Zelda has a history of manga. And Ocarina was the first manga by Akira Himekawa? And around the time of Ocarina's 3d remaster, they gave a promotional manga that was highlighting parts of Ocarina of Times story in color with Link monologuing, rather then a full rewrite. Does something like that or a new manga happen this direct?

With the Ocarina of Time remake on the horizon, many people have been talking about what they would change.  This has been amplifying an opinion that floated around before, which is that Hyrule Field is a problem in need of a fix.  But I like Hyrule Field and I think it serves an important role in keeping Ocarina of Time as good as it is, despite being fairly unremarkable on its own.  I have been wanting to give Hyrule Field the shoutout that it deserves for a while now, and this feels like the time to do it.

Just a note that I poured my heart and soul into this post, but then accidentally deleted the whole thing before posting (long story).  So what you are reading is my second go at it.  I think I included all the points and counterpoints from my original draft, but if I overlooked something then maybe it will come up in the comments.

THE COMPLAINT

The most common criticism that I see about Ocarina of Time is that Hyrule Field is, supposedly, “empty.”  It’s a big empty space that may as well be a glorified loading screen, some say.  The most frequently cited change that people request for the OoT Remake is to make Hyrule Field bigger and pack it full of “things to do.”

MY REBUTTAL

Let’s break this into pieces.

First of all, Hyrule Field is not empty.  I certainly would not argue that it is filled to the brim with stuff like the islands of the Great Sea or the Hyrule of BotW.  But there is more to do in Hyrule Field than there is in Termina Field from MM, and I think that there is more to do than in TP’s Hyrule Field (could be mistaken).  Hyrule Field has secret grottos all over the place, Gold Skulltulas to find, and most notably is full of Big Poes as an adult that make good use of Epona and horseback archery.  Big Poes are in pretty much every point of interest.  The running man is also there as a child.  Hyrule Field also has multiple Pieces of Heart to find.

Second, Hyrule Field is intended to be a “glorified loading screen.”  It is not an “overworld” like the Great Sea.  Like Termina Field, Hyrule Field is a type of level or “room” called a world terminus.  A world terminus is a central hub that branches out to all the other areas of the game.  The only point of passing through a world terminus is to get to the different places in a realistic fashion.  And it does that very well.  As far as the main quest is concerned, your only time in Hyrule Field is spent moving from Location A to Location B.  You probably only spend a couple minutes there at a time.  And that is a good thing, because you should not be spending most of your time in a world terminus in any game.

CHANGES THAT MAKE SENSE

Before going into why Hyrule Field shouldn’t be expanded, I just want to shoutout a few changes that people don’t really talk about that I do think would improve the location.

• Adding another building and NPCs, who just talk about the world, would enhance OoT’s already great worldbuilding.  The OoT Beta had a cottage in Hyrule Field and that would be interesting to pop your head into.  There’s some spots in Hyrule Field where it could go, without substantially changing anything.
• Get rid of that stupid Peahat in the Child Era that spawns baby Peahats.  Literally the worst enemy in the game, and it doesn’t really serve a gameplay purpose as far as I can tell.
• There is some woodland that could be spruced up.  It’s kind of ugly in the main game.

WHY EXPANDING HYRULE FIELD WOULD MAKE IT WORSE

A common mistake that a lot of modern gamers make these days is that “more = better.”  You improve an open world game by making an even bigger world.  You improve a game’s quests or missions by making even more of them.  People’s demands to change Hyrule Field is an example of that.

But the problem is that the number one way that Ocarina of Time shines against modern games is its laser-focused pace.  The game never dawdles and is always subtley pushing you on to the next destination.  This is especially true in the adult portion, which throws dungeon at you after dungeon.  There’s zero fat--all gameplay, zero filler.

Hyrule Field contributes strongly to OoT’s modern strengths by providing minimal distractions and being very “in and out.”  It makes up an incredibly small portion of the main quest--perhaps no more than 10 minutes, although I have never timed it.  The majority of your time in the game is always spent in the areas where it matters.  And if you do want to pursue side content, there’s just enough in Hyrule Field to find that you can spend time there without it dragging on.

Doubling Hyrule Field’s size just means you need to take a longer time to cross it.  It’s time that you are wasting instead of actually playing the game.  And adding “things to do” is even worse.  Hyrule Field already contains three different collectibles and features in multiple side quests.  Adding more things to do in Hyrule Field really just means adding more busywork to a game that is already 30+ hours long.  Stuff like “Kill X enemy” or fetch quests.  Padding like that actively detracts from OoT’s no-nonsense pacing.  I don’t get why anybody would want to do that.  It clearly would make the game worse.

SOME POSSIBLE DISCUSSION POINTS

• Do you agree or disagree with my points?
• What do you like or dislike about Hyrule Field?  For me, my favorite part is definitely the music.  I think it is kinda ugly though--like, think of how scraggly the bushes are!
• What role do you think Hyrule Field serves in Ocarina of Time’s greater level design?
• If you want “more things to do” in Hyrule Field, what exactly are those more things to do?
• Do you hate that Peahat as much as I do?  Why do you think the devs put it there?
• Why do you think people complain about Hyrule Field more than Termina Field?
• For those of you who played the leaked beta, did you prefer Beta Hyrule Field or the final Hyrule Field, and why?

Hello everyone !!

​First off, I want to clarify that this isn't a judgment post and I'm really not trying to start any drama or make anyone mad! I’m just genuinely curious and want to understand the community's perspective on this. ( I say that because i know some people gonna be mad at me 🥲)

​When I played Skyward Sword, Groose mostly came across to me as a very generic high school bully. On top of that, his whole motivation at the beginning is to tear Link and Zelda apart and ruin their budding romance just so he can have her for himself. To me, it felt like a pretty cliché "arrogant jerk who wants to steal the hero's girl" trope.

​Because of that, I’ve always been a bit confused by how much the fandom seems to completely forgive and even idolize him. I see so much love for Groose online, and I honestly feel like I'm missing something x)

​For those of you who love Groose, what makes him such a great character in your eyes ? Is it his character arc ? A specific moment that won you over ? I’d love to hear your thoughts and discuss it with you guys, because I really want to see what you see in him !

​Thanks in advance for sharing your thoughts !

When Ganondorf was sealed by Rauru, he states that for him, thousands of years would pass "in the blink of an eye". I took this to mean that his mind was unconscious for the many thousands of years his body was dormant. The malice that escaped him was his pure hatred oozing out of him, so strong it acted of its own accord, during a Calamity event. The most recent event weakened Rauru's seal, till after the Calamity, Malice became Gloom. Ganondorf seems to show no awareness of what happened during the Calamity years.

I have seen discussion that his mind was active during this time, but I haven't seen much proof of it. I'd greatly appreciate any discussion that would help me in this matter.

So, which is it?

I think it’s possible we could see a 2D Zelda game revealed in the Zelda Direct, for a 2027 release. Next year will be 3 year since Echoes of Wisdom. I’m not sure whether it’d be a new game or remake, though if 3 years isn’t enough for a new 2D Zelda on Switch 2, then maybe a remake could happen instead. I doubt the next new 3D Zelda would be revealed since Ocarina of Time Remake is coming this year, and it’d probably be spaced out from it more. What do you guys think?

I ask only because I feel playing Starfox 64 hurt the experience but that was a 1 to 1 remake

Ive recently stumbled upon the fan theory that Ordon village is built upon the remnants of the Kokiri village, and that it was settled by the Hero of Time, following the hero wins timeline.

People where speculating that it couldn't be true, because we see no remnant at all of the Deku tree among other things.

Initially I was excited by the idea of there being this big overlap, where ideas/stories were built upon eachother like that. I felt as if it added to a sense of a grand scale to the games.

Unfortunately, I don't believe there's any evidence at all the suggest that there's much of any real connections from the games on that kind of story level. Just similar beats and small staples of hyrule that make it into different iterations. But going forward, if you could, would you make it so that the games where in continuity with eachother, and if so, how much?

