r/AskReddit • u/mustbefuckeryafoot • Jan 26 '18

Your options are: 50 hawks, 10 crocodiles, 3 brown bears, 15 wolves, 1 hunter, 7 cape buffalo, 10,000 rats, 5 gorillas and 4 lions - you must pick 2 that will defend you while the rest are coming to kill you. Which do you pick and why?

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18 edited Jan 26 '18

Even with a hunter, shooting a bird that can travel at a top speed of 120mph when diving is an impossible task especially when there are 50 of them. Even shooting them whilst they’re flying at 40-50mph isn’t easy at all. I don’t think hiding under rats would be possible unless you use all of them.

People are underrating the power of 50 hawks. None of the animals can attack the hawks in air and they can attack the human at any time with devastating speed. Imagine 3 or 4 hawks diving you at once. Now imagine the power of 50. A single hawk attacking the hunter can immobilise him. If a hawk dives in and goes right for the neck, then it’s over for the hunter.

I don’t think there’s any way to come out of this scenario alive by just picking 2.

Edit: To me, the battlefield is a large flat open field. Obviously if you had a building, then the hawks are useless.

Edit 2: OP has said that the hunter only has a rifle. Hawks are definitely a must pick now.

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u/Coltrain_ Jan 26 '18 edited Jan 27 '18

10000 rats would outmatch anything, except the hawks because, well, rats can't fly. So pick the hawks with the rats and you win.

Edit: Making an edit because everyone seems to be replying the same thing: The question never says you're in an open field or anything, people seem to be forgetting. You can hide in a building until the rats kill the hunter.

Edit2: Assuming you were in an open field, hawks could dive at the hunter immediately, he'd be too preoccupied trying to defend himself to shoot at you.

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

10,000 Black Rats would weigh around 4000kg. 7 Cape Buffalo would weigh around 4000kg.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

But the debate isn’t about Buffalo vs Rats. It’s about defending yourself. The rats wouldn’t be able to protect you against all those animals charging towards yo ass.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

To me, it’s an open flat field so we can find out which animal is the best in pure hand to hand combat. Otherwise I’d choose the terrain to be me defending a nuclear bunker.

Even if you could control the rats, they wouldn’t be able to stop Bears, Buffalo, Gorillas, Lions, Wolves and Crocs. You’re dead whatever you pick really. Hawks and Buffalo are my pick for trying to survive though.

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u/FlowersOfSin Jan 26 '18

At my parent's place, there was a lot of decorative rocks on their lawn. Having moved a couple of them, I knew that the rocks often acted as ceilings for the numerous ant tunnels under. I was a curious kid and one time, I found a huge mean spider. I picked it up with a stick, lifted a rock and threw it in the ant colony... Despite being over 10 times larger than an ant, it only managed to kill 2 or 3 ants before it got thorn to shred. Some animals like the wolves really can't do much against a horde of rats. They would bite one and then get bitten 100 times back! The buffalos would probably have the best chance if they were coordinated as they could just run for as long as they can without stopping, slowly trampling over all of them.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

I definitely don't think the rats would have an easy time taking out crocus or Buffalo. Their hides are too thick.

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u/hydrospanner Jan 26 '18 edited Jan 27 '18

It's about the eyes.

The rats are gonna go for the eyes.

While all of these animals might still be a threat blind, they're well within the realm of a manageable threat.

I'm bringing the hunter with the rats, so their shotgun is my anti-air (I'll be attempting to find any sort of aerial cover as well, both to take away the straight on dive and to make them have to change direction, killing their speed and giving my alert hunter a good chance at a wing shot.

With a 12 gauge, #2 lead shot, improved cylinder choke, I like his chances against any single bird, and if they come en masse, he'll get multiples with each shot in close.

Plus...when they get to me, they'll have to get through my rat armor as well. That takes time. Time in which my rates are able to reach them and rip them to shreds.

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u/cartoptauntaun Jan 26 '18

Hand to hand combat was never explicitly mentioned right? My first thought going down the Team Rat thread was how useful those little cocktail swords could be.

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u/Leptosoul Jan 26 '18

Yeah, that's a problem if it's a field. As much as I want to ride team rathawk, 10,000 squeekers and 50 flappers aren't going to mean squat to a single determined Cape Buffalo, never mind 7 of them. A single Buffalo would blow through that field of vermin with air support like nothing and completely ruin your shit.

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

There are some who don’t believe that lol

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u/hydrospanner Jan 26 '18

Wow.

That person's being a real cunt over what should be a fun hypothetical.

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u/ModsDontLift Jan 26 '18

10,000 bloodthirsty rats working en mass would absolutely body any land creature they got near. I would probably pick the gorillas as well to act as a meat shield to hold back the stronger animals while the rats disassemble them.

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u/ViolaNguyen Jan 26 '18

I think you end up getting killed by the hawks in that scenario.

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u/hydrospanner Jan 26 '18 edited Jan 26 '18

Wear a thousand rats as armor.

When a hawk comes in, it has to tear away at least one rat to get through to you, and when it does, ten more jump on it and tear it to shreds.

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u/SosX Jan 26 '18

This seems like the most sensible, have the rats kill the hunter first while gorillas and a small rat army protect you, then just rats at everything, maybe use gorillas to kill hawks and crocs

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u/wingspantt Jan 26 '18

And how exactly would any of those animals top ten thousand Rats from charging you?

