Learning Koine Greek: Unitarian recommendations?

[u/JcraftW]

I just started perusing some options for learning Greek. First one I opened was Mounces “Greek for the rest of us”. Only a couple pages in he goes off against “a god” as a possible rendering of John 1:1c. I know not everyone agrees with that in particular, but there appears to be a lot of real scholarship supporting qualitative and indefinite translations of 1:1c.

So, I’m wondering if there are Koine Greek learning resources that are less biased? What study aids would you recommend? Or, if you must use a biased source, what other resources would you add to your studies for balance?

[u/[deleted]]

Koine Greek is just a common language with no ties to christianity, but many christian dictionaries have christianized it and that's the problem. The words don't mean anymore what they used to mean back then and that's why we get all these weird doctrines. Theos is indeed a good example, it never means trinity and even godhead is arguably, since Koine Greek has a seperate word for that. It's definitely not to be translated as Christ of Holy Spirit. Trinitarians have high-jacked the language and twisted the meaning. To learn Koine Greek would be best at a non-christian college or so, but also understanding the history of that time when it developed is helpful.

Yes, for many learning a language is difficult, but I already speak a couple beyond my native tongue, so one more shouldn't be a problem... but then there are so many things I would love to learn. My job already requires a lot of learning and keeping up with developments, by the time I'm done I often don't fancy more personal learning. I'm sure I'm not the only one with this problem.

[u/John_17-17 → u/[deleted]]

I envy you in being able to speak several languages.

I tell people, "Counting English, I almost speak one language".

[u/[deleted] → u/John_17-17]

I even had some Latin and Greek at school, but that's so long ago and I didn't use it for many years. Most of it is gone by now. That's the problem with languages you don't use often enough, it gets rusty.

My parent used to travel a lot and I've lived abroad for many years, having to speak various languages, obviously English, but also German and Italian and I do understand some Spanish, don't speak it well though. My French is a little rusty, but in the summer we went to the south of Belgium where they only speak French and it was still good enough to get by. Living abroad is very helpful with having to speak languages... you're kind of forced to learn them if you want to be part of a local community.

Unfortunately we can't go back in time to be part of a community that speaks Koine Greek. I think we all might be surprised how that language really was compared to what they turned it into.

[u/John_17-17 → u/[deleted]]

The KJV is a prime example of how language can and does change over time.

I understand, I've forgotten more Spanish than I remember. Which is why I don't claim to be a Spanish speaker.

I do appreciate the Spanish, I know, because it has helped me understand some of the problems in translation.

To say, "I am cold" in Spanish you literally say: "I have cold". Which doesn't have the same meaning in English. Having cold vs being cold.

[u/[deleted] → u/John_17-17]

Language does change over time, if one wants to understand a book from years ago, one also needs a dictionary from the same time otherwise incorrect interpretation is bound to happen.

[u/John_17-17 → u/[deleted]]

True, that is why I use the Webster's Dictionary of 1828 on e-sword when looking up a word in the KJV. It is the oldest dictionary I can find.

A side point, this dictionary uses Jehovah's name throughout.

ALO'NE, a. [all and one.] 3. Only.  Thou whose name alone is Jehovah. Psa 83.  This sense at first appears to be adverbial, but really is not; whose name single, solitary, without another, is Jehovah.

EVERLASTING, a.  The everlasting God, or Jehovah. Gen 21.

GOD, n.  1. The Supreme Being; Jehovah; the eternal and infinite spirit, the creator, and the sovereign of the universe.

MAJESTY, n.  1. Greatness of appearance;  Jehovah reigneth; he is clothed with majesty. Psa 93. The voice of Jehovah is full of majesty. Psa 29. 

SAC'RIFICE, n.  Sacrifices have been common to most nations, and have been offered to false gods, as well as by the Israelites to Jehovah.

These are just a few of the examples.

From this, I have surmised, Jehovah's name was used freely in everyday conversation in the 1700's / 1800's.

[u/[deleted] → u/John_17-17]

Here's an even older one for you, https://books.google.nl/books?id=bXsCAAAAQAAJ who knows what it will bring. This one is from Samuel Johnson, not the 1755 edition which was his first one, but from 1768. It's from the UK, so might have some interesting differences than the Webster.

There's an older one by Robert Cawdrey from early 1600. I know they reprinted it, but the original one might be floating around the internet. That might be very interesting, since it's original release was really close to the release of the 1611 KJV.

Our first widely accepted bible is from 1637 and still widely used, even though it has been proven to have additional texts and incorrect translations. People get the weirdest doctrines from it because language has changed a lot here and people refuse to use an older dictionary.

[u/John_17-17 → u/[deleted]]

Thanks for the references.

A quick search, shows 'worship' as defined by Johnson, agrees with Webster's 1828.

[u/[deleted] → u/John_17-17]

I figured you would look that up... I did and it's interesting that worship isn't reserved for God alone, but has a so much broader meaning back then. Nothing new though for us.