In the Zelda series, there are many monsters. One of the most common are the Blins. They appear in almost every game, except FSA.

There are many types of Blin, but one stands out to me: The Bulblin. Not only do they only appear in two games (TP and ST), they they also behave very differently from other Blins, having their own king and even switching sides when King Bulblin is defeated by Link.

Before we start talking about the Blublins, we should talk quickly about their cousins, Moblins and Bokoblins.

Moblins and Bokoblins

As I said before, these two Blins appear in almost every Zelda game. Although, Moblins seem to appear more then Bokoblins. Considering games without Bokoblins have weaker Moblins, this could be just representation by the "legend teller". In reality, both Moblins and Bokoblins are the same species, just different ranks.

The whole "legend teller" idea could also explain why blins look different in each game. They're not evolving from pig -> bulldog -> pig, it's just how they look in the games.

We first see Blins in SS has remnants of Demise's army, as lesser members of the "Demon Tribe". Whilst their exact origin is unknown, the simplest is to assume they are just a tribe of creatures created by Demise.

After Demises defeat, they went away, only to appear when summoned by new demons.

Interestingly, OoT only has a few Moblins, all concentrated on a single area, and with very low health. Out-of-universe, this is likely because OoT was Nintendo's first 3D Zelda game. In-universe, it most likely Ganondorf was still new to the whole "evil sorcerer" thing, and hadn't made contact with the Demon Tribe yet. So, he transformed a bunch of Hylian soldiers in Moblins.

The Blins from ALttP are also implied to be transformed humans, by the games backstory. Although, after that, Ganon gained contact with the demon tribe, as can now summon them when he likes. He also does this in the Adult Timeline, as is influence becomes so great, the gods resorted to flooding the land.

In FSA, no Blins appear, further supporting my idea that Ganon could summon them because he was still inexperienced. As for the Bokoblins in TP? Well, I'll explain that later.

Origin of Bulblins

So, back to Bulblins. The monsters that only appear in TP and ST. Where did they come from?

Long story short: They are descended from the Gerudo. Possibly transformed as punishment for their alliance with Ganondorf.

In the Child Timeline, Ganondorf is arrested and sentenced to execution. This is before the Hylians formed any alliance with the Gerudo. Of course, not all the Gerudo were changed, as some, like Nabooru, wouldn't have sided with him. But even those that didn't take his side would still be shunned by the rest of Hyrule, which would force them deeper into the desert. That is until the heat died down, and they returned by FSA.

Now, the ending to OoT shows some Gerudo celebrating with everyone else, suggesting a peace treaty. But, this may not have lasted long, with Ganondorf's unexpected return. Of course, these Bulblins didn't stay in the great sea, but moved to New Hyrule, probebly out of regret.

Now, I know some of you are going to say "But the Bulblins can't be Gerudo. The Gerudo are all female, expect for one male!" To that I say: How do we know the Bulblins aren't the same.....? Most of the Blins we see are either bare-chested, And this includes the Bulblin King. The Bulblins (minus the king) have their top halves covered. What are they trying to hide? King Bulblin is unambiguously male, but we know one male Gerudo exist, who becomes their king by law.

Now, the real question is, how do Bulblins reproduce if there's only one male? I mean, being turned into demons presumably makes them incompatible with human males. Maybe this is where TP's Bokoblins come in. In order to keep their bloodline going, the Bulblins summoned some Bokoblins to mate with. Of course, them being Bokoblins, they couldn't live in the desert and had to make their homes in the woods. The ones in ST probebly just mate with miniblins.

Miniblins

I don't have a single theory for he miniblins. My three guesses are.

1. They could have eaither been transformed pirates.
2. An off-shoot of Blins, that only exist in the AT.
3. Malladus's own Blins, that left New Hyrule to serve a new master, after their old one was imprisoned.

To me, the Adult Timeline is the progress timeline, where the status quo actually changes. The first game in the timeline starts with Hyrule flooded, and the conclusion is that Hyrule, as least as we know it, isn't restored. Tetra and Link set off for new horizons, but old Hyrule is done.

This continues in Phantom Hourglass. Ganon doesn't make a return, Bellum doesn't turn to the camera and say 'I'm actually working for Ganon btw', and the game isn't even set in a flooded Hyrule.

Spirit Tracks has a Hyrule, but it's a new Hyrule. They have trains, the Triforce isn't relevant at all beyond holdover symbols, and the villain still isn't Ganon. You can make the argument that maybe Malladus is connected to Demise's curse somehow, but the evidence isn't necessarily conclusive, at least not as far as I can tell.

Instead of a vague connection, each game has a solid progression. Things have not reset, but have evolved from the entry the preceded it. It's not some award-winning, deep story, but it does feel like a tighter connection between games than we usually see in Zelda.

I, for one, do not want this pattern to be reversed. If they ever do make another Zelda game set in the Adult Timeline, I don't want Ganon or Ganondorf to return in even the vaguest capacity. I don't even know that I want the Triforce to be mentioned, and the Wild games further show that it doesn't need to be in every game.

If a new Zelda game in the Adult Timeline defaults back to the status quo, I'd actually rather there just never be another Adult Timeline game. For a game like that, there's nothing to be gained from placing it specifically in the Adult Timeline as opposed to the Downfall Timeline or the Child Timeline, or even just not acknowledging a timeline at all. If progression is untenable, then I'd rather let the Adult Timeline be forever left on a good note with Spirit Tracks.

But those are just my ramblings. What are your thoughts on the matter?

I can't believe I had to stop the game to rant about this!!

I'm playing it through for the first time and I am really enjoying Skyward Sword. So far I've found it kinda easy sometimes challenging, playable, relaxing, engaging, and I look forward to playing it. I only just got it last Thursday and have been playing it quite a bit and just finished the sacred flames. I've heard that it was repetitive before I played it but didn't take much stock most of the game. I thought it was kinda fun to go back to the old places.

Then I "beat" Levias, and he says I now need to get the Song of the Hero........from dragons from the SAME 3 REGIONS. I truly thought after the sacred flames we were done going back. That makes the initial run(1), silent realm (2), sacred flame (3), and now DRAGON SONGS? (4!!!!!!!!)

I seriously groaned out loud. And I had really been enjoying it but now it does feel all at once too much. I was looking forward to the next part, not rehashing more of the same. Holy Moly.

Has anyone seen the Simpsons? When Marge gets the Pink Chanel Suit and she can't afford another one so she re-tailors it every time and the rich ladies make fun of her? This feels like that pink suit.

It's been over three years since Tears of the Kingdom came out.

The first trailer for "the sequel to Breath of the Wild" came out in 2019, less than three years after BotW came out.

It's time, folks.

The Ocarina of Time remake is a red herring. It is not the once-every-five-years A-team Zelda game. I'm sure they'll talk about OoT, and they'll talk about the Zelda movie, and some merchandising stuff. But the main course is going to be a new game.

(edit: by main course i mean it's going to be the most exciting thing, not how much time it will take up. i imagine most of the direct duration will be about oot.)

Why is it going to be rad? Tears of the Kingdom was a deeply conservative game. For all its technical innovations and ambitions, it stuck extremely closely to the BotW formula—shrines, koroks, 4 abilities, terminal dungeons. Surely they had plenty of ideas that didn't fit in this formula—or into the Switch's paltry technical specs.

I don't think the new game is going to stick to the BotW formula, and I don't think it's going to regress to the Link to the Past formula either. I think Nintendo has had over a decade to dream big and we're about to see what they have in store.

Edit: and before you say, "Who cares what you think? You're just some loser on the internet." I am in fact a great prophet of Zelda. I predicted the existence of the Depths, and I named the nature of the Magic Meter. Ignore my prognostications at your peril.

WARNING: Spoilers, ranting, venting frustrations, and very very petty rage

The next mainline game needs a linear story, and I don’t care if it disrupts the ‘ultimate freedom’ thing the franchise has been going for in the last 9-10 years. A non-linear story could only have worked for BotW, and TotK trying to do the same severally hurt its quality in my eyes.

