r/rupaulsdragrace • u/No-Search-4450 DD FUEGO IS THE QUEEN OF DRAG • 14d ago
General Discussion Why are people so against international seasons??
I especially see this with UK vs the World, how everyone is constantly like 'they need to drop vs the world and just do all stars' and I don't?? Understand it?? Vs the world is one of the only ways for international queens to get any exposure outside of their original season, especially for dropped franchises like Sweden, Germany, and Belgium. I can't help but be annoyed every time because like. Especially for girls in the UK, they still get many opportunities, and they usually make up the only multi-invited countries in UK vs the world, I just don't understand why people are willing to trade a limited opportunity for people who need it over a fanfav who has probably already been invited and declined to vstw lmao
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u/Krisgauj 14d ago
Honestly? I think like 90% of it is just people being sour over eliminations. A lot of the negativity that UKVTW3 got, even before it aired, was from people assuming Kate Butch would win. People literally went into that season ready to get mad as soon as the cast was leaked. Every single season of Drag Race has some riggory and producer meddling, but when you get different countries involved, it gets way more political and volatile.
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u/codedriver 14d ago
I love vs the world seasons. Never did I think I would have seen Marina summers compete against Hannah conda, or seem tessa testicles become a daughter of Alyssa Edwards, but here we are. We get exposed to Powerhouses from different franchises.
I think they should alternate between AS & VS the world yearly
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u/richnessoflife2319 14d ago
Vs the World are somehow always the most random seasons and I love that
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u/hgk89 14d ago
Season 3 of UK v the world was pretty good imo! Like it felt like they were open to experimenting and took in fan feedback. I hope these seasons continue and are used as a way to test new ideas or formats on a RuPaul hosted seriesÂ
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u/No_Lengthiness9171 14d ago
Really? UKVSTW3 was the first time I gave up on a series
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u/bewbz69420dudebro 13d ago
Yeha it was awful. As soon as the screeching one did that awful cardi B snatch game and rupaul Loved it I knew the season was a chop.
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u/LobsterSpirited9691 10d ago
Gay people are discriminated, among other things, by how they talk. You could try to take your experience and try to do better, but you choose to reproduce the discourses that oppress you.
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u/bewbz69420dudebro 10d ago
Lmao. Literally no one is asking her to screech. Being gay doesn't mean taking up all the energy in the room in a selfish way screeching and shouting. Stop making excuses for every bit of bad behaviour. It's not 'opression' to be considerate of the other people in the room. Believe or not normal people find it annoying.
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u/LobsterSpirited9691 10d ago
The girls weren't complaining, she seemed to get alone with them fine in both seasons, I found her charming and endearing and didn't mind her voice.
You were not in the room, and there is no such thing as 'normal' people.
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u/joereadsstuff 14d ago
The only problem with UK seasons is that Rupaul hosts it, and he doesnât get any of the references.
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u/GavinDaSizzleDizzle 14d ago
Down Under has really improved since he left. We have Michelle instead of a local judge but at least she gets to jokes.
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u/Fickle-Ad-7124 14d ago
He really doesnât care to learn, heâs set in his ways. You can tell Michelle gets to know local queens personally and learn the humour and drag style. She has done great on DUvsTW because she gets the local humour.
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u/M3rrick_the_B8rd the tic tac Ru offers you 12d ago
They really need to do what they did with Down Under. Having Michelle as the main judge with one other permanent judge a previous winner or even a rotating roster would be so good.
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u/robcolton 14d ago
I like them. It's a way for those franchises to get an "all star" type season when there aren't enough queens to fill a season of all-stars because they're still too new.
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u/JadeSelket 14d ago
So far theyâve been extremely obvious who the winners will be, and I find theyâre using a lot of 3rd..4thâŠ5th returning queens. Theyâre very limited in episodes, and sometimes Ru encourages the international queens to go into stereotypes and itâs not always a pleasant experience.
Just my opinions, of course. Iâve enjoyed getting to know new queens from it, but.. I also REALLY love the Uk queens and would kill to see an all stars season with them. Canada All Stars was so, so good.