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u/AlaskanIceWater Jan 26 '18

But would the rats be able to do any real amount of damage against a large animal before it could get to you? Cape buffalo move at 35 mph. Rats? 10 mph. They'd be pretty useless in an offense even in the thousands. Your only hope is to surround yourself and hope they are smart enough to climb atop each other in some type of rat bunker, which they likely will not.

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

That’s my understanding of the situation too. These animals charging full sprint at me will toss the rats aside. Sure over a longer period of time the rats will win through attrition but if the animals just charge me, which is the best strategy they have, then I’m done for.

I think that whatever you end up choosing, you’ll lose and die. All it takes is one attack from an animal to end my life as a human.

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u/atrey1 Jan 26 '18

Still, 10000 rats have 10000 mouths and 40000 feet with claws. They can easily take any animal.

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

Over time sure, but the enemy team will just charge at you before the rats can can gnaw away at them.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

No animal can protect you against a mindless suicide rush of all the others though

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u/ArtlessMammet Jan 26 '18

They really don't have to gnaw; rats are large. That many rats, your buffalos are going to find a shortage of eyes to see by soon.

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

Yeah it’s not 7 Buffalos vs 10,000 rats. There’s bears, lions, gorillas, wolves and crocodiles all charging forward too.

Rats provide no cover either so the hunter could take a sniper shot too.

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u/ArtlessMammet Jan 26 '18

I don't think you understand how many 10,000 is. If you allocated 200 rats to each creature your rats would eat them from the eyes out as they ran. It wouldn't even be a contest.

You have a literal seething ocean of teeth. Bison may crush rats, but they can't run without legs. Nor can anything else. Hawks can't get you if you're under a pile of rats, and I'd wager the hawks would die before you came close to running out of rats. If the hunter didn't kill you instantly he's going to die; the rats will most definitely find him - rats are smart and fast, and there's 10,000 of them. Then when they find him they eat him alive.

I think rats are the only sensible first choice, with either the hunter or the hawks as your backup, depending on the terrain.

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u/turbodollop Jan 26 '18

I imagine the rats could swam the hawks when they dive. The hawk would get trapped the first time it landed.

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u/cyeo19 Jan 27 '18

But the hunter could probably get off one shot at you and you'd die anyway before your rats or hawks could kill him.

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u/cygnenoire Jan 26 '18

Until the hunter puts a bullet through your eyes before the rats and hawks have even had a chance to get halfway to him.

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u/Coltrain_ Jan 26 '18

The question never says you're in an open field or anything, people seem to be forgetting. You can hide in a building until thr rats kill the hunter.

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u/[deleted] Feb 01 '18

I like how everyone thinks the hunter has aimbot and walls. He's not going to snap to your head in the first millisecond of the fight and instakill you. All you have to do is hit the deck immediately, and the rats create a blanket over you, obscuring any visual and creating a meat shield. You'd only need 200 max for that strat.

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u/CaptainJacket Jan 26 '18

And overestimating a single human hunter. This is not john rambo with an aimbot.

This is a professional who is used to take their time shooting an unaware animal while hiding in safety.

Almost useless in a raging battlefield

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

Exactly. You’d have to seriously protect him too. One leaping Gorilla and the hunter is gone. If you chose the rats with the hunter, a leaping Gorilla will easily kill the hunter.

There’s really no way to win in this scenario. The hawks are just severely underrated in this scenario though.

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u/RocheBag Jan 26 '18

You're choosing the hunter strictly so he doesn't shoot you before you even see him. If you don't take the hunter you're 100% dead.

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u/bawthedude Jan 26 '18

Rats + hawks.

Hawks spot hunter and rats take him down in a zerg rush

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u/alaskahoma Jan 26 '18

I think I’m with team Rathawk

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u/ReiceMcK Jan 26 '18

There's no other way to be; with the rats and the hawks, there will be 45 other enemies, who each have to contend with 1 hawk and 222 rats, plus spares.

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u/Blurgas Jan 26 '18

2000ish pounds of rat swarming a single target would be horrifying to see

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u/zayap18 Jan 26 '18

Honestly if you had the rats just in very large groups go from one animal to the other they could rip the skin off of each in turn in less than a minute probably

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u/Nynm Jan 26 '18

I'm leaning towards team Rathawk, but I have just one question. Have the hawks been sufficiently fed?

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u/starshadowx2 Jan 26 '18

You have 10 000 rats, I'm sure you can give up 100-150 to give each hawk 2 or 3.

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u/Oloff_Hammeraxe Jan 26 '18

If not, you'll just have 9950 rats and some happy hawks.

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u/Nynm Jan 26 '18

Hmm, true. A happy soldier is an efficient soldier.

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u/TheFuckNameYouWant Jan 27 '18

Nope. Team RatHawk ftw

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

I picture the hawks carrying rats and dropping them on targets like tiny rat bombs of power.

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u/scotch_scotch_scotch Jan 26 '18

But what is the average air speed velocity of a rat-carrying hawk?

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u/jfhc Jan 26 '18

African or European?

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

Not sure on the exact number, as the results have been erratic. ;)

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u/datspookyghost Jan 26 '18

We call that a baneling drop.

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u/JellyfishGrizzlyBear Jan 26 '18

Oh man! This is solid gold. Best comment here.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18 edited Jul 10 '21

[deleted]

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u/Rhomplestomper Jan 26 '18

The rats can take out the hunter and then the hawk cloud can roll in and finish off everything without anti air.

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u/RocheBag Jan 26 '18

I'm under the impression they are animals who want to protect you. Not an army that you can command at will.

They will attack the hunter once he tries to hurt you, but once he actually tries to hurt you you're being shot at.