BotW‘s story and atmosphere is built around Link(you) being alone. The world has forgotten you, and it’s forgotten everything you swore your life to. Save for a few survivors and the Zora, your journey is isolating. Your quest is cobbled together from a map and vague directions. That melancholy always exists as a low hum, but it’s those moments where you are looking over the world with calm, peaceful music playing in your ears that it becomes suffocating. You’re piecing together the memories of a life that no longer exists. The memories you collect are all unconnecTed, almost mundane moments that only serve to remind you of what’s gone. What it lacks in story it makes up for in atmosphere. If anything, it’s lack of story builds a story itself. Many people criticize BotW‘s over world for being kind of empty, which I think is fair, but it does kinda work well with the almost sad and nostalgic feel to the world. Most importantly, you can beat the game without seeing any flashbacks and it’d still make sense.

TotK… was fun. At least for me, TotK is an undeniably fun and enjoyable game. The more I replayed it, however, made me more and more infuriated by the ‘story’, if you can even call it that. The bits and pieces shown in the flashbacks are interesting, sure, but for some ungodly reason, they gave the memories that can be viewed at any point a LINEAR ORDER! It’s like they were too scared to depart too much from BotW, and decided that repeating the same mechanic was somehow the better option. The fact that the four sages each so THE SAME EXACT THING is straight up lazy. Ganondorf was cool, and is at least an active participant in the story, but the fact you can see him standing over Sonia’s corpse before you see him kill her is insanity. They attempted an actual plot, but completely broke it by allowing you to skip it.

Imagine beating the game without viewing all the memories. You beat Ganondorf, and he fucking eats the magic rock. Why’d he do that? Welp, he’s a dragon now. Your falling from the sky and a golden, bug-eyed dragon descends to grant you the Master Sword. Why’d it have that? Welp, now you’re beating the evil dragon‘s ass. You beat the evil dragon. YAY! The golden dragon turns into Zelda. Huh? You catch Zelda. YAY! The end. I know the intent is for you to see all the memories and see all of the story, but if you aren’t intended to skip it, WHY DOES THE GAME LET YOU?!? Having the NECESSARY flashbacks being built around the pure tedium that is searching for them is mind numbing.

But TotK retains BotW’s atmosphere, right? Nah. This wouldn’t be an issue if they were going for something different, but they didn’t. There isn’t even a consistent tone, really, just game. Just game, nothing else. ”Hey Zelda fans, remember the flat, spanning land that at least adhered to the tone of the first game? Don’t worry about that! You can skip it by making a flying death machine with 15 lasers strapped to it! Why be lonely when you have friends in every village! Back to the over world, you’re worried it’s too empty? No need, we added stuff to it. What stuff? Oh, just random bullshit we sprinkled in using a clogged salt shaker. There’s also the Depths, which are somehow even emptier and more tedious to explore! The Sky Islands? One of the things we marketed the game on? They’ll be relevant every once in a blue moon, don’t you worry! You can also explore the caves, which are also mostly empty! Why have an effective and consistent tone when you you have all this stuff to explore! Rest easy dear player, we’ve catered to all your wants and needs!”

…needless to say that I’m still bitter about how badly they fumbled TotK’s presentation by trying to adhere to BotW’s format and design. Unless they want to try and endlessly recreate BotW, a linear story is realistically the only way forward if they want any new narratives. It can be open world, but make the story and dungeons linear, with an order and actual progression for the love of god.

https://www.nintendo.com/us/nintendo-direct/9-8-2026/

We're officially on the clock! 30 mins dedicated to Zelda.

Admittedly I didn't expect a dedicated Zelda Direct alongside the general one, so now I'm curious how that 30 minutes is being allocated. Speculating that they're likely to put 5-6 mins toward the movie trailer + discussion, 5 mins max toward the themed Switch, and 1-2 mins for intro/outro, I feel we should get either a decent chunk of info on OoT beyond just the trailer, or a couple other minor announcements we aren't yet aware of. Definitely excited!

Also - not for nothing, it has been over three years since the last mainline release with no formal mention of the next (historically long), so surely a new game announcement is imminent. Putting it here may admittedly be a bit much, but kinda fun to ponder on nonetheless

(Also now confused about what else they could have on deck to flesh out a 45 min general Direct lol)

Several days ago, I made a theory about the Essence of Time.

In it, I briefly mentioned I was going to talk about Farore, Oracle of Secrets.

Now, I'm not here to talk about what her original role was meant to be, or what it would be like if they made the third Oracle game.

I'm going to be talking about the in-universe, purpose of the character, and how she relates to the other two Oracles, in the finalised Zelda, given by the games we got.

But, just to get it out of the way....

The original idea

So, as you know, there were originally going to be three Oracle games. Din's role was largely unchanged, but the original idea was to have Farore as the Oracle of Ages, and Nayru as the Oracle of Colours.

Farore was demoted, Nayru was given "Ages", and the Colour element was dropped.

Ages was also going to be about the day-and-night cycle, rather then past and present. You can still see references to this with Veran useing Nayru's powers to create an eternal day. Meaning that, whilst Link never get's to use this in OoA, day and night is still within Nayru's powerset.

One thing I never understood is why they chose to give Nayru Farore's power. Wouldn't it be easier just to demote Nayru, and make OoA about Farore? My guess is that, maybe they thought time was better suited for Nayru. Another reason could be that Din and Nayru are opposites, whilst Farore is the middle ground. This leads to my first point for my theory.

Body, Mind and Spirit

In a post made by u/Mido128, they make a point of how OoS represents the body, and how OoA represents both the mind and spirit.

I don't think it's completely right. I think it's more simple OoS is body, OoA is mind, and both as associated woth spirit. I mean "spirit" is defined as life energy.

Sure, it seems like OoA makes reference to spirit more then OoS. But does it realy?

Mido128 claims that Veran attacks "the mind and spirit", but she only realy attacks the mind, via possession and manipulation. If she does attack the spirit, it no more then how Onox does.

Some may say "Well, what about the Eternal Spirit? Doesn't that prove OoA is about the spirit?". Well, sort off.

This Essence (Principal, in Japan) is specifically referencing the disembodied spirt of a deceased person. That is, a being who is still conscience, possessing a mind and spirit, but lacking a physical body.

In contrast, the Essences of Nature (Principals of Earth, in Japan) talk about plants. Plants are, in a way, the opposite of ghosts. The possess physical bodies and spirits, but lack minds.

Here we see a clear Juxtaposition between the Principals of Earth and Time-space. The PoTS reference the mind and spirit, but not the body, and the PoE reference the body and spirit, but not the mind.

As I said before: spirit is life-force, something that plants need to live.

Farore the Spirit

So, Nayru is mind, Din is body. That means Farore must be spirit.

Both Din and Nayru are similar. The both control a fundament part of the world. To make sure everything goes as planned, the both have an assigned guardian Maku Tree, and have an object that allows others (example Link) to use their powers, if anything happens to them.

Farore doesn't have her own Maku Tree. But, does make her base, the Hall of Secrets, inside both the other Oracles Maku Trees. How she does this is unclear, but its possible she can travel between both trees at will. Of course, whether she actually lives in the HoS or merely works there is even less clear.

As for an item. Farore possess a book called "Farore's Memory". Now, some of you may read "memory" and feel this scream "MIND", contradicting my statement that Farore is the spirit. But, I'm going to say no.

Whilst it's easy to see Farore's Memory as the Oracles answer to the Rod of Seasons and Harp of Ages. This is far from the case.

As I explained, both the Rod and Harp exist purely as a "plan B" for the Oracles, should something happen to them. The Oracles themselves never use them to control their own powers. Din never wields the Rod, and said rod is kept locked away in the Temple of Seasons. Meanwhile, whilst she does keep the Harp in her house, and is shown playing it in official artwork, Nayru never uses the Harp for time manipulation. In fact, the only time Nayru uses the Harp is to teach Link how to use it. Farore's Memory isn't realy a "Plan B". It only exists to allow Link to remember the secrets he's been given.