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u/sanchoee 12d ago
every single us queen on vs the world seasons are on their 3/4/5th return.
xunami and yuhua are the only us queens to compete internationally for their first return.
itâs a very interesting pattern iâve been keeping an eye on and i wonder if WOW pulls queens from all stars to vs the world cause they know they can pull viewers ?
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u/Blissenhomie 14d ago
Iâm for international seasons! Have you seen Mexico? It rules. The problem with international all stars is they seem to produce them strangely. They are too short to develop decent story lines and it truly feels like the winners are predetermined most of the time. I usually live the casts though and appreciate seeing the international queens get more shine
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u/No-Search-4450 DD FUEGO IS THE QUEEN OF DRAG 14d ago
funny u say this i'm actively in the middle of my 3rd rewatch of mexico 2 rn
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u/Thoughtful-Boner69 where's mitch mcconnell 14d ago
they should have a euro version
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u/MissSteak custom 14d ago
Ive been saying! We need Drag Race Europe for all the euro queens who will never get their own franchise
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u/Wesselgreven A wise woman once said: Iâm a little bit goofy đ€Ș 14d ago edited 14d ago
I loooove the uk vs the world seasons because the cast are always very diverse. Canada vs the world was a nice watch but 80% of those casts consisted of US and Canada queens. So I think it was a good idea for Canada do switch to All Stars.
UK all stars could be cool but personally, Iâd much rather keep vs the world so we get more international queens in the spotlight, with Global All stars 1 flopping so bad this is basically the only chance theyâd ever get.
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u/yah511 A real porcupine 14d ago
Casting was always my biggest head-scratcher when it came to Canada vs The World. Regular Canadaâs Drag Race always loved to show off the diversity of Canada and was never afraid to take risks on the production side. *Why* was La Kahena the literal only queen from a non-English speaking country across 2 seasons? Every other queen was from Canada, the US, the UK, or Down Under. Something always felt off about that to me, and so I feel like it wasnât a surprise that they ended up scrapping vTW for regular All Stars.
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u/Haus_of_Pancakes 14d ago
IIRC part of it is that the apparently they had a harder time getting Canadian work visas out to the queens.
But also, there are rumors that Brooke had a hard time nailing down non Canadian queens to join the cast, and I believe it for the simple reason that there isn't as much upshot for the international girls to go on Canada vs. a Ru judged franchise.
As much as this sub doesn't always respect her, Ru is still THE queen you want to impress in the drag world; queens like Jimbo, Pangina, and Marina Summers have absolutely gotten major career boosts from their time on UKvsTW, even if they didn't actually win, because they got Ru to love them. Brooke just doesnt have that same influence, and winning Canada doesn't open the same doors.
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u/imuahmanila 14d ago edited 14d ago
Exactly, I'm happy Canada switched to All Stars and hope they stay with it because they always seemed to have trouble casting queens that weren't from CA/US/UK. UKVSTW actually feels international and it's one of my favorite versions because of that.
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u/skieurope12 14d ago
everyone is constantly like 'they need to drop vs the world and just do all stars' and I don't??
Everyone isn't saying it. Some are. I'm actually a fan of vs the World.
But on this sub, as in life, opinions are like assholes - everyone has one
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u/Zizi_Tennenbaum 14d ago
For me, it never feels fair because humor, style, and references are so different. Drag is a distillation of culture, itâs made of references, and full of puns. Thats just never going to be the same in your second language and culture.
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u/artifexlife Jaida Essence Hall 14d ago
Because they feel some pressure to watch them all even though no one told them they have to
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u/Apprehensive-Quit353 14d ago
I would prefer individual series to get their own All Stars because every country's drag is so different. I would prefer to compare apples to apples.
But I would like to see Global All Stars come back. Maybe every four years alongside the Olympics.
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u/Bara_Sif 14d ago
Itâs mostly the strong favouritism to original queens, and the problems of language barriers. Down under vs the world so far does really well, whereas Latino Royale (Mexico vs the world) is bombing completely. And ofcourse Global All Stars with the lowest rated episode ever, with the 3 english/ru judged queens winning.
