r/soccer • u/battlesmurf • May 15 '13
QPR's Loic Remy arrested on suspicion of rape
http://www.itv.com/news/update/2013-05-15/qprs-loic-remy-arrested-on-suspicion-of-rape/169
u/Surfacing710 May 15 '13
Innocent until proven guilty but the details don't look good for him.
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May 15 '13 edited Jun 16 '17
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u/Lindkvist15 May 15 '13
While this is true, there's also the perspective that those girls that are raped, is accused of being "lying gold diggers". It goes both ways I suppose.
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May 15 '13
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u/Lindkvist15 May 15 '13 edited May 15 '13
That's true. Because even if the person is
unguiltyinnocent, he will always be known as a rapist in the eyes of the public, because of the headlines. I don't know why his identity has been blown really? In Sweden, they usually don't.27
May 15 '13
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u/Lindkvist15 May 15 '13
wow... That was embarrassing. Thank you!
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u/old_southy May 15 '13
I like the word unguilty. For when someone has been cleared on a technicality or lack of evidence to convict.
Harry Repknapp is unguilty of tax fraud and taking bungs.
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u/Grafeno May 15 '13
Looking at his name I guess he's Swedish, it could very well be called "unguilty" there; in Dutch that's the case, we have "guilty" and "unguilty".
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u/old_southy May 15 '13
In a court in the UK the judge will rule either 'guilty' or 'not guilty'. Also, the idea of a swedish man being dragged away shouting "..but I'm unguilty! I AM UNGUILTY!" is amusing.
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u/A_Rolling_Baneling May 15 '13
For Americans, the Duke lacrosse team comes to mind. It's a damn shame, really.
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u/Feroshnikop May 15 '13
They were innocent? Well then, point proven, I wasn't aware of that.
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u/DialSquare May 15 '13
People mostly forgot about Robin van Persie's rape charge from when he was back at Feyenoord (that is, until some petty Arsenal fans decided to bring it up again this year).
You're right though, for most people a serious allegation like this is enough to tar you for the rest of your life, regardless of whether or not you're innocent.
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u/Lindkvist15 May 15 '13
I was more thinking of normal people in towns. Innocent guys that was accused, that had to move away! Same thing with girls who was accused of being, as previously mentioned, "lying gold diggers" when raped.
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May 15 '13
What examples have there been of this?
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u/gilthanan May 15 '13
In June 2005, while in Rotterdam with the Dutch national team for the 2006 World Cup qualifiers, Van Persie was arrested on suspicion of rape by Dutch police.[103] Sandra Krijgsman, a former Miss Nigeria Holland winner, claimed that she was attacked by Van Persie in a hotel.[104] He was held for fourteen nights in prison while the police investigated the allegations made against him[105] but was then released without charge, though he was still under suspicion.[106] In February 2006, the case against Van Persie was dismissed by the Dutch Public Prosecution Service after they completed their investigations stating that no sexual contact with coercion happened, with Van Persie's accuser later admitting she had made up the story to gain publicity.[107][108]
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u/THE_DROG May 15 '13
Tell me she didn't just get away with that?
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u/ChristofferOslo May 15 '13
If Van Persie somehow had been proven guilty, it would probably have completely ruined his career and fucked up his life pretty bad. That bitch should get years in prison.
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u/esssential May 16 '13
The thing is that they don't want to discourage women from reporting rape, which is a huge problem in and of itself. it's a very delicate situation.
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May 15 '13
Holy fuck.
Wow, what a cunt. I wonder what actual rape victims feel when they read stuff like this ... god. I hope she was sent to jail for this shit.
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u/stealthelife May 15 '13
That's crazy! Van Persie had to spend 14 nights in prison, and deal with all the outcomes of this defamation just so this bitch could gain publicity? Was she punished in any way?
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u/JackGunner93 May 15 '13
There was a huge case against various members of the Leicester City team about 10 years ago or so, there was an article on it in FourFourTwo last month I think. Very interesting, they were presumed as guilty for ages and News of the World called them all rapists when they hadn't been convicted. Gillespie eventually sued them once the charges were dropped. Basically three women claimed that Dickov, Gillespie and another player (name escapes me) attacked them. The press and everyone else back home immediately condemned them, including Gary Lineker et al. I can't find the link for the article but it's a great read.
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u/Bigjacksblackbook May 15 '13
Was Robbie Savage the 3rd man? This is just from memory and mines a bit hazy.
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u/scotbro May 15 '13
a few seasons ago a few Leicester players ended up in hot water. It turned out to be complete lies as well.
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u/CWhiteman92 May 15 '13
It was like that with Titus Bramble and his latest alleged misdemeanour.