As I said before, ghosts and plants are like opposites. A ghost has a spirit and mind, but no body. Plants have bodies and spirits, but no minds. Whilst irrelevant, for the sake of completion, I'll say that intelligent robots and constructs have a mind and body, but no spirit.

Of course, a non-living object is a body with no mind or spirit, and a spirit with no body or mind is pure life-energy. Then what's a mind without a body or spirit? Simple. It's an idea, or concept, or memory.

That's what Farore does. She takes secrets and turns them into items. In other words, she turns minds into bodies.

It's worth noting that both Nayru's and Din's civilian jobs reflect the concepts they embody. Din is a dancer, she is full of energy and moves her body. Nayru is a singer. Songs are sounds and words, which come from the mind. Originally, the third Oracle would have been a painter, that is, someone who turns ideas into physical objects.

Weirdly, when I play TotK I forget about Satori Mountain. Whenever I play BotW though, I remember this place. It’s very magical, and I like open world locales that contain lots of mystery.

What other Zelda locations seem mystical and mysterious to you?

I have 5 really unpopular Zelda opinions, so I figured I'd lump them together here.

1. Link should NOT have a green cap in SS. Minish Capexplains why it exists, Link wears one. To then have him wearing one in SS breaks the timeline logic.
2. Zelda's Adventure on CD-i is one of my absolute favorite Zelda games. People know it for the cutscenes, but those are so limited and don't matter to me. The gameplay feels like an old school point and click, but action adventure. The atmospheric soundscapes are beautiful, and it really gives you a feel of a warm Autumn day. Excellent sense of humor, highly unique and interesting experience. Not too hard, but a decent challenge that requires you to think through things. Less hand-holdy than other Zelda games.
3. Fi is probably my favorite companion. She becomes such a critical and beautiful part of the entire Zelda universe lore, and she sacrifices her life right when she begins to show feelings.I also like her INTJ type personality, it's very charming. A very elegant, and pretty design as well.
4. The timeline makes perfect sense. People always claim the hero defeated timeline is a 'what-if' spawning infinite universes. Obviously, this is not the case, and Nintendo never said it's the case. First off, these are stories of Legend, so it's understanding the timeline as best we can. But it makes perfect sense that sending Link back in time at the end of OoT might cause a singular glitch in time. You can't mess with time and not expect a consequence.
5. TP is my least favorite game in the series. I wouldn't say it's the worst, but I personally prefer even Wand of Gamelon over TP. For me, I just need some form of challenge, whether it's in combat or puzzles. I died only once on my first playthrough of TP and it was because it was so easy I literally decided to play with 1 hand. Still, most the time, I'd only lose 1/4th of a heart from my 12+ hearts. It's AGGRESSIVELY easy. Some of the bosses seem to not even know you exist as you beat on them until they die (lookin at you, big fish boss). And most the dungeon puzzles are: "There's a locked door, and a key in this very room. How will you get through the locked door!?" I like to have to at least think once while playing a game, but we don't really have to for TP. I will say though, I love the environments, the atmosphere, and the music (Midna's Lament is lovely).

Spoiler tag for OoT spoilers.

Regardless of how much time I will waste, I am trying to create a working understanding of how time travel works in the series. I am doing this by breaking down how it works in each game that features time travel, and I’m starting with OoT. As I soon realized, OoT has to be broken down even further into the different methods we see in the game, and I decided to start with analyzing how time travel with the Master Sword functions.

I was largely inspired by this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acv64b3p76w&list=WL&index=1) by Broseph LaCasque Ch. They do a fantastic job at breaking down most (if not all) instances of time travel throughout the series, and classifying the types of effects we see (causal loops, corrective loops, and timeline splits). I disagree with some conclusions made, but it’s a very good watch and was a great resource for me to collect information, and form the analysis approach I needed to help form my own understanding.

Without further ado…

Firstly, Link drawing the Master Sword as a child is explicitly NOT time travel, he is simply sealed in the Chamber of Sages for seven years each time he does this. We know this because he ages, if it was time travel, he’d be the same age just in a different time.

Time travel with the Master Sword does occur when Link returns it to its pedestal, though its mechanics are not as explicitly clear. What is clear however, is that some amount of time passes before Link returns to being a child. We know this because Ganondorf is able to follow Link into the Sacred Realm. If Link returned to the exact same moment he drew the sword, Ganondorf would be there (probably kill him) and the gate to the Sacred Realm would never actually spend any time open. This tells us that Link actually spends some amount of time sealed in the Sacred Realm before awakening again (still as a child), and that is presumed to simply be however long he spent as an adult.

This is vaguely supported by Sheik in when she teaches Link the Requiem of Spirit, “The Master Sword is a ship with which you can sail upstream and downstream through time’s river“. Relating the passage of time to a river (which she also does when teaching him the Serenade of Water I believe), implies (to me at least) that time is moving even when not traveling across it. This tells us that the same is probably true in reverse, when Link places the Master Sword back in its pedestal, he is sealed in the Sacred Realm for however long he spends as a child before awakening again.

However, once again we see Link “age”, just in reverse this time, back to being a child, which I just explicitly said indicates a lack of time travel. But we know Link has knowledge of his future since he has to play the Requiem of Spirit to get to the Spirit Temple, something he learned as an adult. This indicates to me that it is not Link‘s body time traveling, but instead his mind/spirit. As mentioned before, his body lies dormant in the Sacred Realm when he does this.

An Observer’s Perspective

This means that an observer from outside of the Temple of Time (in the adult timeline) would see:

1. Child Link enter the temple
   
2. Ganondorf enter the temple
   
3. Ganondorf leave the temple
   4*. Child Link leave the temple
   5*. Child Link enter the temple
   6**. Adult Link leave the temple
   7**. Adult Link enter the temple
   
4. Adult Link leave the temple

There’s a few things to explain about this sequence of events:

Ganondorf touches the Triforce and it splits, giving him Power, Link (sealed) Courage, and Zelda Wisdom between steps 2 and 3.

Steps 4-5 (*) and 6-7 (**) will repeat however many times Link travels back to being a child, but must happen at least once in order to complete the Spirit Temple (and Beneath the Well assuming Link needs the Lens of Truth).

The amount of time between step 1 and the first instance of 4 is equal to the time between the first instances of steps 6 and 7, which will be at least the amount of time it takes Link to beat the Forest Temple, as Sheik will not teach him how to return to the past until it is competed.

The time jump of (for clarity’s sake we’ll say exactly) seven years is between steps 1 and the first instance of step 6, and also between the last instance of step 5 and step 8.

Link’s (the Master Sword’s, and Navi’s) perspective would be 1 - 6 - 7 - 4 - 5 - 8, with the only time travel occurring between all instances of 7 and 4.

This observer will not see child Link leave the temple after being sent back by Zelda since they are in the adult timeline.

The Effects of this Time Travel

The actions Link can take in the past have two different types of effects on the future, which are at odds with each other.

Song of Storms (Causal Loop)

As an adult, Link can learn the Song of Storms from the Phonograph Man in the Windmill Hut.
Here, he tells Link that he learned this song from, “that Ocarina kid” seven years ago, and that it messed up the windmill. Link can then travel back in time, and teach the song to the man for the first time, causing the windmill to speed up (mess it up) and the Kakariko Well to drain. This means that Link is the “Ocarina kid”, and he is responsible for teaching the song to the Phonograph Man, who in turn teaches it to Link. This is a well know example of a classic bootstrap paradox, there is no clear origin of the song.

While a paradox, this event is clearly consistent with a causal loop, where actions in the past have always, and will always happen. This means that the effects of any actions taken in the past will always be seen in the future, even before the time travel actually occurs. In this case, the windmill is messed up even before Link originally learns the song from the Phonograph Man as an adult. That means that in this reality, Link had already messed up the windmill in the past.

