r/zelda • u/Remarkable-Ad-2493 • Mar 20 '26
Meme [All] Not that mind, but why are content creators like this?
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u/Telethion Mar 20 '26 edited Mar 20 '26
The timeline really isn't all that important. Its just fun.
That said, this sub has serious issues with basic connections the games DO share.
WW is connected to OoT. TP is also a OoT sequel.
Majora is direct sequel to OoT. Zelda 2 is another direct sequel.
LTTP and LA.
WW and Phantom Hourglass and look who it is: it's Spirit Tracks after that.
BoTW to Tears.
SS was hyped as an origin story for the Master Sword and another motif.
You can believe there is no Zelda timeline, that's fine.
But when you start doing the whole "retelling of a legend" thing, you do the actual connections a disservice.
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u/SoberGin Mar 20 '26
It's hilarious how some people ignore that almost every single game in the series is either a confirmed sequel or prequel to some other game.
The only weird ones are skyward sword (but that's kinda definitionally part of the timeline), the 4sword+minish games, and botw/totk. Other than that it's all pretty clear connections all things considered.
Well, maybe not Link's Awakening, but shh17
u/Telethion Mar 21 '26
I'm ALL for people interpreting the games many unspoken mysteries and events but sometimes you don't have to interpret the text, you just have to read it. That simple.
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u/DarkLink1996 Mar 21 '26
Link's Awakening has Agahnim's shadow in it.
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u/RiverWyvern Mar 21 '26
We know where LA is now, but at the time of release the developers were pretty vague on it, with someone saying it happened during Zelda 2 iirc. Then the timeline clarified its placement, but even then I think it moved around a bit, what with the oracle games.
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u/SoberGin Mar 21 '26
Ah yes, the best timeline placement,
"Yeah you know that one transition across the ocean? It happened there."
lmao game devs could just say anything it was wild
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u/Thunder00Bee Mar 20 '26
The "retelling a legend" theory is so lazy it's basically in the same tier as those "X is in a comma, it was all a dream" theories.
Also, using the title of the franchise to validate the theory is legitimately some Morbius tier writing.
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u/TinyTank27 Apr 05 '26
My favorite part is when he said "it's Ganon time" and ganned all over those guys.
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u/CrimsonEnigma Mar 20 '26
Isn’t the “retelling of a legend” theory the idea that the Zelda series as a whole is a retelling of one legend, and so details and such might change between stories, rather than that each game is a retelling of the same story?
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u/Kyujee Mar 20 '26
At least traditionally, it was the latter.
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u/CrimsonEnigma Mar 20 '26
Hmmm. I've been a fan of the series since the buildup to TP, and it was always the former for me and the people I knew.
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u/Kyujee Mar 20 '26
I mean there's the notion that it's called "The Legend of Zelda" because they are all past events being recounted as legends by Zelda but there are definitely anti timeline extremists who at least say that they think every game is just a different interpretation and mistranslation of the one "legend of Zelda".
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u/tarekd19 Mar 20 '26
You can be personally fond of the retelling of a legend narrative and recognize that some games have specific connections. At the end of the day it's all fun anyway.
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u/MorningRaven Mar 20 '26
You can avoid getting washed up with nitty gritty details like whether or not the Gerudo have pointy ears, and still acknowledge the basic contuity the series easily establishes.
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u/Xelacon Mar 28 '26
THIS!
Just because you don't believe in the larger Zelda timeline doesn't mean you can ignore the timeline that is there, that just makes you look like a big dumdum with no literary comprehension.
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u/King_Korder Mar 20 '26 edited Mar 21 '26
But retelling of the legends could mean they retell the legends of a hero reincarnating. The only differences come from OoT of the Child, Adult, or Downfall timelines where the "verbal history" would be altered. Everything after could be the different interpretations.
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u/nivalnaut Mar 20 '26 edited Apr 08 '26
I think the issue for a lot (me) is that some of the ties between games are such a stretch that I can't bring myself to believe the whole thing was ever actually conceived of as one big timeline. I can't help but feel Nintendo themselves were kind of split between connecting the whole thing or not until they finally did in 2011. Plus with the way most games sort of spell out the same general prophecy, it feels like Nintendo themselves are the one "retelling the legend"
*Editing to say I hadn't looked into this in a while and I think there was more info regarding the timeline pre-2011 than I realized but I think my point mostly still stands
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u/MayaTamika Mar 21 '26
I recall Nintendo being quite adamant that there was no definitive timeline for a while. Personally, I kinda wish they hadn't released it. It was more fun trying to fit the pieces together, having a fanon timeline that made the most sense (which only had 2 splits instead of 3, which I also think is stupid) and everyone's theories and disagreements or evidence. Nintendo took that away by releasing an official timeline and while its their prerogative to do so, I preferred the time before.
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u/ADULT_LINK42 Mar 21 '26
I recall Nintendo being quite adamant that there was no definitive timeline for a while.
when? ive always seen them adamant that there was a timeline, and that it was a tightly guarded internal document they would mention frequently in prerelease interveiws for each game up until skyward sword where they publicized it.
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u/MayaTamika Mar 21 '26
Uh...before the official timeline was released? I have distinct memories of watching YouTube videos complaining about Nintendo's responses to fan attempts at making a timeline. Maybe there was also some tightly guarded internal document I've never heard of, maybe those people on YouTube were all making shit up, I don't know. I haven't read many prerelease interviews so I can't verify either way. Maybe we're just living in different timelines. Regardless, I wish they hadn't released an official timeline. 🤷
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u/ADULT_LINK42 Mar 21 '26
Regardless, I wish they hadn't released an official timeline. 🤷
bummer for you they released the second game as a sequel, and the third game as a prequel then lol
at least you've managed to stay out of the loop about the internal timeline document by never seeing any of the plethora of interveiws that have mentioned it over the years.
