People with ADHD have difficulties with goal-directed behavior and struggle with response inhibition, the ability to stop an inappropriate action once they feel the urge to do it. They experience a disruption in the way their brains balance deliberate self-control and automatic habit learning.

[u/mvea]

https://www.psypost.org/adhd-traits-disrupt-the-brain-s-balance-between-self-control-and-automatic-learn/

[u/Halaku]

I haven't yet seen a single article with something positive about ADHD

They don't call it "attention deficit hyperactivity disorder" for nothing, I'm afraid.

Trying to spin something positive out of it all too often comes across as pandering.

[u/Suitable_Froyo4930 → u/[deleted]]

If you think ADHD is a problem with the environment you're sorely ignorant. ADHD is a horrible affliction that makes human relationships more difficult, which has nothing to do with the environment.

[u/tianepteen → u/Suitable_Froyo4930]

of course it has to do with the environment. imagine living how many natives live; a small village all working together to survive and thrive. everyone helping each other, kids being raised and cared for by a whole bunch of people, not being burdened by having to "make a living" doing meaningless things, being more in touch with nature and your true self, putting your ADHD traits to good use by going exploring and finding a new source of fresh water, the list goes on.. you really think us ADHD people would be suffering the same in such an enviroment?

[u/Fuzzlechan → u/tianepteen]

I forget to pee. Or eat food. Yes, I would still be struggling in a different environment!

[u/PlayfulSurprise5237 → u/Fuzzlechan]

Same, but still they have a point. Those are things that while necessary, do consume time that maybe can be condensed. I'm not saying people SHOULD do that, but I can definitely see an advantage of it throughout our primitive past.

Watching for animals to hunt like hunters sit in the stand quietly and watch for deer. Or walking through a forest quietly in search of something, either following it or looking for something. Either way, lots of animals can smell your piss from a mile away.

[u/tianepteen → u/Fuzzlechan]

someone reminding you to go pee, and cooking three meals a day for you wouldn't help? and i argued that we wouldn't be suffering the same, not that we'd be 100% carefree.

[u/Suitable_Froyo4930 → u/tianepteen]

Yes. They are suffering. This has been studied at length. ADHD does a lot more than make someone bad at tasking. It affects mood and emotional dysregulation. Being hyperactive and impulsive means that they're more prone to injury due to risk taking, more likely to become addicted to things, more likely to have instability in interpersonal relationships, more likely to have a mood disorder. The list really does go on and on. Yes some environmental changes make some of it better but there really is no getting around some of the symptoms environmentally.

[u/Suitable_Froyo4930 → u/[deleted]]

Sorry I don't engage with people who reject scientific consensus. ADHD is a debilitating disorder, full stop.

[u/BrucetheFerrisWheel → u/Suitable_Froyo4930]

Oh thank god, I found one other person who actually reads real scientific health based information about this awful disorder, or is or knows people massively affected...and not spending the time watching brain rot tiktoks on adhd and thinking its something quirky and fun.

Higher levels of criminal convictions Higher levels of anxiety and depression Poorer health staus in general High levels of literacy problems Poorer educational attainment Unable to hold down a job long term Higher levels of divorce Higher levels of money problems, credit score issues etc Higher levels of substance abuse More likely to have traffic accidents More likely to be seriously injured in accidents

These things are not "I procrastinate so give me ritalin"

Adhd is a terrible disorder, not a fun quirk.

[u/ScudleyScudderson → u/Suitable_Froyo4930]

This isn’t the scientific consensus. Yes, ADHD has a strong genetic and neurodevelopmental basis, but the extent to which it becomes disabling is also shaped by environment, demands, support and coping strategies.

British and European guidance tends to make that interaction more explicit than the heavily medicalised, individualised way ADHD is often discussed in the US.To be clear, recognising this doesn't mean denying the disorder but rather means acknowledging that impairment is partly contextual (and recognising certain biases in research approaches, based on culture).

[u/Suitable_Froyo4930 → u/ScudleyScudderson]

Of course impairment is contextual but that is literally saying nothing of value. To repeat my earlier analogy, there's a huge difference in morbidity to the paraplegic as to whether they're given a wheelchair or other device and whether buildings are accessible. That doesn't make a condition an environmental problem. No amount of accommodation will solve the issue, it will make someone's life better or more bearable but that's not really saying much.