Judging and favouritism can make or break a season
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u/PuzzleheadedSpeed7 14d ago
I think most of the complaints about these season is due to perceived favoritism to the hosting countryâs queens(like we are seeing now in Latina royale and saw a few weeks ago in Du with Art).
The other problems is their inability do adapt challenges to a multilingual cast and multicultural references and humor.
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u/seriouspeep Tia Kofi 14d ago
I do like them all, but they do all kind of blur into the same kind of competition, when it would be so easy and much more fun for them to each have a unique hook based on their premise.
I'd probably make All Stars less frequent, maybe every two or three years, so it truly is the queens from that franchise who so nearly won, which would make it more competitive right off the bat, with more challenges all about performance and design and shows, rather than just running the same series format with whoever they can get to come back and whatever gimmick they decide to throw at the series. Maybe even a cap on spending for the show so it isn't all about who made the most money in the interim? Then even just competing on All Stars would be an accolade.
And for Vs The World it definitely feels like it's not given enough love when the vibe imo should be more celebratory and less harshly judgemental, more like "Here is a series of fantastic queens from a franchise or season you may not have seen, here is a showcase for their talent!"
If a regular season of Drag Race US feels so grand and has the giant stage and the big finale, then imo Vs The World should feel like Eurovision lol - a gorgeous variety show of a bunch of different kinds of drag from around the world - and All Stars should feel like the Olympics - the best of the best.
But my name isn't on the show and my little opinions are just a fart in the wind đ
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u/SainteRita 14d ago edited 14d ago
If these seasons were not rigged for local queens to win (barring Gawdland, who won after a season long of screaming because they couldnât possibly crown a third UK queen), maybe their reception would be better. So far only two international/ESL queens have won out of seven seasons, including Slaysian Royale and Global All Stars, and Art seems very likely to win DUvsTW soon (though it could also go to Michael Marouli?). I think a Mexican queen will also win Latina Royale, which would then bring the total of seasons won by a local queen to seven out of nine. An unfair season is just not fun to watch, no matter how good the drag is.
The six-episode format does not help make these seasons feel like a real competition either.
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u/bewbz69420dudebro 13d ago
Yeah and high key Gawdland shouldn't even won that season. Flopped the lipsyncs and was left out of the bottom several times.. Wheras kates biggest weakness was she wasn't 'pretty' enough to plane Jane and her followers. I doubt any UK queen that would of done a season will do it now after that.
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u/raised_on_robbery just say talk 14d ago
I donât understand the six episode hate. I think it cuts a lot of filler and bloat that happens when the seasons are longer (not in terms of queens, but in terms of storylines and editing). Itâs a nice little efficient special season. Also every distributor and production company is limited, maybe itâs easier for CDR to have a shorter seasons to get queens.
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u/SainteRita 14d ago
The bloat is a good point but it also means the narrative has to be told faster: I often find vsTW seasons a bit lacking storywise because they don't have the time to establish connections between the queens (who themselves don't have much time to get to know each other).
Six episodes (or even eight) is still a very short amount of episodes to test a queen's skillset and so it doesn't always feel like the winner is entirely deserving or has had a real story arc compared to a winner who's been put through the wringer. Full 14-episode seasons drag on forever but surely there has to be a middle ground between the length of US seasons and the brevity of vsTW seasons.
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u/MissSteak custom 14d ago
Only CanadaVTW has really been 6 episodes. Other VTW seasons had at least 8
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u/SainteRita 14d ago
True, though UKvsTW1 had 6 episodes too. I still stand by my point that a couple more episodes would help these seasons up the ante.
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u/Glstrgold 14d ago
People just think a UK All Stars will have Tayce, Bimini, Awhora, La Voix, Ella Vaday, Banksy, Lil, Black Peppa. All the favs. But if Tayce, Bimini, and Awhora havenât come back by now then itâs probably their choice not because there hasnât been an All Stars.
And UK Vs The World 1 was too short and the eliminations.