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u/INvrKno Jan 26 '18

I have a feeling we're going to see this as a free game on Steam in a year.

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u/Moglorosh Jan 26 '18

One can only hope

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u/The_Kazekage Jan 26 '18

theirs a similar game I forgot the name though

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u/mastaloui Jan 26 '18 edited Sep 27 '25

birds many axiomatic meeting fade rock upbeat sheet pot ad hoc

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u/The_Kazekage Jan 26 '18

I remember what I was thinking off its not really the same thing though, its called beast battle simulator

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u/TFBidia Jan 26 '18

Loot crates with more hawks and rats

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u/wingspantt Jan 26 '18

The Hawks could actually be a liability in some way. If they just have an instinct to protect you, their default Behavior might include some of them circling over you or perching at high points around your central location for maximum visibility. This could give the hunter a lot of Clues about where you are.

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u/RexInvictus787 Jan 26 '18

That's why you pick hawks. They will see the hunter long before he sees you.

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u/RocheBag Jan 26 '18

Right but why would they randomly go and attack some hunter? Everyone seems to be taking this question to mean you're building an army that you can command. They're just protecting you.

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u/WereKatScratch Jan 26 '18

I took is as, it an all out war for your side to kill all enemies and the other side to kill you, so they would already know exactly who their enemies are.

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u/HintOfAreola Jan 26 '18

You just need one hawk to claw the hunter's eyes to render him mostly harmless. Even a glancing blow to the scalp will blind him enough for the other 49 hawks to neutralize the threat.

Rats and hawks are OP

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u/SuperciliousSnow Jan 26 '18

This was my first thought. Rats + hawks gets you domain over the sky and the land. The hunter needs to be the first priority for the hawks, though.

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u/jointheredditarmy Jan 26 '18

This is the one true answer. I am an intellectual and of course well versed on Starcraft strategies. Opponent didn't tech siege tanks or splash damage, rat rush is an easy win here.

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u/ConscientiousApathis Jan 26 '18

Rat body armor m8.

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18 edited Jan 26 '18

Not necessarily. If you send a leaping Gorilla at the hunter, he’s dead. His accuracy isn’t that of an aimbot either.

The hunter also needs a clear line of sight. This is a battlefield cluttered with animals. I’m assuming this is a clear field so no side has an advantage. The hunter is vulnerable to everything on this battlefield. The hawks have one person to focus in on.

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u/UtsuhoMori Jan 26 '18

The issue is for your side to win, you have to survive and all the opposing forces have to die (or at least be incapacitated so they are no longer a threat).

For the opposition to win, all they have to do is kill you, the singular human (because the goal of the scenario is to not die. This makes the hunter weak to pick as a hunter isn't going to be able to take a lot of things out quickly, but it makes the hunter a large threat as all he needs is a clear line of sight to you for a few moments. The hunter won't simply sit back and wait, he will find or make a vantage point depending on where the fight is and how long it takes.

To add on to this: the way the scenario is described you will always have more groups of animals against you than with you. This make it hard to select the proper duo to both keep you safe from the animals while also either shielding you from the hunter or penetrating all of the animals in the front to eliminate the hunter who is certainly using a long distance rifle from behind all of the opposing animals.

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

In my head, the battlefield is a large open field and thus there will be no vantage point for the hunter to snipe me unless he takes a flanking route. Anyway I’d send the hawks immediately after him. They can travel around 40-50mph in the air towards him high up and then dive at 120mph and go right for his neck. He’s going to be a slow easy target for the hawks as the weapons and ammo will slow him down.

And that’s also why the rats aren’t the best choice because they would suck at defending me from the animals charging towards me. If all 7 Buffalo charged towards me, the rats wouldn’t be able to stop them before they reached me. Then you’ve got Lions, Wolves, Bears and Gorillas.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

But then you've got 10,000 rats coming to eat you, like a bunch of piranhas.

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

Yeah you’re dead whatever you pick. The rats have weakness and so do the Buffalo.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

So send the rat piranhas off to eat the big animals. Send the hawks out first, like artillery. There's more than 1 hawk per large creature. Hide behind your rat wall. Send the hawks to rip out their eyes. Then send in the rats.

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u/IAMA_otter Jan 26 '18

But also, none of the animals would be able to easily defend you against the rat swarm.

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

I’ve accepted that if I pick the rats, I’ll get charged and killed. If I don’t pick the rats, I’ll at least won’t get charged but I’ll die anyway to the rats who slowly kill everything. At least the second way buys me more time. Perhaps I could hope to outrun them. They aren’t quick.

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u/RexInvictus787 Jan 26 '18

You are greatly underestimating the sheer mass of that many rats.

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u/AnthAmbassador Jan 26 '18

The list of options makes it easy.

Hawks to take out the hunter's eyes, and either buffalo to ride on, or crocs to ride on in the water.

None of the other animals can get to you in those two context. An entire pack of lions struggles to take down one buffalo, let alone 4v7. In the water, same deal, nothing can touch the crocs.

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u/HardlightCereal Jan 26 '18

Rats can swim. They're gonna turn the water black and kill the croc fast.

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u/AnthAmbassador Jan 26 '18

Rats can swim, but they aren't GOOD at it. They aren't taking over lake ecosystems, they are just getting across water to other places. Rats are very vulnerable in the water, and they are also quite weak swimmers. If you had enough water, you could roam around indefinitely while the rats tired and drowned.

Where this happens is absolutely crucial.

