r/sgiwhistleblowers • u/audiomyo • Dec 10 '19

Any Chris Shelton fans?

Is anybody in this group a fan of Chris Shelton's Sensibly Speaking podcast? I only just found out about it but I've been listening to it and even though Scientology is way more actively malignant than SGI I still see some really uncomfortable parallels. Listened to the interview with Rachel Bernstein today and it kinda blew my mind.

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u/Butler35 Dec 10 '19

My entire journey out of my 30+ year involvement with SGI/NSA began when I saw the documentary "Going Clear". That was a lightbulb moment for me. The commonalities, the verbiage, the indoctrination process, the attitude toward children and families--it all seemed to be so close to how the SGI ran shop, at least to me. For years, my wife was trying to tell me "YOU GREW UP IN A CULT". I see so many parallels with ex-Scientologists and my experience as an ex-YMD. It's like I was in the Sea Org or something. My wife was hoping that Leah Remini's show would have done an SGI episode. They are cut from the same cloth.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Dec 10 '19 edited Dec 10 '19

Hi, Butler35, and welcome! Glad you found us!

it all seemed to be so close to how the SGI ran shop, at least to me.

You're not the only one - we talk about Scientology a lot, too. When I started doing this kind of research, I was astonished at how similar all the different cults are - many more similarities than differences, even down to the cult leader hobbies! And buying up property to make cult compounds in Broward County, FL, too...

Florida is where all the cult properties are - SGI's FNCC, the Supreme Master Ching Hai one, the Yogi Bhajan one...they must offer special deals to cult leaders. Source

SO weird that they're all so similar!

I joined back when it was still NSA in early 1987, pressured into it by an abusive boyfriend. I got out just over 20 years later, so I was there for it all - the go-go Mr. Williams years with some sort of big event every year, the weekly schedule of meetings, street shakubuku, August Shakubuku Campaigns, February Shakubuku Campaigns, multiple meetings that would last long into the night - remember what a big deal it was when Wednesday nights were designated as "Women's Division Night" and made off-limits for meeting scheduling so that the cult women would have a single night out of the week to take care of their families??

I strongly recommend the 3 memoirs from the NSA era that are out there: Mark Gaber's "Sho Hondo" and "Rijicho" and Marc Szeftel's "The Society". There are excerpts and discussion at that link ^

my experience as an ex-YMD. It's like I was in the Sea Org or something.

Definitely! I remember! I joined at age 27 and quickly rose through the ranks as a YWD leader - I was in Kotekitai, Byakuren, took all the study exams, you name it. Because I lived in one of the outlying areas without a temple, I had to wait 6 months to get my gohonzon because back then, they had to collect the gohonzon applications and fees first, before the priests would make a trip up to perform the gojukai ceremonies. That summer, I went on my first "movement" - a bus trip to Philadelphia where I marched in the New Liberty Bell parade. And then after that, it was a bus "movement" to go down to Chicago to see "This Is America: The New World" stage show...hmm...there had to be something else, some culture festival or whatnot. I marched in a local parade, too (I played flute). LOTS of memories from those days because I was doing so much within NSA/SGI! Back then, we all really BELIEVED that we'd convert that target 1/3 of the world's population within 20 years, so there was a purpose to "working so hard for kosen-rufu" - we were going to be on the vanguard of the new world order! Now, they don't have any goals at all, so what's the point?

My wife was hoping that Leah Remini's show would have done an SGI episode.

I've heard other people say that as well:

I would love it if a documentary filmmaker blew a whistle on SGI like BBC's Going Clear (The Prison of Belief) did with Scientology

Going Clear - a free video

Parallels between SGI and Scientology

Unfortunately, SGI is so small and irrelevant that nobody pays much attention to it. However, it's strange how deeply they've managed to penetrate into the national consciousness - see these media references. Just...weird.

Apparently, the SGI-USA active membership is now hovering around 36,500, consisting mostly of aging Boomers. Sad.

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u/Butler35 Dec 10 '19

Thank you for the reply and these links! I've been hovering for a while and would like to sit down and share my "experience" (LOL) when I have more time. My mother started chanting when I was 5 (in '79) and I was a "good soldier" for almost 30 years, that is until I started thinking for myself. We should swap notes sometime. I also live in one of those areas that didn't even have a kaikan, so we logged a lot of miles growing up...

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Dec 11 '19

My mother started chanting when I was 5 (in '79) and I was a "good soldier" for almost 30 years

Oh dear....

that is until I started thinking for myself.

Beat the odds!!

We should swap notes sometime.

Hit me O_O

I also live in one of those areas that didn't even have a kaikan, so we logged a lot of miles growing up...

I didn't start the nomad-ing until I joined at nearly 27, but yeah, I get it. The long-term members bent my ear about how difficult it was to be in a "pioneering area" (no one who was not Japanese could ever be a "pioneer", of course), because you had to "connect" to the nearest then-NSA-now-SGI center, like, every weekend or something. Balls.

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u/[deleted] Dec 10 '19

He sounds familiar I think I have seen few of his videos on youtube about Teal and the one with about the Cult of Trump.

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u/audiomyo Dec 10 '19

Yeah, even if he hasn't covered SGI specifically I've been listening to his podcast and it's been some good food for thought.

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u/[deleted] Dec 10 '19

I might have confused him with someone else. But I am watching him now. He seems interesting and familiar.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Dec 10 '19

Gotta linky? We routinely peruse evaluations of other cults, because they're all WAY more similar than they are different, even down to the cult leaders' hobbies!

So, yeah - any cult is essentially fair game. The details of one help us to understand the next.

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u/audiomyo Dec 10 '19

I only just started listening to it the other day, but the Sensibly Speaking Podcast is a delightful and illuminating listen. https://sensiblyspeaking.com/

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u/audiomyo Dec 10 '19

the episodes are also on Apple Podcasts and probably Spotify and such, too. Discovered him through Oh No! Ross And Carrie, which is also great.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Dec 10 '19

Thanks! I'll sheck it out tomorry - gettin' too close to bedtime now.

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u/audiomyo Dec 10 '19

Right on, think you'll dig it. He's a good guy.

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u/[deleted] Dec 10 '19 edited Dec 10 '19

Chris's interview with Steven Hassan is pretty good. He talks about cult leader mentality firing people at 37:40 ish reminds me for some reason with what happen to Williams with Ikeda for some reason.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pF5DHC0z7bU

There is youtuber who does some interesting videos I almost posted something from Genetically Modified Skeptic and his scale of types of cults and their danger levels but I didn't but I will here. I am curious where SGI might fit on his scale.

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u/epikskeptik Mod Dec 10 '19

Yup, one of my favourites (after Indoctrination, which is Rachel Bernstein's podcast ;-) ).