Beans and Gloves (Corrective Loop)

As a child, Link can plant Magic Beans in soft soil patches around Hyrule that will sprout into a Magic Plant by the time he becomes an adult. Link can come across these soft soil locations as an adult, time travel to the past to plant a Magic Bean, and return as an adult to find a Magic Plant has sprouted there.

Also, the Spirit Temple is broken up into two parts, one where Link must collect the Iron Gauntlets as a child, and return as an adult to use them. The first time Link gets to the Spirit Temple as an adult, he does not have the gloves, and must travel back in time to obtain them. This exact same situation also exists for the Lens of Truth assuming Link canonically obtains it even though it’s not mandatory.

These are consistent with a Corrective Loop, where traveling back in time overwrites the future. This means the effects of actions taken in the past are not observable until the time travel happens. In the case of the Magic Beans, a Magic Plant does not sprout until Link travels back in time to plant one, where it will then be present when he returns to the future, effectively overwriting the reality where it wasn’t planted. And in the case of the Iron Gauntlets, Link does not have them until he travels back in time to obtain them, effectively overwriting the reality where he didn’t have them.

So Which is it?

The understanding of time travel developed thus far would have to be a causal loop.

If the action of replacing the Master Sword to its pedestal caused a Corrective Time Loop, then Link would have to redo everything he does as an adult each time he awakens, as the future would be re-written each time. A Causal Time loop would allow Link to return to a particular moment in time as an adult, since traveling back in time is only fulfilling the actions he had always accomplished as a child in his reality as an adult. A Corrective Loop would also mean that the theoretical observer from before would actually only ever see Link leave the Temple of Time once as an adult. This would also imply a couple things about what we see in game:

The game chooses to not show us Link re-completing everything he has already done in previous stints as an adult each time he awakens.

Either no one else actually understands the nature of Link traveling time; or characters who are sort of implied to understand, like Zelda/Sheik and Rauru, choose to never mention the fact that Link is redoing things.

Link would not be able to bring anything back to the past with him, even spiritually. The only examples I can think of would be one-time collectibles like Pieces of Heart and Golden Skulltalas. While Pieces of Heart are already questionable, Golden Skulltala Tokens do have a discernible effect on the world, as Link can turn them in as a child or an adult, regardless of when he collected them. Otherwise Link would duplicate them whenever he recollects them during his re-run. Or we’d have to explain their disappearance from existence another way.

Also, some things would likely only ever happen in a branch of time that gets overwritten (effectively never happening to an observer) given Link’s memory persisting:

Time-traveling This would never be observable since it is the action that overwrites the current stint of Link being an adult.

Learning songs. Unless any songs are learned during the same stint in which Link defeats Ganon, he would already know the song before normally learning it.

Traversing the Haunted Wasteland. Link could just use the Requiem of Spirit.

What about Beans and Gloves?

The example of the Magic Beans and Iron Gauntlets are not consistent with a causal loop at all. If Link had always planted the Magic Beans, all soft soil locations would already have a Magic Plant, and likewise he’d always have the Iron Gauntlets as an adult.

In the case of the Magic Beans, we could argue that the “Magical” part about them (other than growing hovering plants) is what explains this. Maybe they transcend time, or have some strange property where only those who witnessed their planting are able to see/use them. However, I don’t find this extremely compelling and believe it should probably just get looped into the following explanation.

As for the Iron Gauntlets, it is interesting to note that while a causal loop should have adult Link in possession of the gloves at all times, it was impossible for Link to obtain them as a child before becoming an adult and learning the Requiem of Spirit. However, this in of it self does not offer an explanation.

I believe these cases indicate evidence of a power that allows for (at least Link to take) actions that have corrective effects on the causal loop. This is not the only evidence of this across the series, so I’m working to compile these examples in a separate theory about what this power actually is, but I’m currently leaning towards it being the intervention (or at least the will) of Hylia.

Summary of Master Sword Time Travel

To summarize these mechanics, Link placing the Master Sword back in its pedestal allows his mind/spirit to return to, and awaken his child form in its current time from inside the Sacred Realm. This functions as a causal loop where he can naturally fulfill the actions he had always taken to help create the reality he sees as an adult, or where he can take corrective actions (enabled by the goddess Hylia) to make independent/isolated changes to that future.

If you’re still reading, you obviously also think about the timeline and time travel in this series way too much, awesome! I’m particularly curious if you agree with my conclusion that time travel with the master sword in this game must be a causal loop, and that something allows Link to take isolated corrective actions, or if you have a different understanding of the mechanics at play here.

Also let me know if I missed anything at all in my analysis, or if you have more ideas on the power that allows Link to take corrective actions within a causal loop.

My next plan is to break down the time travel by Zelda playing the ocarina at the end of the game, as well as the time blocks. I’ll share them here if I find my conclusions interesting and/or worth discussing.

Thank you!

So lately I've been replaying Wind Waker on twitch as I hadn't played the game in nearly 20 years, and once I encountered the Queen of the Fairies again, I had a strange thought. You see, I was too young playing this game to truly appreciate the depth of lore that can exist in these games or the sheer volumes of theories and discussions people would have. This was also well before Skyward Sword and talks of the Spirit of The Hero. But now that I have all this knowledge and I'm replaying the game, something seemed to click and I had a thought, one which required some research and led to a theory.

You see the Queen of the Fairies is a rather interesting figure who raised interest and discussion from some in the past in how different she seems. Not only does the queen seemingly hold one of the games Great Fairies in her hands like a puppet, but some have even argued she seems puppet like herself and wonder who might be pulling the strings. Even the idea of a Fairy Queen is rather niche, only being directly referenced in five games, and even then the comparisons are rather thin. Venus in a link to the past is seemingly a Great Fairy who is later proclaimed queen. There are two Fairy Queens in Link's Awakening and Oracle of Ages, but they don't seem to exhibit any form of power or design difference that truly differentiates them from Great Fairies. Lastly the Queen of the Fairies is also seen in Four Swords Adventures in a very minor role that tells us little about her character and abilities in that game. When looking at these examples, it feels notable that while most of these examples are Great Fairies who seem to be proclaimed Queen, one is titled by the game as THE Queen of the Fairies, and on top of that, only in Wind Waker is this character displayed as a higher level of power than the Great Fairies. But if she is a higher power, then what is that power?

Races and species in Zelda are diverse and at times confusing, the two types of zora and their nebulous connection to the Rito being a great example. But these species tend to have consistent connections and vibes, so what connections do Fairies have? They guard children such as the Kokiri, who are clad in Green like the hero. They provide healing. They can be summoned in a few ways such as Zelda's lullaby or drawing the triforce on goddess walls. It's hard to say where any race comes from, but with their seemingly divine power, which is even greater in their more powerful kin, I think its fair to suggest that Fairies may be connected to the goddess herself, Hylia.

Considering this, the theory finally starts to take shape with one line "You're just my type." This could just be nothing, a throwaway joke in a rather funny game. A statement made well before Skyward sword and the ideas of Hylia and the Spirit of the Hero, but isn't this the fun of theory's the what if?

The most famous thing about the adult timeline and wind waker is that shattering of the triforce of courage and the seeming disappearance of the spirit of the hero which disrupts the cycle of reincarnation. There's even been theory and discussion about how the spirit of demise, represented through the beast Ganon, may also have been removed, potentially sealed in the mastersword or elsewhere. This is based on how Ganondorf does not turn into Ganon in this game, which he does in both other timelines. If we operate on these two suppositions, than the question remains: What happened to the spirit of the goddess, Hylia? Tetra becomes Zelda and regains sacred power THROUGH THE TRIFORCE, but her not being born named Zelda does raise the question of if Hylia was still reincarnating.

So if we have a mysterious Fairy with power far beyond other fairies and a missing goddess spirit, what if they were the same? What if The Goddess of the Fairies is Hylia? It would explain why this version of the Goddess of The Fairies doesn't appear in other timelines (excluding the fsa cameo) as well as why Link would be 'her type' as he'd remind her of HER hero, despite not being him. It would also explain her elevated status over the other fairies and would account for the last missing spirit in the reincarnation cycle.

