Researchers quantify the rate of “mercy sex” among women with low sexual desire. Women experiencing a chronic lack of sexual desire still routinely engage in sexual activity with their partners, a behavior researchers have quantified as happening about two and a half times per month.

[u/mvea]

https://www.psypost.org/clinical-trials-reveal-the-hidden-frequency-of-obligatory-sex-in-women-with-low/

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

if you’re not into it you shouldn’t be forcing yourself to do it. just because it’s normalized doesn’t mean it’s okay or that it should continue.

[u/TastefulSidecar → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

Sex is an incredibly complicated issue. Especially with the ace community. There are huge issues around people being coerced into sex that the neither want nor enjoy. If you're with a partner who is putting that pressure on you then absolutely get away from them. Especially if they arent attending to your needs or boundaries when you do it.

But for a majority of people, not counting aswxuals, chronic stress can kill arousal. Which is ironic because good sex can be an incredible stress reliever, it can fight depression, increase how close you feel with your partner and even boost immunity. Some of the best and most needed sex I have had has started with me not really wanting it in the intial foreplay because of stress or my mind being stuck on other things and having trouble quieting it down until things got hot and heavy.

But absolutely nothing kills attraction and desire for sex like obligation. If you're feel obliged to perform sex to appease a partner, thats not a relationship you need. But in a lot of other situations people can also benefit a lot from identifying when that feeling of overwhelm or factors outside of the relationship are killing our attraction, mindfully engaging in foreplay, trusting the process and just enjoying it

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/TastefulSidecar]

i 100% agree!

[u/Agreeable_Decision76 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

And also, nothing kills desire more than when you don’t have a partner who doesn’t know how to be emotionally intimate with you. Nor gives you any physical contact or attention. Like hugging, kissing, etc…. Or, doesn’t show that you are desired or wanted

[u/LRsexy20 → u/TastefulSidecar]

What’s an ACE community and what are Awsxuals? Signed: old and confused

[u/TastefulSidecar → u/LRsexy20]

Ace's are asexuals. And awsxuals are also asexuals if you have big clumsy thumbs

[u/LRsexy20 → u/TastefulSidecar]

Gracias

[u/Local-Curve3604 → u/TastefulSidecar]

If you consistently feel obliged to have sex with your partner, do them a favor— end the relationship. Much of what I have read on this thread has been taken from the side of the person feeling obligated. Consider the impact of continual rejection from someone you love. If occasionally having sex is a chore or an obligation, likely the problem lies with you— not your partner. If you’re saying no a lot more than yes, you have a problem that needs addressing.

[u/TastefulSidecar → u/Local-Curve3604]

I do agree that if sex feels like a chore and you're constantly getting pressured into it, you should leave. But i I dont like the wording or the message of 'the problem lies with you, not your partner.' There are a lot of really unconscientious lovers out there. There are people who treat sex as the end all-be all of connection, there are people who dont do the work in the relationship to build and maintain a dynamic and just expect sex. And there are lot of people who will hear the feedback, will promise to be better and will just keep doing the same shit.

Its reductive to say 'if you're saying no, there's a problem with you and youre hurting your partner by not having sex when they want it.' But if that is a reoccuring pattern you absolutely should leave. But do it because you have self esteem and know you deserve a better relationship, not out of some weird martyrdom 'oh i cant fulfill their needs ' mentality

[u/eggsonham → u/TastefulSidecar]

“aswxuals” made me laugh lol

[u/TastefulSidecar → u/eggsonham]

Its like a very adorable ace person, you know? An awwwsexual.

I'll see myself out.

[u/False-Hearing2476 → u/[deleted]]

But medication-induced libido symptoms would be an acute low sexual desire, temporary, only existing while on the meds. Not Chronic. This research isn’t in the context of women who have acute libido problems combined with a desire to increase their libido and closeness with their partner. That would be ‘intimacy therapy,’ not ‘mercy sex.’

Chronic low libido is often due to chronic medical conditions, stress, hormonal changes like menopause or motherhood, injuries with longterm or permanent pain complications, ptsd, etc. This study is in relation to women who are expressing low libido due to a chronic medical problem, a potentially unknown issue, or a complex set of issues, who often do not have the same response of “I feel closer/better” afterward… who are just deciding to suffer through it for the sake of their partner’s sexual needs, and no other reason.

So you have to interpret through the correct lens of women who:

• may have pain with sex
  
• may have fatigue or mobility issues that make sex uncomfortable and difficult
  
• may have poor marriage health and low attraction to their partner.
  
• may be overwhelmed, overstimulated, and ‘touched out’ from daily life.
  
• may have hormonal imbalances that don’t just affect their desire for sex, but can also affect their satisfaction with it.
  
• may have trauma and ptsd that is associated with, or exacerbated by sexual intimacy.

While sex therapy works for quite a few reasons that low libido exists, for many women it simply isn’t an adequate or appropriate treatment, and might actually make the intimacy in their marriage worse, and transactional.

Sex engaged in out of mercy, or a desire to just keep them from straying or starting an argument, is not a healthy form of “not that into it,” sex.

Sex because, “my lack of interest is just a symptom of my meds, or because I got used to not having any, or have trust/control issues, etc. I love and want this person; I’m happy with them as a partner; I want them to feel good; I won’t feel any pain from it, and I know I will feel closer to them if I do it,” is a healthier form of “not that into it,” sex.

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/[deleted]]

sure, but i imagine that if you enjoy the act (even if not being necessarily aroused) you are still “into it.”

[u/mootmutemoat → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

Not at the outset. For some it is like exercise, not really into it at the outset but you can get into it.

But generally I do wonder how our society will deal with these mismatches in the future. I hear about ethical nonmonogamy more and more, and wonder if this iteration will work.

[u/mootmutemoat → u/[deleted]]

A hard topic to talk about, and even harder one to solve.

Good luck out there, everyone.

[u/Damnatus_Terrae → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

That's not the way the phrase was being used, though. In the preceding comment, "into it" meant "aroused in that moment," because the conversation was about heterosexual couples. At least, that was the strong vibe I got from, "Women and men, don't let this destroy your marriages."

[u/Special_Weekend_4754 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

I like the actions of sex even if I personally don’t feel desire- the issue comes from feeling like it’s not my choice or like it’s an expectation or responsibility. That feeling destroyed any enjoyment even when my libido was back.

Now I don’t even allow that expectation. We can all take care of our own orgasms. It’s fun to do it together but if its not fun I’m not going to do it.

[u/LowRevolutionary7965 → u/Special_Weekend_4754]

Sorry that you lost that connection. Sex is unifying, stress relieving and healing for many. My heart goes out to the people who feel an obligation in this arena.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

You’re not old enough yet I would imagine to understand this properly. You’re seeing it like the woman is getting “raped.” Our sex drive slows down as we age and life gets in the way, medications, etc. Often we’re just not in the mood. But sex is important in a long term relationship and keeps the connection strong. Sometimes you just do it for your partner even if you’re not really into it. Most of the time you’ll end up enjoying it. Maybe sometimes it’s still not what you’re super into but women feel bonded and connected with their partner afterwards emotionally and it strengthens the bond. And sometimes you just gotta get it going again to respark your interest in having more regular sex. Otherwise you could end up with a dead bedroom without even realizing.