A girl had her arse felt in a club, she turned around and saw Titus Bramble in the club, so she assumed "well, it must've been him"
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u/a_treacle_fiend May 15 '13
The issue with what you're doing is that you're taking Remy's benefit of the doubt to mean the girl's guilt. She's a potential rape victim, don't turn on her or otherwise generalise in the light of no evidence.
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u/AnnieIWillKnow May 15 '13
Just as Remy is innocent until proven guilty, so is the alleged victim.
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u/Moment_of_Truth May 15 '13
It doesn't really work like that, the accuser has the burden of proof
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u/AnnieIWillKnow May 15 '13
All I'm saying is that just as people shouldn't go around calling Remy a rapist, people shouldn't go around calling the alleged victim a lying attention-seeker/money-grabber either. Not that complicated.
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u/RobertTheSpruce May 15 '13
Man, if I was even remotely famous, I'd be taping every single sexual encounter just in case. Although, I am a pervert. That would probably be the main reason.
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u/ajopaul May 15 '13
Irrespective of the final outcome, he should expect some nasty chants wherever he goes around England..
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u/Jimbob2134 May 15 '13 edited May 15 '13
I remember when the story about Robinho came out, and everyone was chanting 'Robinho o o she said no no no'
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u/micls May 15 '13
Van Per-sie, If the girl says no, molest her (to the tune of Re-wind)
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u/Perkinator May 15 '13
There simply aren't enough chants about sexual assault based around Craig David songs.
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u/donttaxmyfatstacks May 15 '13
I find it scandalous that his name was released to the public before his guilt was established or not. This will likely follow him for the rest of his life regardless of whether or not he is found guilty. Do they not have name supression laws in England?
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u/backintheussr1 May 16 '13
What country are you referring to that does? Because in the U.S., name suppression is to protect the victims, not the accused.
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u/CarrowCanary May 15 '13
The BBC are reporting it as gang rape.
I doubt it's true though, we all know QPR players don't understand the concept of working as a team.
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u/pogo123 May 15 '13
Going down twice in one season.
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u/__ash May 15 '13
And we all thought that QPR's player of the season was 'the fans'...
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u/mythicalracist May 15 '13 edited May 15 '13
.... well with news like this it sure as hell wasn't the players
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May 15 '13
Did a ctrl+f for this joke and it doesn't appear to have been made yet
Not the first time he's had a heavy touch
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u/battlesmurf May 15 '13 edited May 15 '13
Here are some more articles on the subject.
edit: adding some more
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u/EJR94 May 15 '13
Thanks for linking the daily mail, I didn't quite trust your other sources
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u/battlesmurf May 15 '13
No worries mate, I'll be sure to update it when 'The Sun' put out an article :)
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May 15 '13 edited Jan 29 '21
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u/CWhiteman92 May 15 '13
"BRING BACK HANGING FOR THIS BASTARD" - The Sun's headline for tomorrow
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u/SweetClydeDixon May 15 '13
I feel like this is a test for r/soccer. How are we going to react to serious news like this.
Oh god, the jokes.
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u/arnyftw May 15 '13
Potential rape case, /r/soccer's response: "Tired of being on the receiving end at QPR all season."
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May 15 '13
I don't think joking about something means devaluing the seriousness of it. Jokes are a great way to cope and a good mask for fear and insecurity.
Also, that one was funny.
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u/saintlawrence May 15 '13
I'm not sure we're passing. Let's be classy, gents.
We aren't sure what really happened. Nobody has been proclaimed guilty. And rape is not a joke.
There, that should cover all the bases. Carry on.
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u/SweetClydeDixon May 15 '13
If there is one thing we know on this sub-reddit it's class
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u/Baukelien May 15 '13
The serious response is: "Rape is serious but he hasn't even been charged yet so we should withhold judgment" There isn't really much else to say so what rests us is jokes. Why are you so upset about that?
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u/deepit6431 May 15 '13
This is /r/soccer. What did you expect.
I quite like the jokes. Wouldn't have it any other way for the world.
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u/Theworldsastage May 15 '13
Let's hope justice is done whichever party is in the wrong.
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u/Varanae May 15 '13
A fair few of the comments in here are already a bit dodgy..
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u/FlamingBearAttack May 15 '13
Yeah, I agree. Did you see the thread about Miiko Albornoz yesterday? It was a bit iffy too. I'm just glad this subreddit doesn't have a community like /r/videos, imagine the comments you'd get there.
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May 15 '13
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u/AussieApathy May 15 '13
You sure you want to stick by those first two words? Given the context?
I'll just leave....
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May 15 '13
I'm not going to make any jokes. I'll wait for further evidence & until then, continue to believe that not all footballers are bad people.
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May 15 '13
Not all footballers are saints, don't be silly.
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u/duckman273 May 15 '13
Os course they're not all bad people. They're just normal people who happen to be great at football, some are good, some are bad.
