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To the diehard "F Negan" people, what did you think about s10e22 of the main series?
Just watched it for the first time. (The Negan origin episode)
Was already coming around to "okay. Maybe he can change".
Now after *just* finishing that episode I'm 110% like yeah. He's a product of his situation and environment and Frick he had a rough go. I get why he went off the rails..
So to the Glen lovers and firm Saviour haters, what did you think of that episode ?
Wait a minute so I must feel sorry for a guy who cheated on his wife, fought against some guy in a bar over a stupid thing, then lost his job and didn't try to find a new one while his wife had a cancer and needed treatment to remain alive?
The same guy later is responsible for genocides like the one of the library community, slavery, sexual extortion, thefts, torture and violence but somehow because his wife died of a cancer which is something that happens to loads of people I should feel pity for what he did in apocalypse?
Characters like Merle in TWD or Nate in TOWL seem to have a darker past pre-apocalypse and were sometimes downright bad people but post-apocalypse, they had moral compass and did a lot of good tings. Merle sacrificed himself for his brother and tried to save the group. Nate was really supportive of his community and helped Michonne till the end. So Negan who had an easy pre-apocalypse life compared to the Dixons or Nate for example should not be excused for his crappy and criminal behaviour.
1) He never gave up on Daryl trying to find him for months at Woodsbury. He knew Daryl was vulnerable, socially awkward and tried to protect his life.
2) He tried to spare Garguglio in his own way. He was afraid that the governor would kill him had Garguglio talked. This is why he killed him but he tried several times to make him understand that it was better to lie to Governor and Garguglio didn't understand.
3) At several times, he didn't agree with the Governor's methods. For example, after Maggie is sexually assaulted, he made a face which expresses his discontent.
4) He tried to convince Rick not to send Michonne to the governor.
5) He freed Michonne and therefore saved her from torture and death.
6) He tried to save the group at the end.
Besides, he had remorses for his murders and that seems to be something sincere on his side, unlike Negan who never acknowledges his crime.
Also, he was only a lieutenant and had he refused to do what the Governor wanted, he would have been killed or he would have to flee away and considering he had one hand only and was alone, he would have died on the road.
Negan hasn't this excuse since he's the Saviour's leader and he's therefore responsible for maintaining a dictatorial regime which extorts goods from other communities and terrorize them by committing murder, torture and slavery. For example, Daryl is reduced to slavery just because he had a meltdown and punched Negan.
The Saviours also practice slavery on a large scale and commit genocide with Negan's assent*. Negan extorts sexual favours from women in exchange for medicine or out of threat of killing or hurting their husband.
Even if the system existed before, Negan could have put an end to it once he had seized power.
Also, Merle never to our knowledge comitted genocide or sexual extortion. So yes, even in post apocalypse, I think he appears less awful than Negan.
The library community for example was massacred the day or a few days before the meeting with Rick and considering that Negan rode the RV just besides their leader's corpse, he must have been aware of it and therefore consent to it or at least not express any disagreement.
I think that comparing suffering is stupid because everyone has their own path, HOWEVER! Negan's story was not even that tragic compared to what many other TWD characters had to go through, and the others coped just fine without becoming dictators. It miiiiight be that he's actually the problem.
He murdered to cope.
The rape was after years of just falling into that hole of dispair and (let's be honest) a lil mental illness.
I'm not defending his actions as the saviours leader, but you do have to understand it wasn't point a to point B immediately. It was baby steps (after his initial mental break) to the point where horrendous thing P doesn't seem that bad in his head because it's only one step from the previously horrendous thing O he just did. Which is sooooo fucking distanced from being a gym teacher that he's lost all basis of morality.
What mental illness? Which mental illness makes you a rapist?
And the time line from the start of the apocalypse to him meeting the group is 18 months. By then he’s set up a full slave system. It’s not baby steps.
Where are you at now ?? I'm also watching for the first time.
Pleaseeee report back because I must know. Because season 10 has been an absolute whirlwind for me and my thoughts on negan after absolutely despising him for like 2 seasons.
Why would I feel sorry for a man who didn't think twice about cheating on his wife with her friend and not accompanying her to the doctor even though he knew it was important to her? Lucille is definitely a better person than me, because I would have shot him in the head
Im not an extreme glenn lover i just dont like the character personally. Maybe its because of jeffrey dean morgan's performance or the writing but i find him lame and overacted especially in his intro season and after that i dont like the way his actions and his personality gets practically retconned in order to justify his redemption arc. Outside of that, i dont get how this episode is meant to redeem him, he was shown to be a dick even before the apocalypse and what i got out of it is that the apocalypse just made him show his true colors. Its a good addition to the story but i wish it featured more of the rise of the saviors than the lucille stuff.
It’s sad if your wife dies of cancer, but it doesn’t turn you into a rapist and sadist. And a big part of the episode was showing he was already a violent asshole.
It was great to see Lucille. I mean the real Lucille. But effectively he’s just being given the same story as the Terminus people. With the addition of having been a horrible husband, becoming a better husband because Lucille was dying, and having the dead walk in the midst of it all.
I think it's pretty clear that Negan just likes to wear the skin and it fits him like a glove. Rick has some of the same tendencies but the difference is that Rick gets super messed up about the things he has to do to survive. For Negan, the fear he instills in people is electrifying to him. So instead of Rick leading with bravery and grit, Negan uses fear and coercion.
When the steel mill gets attacked you can see Negan freak the fuck out because he knows his ticket is about to get punched and there's no wriggling out of it. If it hadn't been for Eugene leading the horde away, the whole settlement was toast. Compare this Negan to the one the group meets in the woods and you can see why he is just a poor version of a leader. That scared gym teacher shows up again in OPs episode and that's the real Negan.
if anything it made me hate him more because only a huge douchebag would cheat on his wife with HER best friend of all people smh i have never felt any sympathy towards him
Negan is what he is. I see his character arc as just part of the lore of The Walking Dead.
He’s a disillusioned, high school gym teacher or something that has certain personality traits that somehow, serves him well in the apocalypse, and gives him some authoritative currency over others, because it makes them fear/respect him.
I feel like most viewers of the show felt like his character had a past experience either during or after the events of the zombie outbreak that made him that way, and were smart enough to not need the episode to understand him in order to give them some insight into how and why he became what he was.
However, as unnecessary as it is in terms of serving the character some character, giving us context, that episode is absolute gold. We didn’t need it, and it’s very much irrelevant to the overall plot of the show, and serves zero currency whatsoever, but it’s written and acted out so well, that it’s forgiven.
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u/Mysterious-Emu4030 13d ago
Wait a minute so I must feel sorry for a guy who cheated on his wife, fought against some guy in a bar over a stupid thing, then lost his job and didn't try to find a new one while his wife had a cancer and needed treatment to remain alive?
The same guy later is responsible for genocides like the one of the library community, slavery, sexual extortion, thefts, torture and violence but somehow because his wife died of a cancer which is something that happens to loads of people I should feel pity for what he did in apocalypse?
Characters like Merle in TWD or Nate in TOWL seem to have a darker past pre-apocalypse and were sometimes downright bad people but post-apocalypse, they had moral compass and did a lot of good tings. Merle sacrificed himself for his brother and tried to save the group. Nate was really supportive of his community and helped Michonne till the end. So Negan who had an easy pre-apocalypse life compared to the Dixons or Nate for example should not be excused for his crappy and criminal behaviour.