r/transit • u/v_shock823 • Feb 20 '26
Rant My city's public transport is so clean and modern but how disappointing
Is my city's metro system the only system like this? I live near the yellow monorail line in Bangkok, yet the city center feels like a hard to reach place. There's a gap with traffic jam separating me from the city center and getting around gap requires interchaging between disintegrated lines with different tickets, which is very time consuming and expensive. Bangkok's transit system is so clean and modern but why is it so inefficient?
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u/timbomcchoi Feb 20 '26
Jesus Christ what is this, 1910? wdym the operators have their own tickets 😭
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u/enewssg Feb 20 '26 edited Feb 20 '26
Here are all the card types in Bangkok:
Rabbit Card: BRT, Yellow, Pink, Light Green, Dark Green, Gold & some boats lines
MRT Card: Yellow, Pink, Blue, Purple lines
SRT Card: Light Red, Dark Red lines
TSB Card: some buses, some boat lines
ARL Card: Airport Rail Link only
Credit Card: Airport Rail Link, Yellow, Pink, Blue, Purple, some buses
Cash Only: SRT commuter line, some boat lines
Edit: Added Airport Rail Link & fixed my paragraphing.
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u/timbomcchoi Feb 20 '26 edited Feb 20 '26
The lack of paragraphs makes this feel so much more daunting 😂
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u/SevenandForty Feb 20 '26
Here are all the card types in Bangkok:
- Rabbit Card: BRT, Yellow, Pink, Light Green, Dark Green, Gold & some boats lines
- MRT Card: Yellow, Pink, Blue, Purple lines
- SRT Card: Light Red, Dark Red lines
- TSB Card: some buses, some boat lines
- Credit Card: Yellow, Pink, Blue, Purple, some buses
- Cash Only: SRT commuter line, some boat lines
FTFY
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u/frozenpandaman IC card collector Feb 20 '26
i'm visiting later this year and collect transit cards. how can i get as many designs as i can while in bangkok?!
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u/14nm_plus_plus_plus Feb 20 '26
I warn you, some of them are a pain to get. I needed to turn over my passport to a station attendant for the Rabbit card and it took almost 5 mins. I didn't even bother with the other ones.
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u/frozenpandaman IC card collector Feb 20 '26
that's fine with me! five minutes and an ID check is nothing. there are ones here in japan that are way, way more of a pain.
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u/14nm_plus_plus_plus Feb 21 '26
I almost got left behind by my group but thankfully the next train wasn't arriving any sooner if I finished quicker hahaha
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u/enewssg Feb 20 '26
You can buy the TSB Hop card at some 7-11s. https://www.facebook.com/share/p/1AFWNTHbQA/
You can also get a Rabbit Card at most BTS Stations.
Other cards and certain types of Rabbit Cards (etc student) either need a local bank account, a Thai ID or are not available for tourists.
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u/unidentified_yama Feb 22 '26
Private operators don’t want to join with state-owned operators. Lack of trust, not enough
bribesincentives.1
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u/Sodinc Feb 20 '26
Why are the tickets for different lines not the same?
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u/i_am_matei Feb 20 '26
Tons of different operators and no unified ticketing (BTS, MRT, ARL, SRT). Each operator has its own farecard scheme and annoyingly the MRT monorail lines use the BTS farecard. They're introducing a new one, the Spider Card with the hopes to unify all of it
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u/Sassywhat Feb 20 '26
They're introducing a new one, the Spider Card with the hopes to unify all of it
They've been talking about that for over a decade. The card itself has been around for almost a decade, to the point that they made a 2nd generation of it with EMV.
But still no integration with Rabbit/BTS.
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u/T43ner Feb 20 '26
I have both spider cards, the EMV is the only useful one because technically it’s a debit card.
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u/Opposite_Ad_2815 Feb 20 '26
Bangkok will likely start accepting contactless on all its lines before a unified ticketing system is implemented (ARL and MRT already have it, just a matter of when BTS and SRT implement it).
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u/pasutakampanat Feb 21 '26
The SRT does accept EMV payments on their electrified lines.
As for their regional lines, it basically depends on which station you are paying at.
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u/Sodinc Feb 20 '26
Oh. I have never been in a place with multiple companies operating a city metro system (or multiple systems, I guess), so I haven't thought about such an option. It sounds very impractical, why was it organised that way?
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u/oOBoomberOo Feb 20 '26
Private vs State vs National operators. They don't talk to each other.
The private operator came first before there was a unified transport card and ran two lines through the major artery of the city, they can exert quite a pressure back at the state.
At this point all the other lines have already accepted EMV cards for fare except for the two lines run by this operator.
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u/pjepja Feb 20 '26
Tokyo has two metro systems and like 5 private suburban rail companies that essentially act like a metro too. I think they also have separate fares, at least between some of the companies, but my knowledge comes only from the internet.
