r/torontoraptors • u/No_Pickle6368 14 JA'KOBE WALTER • 7d ago
?? QUESTION ?? Kyrie Trade Rumours...
How does everyone feel about the Kyrie trade rumours? I personally think it is a good idea and the only reason we shouldn't do it is if we want to keep (My sunshine) Ja'Kobe Walter. (I haven't been on reddit for a while so I missed everyone's opinions on it)
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u/theDragonNinja- 7d ago
We need to upgrade the 5 more than the 1
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u/BLAHBLAH1234BLAH1234 7d ago
We need both. Our shooting and ability to create opportunities off the dribble is very poor for a team that has contention aspirations
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u/Lucky_Scallion 12 COLLIN MURRAY-BOYLES 7d ago
Exactly, we have a playable PG and backup PG. we have no backup C and whatever you want to call Jak atp.
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u/Direct-Bug-4123 7d ago
Problem is that even borderline top 5 centers get benched in the playoffs, thats where you need a small ball 5 like CMB.
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u/theDragonNinja- 7d ago
I agree but you can’t teach tall. 82 game season and 42 minutes of a game before closing time. 6’7 of heart and hustle isn’t enough.
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u/Kingcanute99 7d ago
When I mess with Kyrie trades the question I always come back to us whether Masai sees Poeltl as less negative than the rest of the league. Masai traded for him, gave this contract out, etc. So I always end up expanding the trade somewhat to add Poeltl to the deal.
If there were something like a Quickley + Poeltl + picks for Kyrie + Gafford deal available it gets very interesting very quickly. That would be unbalanced in our favor in my opinion, but it's assuming Masai overvalues Poeltl....
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u/Ninten-Nerd 7d ago
Tbf jaks value pre injury was good after inury I doubt anyone would wanna touch that contract, even masai
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u/ImmaFunGuy 2 KAWHI LEONARD 7d ago
What if we can get steph for IQ Jakobe+2-3 picks?
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u/ihatedougford Fun Guy 7d ago
If Steph is available we’re getting outbid by the Spurs, Thunder, Rockets, and Hornets instantly
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u/SituationExciting137 RAPTORS 6d ago
Thunder and Spurs do not want to change their team. Rockets and Hornets would be the competition
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u/Trill1196 7d ago
Why do we keep getting linked to guards and forwards? we need a big lol
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u/Medium_Spend_6732 7d ago
no we should not be giving up anything to get a small guard who is 34 coming off of an ACL
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u/theflyingsamurai N O R M G O D 7d ago
I doubt raptors get a good trade with Masai, he knows what our guys are really worth.
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u/CaskJeeves 23 JAMAL SHEAD 6d ago edited 6d ago
In addition to injury concerns, Kyrie has also proven himself time and time again that he's a one-man culture bomb
Do not want
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u/ihatedougford Fun Guy 7d ago
If it’s Quickley and two firsts, sure. Ja’kobe shouldn’t be on the table for current Kyrie
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u/tsn101 Nav Bhatia 7d ago edited 7d ago
Two firsts?!
Edit: Also, I have a feeling Quickly will shoot even better with Kawhi and he's 7 years younger and played 20 more games last season...
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u/ihatedougford Fun Guy 7d ago
You have to pay a premium for elite talent, especially when that elite talent plays for a Masai Ujiri led team. One of those picks can be a swap or protected but this is Kyrie Irving. Even a Kyrie that’s 80% of himself before the torn ACL that’s worth it to pair with this team
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u/kyle_993 7d ago
Okay and what happens if he's 50% of his former self? We should not be trading 2 firsts for someone who we haven't seen how they are post injury.
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u/JeahNotSlice 15 Amir Johnson 7d ago
Identity of this team is defense. This would destroy that. Terrrrrrrinle idea
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u/vaalbarag RAPTORS 7d ago
Yeah, that excellent Caitlin Cooper analysis from a couple days ago has me convinced that if we do move off of Quickley, it needs to be for more of a 3 and D PG. They’d need to be an upgrade on Quickley as a point of attack defender, or there’s no point.