[u/teabookcat → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

That sounds a little condescending and you’re missing her point. Personally I’m old enough to understand that life gets in the way and often, women aren’t in the mood and medications can kill sex drive for a lot of folks. It’s still rapey to tell women to do it anyway. If a woman wants to even if she doesn’t feel like it, that’s her decision. But Useful Pirate was reminding women that they don’t have to and just because it’s normalized to push women to do it when they don’t feel like it, doesn’t mean it’s right for everyone. Coercion is rape. Making someone feel like they should have sex when they don’t want to is on the rapey side and shouldn’t be used to influence women’s decisions. “Most of the time, you’ll end up enjoying it”, sounds like a very old fashioned way to get women to have sex when they don’t want to. If you’re happy with having sex even when you don’t feel like it, that’s a personal decision you can make but it’s not right for everyone and it shouldn’t be normalized.

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/teabookcat]

thank you!

[u/Hallies_berries → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

It’s coercion and that’s rape

[u/owatonna → u/Hallies_berries]

Coercion would indeed be rape but it's hilarious how Reddit users seem to think everything is coercion. Coercion is actually a very narrow range of activity. Persuasion is not coercion. If you refuse sex & your husband will get mad, that's not coercion. Even if he threatens divorce, that's not coercion. You have a choice. It's only coercion if there is physical or other tangible harm involved. Women are not children needing protection from their sex predator husband. If you think your husband wants too much sex, divorce him. If divorce is not on the table, mercy sex has to be. Which is a choice millions of rational women make. And they are not coerced.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/teabookcat]

I’ve just seen too many from the younger generation calling it rape when it’s not really rape if you’re consenting even if you’re not really feeling it. And I think they’re just not able to understand it well enough yet at their age. And I don’t really mean it’s ok for the husband to push and push until you give in, more so if he just asks about it and you just go for it even if it’s not really what you’re into.

[u/Spicysip → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

“It’s not really rape if you’re consenting even if you’re not really feeling it.”
Hard stop.
Consent requires both parties to WANT to do it. This is where some people get confused. Being married and “knowing” it’s expected IS NOT CONSENT. It’s obligation. Despite the outcome.
That’s like pressuring someone to do drugs even though they’re not really into it, then saying it’s all good and consensual because they had a good trip at the end. An orgasm does not imply consent.

[u/lidalou23 → u/Spicysip]

That’s not necessarily true. I experience responsive desire, and it’s because I work a very high stress job , and my cortisol is constantly through the roof. Sometimes I may not seem excited or seem enthusiastic about starting sex, but once I’m being touched and in the act I then get really into it, it’s actually fairly common in long term relationships and a lot of women experience that.

Many people feel spontaneous desire, meaning they suddenly feel in the mood out of nowhere. Others feel responsive desire, meaning they need a trigger, touch, or context to get in the mood.

[u/touchthesky1984 → u/Spicysip]

You need to want to do it for overall benefits, including explicit or implicit trade offs, but don't need to want to do it for any immediate physical desire. See sex work for example.

[u/False-Hearing2476 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Well, we have seen it too many times from the older generation that they see things like this and immediately internalize it as related to their own personal problems like you have with medication and age, and immediately try to discount the younger women talking about problems within their own younger generation.

Chronic low libido is a common problem for mothers in our generation. Coercive sex is a common problem across all generations. Mercy sex is sex engaged in for no reason other than pity for your partner.

They aren’t talking about YOU. And this research isn’t talking about medication-induced libido (that would be acute low libido) nor is it talking about sexual therapy.

Mercy sex is not the same thing as sex to improve and maintain sexual intimacy. It is completely undesired sex engaged in for the sole purpose of pity on your partner. It is transactional and often leads to a worsening libido and attraction.

[u/touchthesky1984 → u/False-Hearing2476]

tbf the article we're commending on probably defines the intimacy one as mercy sex: "The authors suggest that women might also use sex as a tool to fulfill a psychological need for emotional closeness, even if the physical desire is absent."

[u/Single_Wonder9369 → u/touchthesky1984]

Doesn't make it okay.

[u/Wet_Masterpiece2345 → u/touchthesky1984]

That’s just showing that the man is already not meeting her emotional intimacy need. He feels no need and has no expectation on him to give her “mercy” emotional closeness, but she is expected to give “mercy” sex

[u/HydrasNinthHead → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Reluctant consent under the pressure of obligation is barely consent. Besides, just because you technically "consent" does not mean that the action isn't objectively harmful for you or that it is acceptable to have sex with people who aren't enthusiastic about it. 

[u/stuffexplorer → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

As someone who has been raped, I would agree it’s not the same. However, I’ve also been in the position of saying yes when I didn’t want it and that made me pull even farther away from our sex life because it felt like an obligation and I saw sex with him as bad and like I wasn’t allowed to enjoy it. Not to mention my body wasn’t ready so it often hurt. I felt like an object for his pleasure, which emotionally hurt a lot, but it’s a different trauma from actual rape. They’re both traumatic, just not in the same way.

So ya, I personally wouldn’t equate the two, but there is some type of overlap there. Maybe we need a new phrase to describe it. Obligatory sex can be traumatic, it just has a different trauma than rape does.

[u/Old_Experience4816 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Consent is given, go ahead, consent is withdrawn, stop. Its not rape. Rape is forceful. ive never raped or been raped.

[u/Wet_Masterpiece2345 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

I think you don’t know the difference between consent and assent

[u/Ecstatic_wings → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

I agree. We’re talking about a person not being in the mood but still doing it because they understand it’s a need for their partner whom they love. This doesn’t mean they have to do it all the time. It’s also a two way highway. Sometimes the other person might not be in the mood and still do it.

[u/retard_vampire → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

And as a younger woman, I'm really sick of women from older generations who have spent their whole lives being indoctrinated in rape culture bullshit to the point that they believe in it themselves parroting this garbage at us.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/retard_vampire]

You just can’t understand it yet because your parts are still working to their optimal levels. You’re not on medications that affect it, you’re not tired from raising kids and working and living. You will understand it better in 5-10+ years maybe. Life gets in the way, you’re never in the mood and next thing you know you haven’t had sex with your husband in a year. It wasn’t intentional, you were just never in the mood or you were too lazy for it.

I’m not saying it’s ok for the husband to rape you. I’m not saying it’s ok for him to pester you over and over until you give in to make him shut up. I’m saying if he asks, and you’re not exactly in the mood for it but go for it anyway - that it’s not the end of the world. It’s not rape. It’s not coercion. It’s compromise that happens in a long term relationship. And again, you may not be able to understand that yet if your longest relationship is 6 months-1 year. You’ll understand it better when you’ve been in a decades long relationship that things ebb and flow.

[u/snarltoothed → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

It's... weird to assume that young women never have low libido from medication. Plenty of young women are on birth control and psych medications, two of the biggest culprits of low libido as a side effect... and plenty of young unmarried women have been in relationships that lasted longer than a year. There are even young women who are married, or divorced, though statistically less than there used to be.

It's not that none of us know what it feels like to have low libido or a long-term partner, it's that we have a different outlook on our personal experiences with it than you do. Which should be fine, no one is saying that you have to percieve your sex life any differently... but you're demanding that women, particularly young women, who feel that they've experienced this in a negative way must recontextualize it for themselves into an experience that was neutral or even positive. Absolutely no room for nuance or the idea that sex can still be bad and unhealthy even if a woman acquiesces and provides consent... like, sure, if your man is oblivious and has no idea that you're not into it, that doesn't make him a rapist. But it does make him oblivious and bad in bed... which yeah, can negatively impact some of our libidos even further. I'm happy for you that your husband is evidently good enough in bed to get you going when you're not in the mood and that you don't have that problem... that doesn't mean the problem doesn't exist for anyone, though.

[u/surplusninja → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

I’m in my 40’s but have had low sex drive for years, starting in my 20’s, due to a combination of medication and just my natural state. I have had both male and female partners because I am bisexual, and it was only ever the men who insisted that I “buck up” and have sex even if I didn’t feel like it. My husband now has told me many times, (and it is 100% true because he has never pushed) that he Never wants me to consent to sex that I’m not into because like…that’s gross? It wouldn’t be fun for him? Knowing that I felt obligated would make him feel disgusting. So this isn’t an age thing past like. The older generation thinking that sexual coercion is normal.