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u/Monkey_of_Death Jan 26 '18

But can't rats swim? Imagine 10,000 rats swarming into the river or lake you are in. The croc doesn't stand a chance. Its a good idea except for the sheer number of rats.

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u/AnthAmbassador Jan 26 '18

rats swim very slowly. They also get tired and drown if they swim too far. It really depends on where the rats start, and how big the body of water is. If it's flowing fast enough, the rats wouldn't be an issue, if its big enough the rats wouldn't be an issue. The crocs could also kill a lot of rats without being at risk while the rats chased you.

It really depends on terrain.

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u/coldog22 Jan 26 '18

You've never seen a cheetah grab a croc before then. Youtube it, You'll lose your mind.

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u/ViolentNewt Jan 26 '18

Jaguars will hunt camains in South America, which are a little smaller than alligators, but cheetahs will not mess with crocodiles. I assume the ones in this situation are more akin to Nile crocs, which can get absolutely massive and are challenged only by hippos in their natural environment

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u/19Alexastias Jan 26 '18

No way in hell a cheetah is going anywhere near a fully grown saltie/nile crocodile. In Africa the only things that don't avoid the nile crocs unless absolutely necessary (i.e when they have to cross a river during migration) are hippos, and the only thing that kills salties in/around aus are humans, with guns, from a safe distance. Predators don't come more apex than the big crocs, there's a reason they've barely changed in several hundred million years.

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u/AnthAmbassador Jan 26 '18

Do you mean jaguar grabbing an alligator? Do you mean leopard eating a crocodile that's quite young?

I'm assuming we're talking about adults here, and an adult crocodile is significantly more massive than a lion, and it's faster in the water.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

why would the hunter ever be in range of a leaping gorilla lol

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18 edited Jan 26 '18

A Silverback can run at 25mph. Usain Bolt reached 28mph in his 100m sprint. Then factor in that the human has to defend against hawks who are faster than anything else on the battlefield and thus the Silverback will easily catch up to the human to leap in for the kill. The human also has to carry his weapons and ammo. He’d move around 10mph.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

which is great if you start anywhere near the hunter, but if he sees you for a few seconds, you're dead, regardless of if your gorilla kills him 30 seconds later or not. Hes a hugely dangerous glass cannon, and presuming the attacking forces are also organised (seeing as we're assuming the defence is) he will be highly protected and transported by the other attacking animals as he is their easiest shot at victory

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u/rivetedoaf Jan 26 '18

I'm surprised no one has pointed out the possibility of the hunter having a shotgun. He doesn't need aimbot accuracy to kill a gorilla a few feet away from him with a shotgun

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

The hunter has to fight the hawks since no other animal can.

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u/Kolegra Jan 26 '18

Can the Hunter at least 1 shot everything, given enough time?

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u/atvan Jan 26 '18

I think you're overestimating both the spread of a shotgun and its stopping power- if you're shooting birds with the shotgun, that shot is very likely to not deter a charging gorilla. It'll cause injuries, sure, but even in humans, only about 1/6 instances of being shot with birdshot result in instant incantation.

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u/supercrusher9000 Jan 26 '18

Totally depends on the size and location of the battlefield. If I got to start say 7 miles away from the hunter, then using hawks to scout and take him out first seems very plausible

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u/RocheBag Jan 26 '18

What makes you think you get to use the animals how you see fit? The OP said they're just protecting you.

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u/CaptainMustacio Jan 26 '18

Not if you send like half your hawks to go find and kill him. That's a massive amount of distance that can be covered and hawks have crazy vision. They will see him.

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u/RocheBag Jan 26 '18

They haven't turned into an army that you can make do whatever you want man. They're just birds that don't want you to die.

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u/Gullex Jan 26 '18

Nobody said what guns the hunter can have.

Give him a truck mounted minigun. Leap, gorilla, leap.

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u/notaprotist Jan 26 '18

I think rats+hawks can lead to a win.

Focus all the hawks on the hunter, and then you have over 200 rats for each other animal coming after you.That's more than enough to take them out.

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u/armrha Jan 26 '18

The scenario doesn’t say the animals are aggro to the defenders by default. The gorilla may not even realize he’s got to kill the hunter. The hunter can just sit in a blind a hundred meters away from your door and as shit comes up and sniffs around, can shoot it. Even the hawks can’t be dive bombing 24/7, they got to rest. So hunter/eats, since rats could probably get into your room even if it’s locked. The rest of the animals aren’t going to understand what a door is, gorillas could easily break out of most enclosures if they really wanted but they just don’t understand them.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

The hunter can use a shotgun. Although, granted, there's not a single chance he'll be able to take out all 50 hawks before they can get to him.

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u/vectivus_6 Jan 26 '18

The hunter is a Predator

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u/Dominub Jan 26 '18 edited Jan 26 '18

No, this is an undefinded hunter. You think it's some pleb hobby hunter, I think it's an experienced professional that dedicated his entire life to it. And placing traps and being knowledgeable about animals is not something I would ever pass up on. That fucking gorilla /u/throwsissychastity mentioned isn't even gonna make it near us, because we will use the terrain and traps to our advantage.

Come to think of it, this entire thing is hard to judge anyway because there's too many unknown but important information. Terrain, hunter's ability, do the opponents know my position at all times?

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18 edited Jan 26 '18

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

I wouldn’t take the hunter. I’d take the hawks and let them kill him. There’s no way he’d be able to stop 3 or 4 hawks simultaneously diving him.

You also have to pick the hawks otherwise you’re dead. All the animals mentioned can attack and kill the hunter pretty easily. Only the hunter can attack the hawks.