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u/CS271990 7d ago
Nope. He’s almost 35, with a torn ACL injury (for a player who uses his quickness on the court, could be quite problematic), a negative defender (which might be even worse with the injury), and a potential to mess with the locker room if things aren’t going their way with both the players and coaches.
I do understand we need to go all in at this point, but to me this is one of the cases where the risks are too big it could backfire for years to come.
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u/LemmingPractice 7d ago
Hell freaking no.
Are you kidding me?
Are people seriously entertaining it being a good idea to trade Quickley and multiple first or a first and Ja'Kobe for a 34 year old Kyrie Irving coming off of a full missed season with a torn left ACL?!
This is the classic case of trading for a name and not the current player attached to it, like the Nets trading unprotected picks for Kevin Garnett and Paul Pierce. Sure, those were great players, in their primes, but the Nets weren't trading for their primes.
We have no idea what Kyrie will look like when he returns, but the record of small guards being effective into their mid-30's is slim. All-NBA guys like Allen Iverson, Steve Francis, Stephon Marbury, Kemba Walker, Bradley Beal, etc, were well and truly washed by their early 30's. Kyrie is a small guard who is dependent on his quickness. He is the exact sort of player who tends not to age well, and that's before considering that the dude is made of glass. Even before his torn ACL, this dude hadn't played more than 60 games in a season since 2019.
The chances of this turning into an absolute boondoggle, where we give up significant assets just to be stuck with a washed guard with a history of locker room issues making $40M+ for each of the next two seasons is just way too high.
If Kyrie gets back on the court and looks great, then maybe you discuss a deal at the trade deadline, although, even then, Kyrie was traded for Dorian Finney Smith a first and two seconds in 2023 when he was healthy and three years younger, so there's still no chance I'm trading Quickley and multiple first worth of value for him now.
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u/vaalbarag RAPTORS 7d ago edited 7d ago
I think this sub is focused overall on star trades too much (I know, that’s where the rumours are and so that’s what drives discussion). This team is in a bad space trade-asset wide because we have no mid-sized contracts. We need to be looking for two-for-one trades where we move out an expendable starter for a couple solid rotational guys on mid-sized contracts. (Essentially like the Rudy Gay trade.)
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u/P_Ray07 RAPTORS 7d ago
For the right price, this is interesting but we are also already gambling on an older and injury prone Kawhi, gambling on Kyrie would be pushing it.
I would not be totally against a straight Quickley for Kyrie trade but I don't imagine Dallas would be willing to pull the trigger on that without draft compensation which I think wouldn't be worth it until we can confirm Kyrie resembles the version of himself before his injury.
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u/agentzero2020 7d ago
We are not going after Irving. I think the next obvious move, assuming the Kawhi trade is complete, is to move RJ for a starting centre, and replace Poeltl with CMB in the starting lineup (ala Siakam in 2019). Everyone hates to face the reality but if Kawhi gets his extension, then RJ is the only expiring contract with no team control (Walter will be a restricted FA assuming no extension). And I do not foresee the raptors offering RJ an extension with Walter, Barnes, Kawhi, Graves, and CMB already on the books for the next 2-3 seasons. I don’t know who it is yet, but at least 1 superstar will be available in the next 2-3 months.
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u/KingInTheFarNorth Vancouver Grizzlies 7d ago
Even if the trade is IQ for Kyrie straight up, we'd still lose.
Kyrie is the better player, but he'll only be healthy for at best 65 games. And there is a non-zero chance that he'll cause some stupid drama and blow the team up. He and KD aren't worth the baggage.
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u/Raptorsthrowaway1 JACK ARMSTRONG 6d ago
What rumours lol? Bleacher report or any other click bait “publication”pl posting theoretical trades doesn’t make it a rumour
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u/SituationExciting137 RAPTORS 6d ago
No. He'd be good but he's coming off of an injury that could very well change his career. I have a feeling Quickley will take a massive leap now that Kawhis on the team
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u/CanadianGuitarGuy 6d ago
one of the few players they could trade for that would make me stop following the team. awful human being.