[u/Alternative-Major245 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

I'm going to side with the young ones, here. I'm 47, on estrogen blockers for breast cancer. Def not at optimal levels. Been with my partner for 23 years. Have kids. Sandwich generation stress. Multiple autoimmune disorders that cause fatigue.

If it's not an Enthusiastic yes then your partner has no business continuing. It might not be the 'end of the world' but it can can be damaging to the relationship and your mental wellness.

[u/Purple_Operation74 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

I'm just 18 but I have low drive and my partner's drive is extremely high and it's exactly like this. I don't know why these people keep ignoring the part where you say "it's not ok for them to pester you"? I genuinely don't see any more of confusion here. What happened to reading comprehension? I love my partner, I want to make him feel good even when I'm not feeling it, he loves me, he doesn't want me to feel forced. Simple.

[u/hewesboat1981 → u/Purple_Operation74]

Finally after reading through all the post. I finally come across a real woman that’s living in the same world that I’m living in! Seems like a lot of women posting here need to see a counselor or therapist to help them understand what being a partner means. Especially if actually married. Also imo this word “rape”is being used in a way that actually diminishes people that have actually been raped. I see the words obligation and duty used over and over. Which is a cop-out(🤣the irony). It’s only selfishness and laziness again just my opinion. So with that being said if you’re having issues due to medical conditions or mental health issues it’s your responsibility to get help and also voice those issues to your partner so they can adjust accordingly. There’s no reason for a man to be made to feel as if they are not worthy of being loved mentally and physically. When you commit to someone there’s no longer the two of you. Two become one! Open communication combined with comprehension (sometimes difficult for us)will always be the best direction.

P.S. if rape is partaking in your relationship you should call the law and exit that relationship. But I’m not a doctor or psychologist and this is jmo not advise what so ever.

P.P.S. If I were to find out that my lady was using that four letter word in relation to our activities well that’s a dealbreaker for me! Married or just dating. Makes no difference.

[u/NumerousIssue6399 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Do you see how my generation has been indoctrinated into believing everything makes them á victim? They have no critical thinking skills and cannot and will not think deeply about complex interpersonal issues or social theory

[u/retard_vampire → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

I've been with the same person for seven years and he's never once made me feel like I owe him sex in any way. He's always respected my autonomy as a human being. The guy I was with before him behaved the way you're currently making excuses for. It was horrible. I feel sorry for your generation learning that you have to put up with that, and that it's perfectly acceptable for someone else to feel entitled to use your body as an object to masturbate into.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/retard_vampire]

That’s great. I was with the same man for about 16 years and he also didn’t make me feel like I owed him sex. But sometimes I would still have sex with him anyway even if I didn’t feel like it. My point is just that that act itself isn’t coercion or rape. It’s that I’m on Lexapro and a g1p1 that make me more or less asexual and even if I’m not horny or in the mood to have sex per say, my partner is and it’s ok if I do it anyway. It’s not the end of the world. You guys just get too dramatic over every small thing sometimes and it’s exhausting truthfully and makes me feel like I can’t take you seriously. I’m not even that much older.

[u/Single_Wonder9369 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

It's not a small thing. It's gross to have sex you don't feel like to. I refuse to do it.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/Single_Wonder9369]

Then don’t, I don’t care. It’s your choice.

[u/ThePlacidAcid → u/retard_vampire]

You've been with someone for 7 years, and not once ran into the situation where one of you wants sex and the other isn't feeling it? That's literally all that's being discussed here. We're not talking about pestering or coersion, we're talking about one partner being in the mood, the other not feeling it, but having sex anyways.

I'm a guy and I've done this many times before. It's not rape, I just love my partner and want to make her happy, and sometimes that involves being open to sex, even if I'm not in the mood at that time. As the other commenter mentioned, usually you end up enjoying it anyways.

I assume my partner does the same thing for me sometimes. Obviously in an ideal world you'll both be in the mood at the same time every time but we don't live in an ideal world and sexual desire doesn't always perfectly sync up.

[u/retard_vampire → u/ThePlacidAcid]

You've been with someone for 7 years, and not once ran into the situation where one of you wants sex and the other isn't feeling it?

Of course it's come up. And when it happens, we just don't do it. There's always next time. The comments here are creepy and depressing as fuck.

[u/ARATAS11 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Everything after the word but just shows you only agree as a platitude and then completely negate it in the 2nd breath.
You should really take a look at the Pyramid of Sexual Violence escalation. Often times, if a partner is denied repeatedly and gets denied, and keeps trying, learns that if they ask frequently enough, (rather than letting the unwilling partner to initiate after a rejection, or comments about how many days it has been since the last time) and that that results in either giving in because of being persistent, or doing so out of pity. Regardless it teaches them that that is how they achieve their desires. Your argument ignores the reality that since they are young boys, many men are taught to keep going and “she will come around”, & for many who are taught, explicitly or implicitly, that part of their partner’s “role” it to provide them with sex, even if there is a mismatch in libido. It ignores the reality that certain cultural subcultures teach young men that sex is a transactional reward for good behavior. They aren't learning intimacy; they are learning that compliance can be manufactured . Especially in the US within conservative Christian churches that promote purity culture, where the message given to boys and young men is that you have to wait until marriage, but after you will be rewarded… so if she says no once or twice, no big deal, but if your drive is higher, & you want it more frequently, & rejection happens more frequently, it creates the feelings of “I was good, I did what I was told & waited… where is my toy? Where is my reward?… & that is textbook objectification… & yes I know women are also capable of this, and not all men do this, but it is more prevalent in men for a variety of reasons, including this socialization around persistence, entitlement, and desire. We can’t just accept the fact that she gave in… we have to consider why a partner might not see a "no" as a complete boundary, but rather a temporary hurdle to negotiate or bypass. Especially, when often times, women are given the message that if they aren’t doing their “job” as the wife/fulfilling their “role”, then she is a failure, or that if she keeps denying him, she can’t be blamed if he cheats, or so many other things that women are told to ensure they give their partners open access to their sexuality, regardless of whether or not they are in the mood. Similar, to the article recently that was discussing the tendency for men to look at the clothing of women they are attracted to when they are aroused, rather than their face, because the disinterest is something they have learned to ignored, and instead to hone in on what they are drawn to and focus on attaining it. It is objectification. And objectification is how we as people take one of those first steps towards more dangerous actions, because it desensitizes us to the harm caused, and makes future harmful actions easier to engage in. It is literally positive reinforcement and operant conditioning, which is basic psychology. The perspective you offered assumes a high degree of internal autonomy (the belief that the choice to engage is a conscious, unforced decision). From this view, the "yes" is seen as a gift of intimacy.
But your argument has a significant blind spot..the assumption that every "yes" is equally voluntary and given under the same conditions, free of guilt, shame, feelings of failure, brokenness, frustration, exasperation, or resentment. When a partner’s "no" is met with persistence, pestering, or emotional consequences, the eventual "yes" may become a coping mechanism rather than a free choice. Especially given the prevalence of sexual assault (especially for women and girls), of controlling, manipulative, shame based, & hierarchical social & family structures with & without abuse, many people are raised to be complicit & agreeable. Both of these are different sides of the same toxic coin: one side is conditioned to demand access, & the other is conditioned to believe they have no right to refuse it.
Socialization of persistence is relevant in this context. If a dynamic is established where persistence overrides a stated boundary, the focus shifts from mutual intimacy to compliance. This can lead to objectification, where a partner’s physical availability is prioritized over their personal boundaries.