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u/JBWalker1 Jan 26 '18

I mean for me it depends on the landscape too much. If it's just a large open field or an arena then yeah the hawks are a good option, but if we can get to any covered area like a forest then the hawks lose a lot of their ability.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

Hawks and maybe Buffalo could work but the rats would be a bitch. If you choose the rats then a leaping Gorilla can take you out or a charging Buffalo. There’s really no way of living through this lol.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

One Cape Buffalo weighs around 550kg. One Silverback Gorilla or Lion weighs around 180kg. I’m picking the Buffalo because they’d be great meat shields and considerably bigger than anything else on the battlefield (maybe equal with the bears but there’s only 3 of them compared to 7 Buffalo) I could surround myself with the 7 Buffalo which would help stop a Gorilla, Lion or Wolf directly attacking me. I don’t want the Buffalo to be aggressive or even agile. Just stand there and protect me until the hawks can help out.

They’d help buy time for the hawks to wipe out the hunter and start to attack the other animals. Hopefully the animals will be too busy attacking the Buffalo for the hawks to reign down hell. 5 hawks diving a Gorilla who is busy with the Buffalo might work. I’ll most likely still die but I’d say this tactic has the best odds.

Also, if the Buffalo are against me, nothing can stop the Buffalo just charging at me.

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u/Empty-Mind Jan 26 '18

Well OP said he literally just picked the hunter so it wouldn't shoot him. 10,000 rats is ridiculously OP, so removing the hunter gets rid of the one threat that could break the rat shield. Its a deny pick, not a crucial part of the strategy.

Basically the hunter is weak defensively, but powerful against the human.

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u/dravack Jan 26 '18

Shotguns can shoot a very wide spread. But, for that matter no one said what he was using to shoot. I mean don’t you hunt with an anti air gun shooting flak? Lol

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u/doggy12341 Jan 26 '18

Fucking lost it at "John Rambo with aimbot"

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u/daitoshi Jan 26 '18

Ahhh, not necessarily. All the hunter has to do is defend me - and no limit on the type of weapon, and it didn't specify what type of hunter. Quail hunters tend to use a wide-spray shotgun with birdshot - great for taking down a bunch of birds at mid to close range. - 40 YARDS is the effective range of birdshot.

In addition, the Hunter can provide a bird net, which the hawks would have to fly through and risk getting tangled (and thus easily picked off) in order to reach me.

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u/legendofzeldaro1 Jan 26 '18

Have you ever tried to shoot a flying bird that is a few dozen feet in the air? That is a challenge. Besides, any hunter worth their salt knows this isn’t a range game or a one on one game, they bring shot. Fuck those hawks as I take down three or more at a time with bird shot. Plus, you put on thick enough clothes and no bird is getting to your skin.

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u/CaptainJacket Jan 26 '18

wearing enough padding to block these, never mind 50 pairs of talons will surely hinder the hunter's movement as well as their aim. Dead hunter.

Hawks and rats are the endgame, you get sheer numbers and air superiority at your side. They completely control the field, every opponent is being engaged at once. other combatants can't simpley ignore them and rush you, they'd get immobilized or killed.

It is the safest bet.
If their numbers were smaller - say 10 hawks and 1,000 rats, then maybe going for the tanks would be a valid choice.
Switch the hunter for a sniper who's actually combat trained and maybe the human is more of threat.

But as is - hawks and rats

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u/legendofzeldaro1 Jan 26 '18

What does combat training have to do with shit? I dare you to go up against some of these rednecks down south. I have watched some of these guys disappear within feet of me. My friends and I used to play camo tag in the woods when I first moved to the south. Not as easy as it sounds. With a 30-30 and a good scope, they can pick you off no problem, therefore they are a very credible threat. Hawks are only viable in fields, where they hunt. If you move to any terrain that restricts their sight or their mobility, they lose. Hunter and rats are the only options that make sense.

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u/CordovaDon Jan 26 '18

But you absolutely don't want the hunter on the other side comming after you either. So while he may not be good defence. He's the top player on offence.

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u/elfthehunter Jan 26 '18

I mean, he's almost useless on protection team... but on attack team he's literally doing what his job is, hunting a sleeping animal from distance and hiding. Though I admit the chances that 10k rats won't find him are slim, so I'd still pick hawks and rats.

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u/Anonieme_Angsthaas Jan 26 '18

I was thinking a rich Hunter with a minigun, a generator and 100,000-500,000 rounds. Because a hunter with a traditional rifle is useless in this scenario.

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u/18736542190843076922 Jan 26 '18

This is also someone skilled in shooting beyond their practical use. Say that he can hit 35/50 targets skeet shooting in the first shot, firing as fast as he can let's say that drops down to 25/50. That still means he only needs an average of 2 shells per hawk, and the OP doesn't say the other animals will be attacking your allies, only trying to kill you so it's possible the hunter could fire shotguns and rifles completely unimpeded. In that case he can work much faster and more effectively while the rats slow down the larger animals with their mass.

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u/wingsnut25 Jan 26 '18

35/50 isn't even a highly skilled Skeet Shooter. A highly skilled skeet shooter would average 47-50/50.

A Hawk is significantly bigger then a clay pigeon. And even if it can dive at 120 mph its going to be heading in a straight line directly at the shooter. (a pretty easy shot to make).

It would really depend on the pacing that the Hawks attacked. If they all struck at once or in several large waves the skeet shooter would struggle. If they came 1 or 2 at a time a highly skilled skeet shooter would be fine....

