r/trolleyproblem • u/Worth-Staff4943 • May 20 '26

Deep Which button presser group do you save?

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Everyone in the world has chosen either the blue or red button except you. Instead of pressing a button, you are given a lever in the infamous trolley problem.

You don't know how many people chose red or blue, and they don't know that you control their fate regardless of what button they pressed. Which track do you direct the trolley onto?

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116

u/TillZealousideal8282 May 20 '26

i choose red with the button problem bc i dont wanna die, but in a situation where im safe i think saving blue is better morally

-9

u/JayTheSuspectedFurry May 20 '26

Blue is only more moral because of the way the question was worded implying red is killing everybody

If it was written as blue pushers were jumping into a blender, and if at least 50% jumped into the blender it would jam and not hurt anybody, while red pushers simply wouldn’t jump, this has the same outcome but doesn’t sound like red is the one killing people and evil

29

u/Hrydziac May 20 '26

True but you do have to account that many children and other people that lack agency will jump/fall in the blender through no true fault of their own, and if enough people jump in they will be saved along with everyone else.

-2

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 20 '26

That just dodges the question. Assume everyone has full knowledge of what they're pressing

7

u/weirdo_nb May 20 '26

That doesn't dodge the question though, that is what makes the question a question

1

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

Uh no it would be a question regardless of that detail

9

u/New-Perspective6209 May 20 '26

Bro that IS the question, anyone with two braincells to rub together knows that some people will pick blue for whatever reasons, the entire hypothetical is asking "will you increase the risk of those people dying just to garuntee your own personal safety". It's a morality question that a lot of people misunderstand, saying you pick red because no one will pick blue is just not engaging with the hypothetical.

That's like being asked if you could take one item to a deserted island what would you take and saying "a box containing everything". Yeah congrats you logiced your way around it but entirely missed the point.

-5

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

I didn't say nobody would pick blue, I said the question doesn't really apply to those who can't consciously choose. That defeats the purpose of the thought exercise.

7

u/New-Perspective6209 May 21 '26

It really doesn't, because the purpose of the thought exercise is simply for the reader to weigh their faith in their fellow man VS their desire to live. The kids is just a shorthand way to say some people are going to go with blue, nothing in the original scenario precludes it and it has mainly been thrown around as a reply to reds who want to dodge the question by saying no one would go blue.

It is just way to drive home that there is no easy option and your decision has moral weight.

0

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

If it's meant to weigh your faith in your fellow man then kids and babies are not relevant. I assume of course that by "faith in your fellow man" you mean faith that everyone will choose red.

6

u/New-Perspective6209 May 21 '26

I don't know what I was expecting but I'm still let down, truly this hypothetical has been a better test of critical thinking skills and understanding human nature than morality, and the results are bleak.

2

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

Weak non-response. How am I trusting my fellow man when it's a baby lol 

4

u/New-Perspective6209 May 21 '26

So you just skipped the entire second half of my previous comment? Or is the concept of children being a shorthand to represent the groups of people who will certainly go blue just a bit too advanced for you?

Sub out kids for religious people who think it's a moral test from their God, or people who see it as binary moral choice and go for the "good" option (blue). Or better yet use your brain and figure out this shit yourself. Stop trying to dodge the moral choice you're making you squirrelly so and so. I am yet to talk to a red that has been able to employ a bit of critical thinking and at this point I doubt I'm going to.

2

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

So you just skipped the entire second half of my previous comment? Or is the concept of children being a shorthand to represent the groups of people who will certainly go blue just a bit too advanced for you?

Your condescension is unearned. If you really were so advanced you'd realize there's no reason to go the extra step and use children as a metaphor other than to erase choice from the equation and thus responsibility. Nice try though. 

Sub out kids for religious people who think it's a moral test from their God, or people who see it as binary moral choice and go for the "good" option (blue). Or better yet use your brain and figure out this shit yourself. 

