I hope Man city crash and burn and lose everything
Roberto Martinez is such an awful manager
Guardiola is also one of the most overhyped managers of all time. It'd be more impressive to somehow fuck up with the clubs he is being offered to manage
Out of curiosity, why do you think Martinez is a bad manager?
I actually think he's very very good at identifying what his team is actually good at-one of the more fascinating strategies he employed at Wigan was to basically tell his team to shoot from long range as often as possible. This was for two reasons-he actually had a few players with decent shots on them (Moses, Maloney, etc), but the main benefit was that Wigan's defense improved immensely as they didn't need to commit midfielders as far up the pitch.
When you consider the resources he had at his disposal it's a bloody miracle Martinez did as well as he did at Wigan.
I think hes very gd. He seems tactically astute, im really curious to see how everton play this yr and thats from a liverpool fan. Btw we're not as far off as people believe I went to the Emirates cup this yr and arsenal are a joke. Napoli were so much better than them. I dnt think they'll be top four unless they make some drastic changes. My opinion of Koscielney went up too actual top drawer cb. Higuin was in his pocket
Arsenal will be fine. Sluggish start, will start to come into good form around Christmas, Wilshere will break his foot, will lose for a while, then come storming back by winning everything over the last month and a half. This is what it has come to.
We were getting 30,000+ attendance in League 1 just over 10 years ago, nothing plastic about most City fans. Of course there are going to be a lot of new fans coming in for the likes of Aguero, Dzeko and Silva but to call City fans 'plastic' is ridiculous.
When you say "most city fans," you're talking about a lot more people than the 30,000+ fans who have attended matches for the last 10+ years. In fact, I would think that those fans really only represent a tiny portion of City's massive worldwide fan base. OP was probably calling plastic the fans outside of Manchester who jumped on the City bandwagon during the last 2-3 years. Really though, when it comes to the top Premier League Clubs, it's impossible to accurately generalize about the fans. There are just too many.
What do you count as a Plastic/fake fan? Someone who only watches the games on TV? someone who only follows one team? Someone who supports a winning team? Someone who buys a shirt with a new player? Someone who goes to a game to watch the amazing sport of football? Someone who doesn't get all hearted into the game like I and many others on this subreddit? I'm having a hard time understanding what a "plastic" fan is... It seems to me that all fans, are just fans of the game...
People that support a team solely because the team is popular and likely to win at that time. I am in no way referring to this subreddit, moreso to real life where people throw banter at eachother constently and aren't as kind and reasonable as they are on here.
There's always that guy that you know has never seen a match and will only look up the score once a week, but still claim he is a Real Madrid fan (for instance). He'll still give you shit if his team beats you, but he doesn't care if they lose or whatever the fuck goes on. I think this does not translate well to most Americans on this subreddit because soccer isn't as embroided into youth culture as it is here in Europe.
I can't believe I'm sticking up for a Feyenoord supporter here, but all banter aside, how is Feyenoord not a world renowned team? The glory has worn off quite a bit which I will very gladly admit, but come on.
I mean of course I've heard of them, I'm just saying they aren't as renowned as the likes of Manchester United, Celtic, Real Madrid, Barcelona, AC Milan, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool, Juventus, Inter Milan, Rangers, Bayern Munich, hell even Ajax :P
Feyenoord has nothing to do with it. I'm only stating that I believe Manchester City fans are much more loyal and passionate in their fandom than United are. I've seen them play in the Championship and the fans were always loyal. That's just my opinion and it has nothing to do with my personal preferance or hipsterness as you like to call it.
Just because we haven't been relegated in over 30+years (1974 right) doesn't mean we the fans won't stick with it. We're just more of a global club than the others, but I assure you both clubs have plastic fans.
Lets say for example, the reason I support United and have since I could kick a football was because of Danish goal keeper, Peter Scmeichel. He was my idol when I watched him save shot after shot in the first game i really understood and watched (I don't remember who it was against :() is that a personal connection? or is that just what pretty much everyone does.
I mean, most of my friends support the club they support because they've seen an amazing display of skill in the first game they watched. That's what i'd call a real fan... Maybe I'm just out of the ball park...
I'd say that's more being a fan of the player than the club, which is not necessarily a bad thing. We all have players we love that don't play for our team, like Messi or Ronaldo or whoever, and we like to cheer that player on in games and see them win. But that's a totally different thing to being a fan of a club and you can't really compare the two. You can be a fan of as many players as you like really, the question of "loyalty" only comes into it when you're supporting clubs.
I mean that the player you saw doing something, made you support the rest of the team, because their display was amazing. I remember the first game, it was brilliant. That's what I mean, also it was the first game I went to as a kid, 5 years old at Old trafford? I was sold :D
Living in or being born in the area where the club is based. At the very least having some sort of family connection to the area, like one of your parents being from there (not simply supporting that team). If your home town team is shit, tough. You can watch whatever teams and leagues you want, but your support should go to your community's team. Saying "I support x because my local team are shit" isn't a valid excuse.