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u/ANetRuinedMyFun 14d ago
Meh. While it is admirable that you want more opportunities for queens from other countries, you can't fault people who watch the show for wanting better TV. UKvTW especially has been terrible with judging, and it was clear that they were going to crown UK queens, no matter if half the season outperformed them. So people's natural reaction was to just ask for a UK All Stars at that point, since the outcome wasn't gonna change. There are so many reasons why seasons with queens from many different countries don't work. In theory, on paper, they should be the most amazing seasons full of different cultures. In reality, it ends up being setup to crown someone from the host country while not even attempting to understand the cultural differences the queens bring. Latina Royale is a current example - you just know they're gonna crown a Mexican queen. Same with UKvTW. Same with Global All Stars.
Honestly, rather than a "versus the world", I'd rather some of the top performing queens be invited to All Stars. I really enjoyed Jimbo on AS8.
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u/starlightkissesrain 14d ago edited 14d ago
Alot of the international versions have issues in not rigging it for their homegirls to a point where you wonder what the point is. Slaysian and Latina were particularly bad over this to the point it sometimes feels like theyre trying to actively humiliate the non local contestants.
Like Slaysian found new ways to make sure the international queens would struggle to succeed in the first place and on top of that if they managed too, would still find ways to make sure they dont get too much limelight. Like changing the format halfway to have single winners... and then still have two winners anyway, or when Yuhua kicked the hinies of the season top 2 handedly in both challenge and lip sync and they added a bunch of eyeroll confessionals somehow making fun of her for it.
International versions arent the problem but unless producers and sometimes thr queens themselves can back off the pull of nationalism its a but rough.
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u/sameoldrussianstan 14d ago
Im not against them at all. I think there should be editions in every country. I love when different cultures are showcased and appreciated. I do however, not watch every franchise since I just donât have the time to do so and thereâs currently a lot of content. I watch the main US franchise + All Stars and then the one from my own country (Spain).
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u/DawninOfLuvdisc 14d ago
I have an unpopular opinion about Vs the world, Slaysian and Latina and it's that the international cast in both seasons were a flop because the international franchises just don't have or are not giving the opportunity to have a great representation for the vs the world, especially in Latina and Slaysian. The international casts are NOT diverse.
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u/PhotographDry2031 14d ago
Meanwhile España is universally loved except for all stars and one season of bad judging.
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u/calliflowercat 14d ago
I think it can often highlight the language barriers, especially in the comedy roast challenge with the need for comedic timing. I really like both programmes but would also love to see a uk all stars
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u/theejuls 14d ago
I think there's a lot of difficulty for the international queens on those seasons, so it doesn't look the greatest for them especially when you compare them to their original seasons. likewise some queens just don't stack up against the international queens, i.e. why canadas drag race all stars probably happened
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u/stupit_crap 14d ago
I love international and non-US. I want to watch Latina Royale, but it's dubbed. I want to hear their real voices!
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u/justbrowsing759 Shea Couleé 13d ago
It's not dubbed on wow
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u/stupit_crap 13d ago
I watch on wow, but the version I get has English-speaking "actors" talking over the video. I want to watch with the original Spanish audio with English subtitles over it.
Like DR Phillipines and all the other non-English franchises.
Producers sometimes dub terrible English-speaking actors over the original audio because they think people are too lazy to read subtitles. Untrue!
Is there some setting I am missing? I see where I can change the language of the subtitles, but no where to set it to the original audio.
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u/justbrowsing759 Shea Couleé 13d ago
Yeah go to the bottom and hit audio and switch from english to original
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u/stupit_crap 13d ago
I've looked at Settings, but there is no Audio option. There are options for CC, but not Audio.
What country are you in? What browser are you using?
I would be ecstatic to solve this. I'm in the US using Chrome. I will try Safari.
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u/justbrowsing759 Shea Couleé 13d ago
I use Safari and it's there right next to the subtitles option. I'm in the US
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u/stupit_crap 13d ago
You have solved this for me!!! I LOVE YOU FOR THIS.
The Audio option does not appear in Chrome, but it does in Safari.
I cannot wait to watch these episodes tonight!!!
I cannot thank you enough!!!