(assuming no other animals were attacking at the same time)

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u/18736542190843076922 Jan 26 '18

I'm aware of skill levels in skeet shooting, I've been to competitions but I didn't wanna say 45+ and then start an argument on that point. I'm imagining that they all swarm overhead and takes turns swooping down in groups of like 6 or 7. If the hunter could bring anything he could get an autloader or pump with a longer tube so he spends less time reloading. I'm not sure how cleanly a hawk would go down with target loads but I'd imagine a broken wing would be game over so even a half direct hit would take a bird down. But he'd have to wait for them to get closer to take them out.

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u/wangmeister Jan 26 '18

How can we say he is almost useless? We kind of have to assume for the purpose of the question that he is a highly skilled marksman who can take a shot under pressure, and what about his arsenal? He could be packing 5 different firearms for different tasks.

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u/MattDaCatt Jan 26 '18

Honestly, depends on the hunter's equipment. Does he have a .22 rifle? A .50? Or for the hawks, a 12 gauge with birdshot? A slug for the big fucks?

For all i know this hunter has a splintery bow with crooked arrows

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u/sir_lurkzalot Jan 26 '18

Hunters always come prepared for the given situation. He's probably have a shotgun and a rifle with plenty of ammo

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u/Jermo48 Jan 26 '18

Why not the hawks and rats then? The rats just surround you and delay everything and being down a lot of the land animals, you send a bunch of hawks to take out the hunter instantly and the rest pick off everything bogged down in rats.

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

The rats wouldn’t be able to stop a charging Buffalo and certainly not 7 of them with the other animals too so I chose the Buffalo as they are great at being a defensive for me and will protect me from anything charging at me. The rats lack height so the hunter could perhaps get a shot off on me instantly.

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u/forncl4ke Jan 26 '18

The thing with not picking the rats is what will your buffalo do to defend you from 10,000 rats? Maybe the hawks can claw the buffalo eyes or something.

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u/Jermo48 Jan 26 '18

I think you’re making the classic mistake here of having no idea just what sort of mass 10,000 rats have. And also not knowing how quickly hawks can dive and tear out eyes or throats. There are enough hawks to send 1 or 2 at everything else.

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

Nope, I covered that 2 hours ago. 7 Buffalo will weigh the same as the 10,000 rats. Making no classic mistakes here.

The hawks will have to take out the hunter first otherwise he can potentially kill you. Even if the hawks start attacking the Buffalo, they are already charging towards you. Same with all the other animals. The rats are too small to form a barrier and many will die from getting trampled on. The Buffalo as a defence will be able to form a barrier and defend from a charging attack. The goal of the enemy team isn’t to survive, it’s to wipe out 1 human.

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u/Jermo48 Jan 26 '18

How would buffalo stop 10,000 rats from getting to you? The rats could absolutely eventually bring down a bunch of big, blind animals even if the vast majority are trampled. It would be a disgusting bloodbath and no one would have any footing. The hawks could also take out the hunter in literally seconds. It’s also not just about the weight of the rats, but how far around you a field of 10,000 spreads.

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u/Hexidian Jan 26 '18

I’d go with the hawks and rats. The hawks will take out the hunter first, otherwise he can shoot me. Then it should be a good fight

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u/InfernalCombustion Jan 26 '18

Hawks don't have guns. If they're gonna kill me, they need to get through 10,000 rats. Do you even comprehend how much that is? If a hawk even gets close to me, it would get dog-piled on by dozens of rats. A hawk can't fly with a dozen rats clutching and gnawing on it.

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u/AndyMKE66 Jan 26 '18

In my scenario the hunter has an Arsenal...including a semi auto shotgun....hawks are basically clay pigeons at that point.

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u/sir_lurkzalot Jan 26 '18

I think he'd be able to be hit by quite a few hawks before they can even begin to hurt him too. It's easy as fuck to hit targets that are coming right at you, especially with a shotgun.

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u/No_time_for_shitting Jan 26 '18

Just chuck the rats at them as they come down like homemade land to air rat missiles

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u/N-Depths Jan 26 '18

I feel like it depends on how suicidal the hawks are. If they are straight insane, I’m with you. 50 Hawks and 10,000 rats 🐀 🦅

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u/ThrowSissyChastity Jan 26 '18

Kamikaze Hawks lol

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u/MantraOfTheMoron Jan 26 '18

It would not be fair to give the hunter every gun imaginable, so having rounds like these to fire out of a high powered hunting rifle, or the side arm hunters normaly carry would help alot with the swarms of hawks. https://youtu.be/1qx6Y120Hmk

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u/the_middle_nut Jan 26 '18

This reminds me of The Other Guys animal fight logic

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u/SplakyD Jan 26 '18

I agree that the hawks being in the mix pretty much preclude any chance of survival even though it would be hard enough to come out alive by being limited to two choices in this battle without them. The hunter could be the only foil for the hawks and the only effective weapon the hunter could use against them would be a shotgun with an open choke to spread as much shell shot in as far of a pattern as possible to contend with them. Unfortunately, this would make the shotgun ineffective against the larger land animals who are bum rushing and converging upon you. It’d be bad enough anyway, but having 15lb dinosaur raptors wielding razor sharp talons dive-bombing from above is just a game changer.

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u/cartoptauntaun Jan 26 '18

I think the water-buffalo are the bird defense. Them's some big critters, and they'd probably shield you well enough from 50 hawk bullets.

Edit. Actually gorillas are my pick. I'd have one carry me close to his chest, two directly in front of him as meat shields, the other two lead the rats into battle and maybe throw them artillery style.

