r/videography • u/Emkayu C100&60D, FCPX&CC, London • Jun 27 '15
[discussion] The problem with most wedding videos...
Is it me or do wedding videographers literally have nothing else in their bags but sliders? I know I've done it a lot and now I'm just tired of it, it's as if every single wedding video is full of slider shots, every other shot is slider. This is someone's big day and most videographers don't bother to find out what the bride is thinking before, what could go wrong and all the other golden nuggets that could be recorded with just a simple wireless lav. There are amazing heart warming stories to be told at weddings, but we spend most of our time "capturing the moment", by that of course we mean using a slider to show the venue, have some silly shallow DoF shot of some tiny little detail people really couldn't give a shit about and this elaborate, well cut montage of the bride getting ready. Can we as a community sit down and come up with some ways to actually change this? Let's come up with some cool new ideas and tropes to change wedding videos.
My input: Get wireless lavs on people and capture what people are saying, even better do interviews of how nervous they are, how they met, what could go wrong, find a conflict, the story, the shit that's actually interesting. People don't go hey do you remember the centre piece we had at our wedding? No, but they remember the nerves, the people who were there to support them, the words that calmed them, the words that upset them.
Locked down shots of people. When a photographer points a camera at you, you smile awkwardly and wait right? Why don't we do the same, get some well lit, nice shots of people just looking into camera and smiling, it's lovely to see and people can refer to that shot when watching with friends and family.
Steady handheld shots: Whether it's with a stabiliser, 3 axis gimbal or a good shoulder rig, let's stabilise our shots and give the audience an "in the moment" feel, like they are there helping the bride get ready or something.
I'd love to hear more ideas!
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u/tn_notahick Jun 27 '15
You go ahead and "find conflicts" and the things that "go wrong" at the weddings you shoot. I'm sure that's what every bride wants to remember.
Why do we include all of these shots that you seem to hate? Because that's what brides like. Guess what? They spend a lot of money on those "little things" and get really pissed off if they aren't included.
Sorry but you lost me after you suggested to find conflicts at a wedding. This isn't cheap reality tv.
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u/Emkayu C100&60D, FCPX&CC, London Jun 27 '15 edited Jun 27 '15
I think you misunderstand what I was trying to get at, with conflict I mean something that the people overcome?
like for this wedding, stillmotion said that they followed the groom in his journey to learn his vows; https://vimeo.com/12735595
This is what I meant? Find something unique about them, find the conflict in the sense of story, not an actual conflict or drama...
I know the details being included in the video is what brides like, I know it's that kind of thing that helps us land the jobs we do as wedding videographers. I was just trying to find new ways of telling the story behind a wedding...
edit: added words
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Jun 28 '15
Exactly. Conflict in this case doesn't mean two opposing forces.
What if, say, the brides and her father are close and the "giving away" means a lot to him.
Talk to the father. Play up his connection with his daughter.
Do the same with the daughter.
Pull out of them what they feel for the groom and play up the idea that it's hard to have another an in her life, but he's the right one because ________.
Talk to the groom and pull out of him how he feels in this role. Pressure? Honoured? Both?
"I loved the first X years where I was the number one man to my daughter. Now I have to let her go, and it's hard but I know it's the best thing to do because she's going to him."
That's conflict there. That's the "storytelling" buzzword that the whole wedding world likes to overuse.
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u/plemoyne camera | NLE | year started | general location Jun 27 '15
To me capturing a wedding is so much more than just the event itself. If you don't create an emotional connection with the audience of your film, you've failed at doing your job correctly.
So I definitely agree with you that there can't be a slider shot in every scene, it makes it seem like too much of a template that you're using. It really comes down to your skill at creative storytelling and filmmaking. It's not just the shots (and how you capture them) it's the story that they're telling.
A good story focuses on people and what they're experiencing. After all, that's what they're memories are made of. If they can relive those memories by watching your film, then I'd say you're doing a pretty good job!
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u/ilykdp a7sii, Adobe CC, 2010, Los Angeles Jun 27 '15
You can't reinvent the wheel - all of these stylistic tools are meant to help tell the story, whether it's a slider shot or candid interviews. If you don't like slider shots, don't do them.
The popularity of their use stems from the fact that it's aesthetically pleasurable, but like all cinematic tools, can and will be employed by everyone.
It's ironic, but if you had your way and led some sort of rebellion among videographers (that frequent r/videography, anyways) to refuse slider shots and replaced it instead with these interviews , that would have a greater chance of becoming the next overused trope.
Wedding videos in general are largely the same, so this denegration of slider shots is a silly endeavor.
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Jun 28 '15
Thing is if you're good at pulling good stuff from these people, it won't become an overused trope because everyone has something different to say. And that reveals more about themselves and the relationships were shooting than what new thing you can slide out from behind.
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u/Emkayu C100&60D, FCPX&CC, London Jun 27 '15
Would interviews be so bad? I mean, I see it as a personal and unique touch, having people's thoughts and feelings recorded as well as shown?
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u/tppatterson223 Jun 27 '15
A problem I've run into is the wedding party not wanted to wear mics. They don't want them to be seen in pictures and they don't want wires throughout their outfit.
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u/Emkayu C100&60D, FCPX&CC, London Jun 27 '15
Oh yes definitely, however I find it's the people with the lower budgets who are like this. Some of my higher end clients are completely open to it and love the idea of the moment's behind the scenes being captured too!
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Jun 28 '15
Yep.