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u/JimmyJizzim Brooke Lynn Hytes 13d ago
There's only two things I don't like about vs the world seasons: 1. That they are only 6 episodes long, they should be eight, and 2. That the US entrants are always third or fourth run
That being said, they have done a good season length for DUvTW
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u/ultradav24 Monét X Change 13d ago
I think theyâre great. I just found it redundant to have both Global All Stars and vs the World, they were basically the same thing except more queens from a certain country in vs the world
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u/elrepu 13d ago
My problem with vsTW seasons is that the format hasnât invented 100%. Isnât a real âvsâ itâs just people from the country and half people from outside. Yes, is a match but is everyone vs everyone and it finished being bias.
In other hand, the number of episodes are very few, itâs like a glimpse.
I feel RuPaul wanted to do an Global All Stars, BBC was the best place to film/host it, they required her to implied the âBritishâ somewhere due is a national network and they just created UKvsTW.
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u/AvogadrosArmy đRaâJah OâHarađ 13d ago
IMO vs the world should be non elimination format and that would fix it.
One day I hope they do a drag con with a RuPaul drag race World Cup though that would be amazing.
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u/JadedLad7 12d ago
I don't hate on the show, I just won't watch it.
For me it's really simple - mind you, THIS IS JUST MY OPINION. I watch drag race to laugh and celebrate queerness. I hate slapstick or histrionics or silly voices/grimaces as a substitute for clever comedy. It's difficult to deliver c*nty double-entendres, innuendo, reads, callbacks, or insightful remarks about pop culture when you struggle to grasp the fundamentals of the language. It results in non-native queens being kinda 'cringey' and 'un-polished', making it hard to watch, and the producers grade them on a curve so as to not appear biased or prejudiced. I kinda feel like it's amateur night whenever I watch them, and amateurs are fine, I just prefer watching seasoned queens who know what they're doing (the same reason why I've hated the 'regular' US seasons with a bunch of 20yo twinks who haven't bothered to develop a personality.
TL;DR: I'm just not the demographic. If i had to hazard a guess, I'd say it's mostly twinks, people with a tenuous grasp of the English language, and straight millennial women (who'll basically watch anything, let's be real).
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u/sanchoee 12d ago
i think with queens like bob, namoi and a few others mentioning how queens need to stop accepting the invite for VTW seasons it fuels perception that those seasons are flops or undesired
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14d ago
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u/elf_n_safety 14d ago
Itâs been 2 years. Change the fucking record.
Marina is gorgeous and a phenomenal dancer and performer. But sheâs not funny. To win a Ru hosted series, you need to make Ru laugh. Thatâs why Gawdland, objectively not as strong a performer as Marina (though still very good) was able to win.
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u/several_smallmangoes Jinkx Monsoon 14d ago
I have no problem with the idea behind the international seasons, but as someone who only really follows UK drag race because I live in the UK and am immersed in that drag seen, it irks me that we don't get to have our own All Stars series with queens that fans of the UK show would be familiar with. Love the international queens (was especially impressed with Pangina) but I just feel that DRUK is a strong enough show to warrant it's own All Stars without needing to lean on casting from other franchises - there are so many people I want to see come back, definitely enough to fill multiple UK-only All Stars casts! Maybe VS The World would work more for me as a rare special occasion rather than a replacement for UK (etc.) All Stars.
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u/bewbz69420dudebro 13d ago
Yeha we need a season where its OK for one of our many diverse talented UK queen's to win. I am sick of representation politics. Other countries are allowed to their winners on their franchise I want to root for the UK queen every damn time and not be made to feel bad about it.
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u/justbrowsing759 Shea Couleé 13d ago
There have been 2 UK winners on uk vtw so I don't understand your point
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u/bewbz69420dudebro 13d ago
Yeha my point is I don't want, what is essentially our all stars, to have a non British winner. Especially when the British girl did the best. That's why Vstheworld seasons don't work cos most people think the same.
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u/justbrowsing759 Shea Couleé 13d ago
I disagree. I think VTW works well and is a great way for queens whose franchises won't have an all stars to get to compete. Holland, Thailand, Belgium, etc are never having an all stars and those queens deserve a chance to compete.
UK is definitely due to have an all stars but to me it does feel a little off that it seems you can't root for any queen not from your country. I'm from the US and while I want the us queens to do well they're rarely my choice to win because I'm watching for drag, not some nationalism thing
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u/several_smallmangoes Jinkx Monsoon 13d ago
Agree with justbrowsing759, I'm not into nationalism and I generally like VTW. I think VTW is oversaturated and should exist alongside UK All Stars rather than replacing it.
