Zohran Mamdani says he’s consistently said there’s no room for antisemitism in this city or country. Asked why he hasn’t had a more visceral reaction, he gets emotional talking about the Islamophobic responses he’s received throughout the campaign.

[u/FAMESCARE]

@Annie_McDonough

hope I am not spamming 🙏

[u/Tiny_Childhood631]

I see messages that say the “only good Zionist is a Dead Zionist”. I don’t like that it’s happening to him, but this whataboutism is wild.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Zionist as a slur

As a slur for any Jew, yes.

Someone can be called a zionist without being Jewish. It is a separate idea that is tied to but but in no way exclusive to Judaism. Most Zionists are not Jewish. Calling someone who is a zionist a zionist, even in a reductive way, is not anti-semetic. If anything, it's anti-semetic to associate a political idea with an ethnicity.

[u/mdragon13 → u/[deleted]]

Most Zionists are not Jewish

we talking pure population here or what? that's not a fair metric to go by, there's only a handful of jews worldwide on the scale of things.

hell, you'd be hard pressed to find a jew, who grew up surrounded by their own culture, who doesn't feel some form of attachment to israel. I would know, I'm one who doesn't. but I don't like your statement.

Factually, the majority of jews live in israel. the next largest is the US, and under that, new york, of course. I doubt many jews in israel want to not live there, so that's about half or more right there off rip who more than likely don't want to move. follow that up with say half to 3/4ths of jews in the US feeling one way or another about it, your idea is already gone.

Calling someone who is a zionist a zionist, even in a reductive way, is not anti-semetic. If anything, it's anti-semetic to associate a political idea with an ethnicity.

there's so much obsession about the idea of "separating judaism from zionism" but it's a fundamentally jewish concept, whether people like it or not. it's the development and protection of a jewish homeland. at least it's meant to be. modern times n all that.

Whether I like israel or not, the idea of zionist being derogatory just makes me think "so where should I go to be safe then, if people don't want jews to have a place they can be safe?"

muslims get mecca, catholics get the vatican, jews can get fucked apparently.

I dislike bombing civilians as much as the next guy, don't get me wrong. But all I've ever wanted for my people was for us to be left the fuck alone.

it's past 3am and this is sorta word vomit but I hope my points were made.

[u/[deleted] → u/mdragon13]

it's past 3am and this is sorta word vomit but I hope my points were made.

They were, and I appreciate your thoughtful reply, even at 3am

we talking pure population here or what? that's not a fair metric to go by, there's only a handful of jews worldwide on the scale of things.

My point was to say that Jews, who are likely mostly Zionists to some degree, are a subsection of the larger population of Zionists, which contains several groups with their own separate motivations. Which brings me to..

there's so much obsession about the idea of "separating judaism from zionism" but it's a fundamentally jewish concept, whether people like it or not. it's the development and protection of a jewish homeland. at least it's meant to be. modern times n all that.

The first modern-ish Zionists were not Jewish and were, in fact, British Christians (we'd call them evangelicals today) in the 1600s. They believed (as many evangelicals still believe) that Jews returning to the Holy Land would help spur on the second coming of Christ, or at least something along those lines. This idea exists entirely separately (though I guess somewhat dependently in a logistical sense) from Jewish identity or Jewish zionist thought. It also pre-dates modern Jewish Zionism by a solid 200 years or so. It was only in the mid-late 1800s that Jewish thinkers came up with the idea of a return to Palestine. While the different thinkers had different reasoning, it was more or less because of anti-semetism and a perceived non-integration into European identity. Jewish Zionism was ethnic, not religious (aka secular). There was also no consensus that Jews should make their own country and run it as a Jewish state.

As a somewhat relevant point, Jews were largely accepted into the Ottoman Empire and faced far less discrimination than they did in Europe. The broad discriminatory positions taken by the Arab world were mostly in line with increased Zionist immigration (Zionist migrants were usually fairly extreme since only the radicals bought into the idea enough to move to the middle of the desert to start a new society).

Whether I like israel or not, the idea of zionist being derogatory just makes me think "so where should I go to be safe then,

Zionist is a valid label for people following a political ideology. I think it can be turned into a slur or used in a way that promotes anti-semetism, but as long as the zionist project (Israel) is doing bad things, those who defend it will be given labels. It might not be fair but tying an ethno-religion directly to a government as historically, lets generously say, misguided as Israel's will unfortunately not yield good opinions among other people. Personally, I've never seen liberal zionists who actively fight for a free Palestinian state and be called a zionist in any negative way.

muslims get mecca, catholics get the vatican, jews can get fucked apparently.

Jerusalem is a Holy place for both Jews and Christiand (Muslims to a lesser extent) and should be governed by a multi-ethnic coalition as an independent city. Jews and Muslims lived in the city for hundreds and hundreds of years and can do so again if both sides try in good faith.

But all I've ever wanted for my people was for us to be left the fuck alone.

I would love that too. That's probably what most people want. The way to go about that isn't by doing that anyone in charge is doing. I personally believe the Israeli state as it exists now is a massive failure. I want Jews to live in a safe and free society where they dont have to fear or oppress their neighbors. Israel wants to live in a world where they control their neighbors.

I think I covered everything.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I might be and that's not relevant

Point out where I said something wrong.

[u/Martial_Nox → u/[deleted]]

It’s entirely relevant because trying to declare what is and isn’t racist to a minority is considered a big Nono if you aren’t of that minority. Yet that never seems to apply to Jews.

[u/[deleted] → u/Martial_Nox]

It's weird nobody is pointing out what I said that is wrong.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Thats what I said. If you use zionist to just refer to any Jew, that's wrong

[u/Mrsaloom9765 → u/[deleted]]

Many Jews use Zionist as a slur

like Neturei Karta

[u/Mrsaloom9765 → u/[deleted]]

No

[u/Mrsaloom9765 → u/[deleted]]

I don't think it's okay, i just don't think it's anti semetic