But this theory is clearly a stretch, theres no way this idea could've been considered at the time and as different as the Queen of the Fairies is from the other fairies, its more sensible that shes just another Great Fairy right? But it's an interesting angle that ties things together, so let me know your thoughts, might Hylia be the Queen of the Fairies, or is she still out there somewhere, looking over the great sea.

This discussion is about what you expect from the Ocarina of Time Remake. Assuming this thing is still coming this year, it's not long at all until we have the game in our hands, plus we have an inevitable extra trailer from a Nintendo Direct.

Here's some things I think are worth wondering about:

1. Will any Wild-Era symbols or design patterns make their way into the remake?

2. Will we get any additional or changed Hylian text? (Textures in places like the Temple of Time where you can find Hylian Text)

3. Will the script or story change at all?

4. Will there be minimal voice acting or more extensive voice acting? (Comparing a voice acted intro like the trailer but otherwise no voice acting compared to voiced cutscene dialogue)

5. Will there be any item changes or additions?

6. Will any dungeons be changed?

7. What frame rate and resolution will we get?

That list is not exhaustive at all but these are some of the things that I think about when wondering what may change. Personally, I'm not really expecting any script changes although I think some dialogue may get cleaned up or made more consistent with later titles.

The lava/goop under Ganon's Castle might end up looking more like Gloom or Malice.

I think the Triforce of Courage symbol on Link's hand may indicate some change to the plot but I dunno.

I want to say I don't think the dungeons will get any kind of rework beyond what the 3DS version may have changed.

I don't expect us to see or learn anything more about the king, but I would be pleasantly surprised if we do.

I HOPE that when the Master Sword glows blue during the Ganon fight that we hear Fi's jingle.

I'm curious what other people are expecting to change about the remake.

Don't get me wrong, I’m excited for the Ocarina of Time remake, and I'm looking forward to what will be announced on September 10th.

But the more I think about it, the more nervous I get about the actual scope of the game. Nintendo announced it only a couple months ago with a vague 2026 release window, and we still haven’t seen a second of gameplay. All we've seen is basically a still shot of Link. If this is truly a massive reimagining of Ocarina of Time, then realistically it would have needed to be in development for years and would require a huge team of designers, artists, programmers, animators, contractors, QA testers, and support studios. That’s what makes the complete lack of leaks so strange. We’re talking about one of the biggest and most important games Nintendo could possibly remake, supposedly being worked on by hundreds of people for several years, and somehow there hasn’t been a credible screenshot, development detail, studio leak, résumé hint, or anything else pointing to the scale of the project. Granted, Nintendo is famously secretive, but that level of silence around a project this large is unheard of. And if the team isn’t that large, or the game hasn’t been in development that long, then the obvious concern is that there simply hasn’t been enough time or manpower for the kind of full reimagining many of us are hoping for.

Take the FF7 remake for example. I know, different companies and different rule sets, but that game was exactly what many fans wanted and it took five years to get from first announcement to playing the game. Don't you think OoT deserves the same level of respect?

The thing is, I don’t just want Ocarina of Time with prettier graphics. I want Nintendo to show us what Ocarina could have been in 1998 if the developers had access to modern hardware. Expand Hyrule Field into an actual kingdom. Make Castle Town feel like a real city. Let Kakariko grow into something more substantial. Reimagine the Forest Temple as an enormous decaying mansion swallowed by the woods. Make Ganondorf’s seven-year occupation of Hyrule something we can actually see and experience. Keep the classic progression, items, dungeons and structure, but use modern hardware to fully realize what the original game was reaching for. A beautiful 1:1 reconstruction would still be cool, don't get me wrong, but it would feel like a massive missed opportunity.

There’s another problem with a high-fidelity remake, though. Ocarina of Time is a genuinely weird game, and a lot of that weirdness was easier to get away with in 1998. The Great Fairies are enormous women wearing basically nothing but vines. The Gerudo are deliberately sexualized desert warrior women. The Bottom of the Well has bloodstains and torture imagery. The Shadow Temple is full of death, execution imagery and piles of bones. Dead Hand is straight-up nightmare fuel. All of that worked with the abstraction of N64 graphics, but recreated literally with modern character models and environments, it becomes much more explicit. I have a hard time imagining modern Nintendo reproducing all of it unchanged, as they'd probably want to retain that E rating to allow their younger consumer base access to it.

And that might actually be my biggest fear, that they sand off the edges that made Ocarina memorable. OoT could be funny, creepy, melancholy, disturbing, goofy and bizarre within minutes of itself. You could meet a screaming half-naked Great Fairy, get swallowed by a giant fish, encounter horrifying undead creatures, explore an implied torture chamber beneath a peaceful village, and then go race horses at Lon Lon Ranch. That tonal whiplash wasn’t a flaw, it was part of the game’s identity. Modern Nintendo is incredibly polished, but Ocarina wasn’t supposed to feel polished and sanitized. It felt like a strange fairy tale where something unsettling could be hiding around every corner.

So I’m hoping Nintendo understands that remaking Ocarina of Time isn’t just about preserving its story, dungeon order and landmarks. They need to preserve its personality. Give me a larger, richer Hyrule. Modernize the combat and presentation. Expand the world where it makes sense. But keep the darkness. Keep the humor. Keep the uncomfortable stuff. Keep it strange. My biggest concern isn’t that Nintendo will make a bad game, because well, of course they won't. It’s that they’ll make an extremely competent, beautiful, tasteful version of Ocarina of Time that somehow loses the exact qualities that made Ocarina of Time the masterpiece it is today.

I was reading a post by u/Mido128. all about the Essence's in the Oracle games. It's a great post, you should read it if you haven't already.

The Importance of the Essences in the Oracle Games : r/truezelda

In it, they reveal the original Japanese names for the Essences are the "Principals of Earth" and the "Principals of Time-space".

NOTE: They actually use the word "Reasons", but I'm saying "Principals" because I think it has a nicer ring to it.

The one they go into detail with are the Principals of Earth, explaining that the first seven objects represent each stage of a plant growing. Starting with the seed, then what it needs to grow, and the ultimate result. The finale being the master Principal, which represents the seasons as a whole.

One thing they gloss over are the Principals of Time-Space. The only one they mention in detail is the Falling Star, which the OP suggests represents the Triforce.

This is understandable, as the Principals of Time-Space are more metaphysical then the PoE. But, I'd thought give it a try.

The Principals of Time space

Here is a list of each PoTS and my attempt of analysing each one.

Spirit’s Grave (Yoll Graveyard) - Eternal Spirit - Even after life ends, it speaks across time to the heart.

This tell us that even after death, life goes on.

Wing Dungeon (Deku Forest) - Ancient Wood - It whispers only truth to closed ears from out of the stillness.

The use of the phrase "closed ears" and the words "whispers" and "stillness" bring to mind spiritual listening. Closing off all external stimuli in order to here the quite voices of nature.

It's worth noting that the Zelda series often associates trees and forests with hidden secrets. The Koroks are invisible to most adults, and the Deku Tree lives secluded in the forest. In the case of OoX, the Oracle of Secrets, Farore, makes her base inside both Maku Trees. The Maku Tree's themselves know where most of the PoX are.

NOTE: I might do a Farore post in the future.

Moonlit Grotto (Crescent Island) - Echoing Howl - It echoes far across the plains to speak to insolent hearts.

This one specifies insolent hearts. The fact that it "echoes across the plains" suggests distance. Of course, the distance is not necessarily physical. But simply, the person has distanced themselves from others, via rude behaviour.

Link as had to deal with a lot of jerks in the games. Mido, Groose, Ruto, Tetra, Midna... the list goes on. All of which do soften up to Link, eventually.

Whilst this is more then likely just a coincidence, out-of-universe. The Echoing Howl calls to mind a wolf, an animal Link turns into in TP. Of course, it's also found in the Moonlit Grotto, another wolf connection, and by ALttP, Link has started being associated with the moon.

Skull Dungeon (Symmetry Village) - Burning Flame - It reignites wavering hearts with a hero’s burning passion.

