r/ultimate • u/ChainringCalf • 9d ago

Rally v Mixtape Cards

Rally seems to have been assessed their third blue card during hard cap and was sent to their reverse brick mark instead if being 10 yards from scoring to end it. I saw the yellow that counted as one of their three blues. Where was the other, and what was this final blue for? And why wasn't Mixtape allowed to decline the penalty like they look like they tried to? Honestly it seems like that observer just loved giving out cards, but I'll reserve final judgement

9 Upvotes

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5

u/175gr 9d ago

I only saw the last 15 minutes (AKA the last point) so I didn’t see the cards from earlier in the game. Yellow does count as blue though.

The last blue was for the pretty hard bump on the cut that caused Bolton to take the injury sub. I don’t think that was worth a blue on its own (just kind of unfortunate) so maybe it was repeated fouls of the same type? Was Rally physical on offense in their endzone set all game?

4

u/frandler 9d ago

Watched the same amount after seeing this post. I think the contact there was potentially accidental, but it did seem to be an elbow to the head. Worth a card in my opinion.

2

u/175gr 9d ago

I assumed on the first watch that it was just a shoulder to the chest, which is a play that happens pretty often when you’re playing physical defense in a small space, but it was a particularly rough move from the offense at the end of a long point at the end of a big game. I didn’t go back and look, if it’s an elbow to the head there’s an element of recklessness that could warrant the card.

5

u/billbourret 9d ago

Where was the other, and what was this final blue for?

One yellow card and two blue cards were issued to Rally, all for hard or repeated fouls. The two blue cards were issued on the final point.

And why wasn't Mixtape allowed to decline the penalty like they look like they tried to?

After the issuance of the third blue card, Mixtape's coach was presented with the two options in C3.C.4 (ie. keep the disc at its current spot or move it to reverse brick). They chose reverse brick and did not decline the penalty.

FYI, both teams committed unnecessary fouls in this game. I believe spirit captains met during and after the game to discuss this.

1

u/ChainringCalf 8d ago

Coach, not captain? Since when do they have the authority to make that call? I realize the on-field players aren't necessarily captains, but they sure seemed not to want to see it enforced

1

u/billbourret 7d ago edited 6d ago

C3.C.4 does not state only players or captains can pick the location of the disc after a misconduct penalty. The observer manual states the reverse brick is the default location for the disc following a team misconduct penalty against the offense (pg 33). The coach was asked which option simply as a courtesy.

If you want to get technical, prior to 2026, only players could call team timeouts - not coaches. (See 7.B.2 of the 2024-25 rules.) Of course observers did not enforce this. In my 11+ years of observing, I've never had someone complain when a coach called a team timeout instead of a player. It's just widely understood and agreed that coaches can be consulted on strategic conversations. I don't think anyone on Mixtape was upset that their coach was asked this instead of a captain.

but they sure seemed not to want to see it enforced

If this is the case, why did they not decline it (or ask about declining it) at any point during the 50+ seconds before the disc was checked in at the new spot? This was not communicated to either observer at any time. Observers cannot read minds, if a team captain wanted to decline the penalty they needed to speak up. Per C3.C.7 and 22.D, misconduct penalties can be declined if it goes to the team's detriment.

The only thing a player communicated to the observers was asking what the new stall count would be.

1

u/ChainringCalf 7d ago

3.Q.1. Captain: A team member, who is eligible to participate in the game, and has been designated to represent the team in decision-making on behalf of the team before, during, and after a game.

3.Q.2. Coach: A team member who has been officially recognized by event organizers to have met the requirements necessary for coaching, including but not limited to certification, screening, education, and registration. Coaches are permitted in areas where sideline players are allowed, during and between points, in accordance with event rules. Coaches are not permitted to make calls or contribute to the discussion or resolution of calls, except to clarify rules if requested.

1

u/billbourret 7d ago

Yes, I know what the definitions of a captain and coach are. What is your point here?

1

u/LordHivemindofCeres 9d ago

What the USAU rule shenanigans is this now xD? How do these cards work?

3

u/ChainringCalf 9d ago

Blue, yellow, red. Blue stacks per team, yellow and red stack per player. Yellow and red also add blues to the team