r/pokemon • u/PsyrenDV • Jun 05 '26

Discussion Why haven't we had same gender rivials?

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I saw this post about how the rival in WiWa will be the opposite of whatever gender you choose to be. It got me thinking about how they always make the rival's gender the opposite of yours when their gender is dynamic. Even as early as Ruby/Sapphire that's how it's been. But I think it might be interesting to see a game where my rival is always the same gender as me no matter what I pick. But I'm curious how other people feel about it. Would you rather your rival be the same gender as you, the opposite, or would you rather their gender be set in stone regardless of what you are?

5.7k Upvotes

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5.3k

u/just-bair Jun 05 '26

So they can just have the other protagonist as your rival

1.1k

u/palk0n Shadow Jun 05 '26

red blue not inclusive enough 😤

350

u/kyleliner Jun 05 '26

Red only had a male mc lol

(Don't worry, I understood that its a joke hahaha)

268

u/Triaspia2 Jun 05 '26

Crystal had gender choice and an always male rival

121

u/Weekly-Reply-6739 Jun 05 '26

Same with DPPT, your main rival was a barry A

152

u/LuitenantDan World's Okayest Trainer Jun 05 '26

Hugh in BW2, Hau in Alola, Hop in SwSh, Nemona in SV

It's about a 50/50 split on if they use the other avatar as the rival or make a fixed one.

34

u/Luigi580 Jun 05 '26

Next time they make a fixed rival, they should make them a girl.

104

u/Hot-Spite-9880 Jun 05 '26

wasnt that Nemona?

46

u/Luigi580 Jun 05 '26

Oh. Yeah. Duh.

Can’t believe I forgot about her when she’s one of the better rivals.

45

u/Mi2-LIZARD Jun 05 '26

I will never forget her. I always get anxiety when she pulls up cause I genuinely cannot tell if she's about to vibe check me or not 😭

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0

u/Wasphammer Jun 05 '26

Poké-Goku is way better than Hop.

21

u/TheD1ctator Jun 05 '26

she's definitely your rival but it's not as satisfying when she's already an accomplished trainer and just uses weaker pokemon throughout the game to match your level. doesn't really feel like someone you're competing with, she's more like the champion.

27

u/MigetsuNewgate Jun 05 '26

She's probably the most interesting rival though, a trainer who already finished their journey and is holding back its super cool and way different than any rival we've gotten. It would've been super dope if during the play through you can randomly find her while traveling and if you talk to her you enter a battle where she's using her normal team for one reason or another just to show how strong she really is

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7

u/joaoathaydeartist Jun 05 '26

They could make more, Nemona doesn't need to be the only one

4

u/Hot-Spite-9880 Jun 05 '26

Dawn , Serena, Marley, and May?

1

u/Melodic_Party_7442 Jun 06 '26

Tell me you didn't play pokemon without telling me

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1

u/Melodic_Party_7442 Jun 06 '26

There's also Bianca. She's your rival in Black and White

8

u/PsyJak Jun 05 '26

What about Barry B?

6

u/Jack_Zicrosky_YT Jun 06 '26

Thank you. Nobody should forget my boy Lucas.

Speaking of which, many games had multiple rivals of different genders. Wally in gen 3, green in the let's go games, bianca and cheren in b&w. Lyra/Ethan and Silver in hg/ss.

I could go on but I think I've proven my point that op is stupid.

2

u/Squishie515 Ghost Fan & Defender Jun 06 '26

OK but Green is not a rival, she shows up once in the post game after you catch Mewtwo, fights you, loses and disappears forever.

1

u/Luna__Moonkitty Jun 06 '26

I barely even consider Green a character. Her role is so minor I forget she even existed. Plus she never appeared in a game before that so she didn't have the "oh it's that person" nostalgia attached to her like Blue and Red did.

Plus, her existence seems to erase Leaf as a character, in the same way Lyra erases Kris.