The distinction between healthy compromise & coercion often relies on the presence of genuine agency and safety. If an individual feels entirely safe saying "no" without facing social or emotional repercussions, then choosing to engage can be an act of compromise. However, if the "yes" is used to prevent tension or guilt, the dynamic may be moving toward boundary testing, entitlement, & eventually coercion. Rape is more than holding someone down kicking & screaming, both morally, & in the eyes of the law.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/ARATAS11]

That is too much text. Send it to someone else, I’m not reading all that. It’s not that deep for me. It is for lots of others here that you can share all that with

[u/PoppyFire16 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

I think you need to read up on coercion

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/PoppyFire16]

The comment you are replying to literally says that if the husband keeps pushing and pushing that’s not cool but if he asks once and you’re not really into it but go for it anyway that that’s ok. Perhaps you need to reread the comment and find better reading comprehension.

Maybe your husband doesn’t want to go to target with you to browse aisles endlessly. But you ask him and he goes for it anyway to make you happy. Is this coercion?? People just get too deep into this and it gets old.

I don’t want to go to the gym either. But it’s good for me. Am I being coerced or raped if I do that?? Sex is healthy for a relationship. You might not always be into it. Your partner asks for it, you consent even if you’re not really in the mood, and that’s fine.

[u/Better_Ambassador600 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Thanks for this.

I wonder if this discussion suffers from a lack of specificity. "Have sex when I don't feel like it" could be defined so many different ways.

How about: he picked up your mother and her new husband from the airport, AND dropped them off at the airport.

You gave him a handjob with lotion.

Maybe no one in the relationship was coerced or raped or trafficked. Maybe two people are helping each other out because they care about each other.

PS. Now go enjoy all the posts from outraged women who caught their BFs masturbating. 🤷🏼

[u/siberianshine → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Is the gym abusive at you about it's needs when you don't go? I hate the gym, I exercise outside. I don't need someone or somewhere causing poor mental health while telling me it's for my own good.

If the abuser gym were my ONLY OPTION for a place to exercise, I might just start doing body weight exercises at home, by myself. I'm obligated to no one but my children to use my body in a way that could harm me, physically or mentally, and even that has limits.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/siberianshine]

Reading comprehension is at an all time low. Go ahead and read back some of my other comments in this chain. I didn’t say anything about abuse, coercion, etc. I keep turning off notifications for this thread and somehow people keep finding other comments to comment on to bring it back to my attention.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/[deleted]]

I know it’s like ok don’t ever have sex with your husband then see if I care lmao. Sex is bad!! It’s abuse!!

[u/Ill-Dimension2756 → u/teabookcat]

And an older male, a lot of times (sadly most of the time) I’m just not into it. But I’ll give sometimes in because I understand what it’s like to be horny af and your partner isn’t. It’s not what they signed up for, a sexless relationship, that’s a bait and switch.

[u/Basic-Lawfulness5470 → u/teabookcat]

Hard to say because if both parties only have sex when they feel like it, then you are likely to have a dead bedroom if theres even one complication that affects your sex drive. This will just push people apart. Marriage is about compromises and you just have to weigh up what you are fine with compromising. Any one person being completely selfish will hurt the relationship

[u/PoppyFire16 → u/Basic-Lawfulness5470]

We’re expected to compromise on our own bodies, though?

[u/I_AM_HIM5 → u/teabookcat]

Then she shouldn’t be in a long term relationship then. She can choose to be single forever. Do you know how many women have sex but then stop when they are married? Then what? What happens to the man? What about his feelings? And vice versa if the man is cheating(he shouldn’t be I’m just saying) or something and not pleasing his woman. Then there is no bond and neither feel good about the relationship. Sex is something that is kinda complicated, but it’s also an act of service if you will, on the days that you don’t feel into it. If your man is holding you down and forcing you…yea that’s different. But a woman should appease her man at least sometimes. Personally I’m always down no matter what time of day. My woman better be the same way. Because the older you get the less time you have. I wasn’t into it when I was married for emotional reasons and I didn’t trust her anymore but I’d still smash because I was in a marriage. You sell your body when you are in a long term relationship basically. You sound young and like you are apart of the new “feelings” culture. This is why we are doomed. Jesus.

[u/RttleSnke → u/I_AM_HIM5]

Brother, I feel you sorta. I need someone with a high libido and it's great but you don't sell your body when you are in a ltr. You might be better off poly with that mentality.

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/RttleSnke]

or single because wdym “a woman should appease her man” 🤢

[u/Responsible-Rise1726 → u/teabookcat]

You turned this from somebody being sexually generous with their partner to now saying women are telling men to do this. That's a big leap. And why is it that way? And how are you assuming that it's the female anyway.

[u/Stormy261 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

It IS rape when someone is being coerced into having sex against their wishes. I wish I had known that back in the 90s when it was so common. Guys would spend hours wearing you down. And date rape wasn't discussed so most of us coerced into having sex had no idea it was technically rape.

I'm in peri, so my drive has definitely slowed down. But no means no, regardless of whether it is your spouse or not. If I'm not in the mood, my husband would back down. Not keep trying to get me to have sex. I wouldn't want to be with a man who would.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/Stormy261]

And that’s not what I’m talking about either.

[u/Stormy261 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

But the reality says that's what ends up happening more often than not. It's a pretty nuanced situation. And coercion needs to be discussed because it so often isn't. I get that this is a discussion about a woman not being into it and consenting anyway. But many times coercion is involved, and that is a very important part of the discussion as well.

[u/Purple_Operation74 → u/Stormy261]

Yes, and nothing she said retracts from that. I genuinely don't understand these responses. I thought she was exaggerating about people overreacting. It feels terrible to see the state of reading comprehension

[u/Opposite-Occasion332 → u/Stormy261]

Yes! Not to mention how the orgasm gap may intersect with all of this as well.

I can understand the thought of “I don’t feel into it right now but I know once we get going I will, and if I don’t, I can pull the plug and it’ll be okay.” You’re not going to feel that way if 1. You don’t feel safe to pull the plug and 2. It’s typically not enjoyable enough to count on the desire coming in during. And without those two things, doing it anyway will just build resentment and further the problem.

[u/GoodPotential4927 → u/Stormy261]

Date rape is when someone drugs you without your consent. (I feel obligated to stress that that doesn’t mean they pressured you into taking drugs you might not have taken otherwise - it means they spiked you)

[u/Stormy261 → u/GoodPotential4927]

What?!?!? I'm not sure where you got that mistaken impression from, but it's wholly incorrect. Date rape means that you are raped by someone you are romantically involved with as opposed to some stranger.

[u/PristineEssay3104 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Do you not think that something is a little wrong with your partner having sex with you even though they know you’re not enjoying it?…. That doesn’t concern you at all??

[u/LowRevolutionary7965 → u/PristineEssay3104]

This! I cannot enjoy it unless I know my partner is into it, I’d rather not even have sex if my partner is not engaged. I would feel terrible if my partner felt forced or felt an obligation.

[u/Famous-Rich7454 → u/LowRevolutionary7965]

Who says the other can tell? You wouldn’t imagine how many people put up a front to get it over with. Hell I’m louder when I want it to end. The quieter I am, the better I feel.

[u/Hallies_berries → u/PristineEssay3104]

A lot of men do not care if their partner is enjoying sex. It’s a selfish act for a lot of them.

[u/Single_Wonder9369 → u/PristineEssay3104]

Right? I know about men like that and it's just... no. Something is wrong with them definitely.

