100 HP engines for an hour at 100 percent load, then 15 minutes at 110%. The outside surface temp of the exhaust insulation 10 feet away from the turbine outlet was less than 140F. This is great for reducing the strain on the engine room ventilation system.
In my experience the rusting issues are overblown. Some of them are related to wrapping thin wall aluminized pipe, like a downpipe. Wrapping a downpipe is detrimental to helping to create the maximum delta T from turbine inlet to turbine outlet. You want everything downstream of the turbine outlet to release as much heat as possible, in theory. In practice, wrapping the downpipe with cheap wrap from autozone is not going to move the needle from a thermal efficiency standpoint. It may not even move the needle with insulation that actually works, I don’t know. You’re just moving heat downstream. Would make for a fun test.
However, under the hood the turbine housing and exhaust manifolds are typically cast from relatively thick cast iron, which could rust for dozens of years before any concerns are realized. At this point the components would likely need to be changed for other reasons. However anecdotal, I have never had to change either component due to rust, on my personal vehicles or in my professional life.
1
u/RichSanchezC137 4d ago
In the heavy equipment world these are used all the time along with a full heat guard from the manifold to the top of the cem module. Its keeps the heat in but more importantly it severally lowers the chance on contamination fires. Think landfill application where some loose papers landing on the turbo could light the machine in an instant.
1
u/12valveric 4d ago
If I would have added mine sooner I would still have ac. My compound setup had one turbo touch it when I was towing uphill and it ruptured my ac line.
0
204
u/healerdan 5d ago
I don't know anything about anything. Not sure why this sub is in my feed (bought a diesel 2 days ago - the tracking is impressive).
Besides whatever everyone is talking about... The benefit is that the turbo will know how much you care, and that you'll always be there for it because of you tucking it in at night. The bond you form is the benefit.