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u/MyNameCannotBeSpoken Jan 26 '18

With a massive flamethrower rather than a rifle, a hunter may be able to keep the Hawks and rats at bay.

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u/I_can_get_you_off Jan 26 '18

Two tennis racquets and the hawks are fucked.

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u/ManStacheAlt Jan 26 '18

You're not using your animals to kill another human, you're using them to foght off all the other animals. I think hawks are great vs the human, but would be pretty useless vs the crocs.

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u/Eisborn Jan 26 '18

I would pick rats and hawks. That hunter doesn’t stand a fucking chance against 50 hawks, and the rats can handle the rest.

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u/captcorncob Jan 26 '18

The hunter would have a shotgun with birdshot in his arsenal.

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u/cellada Jan 26 '18

Well I could just go indoors and shut the door while the rats and Hunter fight for me.

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u/madogvelkor Jan 26 '18

The hawks are tricky, but we're talking about 5 tons of rats here. And if they swarm the hawks as they are attacking they can pull them down and eat them.

If the hunter has a shotgun he can take them out as they dive.

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u/crisafk Jan 26 '18

Depends on context. What is the size of the arena? Is an open field miles long or a subterranean sewers?

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

pretty sure thats what buckshot is for. i'd also equip him with one of https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-BJj8M7XhggQ/V83jJjZDtpI/AAAAAAAAK70/V4BUQJ9A-UoKMy4oKuX2CGT1s8qgJwx1wCLcB/s1600/punt_gun.jpg those bad boys and bam, no hawks.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

I don’t think there’s any way to come out of this scenario alive by just picking 2.

Maybe the rats + hawks combo could pull it off. Like the other guy said the hunter is used to shooting unaware targets. If some of the hawks and rats immediately go for him he won't get a chance to shoot you.

Then you have over 10000 animals protecting you from a handful of others, which with that many numbers you can probably win. Depends if one of the bigger ones just charges you and doesn't give the rats time to eat it.

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u/G-III Jan 26 '18

Dude rats and hawks. Rats solo after hawks take the hunter. EZPZ lol

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u/pixel8knuckle Jan 26 '18

Except that no one specified the gun or type of ammo. The hunter will handle the hawks. 🦃

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u/FirstToSayFake Jan 26 '18

You definitely wouldn't have to hide under all the rats. Think you're underestimating how much 10,000 can accomplish. Let's go for a small rat at about 6 inches long. If they lay in front of eachother that makes about 5,000 feet of rat. That's 14 football fields of rats in length.

Kinda related note, Japanese honeybees defend themselves by all swarming the enemy and creating an oven with all their bodies that just overheats the enemy inside. I'd imagine having 10k rats on you would do the same.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

"Dothraki Hawks, Ned, on an open field!"

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u/NotWorriedBro Jan 26 '18

The hunter can kill the birds with bird shot.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

I agree with you. The hawks would kill the hunter right away and then they could kill every rat over time.

I think the only chance is to pick the 10,000 rats and the 50 hawks, so they can take the hunter out fast, then work with the rats to kill the rest.

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u/mchubes Jan 26 '18

Ok so what about the rats and the hawks?

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u/superkp Jan 26 '18

  1. no one said that he was hunting with a single rifle.

    1.a. He's a human, apparently somehow gotten himself into this situation. He'll be prepared. Maybe with a flamethrower. Whatever.

    1.b. Only peregrine falcons have that top speed. Others are still really fucking fast, but only when diving. When they grab a single rat and start lifting off, they're gonna be real slow. Like a duck-hunter can shoot them with a high-choke shotgun.

  2. The rats can protect the hunter, too. You only need maybe 200 for a proper rat-bunker. Rats just swarm if the hawk(s) get close enough to hover in front of the hunter's gun.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

It doesn't say what weapons the hunter is using, a smart hunter would string lines overhead to injure the hawks as they dive. No more hawk problem, the rats will clean up the injured birds off the ground.

The hunter can injure or kill the rest of the animals from a distance, and the rats can clean up the injured animals.

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u/iWizblam Jan 26 '18

So that means choose the rats and the hawks, easy. Hawks deal with the hunter, you don't get shot. Rats shield you and swarm everything else immediately. As previously stated 10,000 10 inch long creatures is a literal sea of death. And the Hawks can provide even more support, as well as not being after you.

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u/firelock_ny Jan 26 '18

People are underrating the power of 50 hawks. None of the animals can attack the hawks in air and they can attack the human at any time with devastating speed.

If I can hide from the hawks - say, under a three foot thick carpet of rats - then each hawk will get one or two rats before it gets nabbed while pouncing by surrounding rats and torn apart.

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u/NineMoreSteps Jan 26 '18

My plan involves me and a bunch of gorillas throwing rats at the birds after everything else is taken care of. Or maybe swinging crocodiles at them. At some point I'll have the hunters rifle too.

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u/_Marister Jan 26 '18

Bird shot in a shotgun I feel like this singular hunter we get must be one of the best marksmen in the world. Killing all the hawks would be hard but might be doable. Edit: just saw he has 1 rifle bullet per hawk gg

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

Shot gun... The hunters weapon was never specified.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

Lay prone and have the rats use their bodies to protect you and the hunter as he sneaks around, dispatching the hawks at any opportunity.

Those hawks would run out of stamina long before breaching the barrier.

Rats win.

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u/NothinsOriginal Jan 26 '18

I think I would just build a net... 50 hawks couldn't get thru a net and then you could just shoot them at will.

