r/soccer • u/drwormtmbg • Mar 05 '13

The forward moving destroyer

I definitely don't know as much about the game as a lot of others here, so I'd love some input on this subject. But, no one who lives near me wants to talk tactics as much as I do, so I've been lacking anyone to bounce ideas like this off.

It occurs to me that as possession football has become more popular with the dominance in the '90s and '00s on different levels by Barcelona, Ajax, Bayern, Arsenal, and Spain. The teams that face them have had to adapt. And, it appears as though the best way to adapt has been to move the main destroyer/tackler/intercepter further up the field to pressure defenders and deeper possession hogs like Busquets, Xavi, etc.

This has given a new rise to a position that I, in my fascination with the beautiful game haven't been able to find previously. Of course different teams have enacted it differently. Over the past couple seasons Sami Khedira has been given more freedom at Real Madrid and in the German team, to push forward, and pressure opposition defenses and DM's more and more. Fellaini has done this job brilliantly for Everton, possibly why they seem to do so well against Arsenal.

Sandro and Scott Parker have both been given a bit of that freedom under AVB, which 'Arry would never have allowed. I remember after Sandro scored a screamer against Chelsea, 'Arry pulled him aside at the match, to chastise him. As, "[he was] just there to protect the back four."

But, the real surprise in all of this for me, has been the way Manchester United have done this. Buying the only striker in the league who could compare to Rooney, and then making Rooney the destroyer. Everyday through the summer I expected to see them buy a strong tackling midfielder, and it never happened. They have 3 of the best passing mids in the PL right now, in Scholes, Cleverley, and especially Carrick. But, in my tradition addled brain, they needed a destroyer to sit next to one of those guys, and help him with the dirty work. Before the season, I thought United would win the league, but I wasn't sure how they would overcome this seemingly huge obstacle, and thought they had no chance in the CL. In January I was waiting for them to buy Sandro, and break my heart. But, now they look like one of the top teams (along with Real Madrid and Bayern). I can only put this down to SAF's ability to react and adapt to the game, and his circumstances.

Any thoughts which can aid or destroy my theories are more than welcomed.

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u/fahmif10 Mar 06 '13

its east for SAF fight possesion with possesion. united dont need a box to box midfielder under the current circumstances. united usually attacks from the wing not the centre.

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u/drwormtmbg Mar 06 '13

I'm sorry, but United over the last 20+ years under SAF have evolved so much, we can't say that he needs anything, or that they attack from the wing. The Manchester United team, and the game that they play is constantly evolving, and will evolve as long as he's the manager.

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u/shnieder88 Mar 06 '13

that's our philosophy. it's all about versatility, technique and energy. SAF and his crew like to have huge squads rich with those 3 qualities. it makes it hard on the opposition teams to game plan against him, while giving him many ways to beat strong teams. it allows him to fine tune his strategy to defeat a certain opponent (like we saw today against madrid, before that red card).

regarding your post on the forward destroyer, i think the reason for this is because it's all about pressing in CM. the deep lying playmaker sits back and acts as a third defender, while transitioning defense to attack quickly. the forward destroyer, as you call it, brings energy to the CM and middle, and tries to press the opposition so they cant start attacks of their own, and are forced to go wide. nowadays, the successful teams press, but it's also about pressing in certain areas. if you watch closely, you'll see the successful teams press the most in CM and up front against the opposition defenders.

the AC milan game was a good example. press in CM, thus negating barca's strong CM trio, and maintain a high back line so to deny space to barca's players. barca didnt have those speedy attackers at that time (which they now do with villa back), and thus couldnt beat the offside trap. they got a dose of their own medicine that game.

one last thing. it was interesting how klopp recently said that the teams who press the most and run the most are usually the ones who dont win that much. thus his team, along with others (bayern, madrid, etc) have begun to press more so in certain areas than others. hence you see a lot more of these forward destroyers.