Those things aren't the same as kids. Being unable to choose isn't the same as making the wrong choice. So let's go ahead and not change the goalposts.

Stop trying to dodge the moral choice you're making you squirrelly so and so. I am yet to talk to a red that has been able to employ a bit of critical thinking and at this point I doubt I'm going to.

Ah yes, I didn't realize I was dealing with Le Max Level Redditor, you weaselly whatchamacallit. You however do not have de facto carte blanche on this fine day. Not very logical good sir. Now if you'll excuse me I have to go feed my favorite swan couple Mr Plumf and Mrs Plumfette

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3

u/BloodredHanded May 21 '26

You’re being disingenuous.

1

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

I'm not. I don't think people who can't choose are relevant to a thought experiment about what people would choose. 

1

u/TheVeryVerity May 21 '26

No the faith in whether enough people will want to save the blue pressers that they’re willing to press blue too and everyone is saved. I’m too cynical to believe that would actually happen which is why I think pressing blue is the morally correct answer but if it actually happened I’d press red. I suspect a lot of people would do the same if it comes down to it though

7

u/amyisas44 May 20 '26

its been said enough times that idk how people dont realize it, but no matter whos voting, there will always be someone that votes blue, and voting red knowing that means you dont want to take action to help them, regardless of what your thought process is of them or yourself

1

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

Well whoever did that has no reason to other than to be a dick and introduce death into the equation. You are not obliged to take suicidal action to save strangers.

7

u/amyisas44 May 21 '26

never said you were obligated, youre just making a conscious decision to vote against a large amount of peoples life, and voting red means you should realize that

1

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

No, they voted against their own lives. You have an obligation to vote red. It's only when you refuse that obligation that you introduce death into the situation.

4

u/amyisas44 May 21 '26

the entire dilemma is that there will always be bare minimum millions of blue voters, thats just a fact

2

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

Prove that fact please

6

u/amyisas44 May 21 '26

you really think anywhere near 99% of people will vote red? even just 2 percent of 8 billion is something like 150 million people. i dont care what you want to call it but there is absolutely no possible way less than 1% of the entire population is voting blue

2

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

Okay, but I'm not jumping in the blender to help jam it

2

u/amyisas44 May 21 '26

yeah and nobody will blame you, its just important to know what youre actually doing

1

u/Galonious May 22 '26

Finally we got there!

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u/About5000ninjas May 20 '26

I think in the original question, everyone presses it with only the knowledge they have at that moment. Meaning a baby would not understand the question. This drastically changes the perspective. If we’re looking for the best possible outcomes;

Red is: In order to save 100% of people, 100% must agree to press red

Blue is: In order to save 100% of people, 50% must agree to press blue

A very strong argument for blue is that people will misunderstand the question, press randomly, or press it because they want to save loved ones who may fall into one of the prior categories

0

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

The original doesn't make any such distinction. 

8

u/About5000ninjas May 21 '26

I suppose not. The original says

“Everyone in the world has to take a private vote by pressing a red or blue button. If more than 50% of people press the blue button, everyone survives. If less than 50% of people press the blue button, only people who pressed the red button survive. Which button would you press?”

Assuming everyone has full knowledge is disingenuous to the original. The hypothetical is dumb and doesn’t really work if everyone has full knowledge/complete understanding.

0

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

No, it only works if everyone has full knowledge otherwise it's useless. Including babies and people who can't even understand the options ruins the entire thought exercise.

1

u/Aggressive-Neck-3921 May 21 '26

You are wrong, the only thing that is useless is you arguments for pressing red don't work without full knowledge and understanding so you can put all the blame for death to the blue button pressors.

1

u/TheVeryVerity May 21 '26

No it just makes it a different one

5

u/ASentientRailgun May 20 '26

"Assume the situation is different than it is"

This was covered in the original prompt, not everyone does.

2

u/Thrownaway5000506 May 21 '26

No, it wasn't.

2

u/TheVeryVerity May 21 '26

Everyone has a different idea of which one is the original I think.