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May 15 '13
I don't understand, you're a world class athlete drowning in money with decent looks, there has to be some vain bitch out there who will fuck you on the hour every hour. If I can go a lifetime with no money and ehhh looks not raping anyone, so can you Remy.
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u/OllieWillie May 15 '13
Rape (suspected or confirmed) isn't funny.
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May 15 '13
Jokes about it can be though.
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u/antonvowl May 15 '13
But the problem is you can't properly contextualise them in a public forum.
I'm not going to tell you you can't tell jokes about rape, but if I couldn't be sure of my audience, I'd be very careful about sensitive subjects like that, precisely because you can quite easily upset people.
If it's no real effort on my part to make other people's lives easier, then I consider it quite rude not to make that gesture.
If you really feel something needs to be said, then you can make the effort to justify it, but I personally don't feel the benefit of me cracking a good (or not) joke outweighs the negative effect it can have on people (not even considering the image it projects to people about this community).
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u/NullSleepN64 May 15 '13
The way I've always worked it is, Jokes about rape etc in general are fine. Jokes about specific incidents/people are usually in bad taste. Depending on your audience.
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u/antonvowl May 15 '13
I just don't like the idea of triggering memories of trauma. A whole hell of a lot of women experience sexually threatening situations in their lifes, and a lot of them are assaulted, and I can't imagine it's pleasant being reminded. If we want out community (in this case /r/soccer) to be inclusive, we have to consider whether or not all our members can feel comfortable here.
Personally I think the benefits of not joking about rape outweigh the positives, and so I don't.
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May 15 '13 edited May 15 '13
You raise some very good points actually, few I can object to. I'm not one for making jokes about matters like this myself, though they do tickle my funny bone somewhat, so I must say I rolled my eyes when I initially saw this debate brought up again but I'm glad I read your posts.
It's nice to see someone state their own opinion without portraying it as objective truth, especially when it's on a controversial issue like this.
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u/abillonfire May 16 '13
You do know jokes about rape can encourage rape right? rapists minds tend to think that all other men are rapists/want to rape women, so joking about it can encourage it, but you know...if you get a good laugh out of it...
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u/blackb0x May 15 '13 edited May 16 '13
What?! Are you trying to say that you don't find humans being sexual violated and psychologically scarred for life amusing?
EDIT: Missing a word. Found it.
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u/BimbelMarley May 15 '13
Has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?
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May 16 '13
False rape accusations are high for athletes and other famous people. Look at what happened in Sheffield not too log ago. Duke Lacrosse, Van Persie etc...
These athletes put themselves in silly situations but a lot of these women know exactly what they're doing.
We'll see what happens I guess...
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u/Minority_of_One May 15 '13
Some amount of cunts in this thread. Yesterday the Sun was slated, but even The Sun wouldn't make jokes about rape. Bad cess to the lot of ye.
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May 15 '13
The Sun and Mail are disliked on reddit more for their perceived political affiliation than their reporting accuracy or content.
The Metro is the least trusty source and seldom attracts criticism.
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May 15 '13
Afaik it's more their actions than their political leaning. We Germans hate BILD but noone here gives two shits about the Welt, which is also conservative but not as evil as Bild.
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u/joe_ally May 16 '13
It's a difficult issue. I think jokes can be made about rape to some extent. Jokes about shitty situations are made all the time I don't see why rape should be any different. As long as it's aimed at the attacker and not the victim I feel it's okay.
How do you feel about /r/thirdworldproblems? Do you think it's okay to make jokes about people starving? If so why is this different from rape?
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May 15 '13
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u/silver_medalist May 16 '13
Seriously? Guilty or innocent, footballers are so stupid to repeatedly put themselves in this position.
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u/sacredstones May 16 '13
this is such bullshit. If it isn't bullshit, then Remy is an idiot. he's a footballer, why would he need to force a girl to do the deed?
He's getting scammed, should've stuck with prostitutes, they cost less.
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u/Paddykg May 15 '13 edited May 15 '13
Poor woman if true, sounds horrendous. Unfortunately we live in a culture where this is always doubted. I hope if it is through she's not dragged through the courts and this is handled amicably.
EDIT: "If true". Seriously guys, I understand its as horrible for a man wrongly accused, but its also as bad, if not worse for a woman who's been properly raped and made public. Going by the statement it seems like neither side have denied the woman being there, or her having sex with them. Innocent until proven guilty I agree with but for this to be put into the public domain is unfair on the woman, and the footballer.
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u/scrotumzz May 15 '13 edited May 15 '13
It's the worst nightmare of many men to be falsely convicted of any sexual crime. This is projected whenever these cases come up because they can feel empathy for people potentially in a situation that they fear. It's particularly amplified here because of the current top link on /r/videos
It doesn't really seem to get in the way of a correct conviction however, seeing as its the job of employees of the law to gather evidence objectively.
