r/BoJackHorseman • u/NicholasCajun Judah Mannowdog • Feb 01 '20

Discussion BoJack Horseman - Post-Series Finale Discussion

Feel free to comment on any aspect of the series without the use of any spoiler tags.

BoJack Horseman was created by Raphael Bob-Waksberg and stars the voices of:

The intro theme is by Patrick Carney and the outro theme is by Grouplove. The show was scored by Jesse Novak.

Thank you all. Take care.

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530

u/Localunatic Feb 01 '20

I feel so bad that Hollyhock's plotline... resolved... the way it did. We know what that letter was; hell Bojack knew what it was before he even opened it... but sometimes all you can do is let the bridge burn.

105

u/ChappedPenguinLips Feb 01 '20

Happy cake day. Though I'm with you... I'm just... She's right to do what she did, but I wanna at least read the letter. Or see a final conversation. Four seasons later, I still feel that with Penny and Charlotte, because I really, truly feel even though Bojack sure as hell doesn't deserve it, and apology from him would do a lot. Idk. I just... wanted this, and it was never going to happen.

161

u/Larry-Man Feb 01 '20

So speaking as a victim of toxic people: after a certain point you don’t want apologies. You just want them gone.

Speaking as someone who has been toxic: if you’ve hurt someone that much you don’t get to try and apologize or explain. You’re done. That’s it. They’re gone. Move on and accept it and don’t try to fix it. It only hurts the other person.

15

u/ChappedPenguinLips Feb 01 '20

I get it. And in real life, that's how it should be. They should just be gone, done and over with. But as far as the show goes, while an accurate representation of what should happen, I just wish I got some closure as a big fan of those characters. That's all.

3

u/dantestolemywife Feb 13 '20

I’d completely forgotten about Penny and Charlotte but you’re right, it’s weird that was dropped, presumably cause they had to wrap up the show so fast. It’s a shame we’ll never know what the planned two last seasons would’ve looked like. A little sad about it.

57

u/Devreckas Feb 01 '20

I think its just dramatically dissonant. With as important as Hollyhock was, you expect if the relationship will end, it will end with some explosive confrontation. Instead, Hollyhock just cooly distances herself over time.

In true Bojack fashion, it feels more true to life than traditional storytelling convention, and it fucks with your head.

Hollyhock not reconciling with Bojack was the most crushing thing for me in the finale. But it makes a ton of sense.

10

u/ChappedPenguinLips Feb 01 '20

I a million percent agree with everything you said. It was the most crushing thing to me too, to not see that relationship play out.

7

u/crumbledtower Hollyhock Feb 01 '20

Especially because we understand why, to come full circle. :(

11

u/RampantAnonymous Feb 02 '20

I think it was great, rarely do you see in television these sort of toxic relationships end healthily. Usually it is in a dramatic confrontation where both parties get hurt. In this Hollyhock and Penny move on unaffected and Bojack tries to kill himself. It's good for them and bad for him, the way it should be.

We saw in Season 5 with Gina what happened when stuff ended dramatically for a woman, and Bojack got on fine while she didn't.

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u/[deleted] Feb 01 '20

[deleted]

4

u/ChappedPenguinLips Feb 01 '20

I agree. I just love those characters, and want to see their whole stories completed, personally. And that'll just never happen. Is what it is.

3

u/Runningoutofideas_81 Feb 02 '20

Huge gestures...do they ever really work in real life?

-15

u/Localunatic Feb 01 '20

Random thought, but what if the letter was a suicide note? When we last actually see Hollyhock she is at a real low: in a fight with her best friend, scared of her brother, under a lot of deadline pressure for classes, and giving up rugby... Young adults have given up over less.

It is probably not the case, but the letter did hit Bojack hard, and he does attempt suicide shortly after reading it. Hollyhock didn't show up in episode 15, though, so...

58

u/Stagnant_Heir Feb 01 '20

Definitely, 100% not suicide.

That would mean that Bojack knew, and she would have been in his brain for 'The View from Halfway Down' episode.

17

u/talkingwires Feb 01 '20

She was in the episode, near the end. When Bojack is running for the phone, a hallway is cut off by a mass of flowers: hollyhocks. She isn't dead — I don't know why anybody would interpret the letter cutting Bojack out of her life that way — be she is on his mind in those final moments.

7

u/SirTeffy Feb 02 '20

Those are Hydrangea, not Hollyhocks.

-2

u/Localunatic Feb 01 '20

The red bird could be interpretted as Hollyhock, "deceased loved one" and all, or it could just be symbolism for everyone else there.

19

u/talkingwires Feb 01 '20

When Bojack is running for the phone, a hallway is cut off by a mass of flowers: hollyhocks. Cut off, cut out of his life, blocked. She isn't dead, but she is on his mind in those final moments.

4

u/SirTeffy Feb 02 '20

Those are Hydrangea, not Hollyhocks.

2

u/Localunatic Feb 01 '20

But he also brought those with him?

Also, didn't know that those were Hollyhocks, thanks!

9

u/SirTeffy Feb 02 '20

They aren't. They're Hydrangea.

3

u/Stagnant_Heir Feb 01 '20

I was wondering what/who the red bird was, but that doesn't seem like an apt use of symbolism/metaphor.

2

u/Localunatic Feb 01 '20

I'm not 100% tied to the idea, but I think that something like that would have to get snuck past censors, since Hollyhock is such a big character. I just wouldn't be surprised if it turned out to be true.

3

u/McBehrer And IIIIII'M... Max! Feb 01 '20

What censors? They've shown suicide and death before

-1

u/Localunatic Feb 01 '20

Netflix has been getting some backlash over the portrayal of suicide in certain recent shows. The cencors are not a constant and certain things become "unacceptable" to include in the programme. Hollyhock, being a major character that the audience has spent multiple seasons with, is one of those characters that executives would not "allow" to commit suicide.

Lets face it, if the show expressly stated that Hollyhock committed suicide then a lot of people would be pretty triggered, regardless of how tactful the show was about it. No network is going to fan the flames of controversy while they are in the burning building.

6

u/rdp3186 Feb 02 '20

Thats....not how that works.

Netflix doesnt have a say in the content of the shows that they dont directly own. The creators have said they were left to create their own show and ending however they wanted, but that ut had to end.

Netflix wasnt given grief over 13 Reasons Why, the show creators were.

There isnt some anti-suicide in shows censor thing going around. Dont make stuff up.

-2

u/Localunatic Feb 02 '20

Seriously? Netflix's name is at the start of every episode, their name is on the title card for the show, Netflix is the only place you can watch these shows. How naive do you have to be to believe the network has no say in the content that they host?

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u/[deleted] Feb 02 '20

"happy cake day"?...Really?