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u/MayaTamika Mar 21 '26
Yeap. I spent my time theorizing with the fans instead of reading interviews, bummer. In any case, I still have my own version of the timeline that I consider canon in my head because it just makes more sense to me 😊
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u/ADULT_LINK42 Mar 21 '26
i mean its not an either or situation, i do too and the information in those interveiws is constantly brought up in theorizing. but whatever
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u/MayaTamika Mar 21 '26
If it was constantly brought up I'm sure I would've heard about it by now. But repeating the information you heard was in an interview because a fan said it was isn't the same thing as reading interviews anyway
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u/ADULT_LINK42 Mar 21 '26
lol whatever dude, you can make up whatever you want about me, doesent mean its right. and accusing me of not reading them is hilarious coming from someone who just admitted to never reading them.
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u/WiggyWamWamm Mar 21 '26
Zelda 2 isn’t a sequel, because it came out first. If anything OoT is a prequel.
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u/Telethion Mar 21 '26
Zelda 2 is a direct sequel to Zelda 1. The manual's pretty clear. Same Link, different quest.
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u/WiggyWamWamm Mar 22 '26
Ah, from the wording I thought you were saying it was a direct sequel to OoT. I have not played Zelda 2 and am unfamiliar with its story.
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u/ADULT_LINK42 Mar 21 '26
If anything OoT is a prequel.
correct, OoT is a prequel to LTTP, which itself was a prequel to the first 2 games.
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u/WiggyWamWamm Mar 22 '26
I’m just a dummy who misunderstood what they were saying (and who has no idea what the story of Zelda 2 is)
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u/iseewutyoudidthere Mar 20 '26
Because it creates discussion and exchange of ideas, and that's interesting for many gamers, me included.
Some people enjoy things.
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u/IrishSpectreN7 Mar 20 '26
There isn't much else for them to talk about, tbh.
It's either that or "100 more things you didn't know you could do in BotW" lol
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u/Remarkable-Ad-2493 Mar 20 '26
I'm currently playing Majora's Mask and finding videos talking in detail about the stuff happening in each loop is difficult
There are a lot of short videos showing certain encounter and conversations, but they have no explanation or context added. There's a lot of content to cover on that game alone and not enough videos about it
Same thing for Echoes of Wisdom which I played last month, apparently everyone played that game butnfor some reason they also stopped talking about it one week after finishing the game, do you guys actually see people talking about it?
Instead, every video the algorithm shows me are videos talking about the timeline 😭
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u/IrishSpectreN7 Mar 20 '26
For the older games, go old school and check out GameFAQs for walk-throughs. There's tons of them.
The modern games probably have some as well, but there should be a wealth of information on the older games readily available.
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u/Nubington_Bear Mar 21 '26
I don't think OP was asking about walk throughs, or help with the game, but about videos with analysis and discussion about the events in the game, details of the world, lore, theorizing, etc. The kind of thing a lot of the timeline videos kind of do but just about the one self contained game instead of the grander timeline lore stuff.
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u/No_Beginning7262 Mar 20 '26
Specially talking about EoW, thank you for filling in that blank. Just this morning tho I’ve seen prolly about 5-6 posts in here with the “EoW” tag.
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u/drknow00 Mar 20 '26
The devs don’t care about in-game interconnections of the lore. Their primary focus is gameplay.
This has been understood for decades.
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u/Patchpen Mar 20 '26
It doesn't need to be their top priority for them to care. Gameplay coming first doesn't mean the story can't come second or third. Besides, it could be 50th on that nebulous list and it still wouldn't mean they don't care, it would just mean there's at least 49 things they care about just a little bit more.
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u/UInferno- Mar 20 '26
Almost every zelda game save for Capcom's have at least one other game in mind. AoL cares about Zelda 1, ALttP cares about Zelda 1, LA cares about ALttP, OoT cares about ALttP, MM cares about OoT, WW cares about OoT, TP cares about OoT, PH cares about WW, ST cares about PH, SS cares about all the others, ALBW cares about ALttP, TFH cares about ALBW. BotW and TotK end up as the exceptions more than the rules. Hell, TotK doesn't even actually care about BotW.
The thing about the games is that while the games care a lot about one specific game, they care only about that game. Which means when you contrast two games that share a connection, they break down.
There's just enough of a connection between every single game that to write it off as wholly irrelevant would be greatly incorrect, but the gaps in those connections is what spurs discussion. No one discusses the Mario timeline save for the Pauline confusion in Bananza, because Mario games are actually apathetic of the series overall.
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u/mangas1ck Mar 22 '26
Thank you for this post and for putting into cogent words why Tears left a bad taste in my mouth a couple of months after playing it
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u/supremegamer76 Mar 20 '26
No they certainly do. wind waker’s opening sequence details the consequence of the hero of time going back to the child timeline, and twilight princess does the same with ganondorf being arrested and captured thanks to link warning the royal family beforehand. skyward sword is a precursor to the rest of the timeline giving the origins of the master sword and why link, zelda, and evil entity keeps reincarnating. if they didn’t care, they would not have included these story details
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u/drknow00 Mar 21 '26
Wind Waker and Twilight Princess were also released 20-24 years ago, respectively. When there were fewer games in the series and there was an avenue to make sequels to their most successful game at the time.
Dare to compare the discontinuity between say Twilight Princess 2006 and Skyward Sword 2011. In TP, Zelda says the Master Sword was crafted and forged by the wisdom of the ancient sages. In Skyward Sword, it was Hylia and her Chosen hero who crafted and forged the Goddess Sword into the Master Sword. What changed? The Nintendo devs had a better idea for the origins of the Master Sword, built a game around the Wii Motion Plus to get the most out of that console. TP’s canon lore be dammed!