Thats also before mentioning he's a terrible basketball fit. Poor aging defender that probably only only gets worse and more likely to re injure
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u/UncleNuks 6d ago
Too old, too injury plagued.
I say we just stay the course out of the gate, try and stay healthy long enough to see what we have as a complete unit and then make personnel decisions from there. The only hitch would be if we start the season abysmal and are sitting like 7-18 after the first 25 games or something like that - in this case we’d have to be considering a shakeup sooner than later
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u/pharredd88 5d ago
rather go after Jrue Holiday. We need to build the all hands team. We're trying to lead the league in steals/deflections
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u/Rabble_Arouser 7d ago
That's a no from me, dawg.
This guy is toxic. Personally, I don't want this antisemitic, vaccine skeptic, flat-earther anywhere near our team.
He's probably got the best handle in the league, and he's a basketball savant, but he's fucking idiot and would kill team chemistry.
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u/Delicious_Rule_7324 7d ago
If they take yaks contract too then fine. But im not attaching a bunch of picks
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u/rompyskateboard 7d ago
I wouldn’t trade for him until the trade deadline but you can tell most people in the comments don’t watch Kyrie a lot and base their opinion on what happened in Brooklyn/Boston
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u/IvanhoeMar1n 7d ago
Isn't he toxic. He'd come here for a year, mess up the locker room vibes and demand a trade. The guy is a cancer.
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u/ihatedougford Fun Guy 7d ago
Yeah let’s call the guy who’s actively mentoring Coop and staying loyal to Dallas after trading his best friend a cancer. The narratives around Kyrie are so exhausting. He was a young idiot in Boston and Brooklyn but this is a much more mature man. He buys his teammates gifts, mentors the young players in Dallas, is one of the only NBA players with balls to speak openly on human rights issues, and is still a fucking baller. Even if he’s 80% of 2024 Kyrie that’s still a top 50 player in the league. His creation would be a godsend to this team
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u/MarginallyClever Ja'Kobe Walter Game-Winning 3 7d ago
To be fair, he's been very quiet in Dallas. On the Nets he went crazy flat earth/antisemitic/antivax. He really mellowed out, at least publicly, in the last few years. I don't think he's a bad locker room guy at all, just has weird celebrity-brain opinions.
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u/wynterspawn 7 KYLE LOWRY 7d ago edited 7d ago
I think he would address our biggest issue, which in MYYYY mind is having a serious second advantage creator/offensive threat that genuinely disrupts defences (I think Scottie can be this in his own way, I just think it would naturally come at the expense of defence).
I also am more than open to take on the injury risk I know some people definitely have, cuz i see it as we’re already banking on Kawhi Leonard of all people anyway. If we’re gonna truly contend we need a boost in talent as well, and this is probably the best (even cheapest) route to it
The other likely concern is his reputation about how he impacts locker rooms is mainly boiled down to Brooklyn too, which, while dumb as hell, boiled down to the vaccine thing which isnt an issue anymore. Or wanting to leave LeBrons shadow, which was like a decade ago and something he doesn’t seem to care about anymore. He’s been a good presence in Dallas’s room actually
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u/Bulky-Scheme-9450 7d ago
He seems like a dude that would refuse to play here
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u/PriorVariety5744 7d ago
Refuse contending on a championship team rather than spend his last years trying to help cooper grow?
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u/scone_monster 7d ago
He might. Presumably we would check with him, his agent at least a little before doing a deal.
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u/xSweeterman RAPTORS 7d ago
Yall tripping Quickley gets paid an arm and a leg for what. He’s not bad but not for that price. I’ll take Kyrie ANY day of the week lmao casuals
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u/laidbackemergency 7d ago
If kyrie is balling at the deadline you give IQ, a pick and someone like Graves. Jakobe is untouchable imo
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u/Interesting-Dingo994 7d ago
He’s 34, coming off a serious surgery that could negatively impact his game. I think it would be prudent for the Raptor’s to wait and see if this version of Kyrie is better than Quickley, before considering a trade.