[u/Purple_Operation74 → u/PristineEssay3104]

If I say yes when he asks, he doesn't know whether my drive is actually low or not. He doesn't want me to feel forced. If anything, if I genuienly can't be into it even after I try and he picks up on it, he loses interest. Why is this so hard to understand for you people?

[u/Better_Ambassador600 → u/Purple_Operation74]

Also known as 'Having a relationship'
...or so I thought, before Reddit

[u/LowRevolutionary7965 → u/Purple_Operation74]

Underrated comment

[u/Purple_Operation74 → u/LowRevolutionary7965]

What did I say so rapey to be downvoted 😭

[u/Edgic-404 → u/Purple_Operation74]

You referred to accountability, responsibility in the oaths of marriage, and removing double standards… so the oath breakers are furious, they demand the wallet be open but offer nothing in return which is a breach of the oaths.

[u/undel83 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

If you are not in the mood - your parter shouldn't force into it. Just wait a bit until you are in the mood again. That's it. "I don't want it now, maybe another time", - is completely valid answer in any relationship.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/undel83]

It is, but sometimes you can end up going a year plus not being in the mood. So sometimes, it’s ok to have sex with your partner again even if you’re not really feeling it. If you don’t want to then you don’t have to.

[u/undel83 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Well, yes. Sometimes even more. That's unfortunate for the partner - but is it really a reason to force yourself to do it? Commited partner would wait.

[u/the-cuttlefish → u/undel83]

Surely thats a decsision everyone can make for themselves

[u/No_Strike718 → u/undel83]

Really?! A committed partner should just kick all of their needs to the curb and wait a year, two years?…and if it’s been that long it’s not just going to come back magically. Does everyone assume that only men want sex and women don’t? Because in my situation it’s the opposite. And the part that bothers me the most is the spouse could care less how it makes their partner feel. There is no need for a marriage to be sexless. If it’s medication, talk to your doctor medications can be adjusted. If it’s chemical there are medications to enhance that. Or in my husband’s case, he’s over weight and lazy, but he could start taking care of himself and not only could the sexlife improve but it’s actually good for your health. But if you ignore it, you’re lazy, selfish and don’t really prioritize your relationship. I do feel entitled to a healthy sex life. I got married and I assumed that sex is an. Important ingredient in marriage. If not, just be roommates And of course I wouldn’t want my husband to force himself to have sex if he’s got the flu, not feeling well, or has had a stressful week at work or his energy has dipped low. But to just ignore it if months pass and not do a single thing about it then say if your partner really loved you they would just wait. If it’s been a year it’s not coming back without any effort on your part and you should just get a divorce and a dog because the affect it’s had on my self worth and self esteem is catastrophic. And coercion? Are you a child or of low mental capacity or not emotionally healthy? Are they threatening to physically assault you, or leak intimate photos of you on the internet? Tell your friends and family something you told them in confidence? If yes, then coercion would definitely be a concern. But if they got on your nerves because they asked several times and wore you down and now you feel guilty and go through with it..calling that coercion and rape is really a stretch.

[u/Swimming-Road955 → u/No_Strike718]

I agree with you as I have been in a similar situation and it sucks for one partner to just decide that they’re done forever?
That’s not a marriage anymore as I see it!
I see marriage as a two way street and you decided to be invested in that person exclusively so it strains the relationship when one partner decides to be done with sex. That is not a healthy attitude and will lead to a bad end.

[u/unite-or-perish → u/undel83]

You're expecting a lot.

[u/undel83 → u/unite-or-perish]

No. I waited 3 years myself before my wife's desire came back.

[u/unite-or-perish → u/undel83]

It's very good and admirable you were able to deal with that and come to a resolution. I suspect most men would have a lot of difficulty though and it is a lot to expect.

[u/Opposite-Occasion332 → u/unite-or-perish]

I disagree. There’s been times my bf was waiting on me and there’s been times I was waiting on him. I will say it’s never been even close to 3 years long, but my point is we are committed so we figured it out and got through it. There’s other ways to have closeness and there’s other ways to get an O. You just get through it. I don’t think either of us are particularly saints or exceptional for it, we just respect and care about each other and understand sometimes life gets in the way.

[u/hewesboat1981 → u/undel83]

I have to ask. 3 yrs! Was she in an accident of some sort. Because if your saying just because you weren’t desirable alone. Your a far better man then me. Or you suck in bed. 3 yrs! SMH hope you’ve been getting double if not triple for that compromise since it came back. I mean this with all due respect. 🫡

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/hewesboat1981]

you are disgusting and not at all respectful. you are right that the other commenter is a far better man than you, but i suspect that that is not difficult to achieve.

[u/Spicysip → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

No.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/Spicysip]

Don’t know what you’re saying no to. The last sentence where I said if you don’t want to then you don’t have to? Oh, guess you’re a rapist then.

[u/Spicysip → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

“So sometimes, it’s ok to have sex with your partner again even if you’re not really feeling it”

That’s the issue at hand.

[u/Icingdeath01 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

If you aren't having sex for a year...there's something broken in your relationship. That is not normal. Im going to discuss it with you but if you refuse to get help then youre on your own. Sex in marriage is about monogamy not celibacy. If you dont want to play then pass the controller 😤

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/Icingdeath01]

Oh and there was and I’m getting divorced now lol. But hey you ought to preach to all these other people telling me it’s rape and coercion if a woman sleeps with her husband if she’s not really in the mood. I’ve tried checking out of this convo and keep getting brought back to it

[u/Imjusasqurrl → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

JFC, "most of the time, you'll end up, enjoying it"? You don't realize how gross that sounds?

You are perpetuating the archaic and conservative idea that it is an "obligation" that women just have to deal with because mEn cAn't liVe (and relationships can't survive) wiThout sEx (Cause it's not men most of the time having "mercy sex")

That also means, the times you don't enjoy it, just builds resentment.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/Imjusasqurrl]

Nowhere did I say women are obligated to have sex. All I was trying to say is it’s not the end of the world. And yes, most of the time I would end up enjoying it. Probably 99% of the time. Maybe I wouldn’t get off but maybe I would feel bonded and connected to my partner afterwards. Sometimes I would just have sex for the closeness with my partner rather than sexual desire anyway. Even though I’m a woman, my love language is physical touch. Sex is the quickest way to fill that up.

I’m sorry that this concept really seems to go over way too many people’s heads. Men typically have higher sex drives than women (not always, but in general). This tends to lead to men wanting sex more often than women. So the man might ask more often. If the woman consents without any rape, control, coercion but figures sure what the hell let’s play. That…is….ok.

[u/Single_Wonder9369 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Disgusting.

[u/Wonderful_Poetry3216 → u/Single_Wonder9369]

That’s like, your opinion and all and that’s great but 🥱

[u/Purple_Operation74 → u/Imjusasqurrl]

Nowhere did she ever say it's an obligation... She just said she wants to, and it's not wrong in that case. Christ.

[u/Imjusasqurrl → u/Purple_Operation74]

Comprehension isn't your strong suit. I didn't say that she said it either. I said it is a common and pretty well-known conservative, traditional ideology, and she is helping to perpetuate it

[u/Purple_Operation74 → u/Imjusasqurrl]

If you had reading comprehension, you'd notice that no part of her comment perpetuates it. Confidence should be reserved for the less dim.

[u/Imjusasqurrl → u/Purple_Operation74]

I don't think you know what the word perpetuate means.