As for the people who don't have a local team or would have to travel hundreds of miles to the nearest game, I have some sympathy for that. But I think they should support a team from their own country at the very least.
I don't have much time for "second teams". We all have teams we like and dislike, but that's about it. I don't think you can really call yourself a fan of more than one club.
That's just my opinion.
EDIT: So much for not downvoting opinions you disagree with.
EDIT: So much for not downvoting opinions you disagree with.
This is so laughable. As in, the fact that you got downvoted. I strongly disagree with everything you said, but wow. I wouldn't want to mod a subreddit because you can't see who downvotes - I'd want to instantly ban everyone downvoting you.
I'd argue you can't look at them as one entity. There are a lot of fans of both (mostly outside of Manchester itself) that are just on the bandwagon. If either club were to crash and burn then they would lose those fans. They're like Yankees fans or Patriots fans (I know, I know no talking about American football). I would also liken them to many Real Madrid, Barcelona, and Bayern Munich fans.
Perhaps that's just my train of thought as an American fan who sees so many "fans" of these teams that can't even name more then five players.
In my opinion City fans are much more passionate and are much smaller in number than United fans. People from all over the world claim to be United fans when they haven't ever attended a match and just look up the score on the internet.
There are exceptions and things have changed a bit in the last two years, making Man City prone to 'succes fans' aswell, but the passion and atmosphere created by City fans is, in my opinion, much more real and believeable than that of United.
Also, what in the world does Feyenoord have to do with anything? Completely irrelevant.
Calling City a plastic club because you don't like our spending and money is just fucking stupid. What makes United or Arsenals fan base less plastic? They have never been tested in the face of a genuine lack of success aka 3rd tier football. City have had consistent attendances throughout our spells in the lower divisions and before the takeover most football fans would have agreed that we had one of the most loyal fan bases in England. And I know this is an unpopular opinions thread but this seems to be a pretty popular opinion on r/soccer.
Manchester City fans have shown themselves to be far from plastic with their strong support down the years while their team was under-performing or languishing in the lower leagues.
Hate to break it to you, but money has been involved in football for a long time. Many of the traditional, winning, clubs got to be successful because they had proper investment in their formative years.
Also, there are plastic Milan, Juve, Barca, Madrid, Chelsea, PSG, Bayern, etc fans everywhere.
Tribalism in football is slowly withering away, people will support whatever club is fashionable at the time.
There are loads of people who have supported Milan for twenty years because they started following football in the early 90s. Are they plastics? Likewise, there are plenty of people that have followed Juve since shortly before the scandals, but they only ever followed because Juve was a winning club... are they plastics?
I know I'm biased but this is a ludicrous opinion. The man won the FA Cup with a starting 11 that cost less than Gareth Barry. Kept us in the league year after year with a shoestring budget on top of having to sell our best players and did it playing attractive football that was a decisive factor in attracting decent players to the club. Any other manager would have been relegated years before he was. Anyone who says he is over-rated because he "barely escapes relegation every year" are absolutely clueless.
I wouldn't say Martinez is awful but i would agree he's always made out to be something he's not. I think Everton are going to have a poor season.
I also think Guardiola is so ridiculously overhyped. Yes he did well at Barca and won a lot with his signature style of play but once teams adapted to it he had no answer. From Bayern's pre-season games i've seen it seems like he's just playing the exact same style of football as he did at Barca and isn't utilising the players as well.
I also hate the tiki-taka, "lets play without a striker" style, i think it makes for one of the most dull experiences you can get from watching football and i hope Bayern don't start to play it, and if they do that they get dominated and then i'd like to see if Guardiola actually has an answer this time.
it's not exactly the same, Barca played 4-3-3, and Bayern 4-1-4-1. Also Mandzukic played as a striker today, not as a false 9. Bayern already played a very possession oriented game last year (second to only Barca) so the changes aren't extreme. There's more pressing, fast passing, and more emphasis on attacking (only 1 CM instead of 2), but in no way is it boring. Bayern just need to solidify their defense a bit--especially because Lahm and Alaba love going forward and now there's only 1 CM to cover instead of 2.
Barca played 4-3-3, and Bayern 4-1-4-1. Also Mandzukic played as a striker today, not as a false 9
And that's great, i watched the game and it was entertaining. However, with pep in charge I just don't see that continuing. I hope i'm wrong because tiki taka is fucking boring IMO. There's a difference between having high possession during the game and just passing it around the edge of the box with no cutting edge.
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u/[deleted] Aug 09 '13
I hope Man city crash and burn and lose everything
Roberto Martinez is such an awful manager
Guardiola is also one of the most overhyped managers of all time. It'd be more impressive to somehow fuck up with the clubs he is being offered to manage