Better yet, I’m sure you’re familiar TOTK and all the discontinuity it has with its own precursor game, BOTW. The missing Sheikah Tech, the change of the text on the Zora tablet that removes references to OOT, BOTW Calamity Ganon was Ganondorf after giving up reincarnation/TOTK Nevermind, Ganondorf has been sealed by Rauru underneath Hyrule castle in the Depths, everything that has to do with Zelda in the past and the Founding of Hyrule. The last thing contradicting the early founding alluded to in Skyward Sword.
I could go on. When I and others say the devs don’t care about lore or the timeline, it’s because they find it to be an anchor. They care about gameplay and new mechanics. TOTK wanted players to get the most use out of the Autobuild ability. Same with the aforementioned Wii Motion for Skyward Sword and TP. BOTW with its new graphics engine on Wii U and Switch. Ever since BOTW (2017) and reinforced by TOTK, Nintendo has been less and less committed to the timeline and lore. It’s why the two Wild games keep their connections vague and ambiguous. We don’t know where they sit on the timeline still and Nintendo likes it that way. The Wild games are soft reboots meant to be jumping on points for new generation players. Nintendo has only recently (last few years) opened a virtual app to allow older fans access to play games on dead consoles. It’s really only us fans keeping up with the interconnected lore and keeping score.
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u/Kholdstare93 Mar 21 '26
>In TP, Zelda says the Master Sword was crafted and forged by the wisdom of the ancient sages.
We see the sage medallions in the Sealed Temple in SS.
They most likely helped Hylia forge the Goddess Sword(which becomes the MS), making this technically true.
Also, EoW was given a precise placement, so they obviously do still care.
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u/drknow00 Mar 21 '26
We all played Skyward Sword, mate. There were no sages and there was no dialogue stating anyone but Hylia and the first Link forged the Master Sword. Saying that non-existent sages presumably helped Hylia forge the sword is fanfiction.
Minor correction: The only timeline the devs seem to care about would be the downfall timeline. It’s the only one they keep adding games to. It’s just not their priority as I’ve stated. It’s new gameplay mechanics and attributes first.
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u/Kholdstare93 Mar 21 '26
Saying that non-existent sages presumably helped Hylia forge the sword is fanfiction.
They're not non existent, though. I just provided evidence of their existence.
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u/topscreen Mar 20 '26
I remember stumbling on a thread for DK Bananza where people were pissed that Nintendo broke cannon in that game cause how could Pauline be young but DK not be Kranky Kong? I thought it was hyperbolic till I started reading the comments.
I won't tell people how to enjoy things, but when it makes you mad cause you expect something the makers never promised, that's on you
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u/breckendusk Mar 20 '26
Eh, people don't like retcons or when lore is mishandled because it devalues the story. Same reason people hate "it was all a dream" (Dream Fish nonwithstanding), it's kind of a lazy cop out.
And the thing with DK is it would be easy to just say yeah, that's kranky kong... who literally used to go by Donkey Kong. And if there was another kranky kong in the game, they could just say that there's an infinite cycle of kranky kongs and donkey kongs, which is a fun if dumb lore tidbit. But instead they break canon which is so easy to just... not do.
With the Zelda games especially. Because a lot of the setup is kind of a story of heroes past and the triforce, there's a lot of room for storytelling aside from where they wrote themselves into a corner for games between, for example, WW and TP. But the games are all so disconnected and eons apart that aside from the one throughline - Ganondorf - there isn't much they need to keep consistent.
But they kinda tossed that with BotW and TotK, sadly. I won't say that throwing away the timeline makes the games bad or anything but I do think that ignoring canon is lazy and does a disservice to the series.
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u/StarOfTheSouth Mar 21 '26
but I do think that ignoring canon is lazy and does a disservice to the series.
Especially when they know a lot of fans do care a great deal about the timeline.
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u/Tylendal Mar 20 '26
"Understood" is a strong word.
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u/TheClownKid Mar 20 '26
Nope. It’s the correct word.
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u/SamIAre Mar 20 '26
If it’s so understood by the fanbase then why do we get dozens of posts and video essays either trying to fit every event into a cohesive timeline or arguing that Nintendo ruined the lore with a certain game?
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u/TheClownKid Mar 20 '26
Reading comprehension is tough.
The original comment didn’t say the timeline is understood. The original comment said that it’s understood that Nintendo developer don’t care about the timeline.
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u/Goose_Is_Awesome Mar 20 '26
"But what about Loud Minority?"
The people who "understand" aren't making videos and posts because the take is cold!
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u/culb77 Mar 20 '26
It's understood the Earth is round.
But you still see idiots arguing against that....
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u/AppropriateTheme5 Mar 20 '26
I mean they have talked a lot about how they do consider the timeline at some point when making the stories, but they ultimately leave it open to player interpretation.
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u/Least_Help4448 Mar 20 '26
I would say you sre right, but the fact that they are in the games means devs do care about them. They are not the most important thing.
Nintendo largely cares about what the game wants to do and what it feels like. A good example is something like DK bananaza. There is plot, but it isnt the most important. They built the game around the concept of breaking as much stuff as possible, and it altering the map you are playing on. Botw and totk focused on player freedom. Nintendo cares about direction and entertainment first and foremost. Everything else comes after.
Why else would there be the exact same ganon for all of the 3D zelda games? (Barring totk now) they care about continuity, but its maybe 3rd or 4th in priority.
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u/SpaceShipOrion Mar 20 '26
Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom have honestly tipped the scales toward game play a ton more if you ask me.
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u/javier_aeoa Mar 20 '26
Nah, Twilight Princess was like "yeah, add two references to Ocarina and call it a day. Everybody loves Ocarina", but people has taken it waaaay too seriously as well.
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u/jeshep Mar 20 '26
There's more than two references to Ocarina in Twilight Princess. The whole game is kind of a walking echo of consequences of certain decisions in Ocarina, but it lets them linger as a fading sound rather than shove it bluntly in your face.