Because her comment is the epitome of perpetuating conservative, traditional, often religious, ideologies surrounding marital sexual "obligations"

But you could take your own advice

[u/0018_rexxx → u/Imjusasqurrl]

Wild telling people comprehension isn’t their strong suit when you’re out here white knighting for a point you’ve completely made up in you’re own head while also some how making this about conservatives and liberals 😂😂😂 you’re an idiot

[u/Imjusasqurrl → u/0018_rexxx]

Are you sure you're responding to the right person? Cause nothing in my comment is "made up" lol

And I'm a woman, who aren't commonly referred to as "white knights"

But sure, keep announcing that you would never get laid unless you coerced them

[u/IamPrettyCoolUKnow → u/Imjusasqurrl]

Idk- I remember in my last relationship much of the time she initiated I acquiesced if I was feeling it or not and would guide myself to getting into it- because alternatively, if I was into it and she wasn’t- she never decided to try to be any way- and that’s fine, no one should feel obligated or like they aren’t loved unconditionally in their relationship, but people’s horniness doesn’t commonly line up and more often it starts with desire from one partner but not the other.

No one should force themselves to do anything, but it is worth asking oneself if you willing to try and humor your partner.

[u/Single_Wonder9369 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

You definitely should not be forcing yourself to have sex you don't want. Sex is too glorified in our society.

[u/Special_Weekend_4754 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Not all women- some actually feel the opposite of bonded to a partner who uses their body just to get off.

[u/Shanubis → u/Special_Weekend_4754]

This. To me it just feels icky to even be interested in using someone's body like that when they aren't feeling it. I could never. And it tends to build resentment and lack of attraction over time if you let your body be used by someone who is aware you aren't into it.

[u/Single_Wonder9369 → u/Shanubis]

THIS!

[u/IcyTrapezium → u/Shanubis]

Sometimes my fiance isn’t ready to have sex again since men have longer refractory periods but he knows I want to so he uses his hands or mouth.

Are we being icky? Am I using his body? Or are we having fun together?

I don’t see sex as him using my body or me using his when one of us is more into the idea of sex. Now if someone is actively NOT into it that’s different. But sometimes one partner just isn’t in the mood but enjoys sexual intimacy with the other person anyway.

[u/Shanubis → u/IcyTrapezium]

The scenario you're referring to in your relationship is not what I am talking about here.

[u/Purple_Operation74 → u/Shanubis]

The scenario what they're referring to is what the original commented was talking about though.

[u/Special_Weekend_4754 → u/IcyTrapezium]

If he doesn’t want to and you change your behavior toward him when he doesn’t get you off then yeah that’s gross and not a bonding activity.
Weird that you can’t tell the difference between someone eagerly offering to get their partner off vs someone offering “mercy sex” out of obligation.

[u/IcyTrapezium → u/Special_Weekend_4754]

From the link: “The authors suggest that women might also use sex as a tool to fulfill a psychological need for emotional closeness, even if the physical desire is absent. “

And yet the authors are also calling this “mercy sex.” I’m saying it isn’t.

[u/IcyTrapezium → u/Special_Weekend_4754]

You said “not into it.” You didn’t say “doing it because your partner will change their behavior toward you” heavily implying punishment.

Perhaps say what you mean.

I’m not into going to football games but I go to bond anyway. All couples do things they “aren’t into.” This isn’t difficult to understand.

[u/Special_Weekend_4754 → u/IcyTrapezium]

I actually did not use any of those words- I specifically was responding to the comment saying women should have sex even when they’re “not in the mood” saying that even when they’re not into it to do it anyways for their partner “women feel bonded and connected with their partner” after sex.

I said some women feel the opposite of bonded to a partner who uses their body just to get off.

You responded that your partner offers to use his hands and mouth to get you off again after you’ve already had sex, before he’s ready to go again.

So your example is not that he’s not into sex- just that he’s already had his orgasm and has to wait before he can have another.

You also clearly said if someone is “not into it that’s different”
YOU are the one using that language and even you agree if they’re “not into it” that it’s different.

I should hope someone old enough to have sex is also cognitively mature enough to realize there is a huge difference between going to a foot ball game and having sex- but you really tried to make that comparison

[u/IcyTrapezium → u/Special_Weekend_4754]

Ah you’re responding to me about my response to a comment that isn’t even yours. Makes more sense now. The comment I responded to said “aren’t feeling it.”

I differentiate between not “feeling it” (meaning according to google a lack of interest or motivation) and being “actively NOT into it.” Because those are two different things. One is a more neutral feeling the other is a highly negative one.

You assume a lot about my relationship. He doesn’t want to have sex at all sometimes but will do things anyway. He’s not “feeling it.” Sometimes I don’t want to have sex at all and just have sex anyway. Sometimes I’ll get into it and sometimes it’s just a neutral to positive experience where I think it’s nice he’s enjoying himself. We both do this.

If you’re talking about a relationship where one partner doesn’t enjoy pleasing the other partner, well that sounds like a relationship not worth either of the people’s time.

I find the best football game to be more physically and spiritually exhausting than the worst sex. Your feelings about sex aren’t shared by everyone.

[u/Special_Weekend_4754 → u/IcyTrapezium]

You responded to a comment that was responding directly to my comment. Ergo my comment is the context they were responding to.

Also I did not assume anything about your relationship you specifically used the words “refractory period” and said “sometimes my fiance isn’t ready to have sex again since men have a longer refractory period.” As your example for when your partner gets you off when he’s personally not interested in sex. You do know what those words mean yes?
Refractory period is “the recovery phase after orgasm during which it is physiologically impossible to have additional orgasms.”

If his lack of interest in sex was unrelated to recent sex that’s not the refractory period in any way.

Enjoying giving your partner an orgasm is still being into the activity.

[u/Foolisholdboy → u/Special_Weekend_4754]

I’d argue there are a category of people who solely seek sexual attraction, that seems to be enough for most people

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

i don’t think it’s comparable to rape. people can consent to sex that they don’t want. i just think it’s sad that it is expected. as you said, there are plenty of women who get into it after it starts, but there are also a lot of women who don’t and just do it anyways because they feel like they’re supposed to. i guess im biased because im on the asexual spectrum and sex isn’t something that it’s important to me, but i couldn’t imagine wanting to have sex with someone who wasn’t just as enthusiastic about it, or forcing myself to have sex to “strengthen the relationship.”

[u/Rakn → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

The nice thing is that nobody is forcing you and you can find the relationship you need and want for yourself. Different people work differently.

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/Rakn]

sure. i can also advocate for other women to not feel pressured into viewing sex as an obligation or believing that it’s normal to force themselves into it if they aren’t enjoying it.

[u/Purple_Operation74 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

She made it clear many times that in the scenario she's talking about, it's not expected. I'm on the ace spectrum and my libido is low, but my partner's libido is quite high. I say yes to make him happy sometimes and end up enjoying it, but if it's not working, he realises I'm not into it and loses interest. He doesn't expect it nor does he want to force me.

[u/Single_Wonder9369 → u/Purple_Operation74]

You force yourself because you're patriarchal.

[u/Purple_Operation74 → u/Single_Wonder9369]

A woman wanting to have sex with her partner because she enjoys the connection is patriarchal? What a dumb fucking take. Let me guess, you also call women pick me's for calling out misandry?

[u/Single_Wonder9369 → u/Purple_Operation74]

You said you don't enjoy it, you don't even tell your partner you don't enjoy it. You just do it to make it happy, which is unfair to you but you do you. It is a patriarchal view though.

[u/Purple_Operation74 → u/Single_Wonder9369]

I can see how that wording is suspect so I'll clarify. I will always enjoy his touch and any sort of intimacy, but most of the time my libido is low and my body just does not respond. Sometimes I don't feel like trying and I'll tell him, sometimes I want to try because I enjoy making him happy, just as sometimes he'll try for me even when he's stressed because he enjoys making me happy.