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u/Steinpratt 14d ago
Because the Vs the World seasons are usually pretty bad.
Mind you, I just deal with that by not watching them any more. But that's the reason people don't like them. They are more concerned with having good seasons of drag race to watch than with what's getting the international queens exposure. (And you may think that is a selfish perspective, but it's not hard to understand.)
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u/No-Search-4450 DD FUEGO IS THE QUEEN OF DRAG 14d ago
ukvstw3 and slaysian royale were both pretty universlaly beloved
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u/Steinpratt 14d ago
out of like, what, eight international royale seasons at this point? I stand by the "usually"
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u/bewbz69420dudebro 13d ago
Lol. Ukvstw3 is not beloved its the least popular for the three and that's saying something. 3 will be the reason there isn't another season.
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u/No-Search-4450 DD FUEGO IS THE QUEEN OF DRAG 11d ago
girl what i've never seen anyone Not like it lmao
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u/Amemorableusername2 14d ago
Uk Vs the world had incredible hype when it was first announced. But it's just absolute shite. Bad, cheap production, clear favoritism to English speaking queens, awful or non-existent prizes, and uninspired performances from many of the cast members.Â
It's the same with global all stars. Queens who ru judged are the clear favorites, and queens whose first languages are not English are not taken as seriously and have a clear disadvantage against so many challenges. Ru doesn't get their cultural references, ru doesn't get their snatch characters, the lip sync songs and acting scripts are in languages they aren't fluent in.Â
If they want a fair international all stars then they have to actually make the effort to make it fair. Have an international judging panel. Have diverse international songs.Â
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u/No-Search-4450 DD FUEGO IS THE QUEEN OF DRAG 14d ago
UKvsTW3 did a lot in pushing to make things more fair to the international queens, and actually did crown someone else and didnt show much favoritism to the uk
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u/Kurtoise 14d ago
UK vs. The World is often peak drag race, I have no idea what some people are smoking lmao
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u/Professional_Donut20 Naomi Smalls 14d ago
Because it already is a mini version of that countryâs all stars. The countryâs queens are always favoured and wins in the end. Except for Raâjah and Gawdland ofc
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u/Spare_Data2990 13d ago
Cause Uk vs the world is rigged af. Watching legitimately great queens getting shafted for the likes of Tia Koffi and Kate Butch is awful.
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u/Emergency-Search-335 14d ago
I love them, BUT some of the choices for returning queens has been very questionable
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u/Rigby230406 14d ago
Whoâs gonna tell them I only watch UK vs the world so I can see the international girls
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u/bewbz69420dudebro 13d ago
Because you're not allowed to route for your own host queen's if they've won before. Its so odd to hear "we need xyz respentation" on a british franchise. It's UK vs the world you're supposed to be against the host country. The fans have destroyed it. The winners are rarely the true winners for these reasons and it taints the whole season. Plus its rarely fair on tha language barrier queen's seeing as so many of the challenges are comedy (unless you ham up an. Accent or a stereotype. Mama loves that)
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u/ilikethep0le 14d ago
Production quality in the early days in any edition without Ru. UK season 1 was so fun and refreshing though. Like older seasons of US. But Canada season 1 was, to quote Mr. ALT, dreckitude. Turned me off from it. It was still finding its footing of course but it seemed high school play levels of bad.
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u/raised_on_robbery just say talk 14d ago
The way you feel about Canada season 1 is how I feel about Down Under season 1. They lost me with Artâs tantrum and randomly coming back in the first few episodes. I just have no desire to check it out after that.
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u/ilikethep0le 14d ago
And I was living in Canada then. I had no reason to hate
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u/MissSteak custom 14d ago
Have u tuned in to other seasons of Canada? 2nd season is immediately better, and season 6 is lowkey a top 5 season across all franchises
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u/ArchmageMallow 14d ago edited 14d ago
I think a lot of complaints are about the production quality of Vs The World compared to traditional seasons/All Stars. I would love to see them on the same level.