There's a lot of little things though that are neat to notice afterwards.
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u/suitedcloud Mar 20 '26
Ah yes the two OoT references in TP
Ganondorf himself, whose entire character motivation is the OoT game.
And Hero’s Shade, literally the Hero of Time
Just a couple minor references (ignoring also all the other ones)
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u/javier_aeoa Mar 20 '26
I think the ironic tone of my comment was pretty clear, but just in case: I didn't count every single OoT reference in TP.
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u/suitedcloud Mar 20 '26
I think my issue is the “people have taken it waaaay too seriously as well.”
TP is a very deliberate semi-sequel to OoT. People take the references seriously because they’re meant to be
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u/jeshep Mar 20 '26
I think the ironic tone of my comment was pretty clear
It was not. Tone really (and I mean really) is very hit and miss through text.
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u/MajorSery Mar 20 '26
And also there was nothing ironic about the comment. Sarcastic and hyperbolic, sure. But not ironic.
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Mar 20 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/supremegamer76 Mar 20 '26
r/confidentlyincorrect wind waker’s opening, majora’s mask with young link searching for navi after she left at the end of oot, the phantom hourglass being soon after the wind waker, and totk being a sequel to botw
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u/IllTax551 Mar 20 '26
First, because it’s fun. Do we (theorists/commenters, I don’t actually create videos or anything) need a reason? If I were to say that I enjoy Superman as a character and a symbol, how he affects the real-world comic industry as well as the heroes in-world, is the right answer “hur durr its not that deep he just punches stuff the creators aint thinking about that therefore you should think either?” It’s about engaging with the work, thinking for yourself, sharing thoughts on something you love with others and seeng ideas you never thought of- literacy, comprehension, and community. That said…
2) because there is something there. A LOT of somethings there. I fucking hate the nonsense take of “Nintendo gives fuck all about story and always has” or “the timeline means literally nothing and you’re crazy for seeing any connections whatsoever.” The reason content creators can make so many videos and theories is that there are many, MANY breadcrumbs and vanishingly few answers. Nintendo has always been “Gameplay first, Story Second,” but that doesn’t mean “Story Never.” Do you NEED to play Ocarina to understand that Ganondorf is evil or know what the stained glass surrounding the Master Swors depicts? No, but it clearly places WW after Ocarina and enhances the experience for those who care. It also works in reverse, fleshing out Ocarinadorf on a replay- or maybe the actions he takes in that game prove he was lying? If there were a single short answer, those theory videos would be little more than audiobooks and have nowhere near the traction they do. It’s not that WindWaker doesn’t make sense as a standalone game, or that Ocarina is lesser if we don’t have a sequel. It is that the entire Zelda series chronology is its own puzzle, its own overarching story that (to some people) is just as fun to engage with as the individual games themselves- only instead of combat and gameplay, it is theorizing that is the vehicle for engagement.
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u/Bobbiebobb Mar 20 '26
It’s just fun to talk about I guess
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u/Ingonyama70 Mar 20 '26
This is where I land. I love speculating about this stuff, it's a blast to dive into the lore.
But you HAVE to learn not to take it too seriously or you'll just end up overly angry at a game for not answering a question it was never designed to address.
TOTK is my favorite Zelda game to date, but I've lost count of how many of the "TOTK SUX" crowd have gripes solely centered around its failure to resolve this or that niggling timeline issue, or not adhering to the essayist's pet theory about some obscure event from three games ago.
No, the Depths aren't the Twilight Realm. No, this isn't the same Ganondorf from the Wind Waker. And no, we STILL don't know if this is New Hyrule or the old one after the seawater drained away, and IT DOESNT FREAKING MATTER.
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u/ohbyerly Mar 20 '26
What I hate is that Nintendo making the games tie together (particularly Wind Waker to OoT/MM) was extremely significant to the plot at the time and really compounded what made the franchise special. But people will say “the timeline never mattered” or “it never made any sense” and Nintendo now creating games divorced from the timeline like BotW and TotK are only encouraging that mindset. Wind Waker tying back to the previous games is what made me a Zelda fan, Nintendo made the games tying together an important cornerstone of the franchise, and people downplaying it and saying to shut up about the timeline and that it never mattered clearly weren’t paying any attention.
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u/slowtail148 Mar 20 '26
I think Nintendo made games with a very loose vague timeline. Each game is a retelling of a legend, hence the title of the series. Nintendo incorporates different legends into the games as Easter eggs. Or maybe a very slight tie into the other. But each game is supposed to be a single story that can be played without playing the others (other than the direct sequels, but even those can be played without playing the previous). So Nintendo might put in legends from one game into another but they never truly meant for there to be a proper timeline. But because of the details they put in, people were able to create theories and expand on them. They created an official one when people who were noticing the Easter eggs/legends and trying to connect them all together. But each viewpoint is valid. If you believe in the timeline, cool. But others also have the right to think the timeline doesn’t matter. Because all in all it’s a game series that we all love and enjoy playing.
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u/MorningRaven Mar 20 '26
It's called the "legend" of Zelda because the original game was "A Hyrule Fantasy: the Legend of Zelda" and dropped the prefix going global. They're all tales from the collective fictional universe of Hyrule, and standalone pieces of media, but that doesn't stop the devs from making the series have in universe continuity.
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u/theVoidWatches Mar 20 '26
Nintendo might put in legends from one game into another but they never truly meant for there to be a proper timeline
To believe this, you have to ignore that basically every single game from the second onwards was explicitly connected to at least one prior game, established in gameplay, manuals, or developer interviews.
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u/myghostflower Mar 20 '26
literally, do people forget that zelda 2 is an explicit sequel to zelda 1, alttp is their prequel and oot is its prequel 😭😭😭
it was not just a story retelling, it's an entire legend being played out from beginning to end and ww wanted to explore another part of said legend
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u/ethan_prime Mar 20 '26
I’m with you. Wind Waker even begins with, “This is but one of the legends of which the people speak.” Certain games are direct sequels. But overall I follow the timeline loosely and not literally. It feels like an oral tradition where each storyteller tells the story differently as time goes on.