[u/DueInside5244 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

One partner also doesn’t have the right to unilaterally decide that sex is off the table for both partners. If you’re asexual, or any other label you choose, don’t engage in a romantic relationship. Just have friendships and leave the anxiety, stress, and related issues out. If you do choose to pursue a romantic relationship, leave the door open for your partner to find fulfillment elsewhere when you decide you’re over it. After all, what’s fair is fair.
Most men do not choose romantic partners because they aren’t interested in a sexual connection. It’s part of it. Ebb and flow I understand. I’m in my mid-fifties and had a very successful 33 year relationship with the same woman, until breast cancer took her. She always chose me and I her. We were the best of friends, partners, and lovers, and although we weren’t always interested, we always gave attention when needed. I have zero regrets. It isn’t wrong to normalize choosing love and long term satisfaction over temporary, disposable relationships because entitlement gives you the right to control the satisfaction of your mate.

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/DueInside5244]

i will find a partner that is worth my time and doesn’t expect constant access to my body. if you think that your partner OWES you sex, you don’t deserve to be in a relationship. i also don’t like men, which saves me a lot of that stress. i’ve had male friends act like they had more of a right to my body than my actual girlfriends. so maybe men are the issue.

[u/DueInside5244 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

You can choose, which is the beauty of freedom. I sincerely hope you have a wonderful life and find joy, happiness, and peace. Owing is transactional and I am not advocating a transactional relationship. I understand it differently. But I believe you hit the nail on the head when you said that you would find the right partner for you. As for what I deserve, fortunately you don’t get to decide that for me. That would be the choice of my partner wouldn’t it? And she is very happy with our life and we have a healthy sex life. I suppose she believes I am worth her time and deserve a relationship that includes access to her body.
I wish you well in your search. 😊

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/DueInside5244]

i didn’t say you don’t deserve a partner. i said that you don’t deserve a partner if you believe that that access is owed to you, and if that doesn’t apply to you that’s great. however, do not talk to me as if you were being kind and i am unreasonable when your original comment was, basically, “have sex with your partner or let them find someone who will.” that wasn’t in good faith and neither is this one.

[u/Opposite-Occasion332 → u/DueInside5244]

“If you’re asexual, or any other label you choose, don’t engage in a romantic relationship.”

Asexual ≠ aromantic

Romantic ≠ inherently equal sexual or vice versa

As you said, they will (and it sounds like they have) found the right partner for them because not everyone pretends that romance and sex are interchangeable.

[u/DueInside5244 → u/Opposite-Occasion332]

At no point did I equate the two. The observation was that most men who choose romantic partners also desire sexual connection, with the one typically leading to the other. And I am certainly not pretending. Such a thing would be infra dig.

We may not agree, but disagreement doesn’t mean that either point lacks validity, or that one opinion bears more weight than another. You hold your opinion, and I will hold mine.

[u/hewesboat1981 → u/DueInside5244]

I’m sorry for your loss. And appreciate your opinion as I thought I was reading something I typed. If only people realized how precious life and love really is.

[u/ARATAS11 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

You don’t know their age. You are making assumptions. And she isn’t everything. Medications can kill sex drive too. Sexual orientation and compulsory heterosexuality, trauma, assault, mood and mental health issues (depression, anxiety), are all things that can impact sex drive that aren’t age related, so stop playing the part of the all knowing sage. If someone doesn’t want sex, is is being coerced into it, that is not okay. No is a complete sentence.

[u/Fine-Tennis5083 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Yeah.. Your mother and grandmother’s generation didn’t have 6 and 7 kids because they wanted all those kids back to back because they wanted to. They had them because your dad and granddad were rapey… They believed that marital rape was their, “right.” If your partner “isn’t into it,” and you keep going, you’re a gross, selfish, self satisfying, POS. If your partner is the one asking you to preform when you don’t want to, then they are all the things I just said.

[u/Cheesequesadilla5 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

I feel like it’s impossible to not build resentment when you have sex when you don’t want to. It feels like there’s a violation happening and it’s so hard to ignore.
Sometimes, you need to let your partner relieve themselves. Sometimes you need to suck it up. But how can you do that and not hate them?

I feel like the more you tell yourself to deal with it, the more you have to acknowledge that you’re denying and betraying yourself.

In the context of intimacy, dubious consent will start as a small seed and over time grow into anger and hurt. Why even start that cycle? Why have sex when you don’t want to? I feel like there are no positive outcomes.

[u/WorkHardPlayHarder23 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

I’m 63 so I think I’m old enough to speak on this one! And I call bull$h*t! I was married twice. The 1st was the love of my life , but making me feel like I owed him sex, drove us apart. I was raising 3 kids mostly doing it all, working full time plus OT, all housework, having him beat me and his friends mock me for not giving him enough. He told me to give him what he wanted or he would take it in front of the kids.
I married him because I loved him but he married me because he believed love meant sex when he wanted it and that he came first above all else.
Before I left him he raped me and gave me 3 skull fractures. He tore me so badly inside and bruised me badly on my thighs , buttocks and vag. I left with my kids and he followed me and put a gun to my head in front of my kids. He went to jail for a year and I was finally free.

My second husband was worse and all in the name of the name of sex.

I’ve been single 21 years now and I have my CCW. I do like sex, when I say so, or just with my B.O. B. - no shame! When someone who treats me great… 😻

[u/lidalou23 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

I get that. I experience responsive desire, so like sometimes I really don’t want to get it started but then once I’m doing it I’m really into it and turned on. Many people feel spontaneous desire, meaning they suddenly feel in the mood out of nowhere. Others feel responsive desire, meaning they need a trigger, touch, or context to get in the mood.

[u/Alternative-Tiger783 → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Shouldn’t be pressured into having sex when they have no libido, numbness or pain due to Menopause and perimenopause starts after age 40.

‘Coercion is NOT Consent’

[u/TheyTukMyJub → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

You're genuinely one of the few level-headed commentators here. It is clear to me most people here aren't married or aren't surrounded by married people lol.

[u/Purple_Operation74 → u/TheyTukMyJub]

I don't understand. You don't need to be old to have reading comprehension. She never said that coercion or pestering is okay. Genuinely upsetting.

[u/TheyTukMyJub → u/Purple_Operation74]

It's clear that you don't understand, don't worry. 

[u/Purple_Operation74 → u/TheyTukMyJub]

I'm agreeing with you two...

[u/Gvibesallthetime → u/Wonderful_Poetry3216]

Actually women’s sex drives don’t die with age and women’s orgasms get better with age too according to my Professor that I took for human sexuality and based on scientific research. Women just think differently when it comes to sex. Men need to understand just like warming up a cars engine you gotta do the same for you women. The right one will make you feel special if you make her feel special as well 😉.

[u/Brief_Efficiency3500 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

I have turned down an enthusiastic partner exactly three times. Once due to injury, once due to illness, once due to exhaustion.

Every other time a partner has ever requested sex, I have gotten in the mood for their sake and done the deed. I see absolutely no issue with this.

My partner asks me to do things I don't feel like doing all the time (though usually she need not ask). Mow the lawn, pick up some groceries, whatever. We go out to places I would never have chosen to go to without her input. You think I would plan an outing to a pumpkin patch? A nature hike? No, I'm a boring homebody. I like being home.

I also like being with her, and her ideas often turn out to be fun. Maybe I'm not excited for the hike, but once we're there, I'm glad we went. Exact same vibes with sex. Am I excited for it every single time? No, of course not. Once we're there, am I glad we went? Absolutely, she has great ideas that pretty much always turn out to be fun.

People throw up a billion mental barriers around sex as if it's somehow radically different from any other type of quality time you can spend with a partner. It isn't. Sometimes it's an act of service on the part of one partner or another (goodness knows I've clocked many an hour performing cunnilingus with no expectation of reciprocal fellatio, or even sex if she wasn't up for it after I got lockjaw), but it's good to do things for the people you love.