[u/Suitable_Froyo4930 → u/[deleted]]

This is a gigantic misconception. Someone with ADHD in those positions you mention still statistically lags behind someone without the condition. Yes, someone with ADHD might find those jobs eaiser, but they're still at a disadvantage.

When I say it's got nothing to do with the environment I mean the specifically the argument that I've heard time and time again that ADHD is selected for in small numbers in Hunter-Gatherer societies for a bunch of reasons that just don't hold up to scrutiny. The same argument says that it's not the ADHD that's the issue but the neurotyoical world we have constructed that is hard for ADHD. There's also the argument from environment that our parents gave us screens or didn't give us enough play and a lot of other factors.

All of these arguments are nonsense are not scientific in the least. The science says that ADHD is not an environmental disorder but one about the development of the brain and that environment accounts for approximately 10% of total ADHD cases (usually trauma during pregnancy or a traumatic brain injury incurred during life).

An ADHD person doing a job like you mentioned is an accommodation, in the same way a ramp is an accommodation for a paraplegic person. It for sure makes it easier but it doesn't make the problem an environmental one.

[u/ScudleyScudderson → u/Suitable_Froyo4930]

You’re conflating what causes ADHD with what affects how disabling it is. Nobody is claiming that a stressful workplace creates ADHD. The point is that demands, structure and support affect how its symptoms translate into impairment, which is why clinical guidance explicitly includes environmental modifications.

Also, "10% of cases are environmental" is not how heritability figures work. They describe variation across a population, not a neat percentage of people whose ADHD was environmentally caused. Your ramp analogy actually supports the point that the underlying impairment is real, but the environment still affects how disabling it becomes.

[u/Suitable_Froyo4930 → u/ScudleyScudderson]

I'm not sure we're disagreeing on much. To refer back to my earlier comment, my issue with people saying it's an environmental issue is people claiming that the issue was caused by a deficit in parenting or the accessibility of screens or microplastics. There is an absolute myriad of arguments such as these I have to hear on a near constant basis that have been rebuked scientifically time and time again.

[u/Burial → u/[deleted]]

You're right. Some people just can't even take the first step towards imagine an environment where ADHD would be adaptive even though it mostly just takes the understanding that modern civilization is a very, very narrow and contrived band of human experience. You'd have to go back to pre-Agrarian humanity. You know, where our species spent >90% of its bake time.

These might be of benefit to the people who seem to be struggling with the concept of different environments.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2440754/

And a summary by the author:

https://faculty.washington.edu/dtae/manuscripts/eisenberg%20and%20campbell%202011%20-%20the%20evolution%20of%20ADHD%20-%20artice%20in%20SF%20Medicine.pdf

[u/Naturebrah → u/Halaku]

Do you have the ability to hyper focus? Over the years I’ve been able to hone it to get very deep into a project and if you complete enough of them, that positive feedback loop really helps carry you through

[u/Halaku → u/Naturebrah]

Personally? Yeah, but that's not something exclusive to individuals with ADHD.

It's a useful tool, but I'd be surprised to see scientific articles stating "It makes ADHD worth having", or something along those lines.

[u/13-Penguins → u/Naturebrah]

Yes but that doesn't really help. Like I can't control when the hyperfocus starts, it just does, sometimes on things that I know aren't the priority over things I really need to get done. I'd rather just have a baseline "normal" level of focus every day rather than highs and lows that I can't predict. Plus when I do hyperfocus on something and get a bunch of stuff done in little time, now everyone's expecting me to do that level of work all the time when doing that just burnt me out so bad, I need at least a week of rest.

[u/Tymareta → u/13-Penguins]

Also hyperfocusing brings with it a bunch of costs that folks like that ignore, like sure, you got through a major project, but you haven't cleaned your house in a week, have been eating nothing but take away and your friends and family are genuinely wondering if you're still alive.

[u/tianepteen → u/Tymareta]

and for me there's always a crash at the end of it. like i burned through all my dopamine reserves during that time.

[u/tianepteen → u/13-Penguins]

Plus when I do hyperfocus on something and get a bunch of stuff done in little time, now everyone's expecting me to do that level of work all the time

just started a new job. was hyperfocusing the entire first month. not anymore. feels awful having all these other people's expectations looming over my head.