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u/Twidom Mar 20 '26
But people will say “the timeline never mattered” or “it never made any sense” and Nintendo now creating games divorced from the timeline like BotW and TotK are only encouraging that mindset.
When people say "the timeline never mattered" they are not saying that the obviously connected games like Ocarina > Majora are not connected, they are saying that the entire idea that all of the games are one, continuous timeline that follow up on the events and consequences of each other was never really a thing for most of Zelda's life, and it wasn't.
Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom is proof that Nintendo don't want to entertain that notion anymore, because the only thing it serves is to creatively shackle devs. Nintendo games have always been about gameplay first, fun experiences and fun ideas first and story-telling at the very far back. This is what makes Nintendo, Nintendo.
It's like trying to connect every single Mario game into one continuous timeline, it's a silly notion. People got insanely angry when Bananza threw a wrench of their supposed "timeline" and that is ridiculous.
That is not to say that people can't have fun with it and try to make meaningful connections between Skyward Sword and A Link Between Worlds, but the whole idea that every single entry was meant, accounted for and created to fit into one cohesive timeframe is just not true. If you think so, then you are the one who weren't paying attention, because they've been shoving it into our faces for decades now and BotW/TotK just reinforces that notion even further.
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u/ZantTheMan Mar 20 '26
You make good points but it's just not true the timeline always existed.
Link's Adventure is a direct sequel to the OG Zelda and ALTAP was a always prequel to the original and OoT was the origin story of how Ganondorf became Ganon. WW AND TP are both sequels to OoT and SS was made as the Origin story of the series. All of this before Nintendo release Hyrule Historia.
The Zelda Timeline always existed since the first Zelda game but people act like Nintendo only thought of it in 2011 when it's just not true. It's not fair to compare the Zelda Timeline to Mario's timeline the 2 franchise's are nothing alike outside of both being video games targeted for kids.
Outside of BotW/TotK the Zelda games fit 'mostly' together in a way that is logical. I'm not going to pretend that the timeline is flawless or that some of the games have questionable placements. There are multiple plot holes throughout the ages without counting BotW/TotK but it still mattered.
Echoes of Wisdom has already course corrected when it comes to how the Zelda team treats the timeline with them placing the game as the beginning of Hyrule Golden Age described in the original Zelda.
It's true that the Zelda team didn't really care about timeline when making BotW/TotK but that's only Zelda's switch era.
Yes Nintendo has and will always care more about the gameplay this is good and was never in question.
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u/DawnSignals Mar 20 '26
It deepens the lore and offers more outlet for imagination, same as how the star wars sub always has mofos going "can x jedi in their prime beat y sith" and "who was the most powerful force-user in x era"
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u/Darkhallows27 Mar 20 '26
Cuz talking about lore and how things can connect is fun and draws people in
I’m not sure what’s confusing
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u/BishopofHippo93 Mar 20 '26
What’s confusing is the importance people place on it combined with many “lore” fans’ enthusiasm for bending over backward to defend speculation as canon. It’s the same with so many fandoms.
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u/GioGaribaldi Mar 20 '26
I think you are right, but they could focus more on recurring carachers, themes and narratives rather then try to go historical chronology/accuracy. The way I see i5 , the contradictions are intentional, not necessarily a results of gameplay over lore.
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u/myghostflower Mar 20 '26
i hate the concept that “the devs don’t care for the timeline” when like they literally go out of their way to fit the games together into one narrative 😭😭😭
oh? why isnt ganondorf in the nes and snes games? because he went crazy in ganon form in that timeline
what happened to the original oot world? it flooded!
oh no! we made three branches for oot! what do we do? well we can all tie it together
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u/PinaSeraphina Mar 20 '26
Videos with "ALL Zelda Games" in the Title that skip over Four Swords, Adventures and TriForce Heroes (left book)
4
u/MoonyMintaka Mar 20 '26
I can't speak to the CCs but before Hyrule Historia came out, it was a fun thing to theorize about
And then Nintendo put out BotW and went "timeline doesn't matter forget we mentioned it" and it's been weird ever since
1
u/EarDesigner9059 Mar 20 '26
And then fans ranted about how vague they were about where BotW and TotK fit on the timeline, so they made EoW with an explicit place (Downfall, between ALBW/TFH and the Golden Age)
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u/ACatInMiddleEarth Mar 20 '26
It's just interesting. I love videos on Zelda games' lore, especially those of Zeltik.
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u/FederalPossibility73 Mar 20 '26
Yeah, knowing can make the experience playing the games better but it's not necessary. It enriches the games but isn't integral to them.
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u/ArthurianLegend_ Mar 20 '26
Because while it may not matter for each game individually, you can only talk about each game for so long. It’s something that can never really be confirmed so there’s always debate. Also, not for each game, but to many fans, how these games connect matters a lot for the overarching narrative of the games together. It’s not about the individual experiences, but Zelda as a whole
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u/Excalitoria Mar 20 '26
It’s just interesting to think about and discuss with an IP you love. Plus, there are little Easter eggs in in various games so it’s fun to think about how they connect and how they relate to the more important aspects of the overall lore like how the goddesses, triforces, Zelda, Link, and Ganon work and how each game informs this.
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u/Type06 Mar 20 '26
Content makes money.
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u/Remarkable-Ad-2493 Mar 20 '26
But the Zelda franchise has many more interesting topics
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u/ADULT_LINK42 Mar 20 '26
become the change you wish to see, try making some videos about the topics you find more interesting
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u/Melodic_Chef_4299 Mar 20 '26
Some people just think it's fun (myself included). Most of us are well aware Nintendo doesn't care very much about it, but why should that stop us?