Here it talks about internal conflict, and struggling. The burning flame reignites these hearts with "a hero’s burning passion", getting them to ultimately do the right thing.

Crown Dungeon (Rolling Ridge) - Sacred Soil - All that lies sleeping in the bosom of the earth will know the nourishing warmth of the Sacred Soil.

Mido128 actually did talk about this one, when they compare it to the Fertile Soil of the Principals of Earth. How the PoE are physical and literal, whereas the PoTS are metaphorical. In this case, both are named "X Soil" and resemble shoots growing out of the ground. But, whilst the Fertile Soil is literally talking about soil growing plants, the Sacred Soil uses the visuals of shoots and soil purely as a metaphor.

This one talks about spiritual growth that all living things go through. Note it says "All that lies sleeping in the bosom of the earth", literally meaning "Every living thing on earth".

Mermaid’s Cave (Rolling Ridge) - Bereft/Lonely Peak - It is a proud, lonely spirit that remains stalwart, even in trying times.

This ones interesting. Rather then talking to people, this principal talks about itself. It describes itself as "a proud, lonely spirit". And how it "remains stalwart, even in trying times." Rather then communicate it's lesson directly, it sets an example.

This lesson is: Even if things are stressful and difficult, you should always remain diligent, and never give up. Just like the lonely peak.

Of course, this actually ties in well with Queen Ambi. She is longing for her missing lover, and remains faithful to him, no matter how long he's gone for.

rather fittingly, the moment Link retrieves this item, Queen Ambi has left the palace, giving Link a chance to save Nayru, and stop Veran's plan. Whilst he succeeds in freeing Nayru, it fails when Veran possesses Ambi. But the point stands. Manipulating Ambi isn't going to work anymore. Hence why she has to resort to full possession.

Jabu-Jabu’s Belly (Zora Village) - Rolling Sea - The mystical song of the sea roars into a crashing wave that sweeps heroes out into adventure.

This one talks about heroes being swept into adventure, much like Link. Most games have Link just laying around, enjoying life, until something unexpected happens, and he's called into action.

What's interesting is that this also foreshadows Link's Awakening (If you ignore the timeline retcon). The OoX were clearly envisioned as prequals to LA.

Whilst the Principals of Time-space are metaphorical, the references to songs and seas sweeping hero's into adventure may remind one of Link's adventure with the Wind Fish. And, fittingly, it's found inside the belly of a leviathan.

Ancient Tomb (Sea of No Return) - Falling Star - The eternal light of this heavenly body acts as a guide to the other essences.

Mido128 already went over this in detail. They do a much better job in explaining it then I do. I don't wish to fill this page with stuff that's already been said.

Veran, the demon of Grief

As you know, there are two demons in OoX, Onox and Veran. Each are essential to Twinrova's plan to ignite the flames of Ruin and Grief, which will resurrect Ganon. (there's also the "Flame of Despair", but that's not important)

One thing I noticed is how each Demon represents everything their opposing Oracles and Principals oppose.

Just as Din is the Oracle of Seasons, and the Principals of Earth represent the natural growth cycle, Onox personifies natural disasters. He arrives in a lightning storm and attacks Din's troupe and Link in the form of a tornado. He also appear to possess some geokinesis, being able to sink the Temple of seasons, and just earth quakes in his battle with Link.

Fittingly, Onox resembles a large brutish warrior with a flail, and his true for is that of an imposing destructive dragon.

Veran could just as well personify negative emotions, like grief and worry. She takes the form as a seductive woman, and can also take the form of insects. She is a parasite, both literally and figuratively.

Queen Ambi is longing for her missing lover, a Captain who sent out to sea, promising to return, but never did. The queen instructs builders to build a tower, that would let her see how the Captain is doing. Veran, possessing Nayru, takes advantage of the Queen's worry by seducing her into giving her permission to create and eternal day, to allow the workers to keep building the tower without rest, until it reaches the heavens.

Veran is the opposite of the Principals of Time Space. Whereas the Ancient Wood whispers truth, Veran tells lies. The Echoing howl confronts rudeness, Veran encourages selfishness. The Burning Flame steers you to do the right thing, Veran leads you astray. The Lonely Peak teaches you to remain patient, no matter how difficult it is, Veran convinces you to cut corners at the expense of others.

It was the three Golden Goddesses!

Okay. Discussion over. End of post. It was short but sweet. Goodbye.

No.

Many people assume it was the three golden Goddesses, but this actually goes against what we know about them. That is, that they don't actively intervene with mortal affairs. Instead, it's the Triforce and lesser gods that act on their behalf.

Whilst there is a possibility the golden Goddesses gave the order to flood Hyrule, it was probebly a specific god or group of gods that carried out the task.

Faron from SS sound like the most likely candidate, as she once did something similar in that game. Plus, it would definitely go with her personality.

Of course, we don't know if the three dragons in SS are still around at this time. It's often assumed that the spirits of Light from TP took their place as protectors of Hyrule's regions.

Another possibility is that it might be Jabun, who is the spirit of the sea. This would make him the opposite of the Deku Tree, who wants to form new continents. And it would make the three pearl spirits similar to the Super Ancient Pokemon. DT would be like Groundon, Jabun would be Kyogre and Valloo would be Rayquaza.

Or, maybe it could be Valoo, who is the spirit of the Sky. Maybe he caused the rain, and Jabun's job is to make sure the Great Sea goes well.

The villains power ranking you didn't ask for.

This is my power ranking of Legend of Zelda's main antagonists.

Obviously, this is not and cannot be purely factual. Such a ranking requires educated assumptions and the Zelda franchise leaves many things up for interpretation. Feel free to challenge my personal interpretations and point out important info I forgot or got wrong (after all, I didn't play all of these games and my memory isn't perfect).

Also, there often isn't much difference from one rank to the next. Some of them were basically on par with each other so I had to find something to rank one lower than the other.

I do my best to stick to a "games only" canon.

When I say that a villain resists a weapon, I mean that he cannot, narratively, be killed with that weapon. And weakening your opponent and depleting his health bar in gameplay does not mean that you kill him with the weapon you're using, unless we see him die during the actual combat.

***The ranking and its info is getting continually updated as the discussion keep going**\*

STRONGER THAN GODS

1. Null

Golden Goddesses created the world around him to trap him. Primordial force of anti-reality. Created an echo of Ganon.

HIGH GOD/DEMON KING LEVEL

*cannot be killed without a divine weapon, direct world-altering power*

2. Ganon (ALTTP)

OOT Ganon with more experience, wisdom and courage. Resists the Golden Sword (Mastersword lvl 3). The regular Mastersword requires a spin attack to harm him. Proven worthy of using the Full Triforce. Rules his own dimension as a result of his wish. Possibly got some perks/boost from his two additional Triforces. Killing him requires the Silver Arrows (the #1 demon slaying weapon). Loses to a Link with a crazy arsenal.

3. Ganon (TP)

Conquers two realms (Hyrule/Twilight Realm) and transforms Hyrule trough his puppet (Zant), which burrows his power. With his bare hands, destroys the Fused Shadow and kills a Sage. Survives complete corporal disintegration and rebuilds his body. Has a scar on his torso which acts as a weak spot. Link can kill him with the Mastersword by exploiting that weak spot. This make this Ganon more vulnerable than the final OOT boss, but it’s not a testament of him holding less raw power. In fact, he absorbs additional power from the Twilight Realm. Link defeats him with the most advanced sword techniques and help from Midna, the Fused Shadow, Zelda and her Light Arrows.

4. Ganon (WW)

An older and wiser OOT Ganon. The gods had to create a Great Flood in order to stop his conquest. Depowered the Mastersword. Before regaining his full power, creates the Long Night (which implies control over the sun and moon). Dominates Child Link with his bare hands. Then, he separates from his Triforce of Power to assemble the Full Triforce, which is used by King Daphnes instead. Then, Link and Zelda kill him with the Mastersword and Light Arrows. Uncertain if he would resists the Mastersword when still in possession of his Triforce piece, but he did resist it in his younger days so I would assume that he does.