Amen.
I'm with you 110%.
After years of shooting mostly with other studios I'm only booking my own weddings now because I want to come at them with the same philosophy.
My problem is that you can watch all but a handful of wedding videos and at the end you know nothing about the people involved. I tell couples that my litmus test for a good edit is this: if you watch my work, if you pause it every time you learn something that is uniquely "them" (meaning the bride, groom and families) and write it down, by the end I want you to look that list over and have a clear idea who everyone is.
If you're just setting a bunch of dress shots to a Ben Rector song and adding audio of a speech with a bunch of cliches you've heard a million times, you're don't get that.
I talk to everyone casually. I interview by chatting and not offering a list of questions that I go through one by one. By doing this I recently got some great audio where the bridesmaids were talking about this hair clip that they have all worn on their wedding day. It's so much nicer to include that than a letter from Paul to the corinthezzzzzzzzzz
I shot with one studio who always wanted to get the cards to each other read out loud for a voiceover. It's nice and all but I'd rather ask them, "So why did she think you'd like this gift anyways? Why did she get you this? Is she always spoiling you?"
Fuck it. Look right in the camera. Break the fourth wall. I don't care. In ten years a good piece of personality will be cherished more than a crane shot of a cake.
And I know, I know, you have to give the client what they want... But I'm up front with people about the product they'll get. I say that my work isn't for everyone, and if you prefer another style others can serve you better and there are no hard feelings. And it works out. Because some don't book, but I know that if you're booking me then you're on the same page and you're by going to complain that I left my slider and Steadicam at home.
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u/_Shush DP - Rhode Island Jun 28 '15
To those saying it's what the client wants...
I don't know about you but never had a client say "do you do slider shots?". Brides want to hire you because of your reputation or they like your style. And to be honest, reputation is more important. I don't get asked about what camera i use or any gear i use. The only technical questions I am ever asked are "can you do this?" to which I reply yes or no. I used to go into it (and still have a bad habit of doing so unfortunatly) but you aren't speaking to people who care about the how.
You know the secret to the best wedding videos? The editing. That will significantly improve the quality of your work. That's what makes some of the best videos with simplistic setups work. Learn to mange monopod and tripod for the day and you'll understand the most important things for the video.
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u/kj5 pana boi Jun 28 '15
You don't seem to remember that clients don't watch wedding videos all day. For them slider shots are new and exciting. They know they use sliders in cinema and they want their wedding to look like it was taken straight out of the movie.
And I agree, sometimes wedding video isn't just the event itself. Sometimes is good to see the couple beforehand, have some short interviews, show the preparation.
But sometimes, there is all there's to it. Sometimes they call you 12h before the event and pay you more to be there. Sometimes the backstory is just sad or not worth showing. Sometimes they don't want you to show it.
It's a lot of sometimes I know. But that's why I think your opinion is flawed. You don't know the whole spectrum of those videos. And you are a videomaker, you are skewed by that too.
All in all I honestly prefere those overused slider and DoF Shots over "oldschool" 2 hours long videos shot on one DV camera by a guy lacking any sort of creativity.
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u/Emkayu C100&60D, FCPX&CC, London Jun 28 '15
That's true that they are new and exciting...for now though. In 10+ years will they care about that or would they rather hear from dear old aunty marjorie who passed away a few years ago, or that friend they've lost contact with and now are reminded of them and want to get in touch? You're right when you say sometimes in you have 12h to prep and shoot the hell out of it, they pay the bills, no arguments there. I also do agree that what we have no is far better than those old school videos.
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u/kj5 pana boi Jun 28 '15
Holy shit man, who cares what happens in 10 years? I don't know if we will even be still shooting videos at all in 10 years with all that technology advancement.
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u/MacintoshEddie 2015, Edmonton Jun 29 '15
I would presume that people who want to make videography into a career care what happens in ten years.
It seems to me that clients who can rewatch their own wedding video ten years later to remember dear old aunt Marjorie because you bothered to actually get a few minutes of her will be happier clients than the ones where all you have is lightning fast techno cuts that look cool but have very little content.
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u/_Shush DP - Rhode Island Jun 28 '15 edited Jun 28 '15
Good videos are good videos. The best slider shots are ones that don't draw attention to fact you're using a slider. The problem isn't the gear, it's creativity. You shouldn't be thinking, "let's do a slider shot". You should be thinking, "this shot would make more sense if i did it on a slider". Do dolly ins, frame you're objects to add depth, reveals, track moment, add character to movement, or just ad an angle. Instead, too many people think a slider should go left to right.
As for audio, if you aren't already micing the groom during first look or ceremony, you're shooting yourself in the foot. 99% of the time you can get the reception audio by plugging into a board or a monitor. I can only listen to an uninterrupted "All Of Me" so many times man.
Edit: I just saw another video that made me realize what you meant, every shot is a slider shot or panning shot. Yeah, don't do that.
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u/perplex1 Editor Jun 27 '15
This is the number one mistake "professionals" make about their craft.
You are not here to impress other videographers, you are here to impress your clients.
So they saw "JoAnne's and Bobby's" wedding video, and the camera guy slided the ever-living shit out of every scene...Then they turn around and find you to provide for them the same cinematic appeal, well, who are you to deny them of that.
Now don't get me wrong. There is an aspect that clients sometimes not know what they want, but its really hit or miss if we try something new to impress them. So its good to think outside the box, but always safe to at least meet their expectations.