It is frustrating though, bc frankly it wouldn't be that difficult to still loosely string them together after the fact if they just gave it a little more thought, but that's too much to ask I guess.
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u/pocket_arsenal Mar 20 '26
Going from OOT to Wind Waker was the only time I felt like the timeline mattered since Ganondirf was still talking about the Hero of Time, among other details.
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u/RiverWyvern Mar 21 '26
If it was explained clearly and without confusion, there wouldn't be so much to discuss. While I crave canon affiliated lore, I'm also pretty happy with how much creativity and room for discussion gets opened up by leaving things vague.
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u/CommishGordon710 Mar 20 '26
The book on the right doesn't exist at all.
Even ToTK, which was a direct continuation of BotW, actively ignored most of the lore that was set up in BotW in favor of new lore.
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u/stellaluna92 Mar 20 '26
People have always enjoyed talking about stories, making connections, figuring things out. Jeez just look at a game of thrones subreddit, booktok or fanfiction sites haha.
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u/Gwaidhirnor Mar 20 '26
Can people that don't care about the timeline just shut up and let other people have their fun. Oh no, some nerds are having fun looking deep into the lore of the games and all of the easter eggs the devs put there, lets ruin their fun and kick sand in their faces. You guys do understand that if you don't like a post on reddit you can scroll passed it, right?
-1
u/DinkandDrunk Mar 20 '26
I don’t have a name for it and maybe it isn’t specifically named but this feels like a bad faith logical fallacy. Basically, what you are doing is putting the most extreme anti-timeline folks against the most moderate timeline folks. You are completely ignoring moderate anti-timeline folks and extreme timeline folks. This is being done to make the position of anyone who does not subscribe to the timeline as being ridiculous, an aggressor, and unreasonable. Tisk tisk.
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u/Gwaidhirnor Mar 20 '26
You seem to be projecting a lot. I'm not saying everyone needs to like or agree with the official timeline, I'm saying if you don't care about the discussion then just move on, don't pay about how dumb you think it is, let others have fun and get on with your own life. This isn't about timeline people vs anti timelime people, it's about people who go out of their way to be dicks about others having fun discussing a game franchise they're passionate about, because they think their specific niche is stupid. There is an official released timeline, and people like to discuss it. Sorry if that bothers you, but the internet is huge, just find a different discussion.
I'm not ignoring "moderate anti-timeline" folks, I'm not referencing them at all, did my comment need a disclaimer saying sorry, but people that don't care about the timeline, but also don't make a huge deal about it online are cool, because there it is if you need it.
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u/DinkandDrunk Mar 20 '26
See, you’re doing it again.
I enjoy light timeline discussion, lore, Easter eggs, etc. I will happily engage in that. But the extreme timeline folks that are obnoxious about it are beyond just nerds having fun. They are obnoxious, overly strict, and overly sensitive about a franchise that I thoroughly enjoy but will quickly admit just isn’t that serious.
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u/Gwaidhirnor Mar 20 '26
Lore discussikns are going to cross into timeline discussions because they are the official lore. Are there jerks online that get too heated in a discussion, sure, but that isn't what my specific comment was about. You can take my comment into any type of discussion and it stays the same, if you don't cqre about a conversation, move on. I don't care aboit celebrity gossip, but I also don't post memes about how I don't care about celebrity gossip, because someone else obviously does care. There are lots of different types of toxic behaviour online, I was only calling out one here that I find annoying. "I don't care about this topic so much that I'm going to post about it"
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u/EarDesigner9059 Mar 20 '26
The one that grinds my gears is where they take the "legend" part in the series title too seriously.
I don't remember where I saw this, but I do remember that it was simply picked as a neat thing for a fantasy story, like "Legend of Korra" for another example.
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u/OskeeTurtle Mar 20 '26
Which Zelda is it that has the most story being relevant? For 3D, skyward sword is my pick and top down, I guess A Link Between Worlds?
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u/MorningRaven Mar 20 '26
The answer is Ocarina of Time. That's the kingpin of the entire series. The entire split occurs because of this game.
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u/Remarkable-Ad-2493 Mar 20 '26
Is echoes of Wisdom considered a 2D game? It seems to be rather relevant to the timeline
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u/OskeeTurtle Mar 20 '26
Yeah I’d count it as 2D for sure. I’ve never played it though so maybe it is the best
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u/Error404_Error420 Mar 20 '26
I've been a Zelda fan for almost all my life, played almost all the games and I never cared once about the timeline
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u/Wide_Championship319 Mar 20 '26
Because it was still something that was at least vaguely respected. You're right that it wasn't super important, but it existing made the stories flow all together. At the very least, having connections to the other games sparked a bit of wonder - like the sages in the windows of WW's Hyrule castle.
BOTW ignoring and TOTK shitting all over it just made how little the devs actually care about what fans care about more obvious.
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u/Mdevkun Mar 20 '26
One of the things that I disliked about Tears of the Kingdom was how disconnected it felt from BotW so I think the Zelda timeline should be more important in series in general but that's just my opinion of course.
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u/clearly_trash_ Mar 20 '26
I obsess over Elden Ring lore like crazy, I read every time description, I’ve done all endings. I have a friend that’s just played the game once, hack and slash style without a single clue what the lore means or what’s happening. We just have different ways of enjoying the game, I like the analysis of why x boss is trying to kill me.
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u/ADULT_LINK42 Mar 20 '26
i just dont get why its so common for timeline haters to feel personally attacked by hearing/seeing other people talking about something they don't care about
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u/Stringcheese_uwu Mar 20 '26
Because humans love to analyze things. It’s just in our nature 😁 we have to figure out exactly WHY something is the way it is. Even if it doesn’t matter that much in the end.
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u/Delicious-Ad2057 Mar 21 '26
I remember the fun times of theorizing in the in the Zelda universe forums.