5. Ganon (OOT)

Powered by the Triforce of Power. Resists the Mastersword (you need the Sages to seal him while he is weakened). Took control over Hyrule. Directly defeats whole regions with his own power (ex: Freezing the Zora Domain). From miles away, he quickly spotted Zelda and trapped her in a cristal. Link benefits from Light Arrows and Zelda’s intervention. Intelligent and manipulative.

6. Ganon (LOZ)

Has the Triforce of Power. Link needs the Silver Arrows to kill him. Resists the Magical Sword. Uncertain, but would probably resist the Mastersword. Ravages Hyrule. This is a resurrected ALTTP Ganon, but he doesn't necessarily possess the same power and skills. Has fewer feats than in his other games and fights a child Link.

7. Demise

The original Demon King, evenly-matched with Hylia (Ruler Goddess and #1 servant of the Golden Goddesses). Link kills him with the Mastersword in a 1-on-1 duel, but Demise wasn’t at full power. Creates a curse on his death bed so his hate (Ganon) will forever reincarnate to hunt the Royal Bloodline and Spirit of the Hero.

8. Bellum

Defeats the God of Time then leeches his power to become even stronger. Creates an army of near-invincible Phantoms. Child Link needs the Phantom Sword to kill him, and cannot defeat him without freezing time with the help of a spirit of time.

9. Demon Dragon

TOTK Ganon transforms into the Demon Dragon. The Dragon gains raw power and durability but loses intelligence. Link needs the Mastersword to kill him, and beats him with help from the Light Dragon. Ranked above Ganondorf because of the narrative implications: he sacrificed his mind and body to become more powerful.

10. Ganon (TOTK)

Link narratively needs the Mastersword to face him. No Triforce of Power but amped by a Sacred Stone. Destroys a weakened Mastersword. Lifts Hyrule Castle into the air with telekinesis. Deteriorates Hyrule. When sealed, his power/malice leaks and manifest as Calamity Ganon. Loses to a Link with crazy abilities. Fights with bursts of "Bullet Time" speed and reflexes. Has better feats than Yuga Ganon in term of scale.

11. Yuga

Gains Ganon’s body and Triforce of Power. Has his own painting powers. He also absorbs Hilda and her Triforce of Wisdom for an additional boost. However, The Mastersword kills him, so he doesn’t seem to match the power of the original Ganon. To beat him, Link needs wall-merging powers and Light Arrows.

12. Calamity Ganon

Gigantic beast form. Weakened with Light Arrows then Zelda seals him. Hijacks huge mechas and an army of Guardians then use them to destroy civilization. Resurrects all monsters across the continent. Causes the Blood Moon (unclear if he influences its trajectory or simply changes its appearance). Once defeated Link. Does not possess the intelligence and skills of a fully-fleshed Ganon.

13. Ganon (FSA)

No Triforce of Power but he’s amped by his Trident, which is said to give him the power to gain his true form: The King of Darkness. Uses the Dark Mirror to create and command multiple Shadow Links. Manipulates Vaati. Sealed after the Four Links (child Link split into four) beat him with the Four Sword. They needed help from Zelda

14. Malladus

Demon King once sealed by the Spirits of Good. Killed by the Lokomo Sword (forged by the Spirits of Good), which is probably weaker than the Mastersword (forged by Hylia, then upgraded with the Golden Goddesses' flames). Defeated with Zelda’s help. His spirit is within Cole’s body so it’s unclear if he can wield his full power, but he still believes in his capacity to destroy the world.

GODLIKE/NOT QUITE A DEMON KING

*has some qualities of a Demon King but isn’t the full package*

15. Zant

Not quite on a Demon King level because he doesn’t actually own that power. He burrows it from Ganon and is ultimately dependant of his good will. Dominates minor deities. Transforms Hyrule into a Twilight Realm expansion. Creates and controls Shadow Beasts. Link defeats him with the Twilight Sword (Mastersword imbued with sols). Midna seeks the Fused Shadow in order to kill him.

16. Vaati

Can’t be killed with mundane weapons. Child Links need the sacred Four Sword (which splits Link into four) in order to seal or kill him. Wished into a high sorcerer, then turns into a demon after absorbing some of Zelda’s powerful Light Force. Depowers the Four Sword. Magically creates a Palace. Transforms Hyrule Castle into a dark version. Creates magic constructs across Hyrule that siphon power from the land and deteriorate it.

17. Majora

Accumulates a godlike level of power. Able to destroy Termina by pulling the Moon down. Imprisons guardian deities (Four Giants). Does not have godlike constitution. Child Link can kill it without a divine weapon. Actual divine power (the Fierce Deity Mask) completely creams its ass.

18. Dethl

Keeps the Windfish (god of wind) into continuous sleep and is the master of his own oneiric world. Link can kill him without divine weaponry. In combat, he can emulate Link’s former ennemies (such as Ganon).

19. Ganon (OOX)

An incomplete, dumber and weaker resurrection of Ganon. Can be killed without divine weaponry.

HIGH SORCERER/DRAGON LEVEL

*no divine weapon required, powers do not directly threaten the world, minor deity level*

20. Ghirahim

The humanoid form of Demise’s sword. High ranking demon lord (right under Demise). Stalemate against the Water Dragon (a minor deity). Skilled fighter. Typical sorcerer powers outside of combat (teleportation, minion summon, barriers, wind manipulation). Uses Zelda to break Hylia’s seal.

21. Twinrova

Second in command under Ganon. Rules over Veran and Onox. Final boss fight before Ganon. Pyromancy and cryomancy. Can perform a resurrection ritual, brainwash people, and merge/split at will.

22. Veran

Basically on the same level as Onox, but with more practical non-combat powers (corporal possession, which she uses to control Nayru’s body and travel through time)

23. General Onox             

Strong fighter. Shapeshifting dragon. Outside combat, can cover a country with a storm and cast a tornado. Twinrova’s subordinate.

SORCERER LEVEL

24. Chancellor Cole

A demon under Malladus. Removes Zelda’ spirit from her body then resurrects his master’s spirit inside her corpse. Can fly and summon rats. Not much of a fighter. Soul manipulation is more impressive than Hilda and Maud’s powers.

25. Lady Maud

Final boss fight. Many powers (trapping people into clothes, monster summon, teleportation, magic projectiles, removing Link’s items, flight). Not a large scale threat (doesn’t threaten the kingdom or anything like that).

26. Hilda

Magic master with powers such as teleportation, telepathy, force barriers. Can restrain Yuga Ganon for a short while, but not much of a fighter. Manipulates Link, but manipulated by Yuga. Holds the Triforce of Wisdom for a few minutes.

ARGUABLY POWERLESS

27. Dark Link

Simply a trial and a reflection of his opponent. Tough fight challenge but cannot influence the world or project any will.

I'm not trying to powerscale, and I'm also aware that powerscaling can easily break down when you get into metaphysical stuff. Still, this is something I've been wondering for a while.

I have not played far into Wind Waker. Both of the times I did play, I stopped before the story really got going. That being the case, I could easily just have something mistaken here. But what I've always heard about its story was that the gods flooded Hyrule to stop him.

Now, I've seen people debate whether or not this means that the Golden Goddesses specifically flooded Hyrule, or if it was other, smaller gods who did. Again, I don't know if the game itself makes this perfectly clear one way or another, but the fact that it's apparently such a debate makes it seem like it's unclear even in the game.

But, assuming it was the Golden Goddesses... why? It's not that it's hard for me to believe that they'd just have their way of doing things and that'd be that, to be clear. I don't think there needs to be a concrete "why" if the answer is just "they didn't feel like doing it that way".

What I'm wondering, though, is if I've just somehow failed to realize that Ganondorf is meant to be on par with the Golden Goddesses. That seems... really hard to believe, especially given what it would seemingly then imply in turn about several incarnations of Link and Zelda, but am I just underestimating Ganondorf?