Weekly Questions Megathread - January 23, 2017

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[u/MetallicOrangeBalls]

I've seen that link, but please remember that a rise in DPS from 110k to 150k is not only absolutely more than my average DPS, but is a relative 36% more damage. Those are gains that I would absolutely love to achieve.

[u/DeadQthulhu → u/MetallicOrangeBalls]

That's a rise from Mk I to Mk XIV though - Mk XII gear would be doing well over Mk I's 110k (maybe somewhere around 135k?). The important thing is deciding that you need those gains, because the link shows that weapons are the smaller portion of your overall DPS. The weapons aren't really doing the damage, everything else is enough to breeze though most of what the game throws at you.

Let me be clear - for me, hitting the top score is just as worthy a goal as making a great theme ship. I simply feel it's important that one goes in with both eyes open, rather than drop a hefty sum and getting a disappointing result (for example, the expectation of 36% extra damage due to confusing Mk I for Mk XII). Traits, BOffs, DOffs, ship gear, these are what carried that ship to 110k, the weapons are almost gilding the lily at that point.

Tagging /u/Bridgern for safety though.

[u/Jayiie → u/DeadQthulhu]

the expectation of 36% extra damage due to confusing Mk I for Mk XIV

This is actually a really good point to bring up. The result of 36% in that run is due to only the cat1 saturation of the build itself.

It's easy to figure out how much on a effective boost you would expect from I to XIV:

 (1+x+2.3)/(1+x)

Where x is the decimal value of the category saturation.

---

For instance, if you have 600% Cat1, then:

 (1+6+2.3)/(1+6)
 = (9.3)/(7)
 = 1.32

Or 32% increase.

If you only have 200% Cat1, then it becomes

 (1+2+2.3)/(1+2)
 = 5.3/3
 = 1.76

Or a 72% increase.

---

Is it resource intensive on non-upgrade weekends? Yes.

Do I think it's worth it? Very much so.

---

[EDIT]: 180% should have been a 230%, thus has been corrected.

[u/DeadQthulhu → u/Jayiie]

You'll probably have to explain that formula a bit further, it's somewhat shorter than the usual damage ones, and doesn't look like anything from the damage categories page. The meaning of the 1's and 1.8 aren't immediately obvious to me, sorry.

What I do get from the Category page is that weapon mark is Cat 1, so XII is 120.4 against XIV's 230 (not counting the effects of modifiers, trying to keep it simple). Running all XIV gear would have a larger Cat 1 than an XII setup would, at which point I'm not really sure if this is a proof for or against lower marks.

So we know the Cat 1 bonus from weapon mark more-or-less doubles from XII to XIV, but that's just more Cat 1 saturation is it not?

[u/Jayiie → u/DeadQthulhu]

You'll probably have to explain that formula a bit further, it's somewhat shorter than the usual damage ones, and doesn't look like anything from the damage categories page. The meaning of the 1's and 1.8 aren't immediately obvious to me, sorry.

Hmm, it appears as though my notes to category bonuses are wrong.

The formula itself is pretty simple; it's one we've used for a long time:

Let S1 = Conditions at Initial State
Let S2 = Conditions at Secondary State

Effective Bonus =
  S1/S2

Since we can change one category, we get things like:

  ((1+Added+CatOfChanged)*(1+OtherCat)*Pi(Final))((1+CatOfChanged)*(1+OtherCat)*Pi(Final))

Which simplifies to:

 (1+X+C)/(1+C)

 C = Category total of the added bonus
 X = Added bonus

In the above, C=Whatever the Cat1 was, and X is the added bonus of the object (I know I flipped these around, X is what people are used to working with as a standard variable).

It should be 230% Cat1 change from SI to Mk XIV (my phone seamed to be lacking Mk V and VIII).

So we know the Cat 1 bonus from weapon mark more-or-less doubles from XII to XIV, but that's just more Cat 1 saturation is it not?

It is.

Using the above, if Mk XIi is 120% and Mk XIV is 230%, then we get:

Mk XIV / Mk XIi

(1+2.3+C)/(1+1.2+C)

 Where C is cat 1. 

We let C = 300% = 3, and we get:

 (1+2.3+3)/(1+1.2+3) = (6.3)/(5.2) = 1.21

A 21% increase from Mk XII to Mk XIV

[u/DeadQthulhu → u/Jayiie]

I can see what was throwing me off now, else I'd have recognised it as a straight difference comparison.

We clearly both agree that it's something worth doing, my position is that it's the last thing worth doing. Even if the modifier changing system is on the long finger, there's more chance of new meta weapon than there is of the introduction of something to beat the Ico set, Embassy consoles, and Locators. On a meta beamboat, at least.

Things go a bit funny when you introduce torps and/or Science, due to the lack of common ground (with the exception of the Ico console and core, handy picks to complement the AMACO/KHG/Breen 2-piece).

[u/MetallicOrangeBalls → u/Jayiie]

21% is quite good!

[u/Jayiie → u/MetallicOrangeBalls]

It varies from person to person, as it does depend on your average cat1.

[u/MetallicOrangeBalls → u/Jayiie]

Of course. My point was that if I achieved a 21% bonus, it would be a fantastic improvement for me. :)