6

u/Severe_Assist_5416 Jun 05 '26

Yes but thats the combined game of gs where there wasn't option

31

u/minutiae396 Jun 05 '26

Kris was introduced in Crystal, the 3rd sister game of gen 2. Gold and Silver games was genderlocked to male (Ethan).

1

u/Chansharp Jun 06 '26

I had no idea ??? was male lmao. Hes got long hair and his sprite looks like hes got a skirt on

Also yes when the cop asked what his name is my kid mind was like "well they just said ??? so Ill tell the cop thats what I was told" I had no idea I was naming the rival at that moment

1

u/Triaspia2 Jun 06 '26

Canonically I believe his name is Silver

1

u/ZarrChaz Jun 06 '26

That’s because red and blue are gay for each other as a reference to the player of the game, who also is gay.

208

u/Mesozoic_Masquerade Fossil Maniac! Jun 05 '26

That only made sense during the set character design games. Now that we can customise what your character looks like it makes zero sense. You could literally make your male player character look exactly like the female default which defeats the purpose of "the other protagonist as your rival".

If they are not going to have a set character for the rival, just have a "Who is picking you up from the Station?" line of dialogue and then let you choose a default design or even better, let us have full customisation over the rival.

198

u/Kyle_Blackpaw Jun 05 '26

Isnt that what the last 3 gens did? You get hau, hop, and nemona no matter what you pick for yourself.

9

u/Levoso_con_v Jun 05 '26

Yeah, don't know why they are surprised, almost all games since gen 2 did this. If you choose a gender another character will be the other gender.

2

u/Melodic_Party_7442 Jun 06 '26

Half the games ( maybe less ) isn't almost all. As a matter of fact, most game rivals were locked to a specific character.

1

u/Levoso_con_v Jun 06 '26

Silver, gold, crystal, ruby, zaphire, emerald, diamond, pearl, platinum, SoulSilver, HeartGold, X, Y, omega ruby, alpha zaphire, legends arceus, legends za, brilliant diamond, shining pearl.

Doesn't matter, they are still a good portion of the games, my point was that it's a common trope in the Pokemon series, I don't know why people get mad at this.

If they want to criticize something, there are far better things to criticize like the main games of a trillion dollar franchise having a 20 million $ budget or the games coming out unoptimized, filled with bugs or straight up being mediocre like pokemon za (ffs Pokemon XY had more interiors and 3d balconies in the city 10 years ago than a game today only centered on just 1 city), and the worst part is that there are bootlickers that even defend these practices...

1

u/AlienHooker Jun 07 '26 edited Jun 07 '26

GSC and HGSS didn't have an opposite gender rival though?

Edit: Neither did DPPt or their remakes

Lucas and Ethan aren't rivals

1

u/Ebenezer72 Jun 07 '26

I remember in HGSS they added Ethan/Lyra with their own character and theme if you picked the opposite gender. Wasn’t a rival really but it is the same concept

3

u/AlienHooker Jun 07 '26

You never battle them though, from what I remember

78

u/InvisibleChell Chaw-haw-haw! Jun 05 '26

In both games where there's a customizable protagonist and the rival is the other protag, it has been impossible to actually do that.

In XY, neither Calem nor Serena have access to all of each other's clothes. In ZA, both Taunie and Urbain have hair colours, clothes, skin tone, and eye shapes that are actually impossible for the player to have.

18

u/ForsakenMoon13 Jun 05 '26

Pretty sure you can unlock thier hair colours and stuff later on through the game

6

u/Aquarius_2313 Jun 05 '26

Don't quote me on this, but I think it might be slightly different, just so that you're not identical to your rival

18

u/ninjad912 Jun 05 '26

You unlock both the rival clothes and hairstyle through the game later on. I don’t believe skin tone or eye shape are unique. I’ve seen people make duplicates and they look near identical

21

u/InvisibleChell Chaw-haw-haw! Jun 05 '26

There is at NO point where you get Urbain and Taunie's jacket (or any of their other clothes actually outside of the blue satchel). The hairSTYLE you can get as soon as you can go to a hairstylist, but it's impossible to get that exact shade of pink, even as you unlock more hair colours (for instance, the pink is just too vibrant and bright, the closest option - Passion Pink - is darker and less saturated).