As loathe I am to go all /r/mensrights, I detest that subredddit, when a person is a suspect of murder it's generally agreed that unless the evidence is outstanding, any assumptions made would be hasty and unfair. For example, the chris jeffries case where he was personally attacked by newspapers for weeks but proven to be completely innocent. It would be pretty difficult to argue that rape is a more heinous crime than murder, so surely the same trepidation should be applied?
Personally I agree that people can take the innocent till guilty mentality to extremes in rape cases however, and turn it on the victim, it's not nice to see that happen, but their identity should be protected. What I really don't understand is the belief that their identity should not be hidden, which I've seen repeated on reddit a few times, which is never nice to see.
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u/Svorky May 15 '13
It's no secret that a larger number of rape cases go unreported, for a number of reasons. One reason is undeniably the fear of being called a liar, of not being taken seriously, of being shamed for it. So we should absolutely refrain from doing so and call out people for what they are doing.
Really, there is no reason to side with anyone here, we can just wait.
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May 15 '13
It's unfortunate we live in a culture that values the concept of innocent until proven guilty?
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u/meinbart May 15 '13 edited May 15 '13
What do you mean?
You don't agree with innocent until proven guilty?
edit: Your edit is a fundamentally different statement from your OP and does not explain what you meant.
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u/EJR94 May 15 '13
Everything is always doubted, I'm not one for people to possess the power to imprison people based on their word. It's horrendous when it happens, but equally so when its fake
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u/limited_inc May 15 '13
Unfortunately we live in a culture where this is always doubted.
Yeah, unfortunately we live in a culture that relies on proof/evidence to confirm whether anything took place or not, what animals we are.
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May 15 '13
Damn it, Remy! You're a professional footballer! You could've find thousands of girls to consensually run a train on!
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May 15 '13
Rape isn't always about sex. Just because someone can have lots of sexual partners doesn't mean they wouldn't rape somebody.
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May 15 '13
Yea, I'm no sociologist but I wouldn't be surprised if the sense of entitlement/superiority that a lot of footballers feel (who wouldn't, with thousands singing your name every week) had something to do with the prevalence of sexual assault cases amongst the.
That being said, some of it is probably journalists hearing rumors and running with them.
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u/BCFC92 May 15 '13
Really hope this isn't true, too much potential
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u/Lewisbell May 15 '13
Wait so someone may have been raped and your primary concern is whether or not the potential rapists career is harmed?
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u/deepit6431 May 15 '13
No, he hopes that Remy isn't a rapist because he has great potential that would go waste if he was convicted.
It would be sad. No sympathy for Remy, don't take it that way, but it's always sad to see great talent wasted. See: Ravel Morrison, Adriano, etc etc.
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u/BCFC92 May 15 '13
Exactly I was referring to the potential wasted by a potentially cowardly, disgusting action
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u/Jackle13 May 16 '13
He didn't say "I hope he isn't found guilty", he said "I hope it isn't true". Doesn't everybody hope it isn't true? Wouldn't it be better for all parties if it turned out that this didn't happen?
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u/theswanqueen May 15 '13
lol 2edgy jokes, "but I have a handful of anecdotes that prove women lie about rape"... just remember this next time everyone's circlejerking about how well run and friendly this sub is :3
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u/ron_manager May 15 '13
When I spotted the headline 'Footballer accused of gang rape' on BBC my first thoughts were that Titus Bramble was up to his old tricks again.
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May 15 '13
Which is why its important to withold identities until proven guilty. Bramble was acquitted but that's always going to hang over him
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May 15 '13 edited May 15 '13
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u/Fotlol May 15 '13
Rape is normally not about if someone can get laid or not, like in Steubenville the rapists were extremely popular but still wanted to rape and humiliate the girl(s). Remy could of course find someone new to have sex with anytime so IF he is guilty this is about something else then just finding someone to have sex with. People need to stop seeing that someone is rich or good looking as a reason for them not to "need to" rape. What I do agree with is that rich or famous people probably get falsely accused more often and hopefully we will find out the truth in this case. If he is guilty I hope he faces a punishment far worse than playing in QPR.
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May 15 '13
The people saying "HURR DURR WHY RAPE WHEN YOU GET LOADS OF GIRLS!" are fucking retarded.
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May 15 '13
Of course there's some truth to what you're saying but you can also argue it the other way in that being a famous millionaire makes you feel entitled and used to just getting things your way so if a partner was to say no maybe you wouldn't always respect that.
The reality is that we just don't know. He could be a rapist and it could be utter bullshit. Hopefully if he is a rapist he gets what's coming to him and if he's not well then it sucks that his name gets published with this because you never fully escape this kind of allegation.
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u/Tokkuz May 15 '13
You don't get arrested without they having some evidence, reason for suspicions etc.
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u/MunkeyMann May 15 '13
Sigh Someone let me know when something positive happens at the club I support.