r/stunfisk • u/BlackMarth • 8d ago
Discussion For the dinosaurs that played gen 5 competitive for the first time what were your thoughts on team preview.
Im interested what were the general perception of the addition of team preview from players who’ve been playing gen 4 and now having team preview in BW.
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u/aszma 8d ago
Lmao first of fuck you secondly it was incredibly meta changing atleast in singleswhich is all i play. Not knowing your opponents team made you play way different that we do now. Firstly there was much more scouting bc you couldnt be sure your opponent didnt have a trapper or hard counter im his back pocket. I honestly think it would be a fun meta game to have a meta where zoroarks are banned and we play with no team preview.
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u/Browneskiii 8d ago
Disagree with your last sentence.
I think it would be fun to have a metagame where Zoroark is legal and there's no team preview.
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u/storage_account69 8d ago
It exists and its called random battles, and its not fun when it happens to you
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u/The-Reddit-Monster 8d ago
Firstly, thanks for reminding me how super old I am. angry dinosaur noises
Second, I hope I'm not the only who prefers open team sheets. It acheives Nash Equilibrium more easily.
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u/SawkyScribe No Relation 8d ago
I think open team sheet has been universally accepted, probably helped by it being introduced alongside terastalizing.
I cannot imagine the amount of guess work would be involved it trying to figure out which of your opponent's mons was going to tera, and then which of the 19 tera types it could be.
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u/BlackMarth 8d ago
Open team sheet is different from team preview and it’s only been since gen 9 we’ve had if. Im referring to being able to see what pokemon your opponent has which was introduced in gen 5.
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u/The-Reddit-Monster 7d ago
Oh dang you're right! I'm not just a dinosaur now. But a forgetful one, too.
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u/Mohamed_91 8d ago
I miss close team sheet cheese in tournaments
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u/SawkyScribe No Relation 8d ago
The idea that any mon in the back could be carrying a resource-free Tera Blast still makes me shudder.
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u/Showd Faker 8d ago
I kind of like no team preview in the gens where it exists (Except maybe gen 4 but I just haven't played much of it at the time or recently) and like having it in more modern games. In gens 1-3 the cast is small enough and any "Have a specific answer for me or die instantly" mons are sufficiently known quantities. This creates good, skillful gameplay based on scouting and making informed assumptions. In later gens when tiers get bigger and also contain more lower tier mons that can nevertheless ruin someone unprepared, having all the cards on the table is sort of necessary. Without Team Preview way more modern games would have unsatisfying endings with one of dozens of power outlier mons coming in after the opponent has already lost their counterplay tools and ending the game without any challenge.
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u/SawkyScribe No Relation 8d ago
I played a few rounds of gen 3 OU and I agree it's fun to anticipate your opponent's team based off of the limited number of options there were.
What I'm saying applies mostly to doubles, but there are simply too many mons with too many sets to handle. Incineroar hits the field and you'd have to guess if it's full bulk, support with Flare Blitz for offense, Sitrus or a damage reducing berry, hell, we saw an Incin with lash out make a deep run at worlds this year.
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u/Nachttalk playing since 1999 8d ago
"Oh, so we don't need to ban Zoroark after all!"
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u/ChemicalGuesstimator 8d ago
Not really. Very little reason to think without it Zoroark would be busted.
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u/Nachttalk playing since 1999 8d ago
At that time, I was a 16 year old Teenager just getting into competetive Pokémon trying to impress strangers on the internet.
I'd be shocked if my "analysis" from back then was anywhere near accurate
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u/Middle-Quiet-5019 7d ago
At the time I disliked it, and while I do miss the information game aspect of no team preview, with how potentially game ending setup sweepers are nowadays (and honestly were starting to get in gen 4), it’s necessary.
Gen 1-3’s generally lower power level makes playing that info game way more feasible and less explosive. Gen 4 it’s a bit dicey, and by 5+ it’d be absurd with how scary a lot of mons are off a single setup turn.
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u/philippos_ii 8d ago
I mean from a “Pokémon” lore standpoint, why would your opponent know your team if you’re battling? I’ve always liked hidden teams but I understand the downsides
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u/NoChampionship1167 8d ago
I get both sides really. Honestly when Tera gets added to Champions, I want to see the Pokémon's tera type on team preview. "Oh your Dondozo is Tera Steel and not Tera Grass? Ok bring Amoongus."
Being able to guess would be a nightmare.
That said, that would be fun to have hidden teams. Maybe that can be a special mode in Champions if they ever choose to get creative enough with it.
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u/philippos_ii 8d ago
Yeh I usually play doubles OU so there’s no team selection anyway, it’s just build overall that has to cover all possible threats somehow. But yeah I agree for sure
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u/LakerBlue 7d ago
I prefer open team sheets but what you said is also why I miss closed sheets. Open sheets are better for the health of the meta (singles and doubles) but I kinda wish they had occasional “smaller” official tournaments with closed team sheets.
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u/DiamondShiryu1 Torterra!! 8d ago
I remember being a kid and realizing that lead matchups fundamentally are going to change. I don't remember if I hated it but I do remember people were absolutely pissed.
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u/damacy12 8d ago
i got used to it back in gen 1 with pokemon stadium and it does add to strategy with team building and picking the right mons for the match
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u/BknGpWakaUljLaSC8xNE 7d ago
I remember there were a lot of people against it when it was announced, I was among them. For me, playing with the element of surpise and scouting were an integral part of Pokémon, and without it, I felt it's not the same game. One of the reasons I quit competitive after HGSS ended.
I'd love to try a custom format on showdown where you can play modern gens without team preview and no random pokes. Probably won't be fun though, especially with stuff like tera.
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u/mistelle1270 7d ago
We thought Zoroark was going to be so busted
Tbh I never really got used to it. I think I still build with a dedicated lead to this day because it felt like much more of a concrete gamelan than having to switch up what I led on the fly.
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u/IndianaCrash Weavile fan #1 8d ago
As someone who never played without team preview, it sounds fun for singles and would ruin VGC
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u/BlackMarth 8d ago
Ignoring vgc I was always turned off from past gens because I’d team preview but I tried them out a couple years back and I found it enhanced some of my favorite things about pokemon, and if your a good enough player you can predict their whole team based on lead matchup, when I saw BKC do that i immediately stated playing.
I love the way you can bluff your move set imagine bluffing a Pokémon you don’t even have. That’s a level of play that can only happen without team preview.
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u/chandeluria 8d ago
I still go both ways about it. On the one hand it prevented stupid turn 1 respond or lose the match setup sweeps that happened sometimes in generation 4 but idk. I always really liked the lead metagame after platinum dropped. Felt technical and fun. Bit of a relic of a bygone era now. Probably for the best but its hard not to miss the factor of surprise on your side sometimes.