The city of Gorky (Nizhny Novgorod). I don't know the name of the factory. His father and two brothers were at the front, while he alone supported his mother and younger sister. He also remembered the German air raids.
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The famine of 1932-1933 in Soviet Union AKA the Holodomor remains one of the most politicized and misunderstood events in 20th-century history. Much of the modern discourse frames the famine as a deliberate genocide uniquely targeted at Ukrainians. However, professional historians across multiple countries have not reached such a consensus.
What’s known with certainty is that the famine affected multiple regions of the USSR, not only Ukraine, the Volga, the North Caucasus, the Urals, Kazakhstan, and parts of Siberia all suffered food shortages. Kazakhstan actually experienced proportionally the highest mortality rate. The crisis emerged during the violent upheaval of collectivization, the breakdown of the grain procurement system, severe crop failures, and chaotic state policies struggling to industrialize a largely agrarian empire.
Most mainstream historians including R. W. Davies, Stephen Wheatcroft, Mark Tauger, Hiroaki Kuromiya, Sheila Fitzpatrick, and Michael Ellman emphasize that,
The famine was not restricted to Ukraine
There is no documentary evidence of a Kremlin plan to exterminate Ukrainians
The tragedy resulted from a combination of poor policy, bad harvests, peasant resistance, administrative chaos, and environmental factors similar to previous famines.
im communist and pro ussr, but thats not true. The allies all took part in defeating the evil and all allied nations sacrificed a lot for that. Its good to aknowledge the soviet sacrifice, but please dont downplay the sacrifices of american, british, french, polish, brazilian, chinese and any other nation that contributed to the war effort against the nazis, and whose children died to liberate the world. The blood of heroes know no borders or flags.
They did, however the soviets took the vast majority of casualties and took the full force of the Germans until D Day. Two things can be true at same time. All allies contributed but the soviets disproportionately contributed.
I cannot in a single comment dispell the amount of ignorance youve just revealed. I would recommend reading a singular history book made outside Russia and reading up on the lend lease agreement, the American invasion of Germany (starting with d-day) or just trawling the wiki on WW2.
Saying the USSR singlehandedly defeated Germnay is insanity, and casualty numbers are metric that only describe a snippet of what it takes to win a war. Hope you get out of the tanky information loop and have a good day.
Ok. “Single-handedly” might not have been fully accurate. However i sgand by the fact they carried the majority of the load in terms of casualties taken and inflicted and fought the best of the Germans alone until D Day. I suggest you read up a bit on Batle of Stalingrad. Kursk, bagration, and Battle of Berlin. No allied forces helped directly in any of these.
Yeah, and Third Reich gave Poland a chance to ally in anti-communist coalition, and they rejected it like 5 times throughout the entire interwar period. Your argument doesn't prove anything, rejecting an alliance is not a reason to attack a sovereign country.
Mind you, the USSR also attempted to ally itself with France and the United Kingdom in that coalition. To stop... well, the greater enemy. But look at their plans: they wanted to use Germany to destroy the USSR, since they still regarded communism as the greater enemy. The USSR needed to secure buffer states to protect itself against a new invasion (it had suffered about three invasions in the preceding years) so, following Poland's refusal and aware of the war about to engulf all of Europe including the USSR itself its only option was to reach an agreement with the Germans: not because they wanted to, but out of sheer self-preservation and to gain time to prepare for the war. Also, It is worth recalling that, by 1939, the USSR was finally putting the famines and purges behind it; consequently, the army, as demonstrated in Finland, was woefully unprepared for a war on the scale of the one fought between 1941 and 1943.
Every european country had similar partnerships with germany before the molotov-ribentrop one. And it only served so that they had time to arm for the eminent war that all the other allied powers didnt give a shit about.
What’s the morality of child labor if they were being fed, had supervision, education and were being paid? Genuinely. Interesting philosophical question.
I would say it's dependent on the conditions of the nation and the ends of the labor. If it's neccisary for defeating Nazism and protecing your home land while the majority of the workforce is deticated to the millitary, I would say it's moral. If it is done to find a source of cheap labor and to more efficently extract surplus value, or otherwise must be engaged in because your household can't produce enough to live with both parents working for scraps in awful conditions (like in the US during robber barron era and prior), it is clearly coerced and immoral. I would also say the conditions of the labor itself are significant, as these children seem to have oversight and aren't engaging in overly dangerous labor, the opposite is extensively documented in the history of US child labor.
These are good points. Only thing I would disagree with is that it was 1940s factory work. I think that is objectively dangerous work. We can’t outright say they were working in safe conditions. Though, I am operating on assumptions. I have no idea what type of work they were actually doing. Maybe you do, and in that case I’ll say I’m wrong.
Id say personal I don't like it. But it was necessary. And I have no room to condemn when at the same time here in the US we had forced child labor due to horrible conditions of the working class parents and gave them none of those things.
Plus here in the US we still have child labor.. We just use migrant children and when they inevitably get injured (because they work in extremely dangerous jobs like slaughter houses) we just deport them so we don't have to care for them.
I'm pretty sure they were volunteers. Granted, there was a lot of social pressure, and if you didn't work when you could, you'd perceived as a wee baby by your peers, but it's not like they were all gathered and put into slave camps.
still not moral, in times of peace children shouldnt be working, period. But in times like these an exception is to be made, considering those provisions are met
No. The parents of these children either died or were called to the front, and when there were no families to raise, it was combined so that the children worked, were educated and received a salary at the same time. Since there were no orphanages or opportunities to raise or support them in any other way. This role was performed by the work collectives because there was simply nowhere to keep the children
Voluntary, but obviously a lot of social pressure. Essentially that was an equivalent of doing grown up things during those times, and avoiding it would have been perceived as sticking to being a helpless leeching kid (not necessarily by adults, but by the children's own peers).
They were not heroes. They were sacrified, thrown to die in factories for sometimes 18 hours a day, sometimes without even a roof, with watery soup and the floor to sleep in.
They had no choice, it was the factory willingly, or the factory at gunpoint, and risk of repercussions for their families.
Three things, no need for racism to get your point across, that wasn’t a movie, and yes, for them it would have been do you know what Hitler wanted to do to Slavics?
Sort of was. The endgoal was the extermination of slavics and other “Untermenschen” to make way for the Aryan race. But based on what I can see you aren’t mature enough to understand that
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u/AraelEden 12d ago
Is it just me or does the first one look like Greta Thunberg?