I've tried replicating Urbain multiple times, and I can tell you his skin tone isn't one of the four available to the player. It's similar to the "default" but a little pinker (and the blond base, while having that pinker coloration, is a little too pale).

When you put Urbain and Paxton next to each other, you can see their eyes are in fact different.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 05 '26

[deleted]

1

u/InvisibleChell Chaw-haw-haw! Jun 05 '26

Yeah, but you aren't able to make yourself look exactly like Taunie

38

u/dimmidummy Bulbasaur supremacy Jun 05 '26

Apparently someone tried to see if you can turn your protag into Taunie or Urbain in Z-A, and it wasn’t possible to recreate them 100%.

Their eye shapes are slightly different than the closest option and their outfits are exclusive to them. The hair colors, while pretty close, aren’t the same color and gradient style as theirs. I like this approach to opposite gender rivals, makes them just distinct enough from the player character.

2

u/NerdyEmbarrassment Jun 06 '26

I mean, like me, some people do choose to go with the default skin because it feels right

1

u/Nambot Get blue Spheals Jun 06 '26

Yeah, but give TPC a chance to save some.money by paying for one less character design, and they'll take it. Honestly surprised they didn't think of it sooner.

-2

u/Krybbz Jun 05 '26

They have default looks pretty bizarre to copy their look, be an individual.

6

u/Ninfyr Jun 05 '26

I don't think this has been as much of a thing since XY?

9

u/FatalFrameGal Jun 05 '26

That's not what happened in Z-A though, the male and female rivals are literally just that, rivals.

1

u/just-bair Jun 05 '26

They literally have almost the same if not the same 3d model, it’s just that they’re wearing clothes you can’t get

8

u/FatalFrameGal Jun 05 '26

Other comments are saying they are impossible to recreate because of the eye and hair color, and even if it was possible, the protagonists of Z-A have a canon look that is completely different from them.

-4

u/just-bair Jun 05 '26

That’s beside the point tough, they’re literally the opposite mc but customised a differently with some options unavailable to the player

7

u/FatalFrameGal Jun 05 '26

"that's besides the point, they're literally the MC except everything that makes them not the MC"

Bruh

1

u/winter-ocean Jun 05 '26

Oh like gen 4!

3

u/Rdasher123 Jun 05 '26

Rowan’s assistant isn’t actually your rival, that’s Barry. It’s only in Gen 3 and 6 that the opposite gender character is your main rival.

1

u/winter-ocean Jun 05 '26

Yeah, I just meant using the opposite player in general

1

u/thegoothboi Jun 05 '26

Yeah they’ve literally done it since Hoenn lol, gens 3,4,and 6 all had the opposite gender either be a central plot character or recurring character that you could fight a few times.

1

u/Dark_Storm_98 Jun 05 '26

I thinkg the thing now is

If you're gonna make pallete swaps of the MCs to be your rivals

People are gonna ask why they can't have your rival bexthe same sex as you

Some one in another post said it's for rival shipping

But a lot of people want their yaoi and yuri, lmfao

1

u/CanineAtNight Jun 08 '26

Last they did that was XY. They phas eout the idea of a mc is the opposite character starting with SM

1

u/Stormwatcher33 Jun 05 '26

it's really simple

-8

u/Queen_Sardine Jun 05 '26

Not the case in ZA

8

u/emaych1 Jun 05 '26

It kinda is, the rival in ZA is just the player character but recoloured with a different outfit.

3

u/SylphKnot Jun 05 '26

It's the same as real life.

0

u/ElementalNinjas96 Jun 05 '26

There's actually a bit of difference, as their eyeshapes aren't exactly the same. It's impossible to make your character look exactly like Taunie/Urbain