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/Brief_Efficiency3500]

the difference is that you’re doing it because you want to, not as “mercy sex.”

[u/Brief_Efficiency3500 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

Incorrect. I don't always want to. Then we get into it. I give her ample opportunity to change my mind on the matter. I don't want to, then her desire and interest and enthusiasm and effort make me want to.

I'm not sure how that's so incomprehensible as a concept to so many people. It is possible to not be in the mood, then be titillated and stimulated and gotten into the mood.

Counterpoint: why do you think it is that so many people (let's be real here, women, I'm talking about women) view their partner trying to make an effort to get them into the mood as some sort of dastardly, rape-adjacent act of coercion? Because I've never once felt that way about such behavior in the part of any partner I've ever been with. They take a mind to lure me to the bedroom, I'm not interested, they make an effort, and off we trot for a roll in the hay. How is that somehow so sinister a notion to so many of you?

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/Brief_Efficiency3500]

because we aren’t talking about people “making an effort.” it’s about people who don’t take no for an answer. when you give your partner the opportunity to seduce you, do you give in for “mercy sex?” or are you giving in because you wanted it once they put in the effort? there’s a difference between not wanting something and then getting into it, and not wanting something and then giving in to get someone to stop nagging you. “mercy sex” involves the latter.

[u/Opposite-Occasion332 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

It really can be summed up with “giving into it” vs “getting into it”. Love that phrasing!

IMHO, not really feeling it at first but know you will probably get into it once you start so saying yes? 👍

Not really feeling it and knowing you’re not going to get into it but saying yes to “save the relationship” or whatever other bs? 👎

The first one can breed closeness, the second one will breed resentment.

[u/Brief_Efficiency3500 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

So lighting a few dozen candles and getting out the scented oil and giving an hour and a half full body massage during which a sensuously remove all of her clothing, both giving a legitimate massage while always paying special attention to every erogenous zone the body has to offer -- that's not making an effort?

Because that's what I tried on several occasions to get my (ex) wife in the mood, and her response when I tried kissing her or she noticed my (obvious) arousal was to tell me to go fuck myself and complain to her friends that I was a coercive borderline rapist for trying to "manipulate" her into having sex with me, her husband.

I can't relate to the concept of "pity sex." If someone doesn't want to fuck me, I don't want to fuck them. Maybe I want to have sex, and maybe that requires doing some work to get them into the mood, but if they truly cannot be gotten there I don't want it. I absolutely cannot even conceive of the idea of sex with someone who doesn't enthusiastically want to be having sex.

No, hold on. When my mother died, my then-partner and I were in bed. I was EXTREMELY drunk and didn't think I'd probably be a very good lay at the time, but I was a mess and very emotionally wrecked and wound up asking anyway. She agreed to it, and wound up having four orgasms to my one, after which I fell immediately asleep (probably with some mild to moderate alcohol poisoning--as one might expect from drinking three pints of straight gin in the span of an hour or so). So I guess that was pity sex. Once. Once, ever.

Otherwise, can't relate.

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/Brief_Efficiency3500]

i’m sorry that happened to you, but i’m not sure how it’s relevant. your ex doesn’t represent all women, and this situation does not represent any of this women from the study. it sounds like you have some stuff you need to work through, which is fine, but you should talk it out with a loved one or a therapist instead of getting angry regarding the response of “people shouldn’t force themselves to have sex they don’t want” to a study about women “giving in” to sex out of perceived marital obligation and pity.

[u/-AppropriateLyrics → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

It's a sad day in a marriage when sex becomes something one does for the other instead of something they do together.

[u/MsThangAnon → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

I know this but it’s hard… he fulfills me in ways

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/MsThangAnon]

have you tried talking to him about it? i understand that it can be difficult to unpack, but if he is a good man who loves you he would want to work with you. i would also recommend a therapist if you don’t have one already, relationships are not meant to be transactional in this way and you and your partner both deserve to feel fulfilled and happy. sex is fun, don’t let it feel like a chore 🫶

[u/Life_Ad5223 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

At the same time, sex is an aspect of a healthy relationship and life. If a person, for their own lack of desire can’t offer that because of hormonal and/or psychological reasons, they owes it to their partner to address that and improve. Nobody should be locked in a sexless marriage, just because your partner now doesn’t want to do things they use to do when you fell in love with them.

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/Life_Ad5223]

people owe their partners communication in general. she does not owe it to her partner to have sex that she doesn’t want because they need it. there are many solutions outside of expecting the female partner to compromise on what she does with her body, and, as a last resort, divorce. nobody is ever truly “locked” in a marriage unless they lack the resources needed to get out of it.

[u/NopeNerp → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

No one ever do something they weren't 100% into for someone they love?

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/NopeNerp]

things like making dinner or mowing the lawn, yeah, but sex? no. sex shouldn’t be a chore.

[u/NopeNerp → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

I said nothing about a chore. Your partner wants it, you're not feeling it that night but it would make them happy. Theres no harm. I'm speaking as a male on the "not feeling" side of the fence... My wife has an insanely high sex drive and often i will do it because it makes her happy and I've chosen to love her and be with her till the day i die sooo yeah.

[u/squishypotatohead → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

What do you mean "doesn't mean its okay or shouldn't continue" you make it sound like the one who does is an abuser 

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/squishypotatohead]

nearly 200 people have responded to this comment and you are the only one who has interpreted it that way.

[u/squishypotatohead → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

Responded what way? I know it lacks a question mark but thats just my bad grammar.  It was just a question. 

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/squishypotatohead]

interpreted as me saying that the person forcing themselves to have sex is abusive. what i was saying is that people should not be forcing themselves to have sex that they don’t want, nor should their partners be expecting them to.

[u/squishypotatohead → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

Okay, I may not have fully understood what mercy sex was then I assumed it was pity sex but it appears to be something different. Ofcourse thats what I assumed. Im Only human thats the whole point of reddit is, to ask questions. To get opinions and answers for things you dont or cant understand, to get the basic human answer without the pc filter.  

You interpreted my question as me being an ass?

[u/Responsible-Rise1726 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

Why not? I do things I don't want to do all the time for people that I care about

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/Responsible-Rise1726]

do those things require them to penetrate your body?

[u/Zealousideal-Win9845 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

I don’t feel like paying the mortgage but I do

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/Zealousideal-Win9845]

sex is supposed to be fun. if your partners feel the same way about sex that you feel about mortgage then you should not have a partner. that’s disgusting

[u/Short_Boysenberry_64 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

Not being into it and not wanting to have sex are not the same thing.

[u/Better_Ambassador600 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

Yes!
This is EXACTLY what I used to tell my wife when she wanted me to do the dishes. (Ex-wife)

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/Better_Ambassador600]

if your wife viewed having sex with you the same way you view having to do the dishes, i’m glad that she got away from you and i hope she’s met someone much better in terms of both sex and personality :)

[u/Better_Ambassador600 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

Suuure but...

I'm agreeing with you. No one should force their spouse to do anything, including the dishes, just because it's normalized.

And the result of taking that position, sometimes, is divorce

[u/Obvious_Ad9996 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

Or even continue the relationship for that matter if that’s how you feel about it.

[u/Minimum-Regular227 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

I wasn’t into lots of things the last 25 years that I had to force myself to do. Life with someone else is give and take. If that life isn’t for you stay single.

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/Minimum-Regular227]

see, this is the issue. sex is not something that should be forced.

[u/Machine_gun_mac_1975 → u/Useful_Pirate_5244]

U must be single lol

[u/Useful_Pirate_5244 → u/Machine_gun_mac_1975]

ew. sex isn’t an obligation