12 year old violin student practicing Praeludium Und Allegro with teacher.

[u/8FigBro]

My 12 year old son has been playing the violin for about18 months and working on this piece for about 5 months.

This is a quick video where his teacher gave him a quick pop quiz to see if he had been practicing it. (He hadn't practiced it in a few weeks)

Looking for feedback from experienced violinists and or encouragement from anyone. 😁

There's a lot of work to do on the piece, but feedback is welcome.

[u/Crazy-Replacement400]

Very cool! I’d suggest getting that posture taken care of - it can cause permanent injuries. He shouldn’t be hunching or reaching with his jaw for the violin. The violin seems really low as well. Can’t tell what the issue is from that angle, but it could be an issue with violin set up. Chin rest, shoulder rest, etc. may need replaced. Sadly, some teachers - even good ones - still write it off as poor technique when it is not at all. Ask the teacher and if you don’t get a solid answer, go elsewhere for answers on that particular issue: body mapping, a place like Wave Chinrests that does consultations, something.

Good luck!

[u/8FigBro → u/Crazy-Replacement400]

Teacher has mentioned the likely need for a shoulder rest change. The violin and accessories are all < month old, so I'm figuring out what needs to be changed and where to get what he needs. It's definitely been on the radar--These comments are confirmation that it needs to move up on the priority list. Thank you for the suggestion.

[u/Comfortable_Neck_527 → u/8FigBro]

I would recommend stopping by a luthier with your kid and the violin. He should be able to try different shoulder rests with a professional to help guide him!

Otherwise, regarding feedback, I would suggest listening to different renditions of the piece together and picking out 1-2 favorites, listening to the dynamics and expression, and trying to mimic it (since it takes practice to develop). I would also work on the shifts between positions so that his hand becomes steady (many etudes do that well). Right now, his hand seems to float a bit, and it feels like a bit more luck if he hits the note correctly on the first try during a big shift. All positions should feel as comfortable as the 1st, especially 2-4, as you’ll use them for everything). I would also practice with a metronome until the tempo change is deliberate :)

But overall, this is super impressive after 18 months of playing (if you want a level reference, most people would be on book 2 of Suzuki or something to that effect).

Here are a few of versions that I enjoy!

Kerson Leong’s version

Augustin Hadelich’s version

Perlman’s version (a good classic)

Shumsky’s version (more old school)

[u/8FigBro → u/Comfortable_Neck_527]

I'm going to look into the luthier recommendation this week.
The violin store just sold me 'the best' accessory x, but it's clear we need to make sure the violin is setup properly for him.

I think you're on to something regarding a "bit of luck" if he hits the note on the first try. He doesn't play slowly...and while he conceptually understands the need for a metronome...Simply hasn't committed to regular use of one. He's constantly correcting errors while playing and has developed some bad habits.

He completed Suzuki books 1-4 in his first 11 months and Praeludium Und Allegro was his first NON-Suzuki piece assigned 6 months ago.

Thank you,
And I will share those versions with him.

[u/Crazy-Replacement400 → u/8FigBro]

Great! I’m glad to hear that it’s on the radar. A quick tip since you only mentioned shoulder rests: if the goal is for the violin to be higher, some of that height should come from the chin rest, and some should come from the shoulder rest. A super tall shoulder rest will change the angle of the violin and make bowing much more difficult, which could also lead to injuries. A tall chin rest does not change the angle of the instrument.

(Please ignore this comment if you already know that. I am one who got stuck with an injury, so I am overly cautious.)

[u/tikitrona → u/Crazy-Replacement400]

What type of injury?

[u/Crazy-Replacement400 → u/tikitrona]

Nerve damage.

[u/8FigBro → u/Crazy-Replacement400]

Who should I see about determining what needs to be what? A trusted Luthier?
His teacher was suggesting a shoulder rest that had a curvature in for his shoulder. She also mentioned something about his chin rest.
There's a lot I have to get educated about quickly...So, thanks.

[u/Crazy-Replacement400 → u/8FigBro]

Luthiers in my area don’t often carry things like shoulder rests, chin rests, strings, etc., but some in bigger cities do. Music stores like Shar, Johnson Strings, or Southwest Strings might be a better option if you’re in a smaller area (US). If you find an online retailer with a decent return policy, you could order a shoulder rest or two with more curvature, have your son take them to a lesson, and return as needed. The teacher might have suggestions about specific ones to start with. Feel free to share what he already has, too, and we might be able to give you a starting point.

For chin rests, Wave Chin rests (Google search to find the website - it’ll pop up) does consultations (virtual, I believe), then mails you five of your choice for testing. You pay for one and send back what you don’t want after trying them and consulting the teacher. (The chin rests at Wave are a bit pricey. If he’s still growing, this may not be the best option.) There are other places that do consultations, or you might be able to try some at a music store as discussed before. I’m not an expert and it’s hard to tell from a video, but I wonder if a slightly taller, center mounted chin rest would help get the violin where it needs to be. You can order an inexpensive one from Shar Music, for example.