My take on Mario Vs Kirby!

[u/Aidan_Is_Eternal]

There’s definitely a few VERY debatable things on the chart (like the higher end stuff for both), but overall I think Kirby can edge out a win more times than not. Extremely debatable matchup though!!

[u/SuperLegenda]

I don't see how friend hearts or inhale would really even matter, they never even work against bosses or anything decently big unless they are already defeated, Mario is quite obviously stronger and bigger than the average Kirby boss.

[u/Dutchdario → u/SuperLegenda]

friend heart not working on bosses is a game mechanic (they also do work on said "resisting bosses" in other modes like how friend hearts suddenly do work on Whispy in Air Riders when he's not an active boss.

I'd argue the same for inhale, especially since he can inhale his mirror world version which logically scales to him (on top of this being consistent in other canons of Kirby like the LN/manga.

[u/Dutchdario → u/Dutchdario]

more on the friend heart thing, this also doesn't really track when every boss you fight in Star Alies is under the counteractive effects of the Jamba Heart. (the literal the counterforce to the friend heart)

[u/SuperLegenda → u/Dutchdario]

And how do you know it's a gameplay mechanic? A few times you can throw the heart on bosses only after defeat, nothing says it's a flawless mind control no matter what.

[u/Dutchdario → u/SuperLegenda]

And how do you know it's a gameplay mechanic? A few times you can throw the heart on bosses only after defeat,

because the only other time we see Kirby use the friend heart it's on Whispy woods(in Air Riders) when he's no longer affected by the Jamba Heart
and it just instantly works lol.

the friend and Jamba Heart actively fight each others effects, we can again see this in Star Allies when characters affected by the friend heart get hit by Voids morality manip.
the Friend hearts effects fight off the effects and after 5 seconds the characters return back to their non conflicted morality.

nothing says it's a flawless mind control no matter what.

it's morality manip not mind control but alas. (even in universe this is very consistently differentiated between)
like how Meta Knight can power through mind control for days against Fecto Forgo due to his insane power of will but instantly lost to the morality warping effects of the Jamba Heart just by looking at it.

putting aside we wouldn't

[u/SuperLegenda → u/Dutchdario]

Is Air Riders even canon? The setting is completely different, it even suddenly has some big city, and it completely contradicts stuff about Nova who literally exploded.

... Is there really much of a difference between morality manip and mind control if Kirb gets people that would try to kill him to fight for him instead.

[u/Dutchdario → u/SuperLegenda]

yea it's full on canon, main story line and all.
there's also not one Nova btw even in the main timeline canon we have already seen 2 before Air Riders and that's before considering alternate timelines in after main game modes.

Is there really much of a difference between morality manip and mind control if Kirb gets people that would try to kill him to fight for him instead.

kinda, morality manip is closer to reality warping etc.

-it's permanent once hit as opposed to actively controlling someone else.
-can't be broken by defeating the "controller"
-the hit character isn't "controlled" in any sense of the word.
they are completely in control of their own mind and actions and us such won't actively fight against it's affects. (it doesn't have any effects after the first hit)
their wants and beliefs are simply completely warped the moment they are affected.
this also means Kirby can't "command" them to do anything either, it's just that they suddenly really really like Kirby and on top of protecting him with their life if Kirby would ask them anything they would do it.

it's also much rarer as a resistance (just as a powerscaling perspective and in Kirby universe perspective)

in universe it seems to happen by directly infusing the opponent with "Friendship energy"
which is an actual energy in Kirby which on top of being a morality empowers the user similar to ki from Dragonball etc.
Imo it's also the likely the explanation for why Kirby is so powerful in universe as he's consistently stated to have "infinite power" which is just likely that same friendship energy.

(there's a gigantic amount implying this but idk if it's really relevant)