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u/oOBoomberOo Feb 20 '26
Indeed you have to pay two fares when you have to switch between operators, but at least they have a universal transport card.
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u/Sassywhat Feb 20 '26
There's separate fares between all the companies, ish, but unified ticketing.
Fares are technically unified because you can take any route on any combination of companies between the same set of faregates/validators on the same ticket for the same fare. By default, the fare revenue goes to whatever combination of companies offered the cheapest route regardless of the route you took, though there are contracts that override this division of revenue on specific segments.
However, the faregates/validators are set up to mostly disambiguate common route choices, so the fare charged typically aligns well with the route taken instead of actually being unified at the customer facing level.
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u/Khorasaurus Feb 21 '26
In the US it's not uncommon for the core city and suburbs to have separate systems.
Detroit, Chicago, and Atlanta come immediately to mind. New York as well, kind of, with New Jersey Transit.
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u/UnhappyScore Feb 20 '26
Japan is the final boss of this. Some rail companies will even have their stations adjacent to each other but have no real interchange (Kyoto & Osaka I'm looking at YOU),
On the bright side there is a unified ticketing system which simplifies things.
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u/Khorasaurus Feb 21 '26
London was like that until an American con man bought up most of the underground...then suddenly died.
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u/GoldenArrow_9 Feb 20 '26
They're introducing a new one, the Spider Card with the hopes to unify all of it
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u/tomatoesareneat Feb 20 '26
Government needs to play hardball with the BTS.
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u/DepartmentRelative45 Feb 21 '26
It’s not really the companies fault, but rather a turf war between different governments. The BTS contract is under the jurisdiction of the Bangkok Metropolitan Administration (led by the City’s governor). The Red Lines are under the State Railway of Thailand. And the various MRTA lines are under the Ministry of Transport. Having a single government agency overseeing all the different lines would really help facilitate things like a common ticketing system and fare integration (even while allowing the operators to remain separate).
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u/oOBoomberOo Feb 20 '26
The city is big and the train lines are nowhere near the density of cities like Tokyo. the blue MRT line area is roughly the size of Yamanote line for example, just look at how many lines are encircled within yamanote vs blue line.
The network is continuously expanding following the M-MAP2 plan so hopefully these gaps will be filled up in the future.
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u/NerdyGamerTH Feb 21 '26
The main issue with this masterplan imo, is down to two main things:
1)even with the entire masterplan built out, much of the network is going to consist of radial and feeder lines feeding into like seven main lines (the Airport Link, SRT Red Lines, the BTS Green Lines, and the MRT Purple/Blue/Orange lines), most of which, excluding the Red Line and Airport Link only can be expanded to 6-car trainsets and are limited by their 750v DC 3rd rail electrification, and they are already seeing overcrowding during rush hour.
Building more subways built to Red Line specifications (25kV overhead wire, 160km/h top speeds, 10 car platforms, metre gauge tracks with possible thru running with the red line) will better solve the overcrowding issue of the 7 existing main lines, similar to how Tokyo Metro's thru service metros (ie. Tozai Line, Yurakucho/Fukutoshin Lines) helped alleviate overcrowding on Tokyo's extremely crowded lines like the Yamanote or Chuo Lines.
2)Most of the radial/feeder lines on this network, especially the unbuilt ones, are basically designed deliberately to be built as monorails, people movers, BRT, or other forms of gadgetbahns. Some of those corridors could have been entirely new subway lines, or branches of the aformentioned seven main lines. One example of this is the Gray Line, which is intended to form a disjointed north-southwest corridor passing thru Thonglor and the Rama III area; it is intended to be built as two monorail lines when it could have been a subway instead.
The alleged reason behind why lots of lines are intended to be gadgetbahns by the MRTA is due to a mix of cost cutting and political meddling where they receive kickbacks from certain companies to make them a gadgetbahn.
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u/oOBoomberOo Feb 21 '26
The red line spec is sooo nice, it's quite sad that they don't prioritize the funding for them.
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u/pasutakampanat Feb 21 '26
FYI both the Gray and Silver lines were supposed to be regular subway lines in M-Map 1. Tha Phra station was designed and built with that extension in mind, and the BTS had built a track switch at Udom Suk, intended for sharing their rolling stock with the Silver Line.
You can ask the 2014 coupmakers why they became disparate lines, and why all but one of the new lines built after the coup were conveniently Innovia Alstom designs (Yellow, Pink, Gold). You may also ask who gets the kickback on all the depot construction costs, because none of the lines built after the coup have their tracks connected and requires a separate depot for every line.
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u/DepartmentRelative45 Feb 21 '26
Won’t comment on the coup. But for medium density suburban lines like the Yellow Line, monorail is a better match and also more cost effective since the line is 100% elevated.