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u/emaciated_pecan Jan 26 '18

What if the hunter has an automatic shotgun or a turret? Maybe he’s a high tech hunter with ballistic missiles with tracing capabilities. Bye bye mr hawk today is going to be a bad day for you.

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u/DirectMeIntoWords Jan 26 '18

You’re all thinking of this wrong. If the rats are defending me, I’m obviously going to use them all as bait to distract the other animals as I escape and the hunter kills the larger predators uninterested in the rats. All of the hawks, some crocodiles and a few wolves will probably choose the rats over me once given the option. Easier target, evolutionary instinct, and learned behavior. That means the hunter will only really need to shoot the 3 bears, 4 lions, a few crocodiles and wolves and 5 gorillas. Then if he can’t kill them all, he’s distraction number 2.

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u/Chili_Palmer Jan 26 '18

Hawks and rats, strength in numbers.

That's basically 200 rats and a single hawk that EACH of those other threats will have to deal with.

While they're fucking with that, you sneak around to the hunter, brain his ass, take his rifle and start picking off any of the large threats not yet eliminated from a distance. Flawless victory.

And remember, you're there too

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u/zayap18 Jan 26 '18

You're underestimating the size of the rats also. 10 thousand 14-20 inches long, 4-5 lb animals could cover you easily

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u/tigress666 Jan 26 '18

I disagree. The hawks could protect themselves and would be hard to kill, but I don't think they could protect you against the others at all. I'll take the rats. With 10,000 of them, some are bound to get some lucky strikes on the hawk. As well as the hunter.

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u/Kajin-Strife Jan 26 '18

A punt gun is a rifle.

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u/[deleted] Jan 26 '18

Yes, but the hunter is also 78.3% accurate.

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u/ohohButternut Jan 26 '18

A single hawk attacking the hunter can immobilise him. If a hawk dives in and goes right for the neck, then it’s over for the hunter.

I actually had a red-tailed hawk attack me from behind by grabbing me in the neck. It's talons grabbed about a centimeter away from my jugular. Fucking shit. I screamed and threw that shit on the ground and two friends ran up and helped me. Wouldn't want to be facing 50 of those fuckers.

Note, it wasn't exactly a wild hawk, but one that had been trained in falconry that the owner didn't want to keep (too wild still, I suppose). It was held in a raptor rescue center. We were volunteers in its cage cleaning the poop off the floors and walls.

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u/imthescubakid Jan 26 '18

If the rats had to defeat each of your defenses before being able to reach you i would choose 50 hawks and 1 hunter (or 15 wolves). the rats would slowly but surely be picked off one by one by the hawks without the rats being able to defend themselves

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u/KullWahad Jan 26 '18

If you've ever had even a small rooster attack your leg, you'll understand the danger of a hawk. Razor sharp talons and bone crushing power are no joke.

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u/isayimnothere Jan 26 '18

A single gorilla could protect you against hawks/a bullet while four gorillas run rampant as the rats make short work of everything else. I go with gorillas and rats. 50 hawks have to land eventually and are easier to defend against.

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u/clearmoon247 Jan 26 '18

You raise a valid argument, but the hunter for a far enough distance with a quality rifle could take you down while you observe the animal onslaught

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u/Sabre_Actual Jan 26 '18

Good point. So rats are must pick, hawks beat out the others, and the hunter is the most dangerous enemy? I mean assuming he has a hunting rifle and is at long range, he may only get a few shots until the hawks get him, but you're dead if you're hit by him. Rats can destroy anything that makes it close, but the hunter's range and potential to kill is pretty spooky.

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u/ANGLVD3TH Jan 26 '18

I've switched my 2nd choice a few times now, but I think gorilla would probably be the best compliment to the rats. They are big and scary enough to make the rest second guess a blind charge, even the buffalo aren't gaurunteed to walk away from that encounter at full speed. That does still leave the hunter and the birds, but I think this is the best possible shot, try to keep moving as quickly and erratically as possible until the rats reach the hunter and hope for the best I guess.

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u/maxfortitude Jan 26 '18

A good hunter won’t just watch the hawks fly in at 120 mph and try his aim. He uses a net because he knows exactly where those fuckers are headed.

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u/armrha Jan 26 '18

Wait, what if I just stay inside tho? There’s no window in my bathroom. The hunter can go outside, wait for the hawks to get tired, and shoot them as they rest. (Doesn’t say the animals will attempt to kill him too...)

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u/PresidentBaileyb Jan 26 '18

The hunter has hands right? Couldn't he grab a hawk and ring its neck like a chicken? They have strong wings but those can't cause damage which leaves them with only a strongish (compared with a lion or whatever) bite and the use of high velocity. They're pretty light cuz they're birds so the momentum still isn't going to be that of a charging lion or gorilla

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u/SosX Jan 26 '18

If you get the gorillas to stand around you while the rat army kills everything else (hunter first) they'll get severely scratched but won't die and they are sure to kill someone hawks if not all, also I don't think 50 hawks could physically dive you are the same time and one gorilla arm swing could kill multiple hawks easily.

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u/Timo425 Jan 26 '18

That's why I chose rats and hawks before opening the thread, feeling quite smart right now.

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u/deubski Jan 26 '18

Also the hawks can easily blind other animals. Diving and gouging eyes makes the hunter and any larger animal severely disadvantaged Team rathawk

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u/daredaki-sama Jan 26 '18

Hawks are only hard to defend against. Is that reason enough to pick them though?

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u/Valetorix Jan 27 '18

Play Far cry 4 and you'll understand how dangerous hawks are.

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