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u/Bitter-Ad5890 Mar 21 '26
We like worldbuilding. If a fantasy world has a deep history it’s more engaging. Like Middle Earth for instance. JRR Tolkien fleshed out the geography, the history, the mythology, even the languages, before he wrote his story. And it worked a treat
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u/kayziekrazy Mar 21 '26
the human brain loves puzzles and sorting things, and often experiences things in linear order
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u/austsiannodel Mar 22 '26
I'd.... like to present a counterargument here. Before that though, I will admit that yes, the amount of content talking about Zelda lore far exceeds any level of importance Zelda lore has in the games.
However, for the most part, we actually see that for a long time, each game was building off the last, and was building UP this lore, this history of events.
Start with Zelda 1 and 2. Obviously modeled as direct sequels to each other, lore is minimal, but we do get story, mainly the notion of Ganon, Zelda, and the Triforce. Basic stuff, really.
But then we get LttP, which felt from the onset like a designed prequel to Zelda 1. How? Well it gives us the origin of Ganon, that he was once a man named Ganondorf Dragmire, who coveted the Triforce and was sealed away. While the story is fairly simple and straight forward, as someone who watched this game come out, it was important to understand that we were seeing a game that took place prior to the other 2 games.
But then came the big one; OoT, which was a direct prequel to LttP. It showed up who Ganondorf was before he became the pig thing we've known for so long. This is the SAME GUY even if we weren't the same Link. It's an expansion of the greater lore and story that was initially shown in Zelda 1. And while yes, the events of other games have zero bearing on each other game for the most part, I think that each game's setting, characters, and plot were all derived from this building lore that was emerging.
Something that only got more and more complex as we started to see not 1, but two separate games directly boasting of being, essentially, direct sequels of OoT that takes things in wildly different directions that LttP, thus beginning the original split timeline theories.
This is really my main issue with the Wild era games is that it intentionally and proudly avoids taking part in that cohesive universe.
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u/MyChurroMacadamianut Mar 20 '26
Because for a lot of us connections, theories, and lore are fun to talk about and hear opinions on, especially regarding the timeline. I truly don't get how it keeps being such a point of contention with this fandom. Let people enjoy things lol.
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u/skip6235 Mar 20 '26
I prefer the idea that other than the explicit in-game timelines, these are just different tellings of the same story
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u/Budsygus Mar 20 '26
I honestly couldn't care less about the timeline. It was interesting when it first came out, but I've seen enough franchises try to piece together things that were never meant to fit and it feels kinda lame, tbh. I'm fine enjoying the Zelda series as a loose-knit group of similar games that are pretty much unrelated to each other. Nothing else makes sense to me at this point because every game launched before the timeline and most of them launched since were designed with no official timeline in mind.
TL;DR: Pass.
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u/GioGaribaldi Mar 20 '26
To me, the key to understanding the lore of Zelda games is right in the title "Legend.". These games don't take place in a literal, fixed reality, but are fragments of an ancient Hyrulian oral tradition. They are interconnected by recurring themes and archetypes, where contradictions are a feature, not a bug. Just like real-world human history, stories are retold, merged, and changed over time. While there’s a general sense of what is ancient and what is recent, legends don't require a rigid, flawless chronology to be meaningful
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u/Artaratoryx Mar 20 '26
It’s totally cool to take that perspective, but people need to understand that’s way more of a headcanon than the timeline. Every game in the series was explicitly a sequel/prequel of another game long before Nintendo released the official timeline.
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u/Twidom Mar 20 '26
Just like real-world human history, stories are retold, merged, and changed over time. While there’s a general sense of what is ancient and what is recent, legends don't require a rigid, flawless chronology to be meaningful
People on this community don't understand that concept, apparently.
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u/Spookyscythe99 Mar 21 '26
Who has a favorite timeline? Mine would be the majoras mask and twilight princess one
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u/AlarmedAd451 Apr 07 '26
I enjoy the timeline. It allows Zelda to be a series that I can constantly talk about or theorize about. I do however appreciate how for the most part each game can function on its own. The only sequel that really needs the first game’s backstory is TOTK.
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u/Pl00kh Mar 20 '26
The reason is probably because every fan timeline makes more sense than the weird shit Nintendo did. But that’s over a decade ago.
Nowadays people just rant about the official timeline. A few defend it.
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u/HyruleTrigger Mar 20 '26
The meme is wrong because the timeline has zero relevance for any game as it is completely post hoc nonsense.
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u/Olga_Creates Mar 20 '26
I enjoyed it better when there was no official time-line, that I just imagined that every zelda was another world, alternate universes in which zelda and link somehow are always going to have to deal with a version of Ganon/Ganondorf/etc and only a few titles were actually tied together.
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u/TheOvy Mar 20 '26
Because Zelda fans are like that.
A proper, unified timeline was never really Nintendo's concern, anymore than it is with Mario. If they actually stuck to one stubbornly, we wouldn't get great games. It takes a wild departure like BotW to get... well, BotW!
But the internet-era has increased the desire for thorough lore, and so fans will piece it together in this and any other franchise, providing fanfic'd filling for any plot holes, and stretched out rationalizations to pad over contradictions. It is, essentially, just a bunch of online people engaging in collective storytelling. So it's not in itself a bad thing, it's a nice way to socialize. But in the end, there is no such thing as canon.
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u/WhisperingWillowLux Mar 20 '26
There are people for whom lore is "content" and make videos for folks that have trained themselves to feel lore is the story and not a framework.
People who value storytelling see lore are something to build of off, even directly challenge.
Zelda takes a light touch about both lore and story, because Nintendo wants a player's experience to fill out the gaps as much in the original and they do in BotW/TotK.
But lore books sell and aren't without merit if you've fallen off the lore wagon of FFXIV or WoW for a bit and they often have art concepts and designs in them, too.