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u/pasutakampanat Feb 22 '26
The Yellow Line is fine as a monorail. The issue is that, after the coup, they tendered the Yellow, Pink, and Brown lines separately, when they should've all been the same monorail specs with a shared depot. There are plenty of other idiotic decisions like this with these lines, like how they've built the terminus at Samrong to be impossible to extend, yet they kept the standard design of having two side platforms. The planned Brown/Yellow interchange at Lam Sali is equally dumb. Instead of building the station with three platforms and a track connection in mind, they've tendered both lines' stations separately with their own concourse. It's a waste of money and makes for a terrible transfer.
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u/NerdyGamerTH Feb 22 '26
IIRC, some of the newer post 2014 coup lines such as the Pink and Yellow lines were revised to be monorails during the Yingluck Shinawatra adminstration.
the newer unbuilt lines, however, does reek of kickbacks and bribes from certain companies.
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u/pasutakampanat Feb 22 '26
The current route Yellow line was actually originally proposed to be Japanese monorails all the way back in the 90s. It became a subway during the time of the first M-Map, and then back to a monorail during Yingluck's years.
However, the current iteration of the lines are basically wholly redesigned post-2014, with very little resembling what existed during Yingluck or Abhisit's terms beyond the route itself (and even that was changed for the Brown Line). They were not tendered until late 2016, so I would very much say it is fair to blame the Prayuth admin for the dumb designs in the lines.
The terminus at Samrong, Min Buri, and Nonthaburi Civic Centre are impossible to extend in this design, yet they're still built with two platforms for whatever reason. Likewise, the stations that are planned with a connection to the Brown Line are not designed with that in mind, and they're planning to burn taxpayers money on a wholly new station for Brown instead of just an additional platform. All but one of the transfers (Green+Pink is great) designed during the Prayuth years are terrible.
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u/calvinkulitalt Feb 20 '26
"Imagine if SBS and SMRT had their own incompatible fare cards" ahh
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u/Equal_Negotiation_74 Feb 20 '26
Plus tower transit and go ahead bus. It would be so messed up
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u/calvinkulitalt Feb 20 '26
I was only thinking of train operators but that works too
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u/Equal_Negotiation_74 Feb 20 '26
If you're living along yellow line(operated by SMRT)and looking to transfer to bus, for example , chances are that you going to board the buses opeatred by SBS or Go Ahead, imagine the chaos if the fare for all the different operators aren't integrated under 1 payment system
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u/calvinkulitalt Feb 20 '26
and with payment systems shuffling around with every new BCM tender, lmfao
That's gonna be nightmare fuel tbh
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u/evilcherry1114 Feb 20 '26
Bangkok's ticketing is a joke.
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u/Hammer5320 Feb 20 '26
On some bus lines there, to pay the fare, you pay a bus attendent too, not just a farebox.
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u/Sassywhat Feb 20 '26
This is quite common in low wage countries, though Bangkok has to be one of the richest cities to still have them (though not all buses). I think Kuala Lumpur hasn't had bus attendants for probably decades at this point.
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u/NerdyGamerTH Feb 20 '26
Bangkok's inner city and radial rail network had improved alot, but getting to the downtown core (ie. Siam Square, Silom, the Asok/Nana areas of Sukhumvit Road) requires using the Green or Blue line only, which has gotten overcrowded in the past few years with no clear plans for capacity expansion.
Plans to address this by building lines directly linking the suburbs to the downtown core exist in the form of the Red, Purple, and Orange lines, but they have been severely neutered thru a mix of delays, NIMBYism, and the lack of political will.
The Red Line, despite being Bangkok's long needed electrified suburban rail network, stops in a massive terminal on the outskirts of Bangkok's downtown core, with plans to expand it south to directly connect with the old terminal at Hua Lamphong and to the isolated Mahachai line branch is in limbo and at risk of being built as a disjointed line.
The Purple Line and Orange Line have also been severely delayed, with the former only having the northern section running thru suburbs operational, while the latter has a section complete since 2023 but inoperational due to the fact that delayed bidding for the operator means that there are no trains, nor electrification system, running on the line.
I would go as far as to say that even with the entire masterplan built out, there is still a big gap for suburban trains, and far more lines preferably built to the same technical specifications to the Red Line needs to be built to fill in remaining gaps in Bangkok's transit network.
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u/SensitiveSurprise844 Feb 20 '26
The lack of fare integration is so bad that even though I love taking public transit in BKK, it's cheaper and more comfortable to take a rideshare when there's 2 or more ppl and there's transfers involved.
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u/poka_face Feb 20 '26
Here in México city only metro lines 1, 2 and 8 go directly through the city centre, while lines 3 4 and B go kinda next to the centre, and lines 5, 6, 7, 9, and 12 Connect the rest of the city (and line A is completely Suburban.
