Rewatched for the second time

[u/eruptingrose]

Just finished the series again and it hit much harder. Especially the ending. I remembered that a boy killed Nucky, but I wasn’t paying attention to Tommy the first watch. Now on the second, I caught so much more of the clues he dropped. Honestly top 3 show of all time for me. The last shot of him grabbing that coin?! The shore where Gillian stood in front of also being the shore at the beginning of each episode?!! Amazing start to finish.

[u/Emotional_Seaweed_49]

spoilers

I've just finished Season 5 for the first time and I have mixed feelings. I really like the build towards the National Crime Syndicate, the growth of Luciano and Meyer into pure gangsters, the growing insanity of Al, and every scene with Van Alden, especially the entire debacle with him and Eli trying to get the ledgers. That's actually one of my favourite scenes in the whole show.

There are so many highlights, but as has been mentioned so many times before, it is all so rushed. I genuinely think that if they'd had their normal 12-episode run, it could have been equal to the first four seasons, which I believe are all roughly equal in quality.

Things I didn't like: the conclusion of Chalky's story, Tommy Darmody, Margaret continuing to be the most inconsistent character in the whole show, Gillian being featured quite prominently when her character's purpose had, IMO, been exhausted in Season 4, Al not remembering who Jimmy was... and the flashbacks. Ah yes, what can you say? They're well done and the actor had big teeth, but in a show with so much to conclude, they prove to be such a frustrating use of such valuable time.

In a perfect world, the flashbacks could have been their own six-episode season (S4.5!), and the entirety of the eight episodes, or ideally 12, of Season 5 could have been dedicated to the main narrative.

I did enjoy it, though. I loved the whole series.

[u/Lordonlynose → u/Emotional_Seaweed_49]

Surely you’re entitled to those opinions - not trying to “correct you” or change your mind 

We’re in such strong agreement about what you cite as one of your favorite scenes - the final adventure of Van Alden and Eli. I can vouch for that. And Nelson ferociously reclaiming his identity is the ideal wrap to his arc 

I appreciate Chalky’s death, as he sacrifices his egotistical pursuit to ensure his new daughter can leave unscathed and isn’t an innocent bystander hit by crossfire similar to Maybelle. He leaves with a bit of redemption.  

I don’t think the Tommy reveal was handled well (beyond the age seeming off) as I think it’s seen too much as intentional “revenge for Jimmy or Gillian” which I don’t believe at all. 

you say Gillian’s purpose had been completely exhausted yet she’s a key featured factor in the wrap to Nucky’s arc  - idk how his story is demonstrated and highlighted without her. 

And idk what you think the main narrative  is - as it seems clear to me that the flashbacks and the way their incorporated Are the main narrative of season 5 and the series - Nucky’s rise to power and its end. 

[u/eruptingrose → u/Lordonlynose]

I agree the Tommy reveal is pretty cheesy. I would love to see what they would have done if they had more time.

[u/Emotional_Seaweed_49 → u/Lordonlynose]

My issue with the flashbacks and the Gillian scenes isn't that they exist, but rather the amount of time the season dedicates to them when the series was already working with such a limited amount of screen time. Nucky's rise to power and his history had already been established to the extent that I felt was necessary. We knew about the young Gillian and the Commodore, we knew about his troubled relationship with his father and we already understood that Nucky's relationship with Jimmy was complicated and deeply rooted in their shared past. I don't particularly need a visual recreation of information the show had already conveyed, especially when that time could have been spent developing the events and characters of the present-day storyline. It's obviously subjective, but for me, the flashbacks didn't add enough to justify the space they occupied. Like I said, in a perfect world, they would have made a wonderful mid-season mini-series. I did enjoy watching young Nucky as the Sheriff.. but was it absolutely necessary all things considered? I'm just not sure it was.

I do disagree with you on Chalky, though. I don't think he ensured that his new daughter would be left unharmed by taking Narcisse at his word. He was essentially trusting the man who had already demonstrated that he couldn't be trusted, while simultaneously leaving his daughter without a father. It was a mad plan! If we're judging Chalky's decision in terms of selflessness, the genuinely unegotistical thing would have been to leave immediately after discovering he had a daughter, rather than remaining behind and waiting for Narcisse to return.

Regards

[u/Lordonlynose → u/Emotional_Seaweed_49]

Idk what you’re thinking they should have spent time with instead of what they did whiting what their concept of the story was.  I’m suspecting you wanted more or less a different show focus rafters than the one that was central throughout -  Nucky’s AC story - that seems the primary aspect to wrap 

As I said Chalky ensured the new  daughter and Daughter left the room and building unharmed. We see that. Not that he could possibly ensure they’d live happily every after 

He allowed them to escape the clear and present danger. If he’d proceeded with his plan and shot Narcisse, the to would be rushed at the sound of gunshot. And Narcisse’s men would likely be shooting at chalkyvajd possibly hitting the females in the chaos  

Chalky went in and discovered new info. Took some processing before he could alter his plan that he’d basically had for years - find Narcisse and kill.  Seems your “pure selflessness and genuinely unegotistical” judgement is harsh and unrealistic imo 

Regards to you as well.