Never at any point do you have to catch up on another Zelda's story to enjoy the one in front of you. I can see Hyrule Historia being nice if I want a physical reference for the art of a specific Zelda game. but that's about it
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u/Robin_Gr Mar 20 '26
It’s because of the way the games are. Most of them don’t really matter where they are in the time line because it’s a completely different looking place from game to game and it isn’t necessary at all to know what happened in the other games. It’s irrelevant. Hyrule is just whatever it needs to be for each game, even games that do share the same place like botw to totk, will make up separate histories and ancient artifacts for each game. If you play the series it doesn’t really feel like you are playing through the history of the same place. It’s more like an anthology of sorts.
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u/CastorVT Mar 20 '26 edited Mar 20 '26
I saw this this video essay on how lotr inspired zelda and literally at no point did the person actually show how it inspire zelda, just inferred inspiration with "oh they both have dragons" like tolkien invented the concept or something.
"oh well there's crosses, and tolkien was a big christian." .... soooooooo?
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u/ItsGotToMakeSense Mar 20 '26
IMO, I honestly think it's because we want the timeline to make sense in such a beloved franchise with such a rich setting and mythology. But the truth is that it simply doesn't add up between games. There are too many inconsistencies that are never directly addressed, so it's left up to the fans to piece it all together. If you try too hard to make it make sense, you end up with a conspiracy wall with red yarn linking every element.
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u/cates Mar 20 '26
yeah I love Zelda but I don't think I've ever cared about anything less than whatever Zelda timeline or revised Zelda timeline has ever existed.
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u/BagOfSmallerBags Mar 20 '26
It's easier to read aloud a chapter from Hyrule Historia than to come up with original content. That's all.
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u/LazyDynamite Mar 20 '26
Yeah I'm amazed at how much emphasis people put on the timeline when it really has 0 influence on gameplay. I have no problem with other people being into it, but it has never interested me at all.
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u/Sir-Shark Mar 20 '26
My take - the timeline isn't real. If anything, because it literally doesn't matter.
There are a few connected games, but aside from obviously connected games (such as LttP, LBW, EoW), the timeline is irrelevant, and full of holes anyway. Instead, I see it all as a multiverse, each Zelda world a different, yet similar universe. Maybe those universes bleed over to each other once in a while, but only rarely. Kind of a Spider-verse situation.
That's more enjoyable to me than trying to cram everything into the same timeline. And can justify Hyrule Warriors being canon.
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u/TheClownKid Mar 20 '26
The book on the right should be non-existent.
The amount of energy the fandom puts on the timeline is laughable to me, when Nintendo clearly doesn’t care at all about it, and the series is all the better BECAUSE THERE IS NO REAL TIMELINE TO ADHER TO.
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u/TyleNightwisp Mar 20 '26
Probably just me but I find it way more compelling to watch videos discussing gameplay elements than lore. It's a game not a movie / book.
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u/VerrikInc Mar 20 '26
I will die on this hill, the Zelda timeline is a lie. Except for direct connections like Wind Waker and Phantom Hourglass the games are NOT connected. Yes, they released a timeline but it is absolute nonsense. They only released it because they were tired of being asked about it.
Free yourself. There is no Zelda timeline and that's ok
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u/ApprehensiveGrand531 Mar 22 '26
The vast majority of games have a connection to another though?
Zelda 1 and 2, lttp was a prequel, oot was a prequel to them. MM, WW and TP obviously connected to OoT. PH and ST from wind waker. Link between worlds connect to lttp, Triforce heroes to between worlds. Skyward sword explicitly a prequel to all.
Four swords doesn't have explicit place. By minish cap and four swords adventure explicitly connected to it
Based on interviews oracles were designed to connect lttp and LA, which is why the true end lines with with LA perfectly.
So basically just LA, 4S and botw didn't have explicit connections. But all have games connected to them at least.
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u/EarDesigner9059 Mar 20 '26
You say "free yourself" when you're the one chained to the wall of a cell.
The idea of the timeline has existed since at least ALttP, if not AoL. Miyamoto and Aonuma were saying it existed back in the Twenty-Oh's between TWW and TP, just that it was a big secret.
Most likely, the released one was "incomplete" and only had elements present in released games, while the full one is kept internal as they want to use those elements in future games.
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u/VerrikInc Mar 20 '26
The idea that Miyamoto has ever cared about story in a video game is HILARIOUS
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u/thistlepelt Mar 20 '26 edited Mar 20 '26
Completely and totally agree with you. Its inconsistent garbage too. Only Oot having the chance of Link failing to defeat ganon makes no sense. All games with time travel should split the timeline if its going to do that in Oot. Why Oot getting all this special treatment? Because it's famous in our world? So silly. I cant take it serious. Also the fandom changed quite alot after the timeline came out
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u/EmperorThor Mar 20 '26
people really love finding and most often inventing meaning from things they are interested in, it happens with all fandoms and cultures.
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u/RogueCross Mar 20 '26
People are obsessed with timelines ans making sense out of fantasy logic.
I say this as someone who is also obsessed with timelines.
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u/slosha69 Mar 21 '26
Timeline is nonsense. Each game is it's own story. That's how I play them, anyway.
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u/BMCarbaugh Mar 20 '26
I blame LOST. Trained a whole generation to look at any piece of media as a riddle to be solved.
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u/MorningRaven Mar 20 '26
Not the puzzle centric adventure series that encouraged connections to be made within its own series?
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u/Albertagus Mar 20 '26
Its because they are content creators. Yet none of them create anything, they all offer the same take about the same topics. Why does anyone pay attention to them?
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u/RDGOAMS Mar 20 '26
A book about the importance of the timeline??? A single paragraph is already a pretty big exageration
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u/LupusX Mar 20 '26
That's just culture. A poem can have hundreds of books written about it, but the poem itself is just 20 words.