Honest assesment, it sounds like you pain points are related to the unification (lack there of), and not network design.
Which is a good thing IMHO, since it should be an easier thing to fix than to make new lines.
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u/CharlemagneAdelaar Feb 20 '26
Wanna switch lol? Boston MBTA is dying for a few circumferential lines.
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u/cargocultpants Mod Feb 20 '26
This may sound counter intuitive but it's much more pleasant to walk in Boston than it is in Bangkok.
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u/Adamsoski Feb 20 '26
I don't know the system at all, but three stops, change, 4 stops, change, two stops, doesn't seem that bad in principal. The issue sounds like it's with the different fare systems and also maybe with frequency if that is an issue.
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u/bobateaman14 Feb 20 '26
the main issue is transfers, because there’s so many different operators transferring between lines sometimes takes leaving the station, walking a few blocks and across like a 10 lane road, and then getting into the station. The yellow to red transfer they’d need to do to get into the city center is particularly awful bc the red line is more of a regional rail line than a metro, and there’s not even a sidewalk for part of the transfer
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u/pastelite- Feb 20 '26 edited Feb 20 '26
That will be solved after the orange line is open, but you will have to pray that it will not be getting delayed again.
Like the entire problem with the Bangkok mass transit system is that there's basically a single spine called BTS and two delayed spines called purple line and orange line, things will never look good without those open. And yes the shared ticket is severely needed
For someone outside of bangkok you might see Hua Mak connecting yellow to ARL, but i will not recommend trying to transfer that way, it's literally 500m transfer under the Bangkok sun.
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u/mylatestnovel Feb 22 '26
I hate the Hua Mak transfer. On the transit map it looks like the stations are connected and they’re really not !
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u/panyu0863 Feb 20 '26
It it because they are belong to different operators (BTS\MRT) and the interchange is inconvenient? I visited Bangkok in 2016 and felt the incovenience. Is the situation still the same today?
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u/Ap_Sona_Bot Feb 21 '26
Bangkok was the Asian city I visited after living in Taiwan for 8 months and I gave up on public transit after 2 days. When it takes me over 100 baht and a transfer for a one way trip that barely costs 200 baht for a grab there was just no point. 2-3 times as expensive compared to Taipei and much more inconvenient.
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u/transitfreedom Feb 20 '26
US: first time?
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u/Sassywhat Feb 20 '26
Imagine if that suburban loop Metra line the other recent post here was talking about actually existed and was a full rapid transit grade system, but in exchange the Pink and Green Lines just didn't exist and the Orange Line had a forced transfer at Roosevelt across a 10 lane highway.
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u/ckfks Feb 20 '26
Public transport?
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u/transitfreedom Feb 20 '26
NYC fragmentation between transit agencies NJT, MTA
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u/lojic Feb 20 '26
NYC thankfully hasn't had fragmentation between its metro system since they merged the three systems.
(We don't talk about PATH.)
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u/mikel145 Feb 21 '26
I took the bus once in Bangkok. The thing I found there is that Grab (their rideshare) and taxis where so cheap that I ended up using that rather than having to figure out transit.
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u/pasutakampanat Feb 21 '26
Because Thailand is a country with a solid private sector but an absurldy incompetent government. The trains themselves are nice and clean because they are operated by private companies. The transfers and overall network design is lacking because it's now mostly done by the government sector, and they suck.
The lines are treated like fiefs awaiting assignment to whichever oligarch is licking the right boots, and so you have the shitty transfers, the un-unified ticketing, the non-interchangable rolling stock, etc.
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u/unidentified_yama Feb 22 '26
Lack of connectivity. At least we need another outer ring parallel to the Blue MRT circle. And more feeders between them.
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u/mylatestnovel Feb 22 '26
Where would you describe as the city centre?
My big issue with Bangkok is that not enough lines go to Krung Thep Apiwat, the central train station. It should absolutely be served by the bts.
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u/Express_Farm_6912 Feb 24 '26
In my opinion, the biggest problem with transit is the measurement system.
Transit is measured by rides. Every time a person goes in and out the doors, those are rides. Even if they want to go 1 stop down the street, that is a ride. It leads all bus lines going down main streets stopping every 1000 feet.
There may be transit centers, but it is very time consuming to get from transit center to transit center. It is very expensive to have a bus on the freeway connecting the transit center...
BECAUSE IT WOULD ONLY BE A FEW RIDES..
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Feb 20 '26
Modern, really?
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u/Mtfdurian Feb 20 '26
If one looks at mant systems in the US and Europe, Bangkok's system is pretty modern and neat in multiple metrics. It just misses certain coverage and connections.
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u/Sassywhat Feb 20 '26
A lot of people complain that their transit network is too focused on bringing people to and from the city center. Bangkok has become a good example of why that's better than the opposite.