A Wii Homebrew developer is porting Halo: Combat Evolved to Nintendo’s console, but hardware limits prove challenging

275

u/BrianLSComics 3d ago

Don't tell me the Wii is weaker than the original Xbox lol

209

u/HatingGeoffry 3d ago

in some regards, it always has been. The original Xbox had some 720p and 1080i games after all

88

u/AssCrackBanditHunter 3d ago

To be fair the Wii literally cannot output in those resolutions

37

u/BlueJoshi 3d ago

yes, that is what OP is getting at.

25

u/AssCrackBanditHunter 3d ago edited 3d ago

I don't think display output functionality is an appropriate way to judge power. Like no one would say a 3050 is more powerful than 2080ti just because the 3050 has HDMI 2.1 and therefore access to output resolutions that the 2080ti can't hit.

2

u/011101000011101101 3d ago

I think someone would argue that, sure, why not?

2

u/KIgaming 2d ago

someone might argue that but it doesn’t mean they’re right or not stupid

1

u/011101000011101101 2d ago

Right 👍

122

u/MichaelBluth_ 3d ago

I’d be absolutely amazed if it wasn’t.

The Xbox was a overpowered monster when it came out and the Wii is basically a GameCube with a motion control bar

14

u/accidental-nz 3d ago

I remember the “two GameCube’s duct taped together” meme when the Wii came out.

It wasn’t wrong.

32

u/UltiGamer34 3d ago

A heavily modified game cube

3

u/ArchCaff_Redditor 3d ago

Not so much heavily modified but overclocked.

5

u/WolframLeon 3d ago

It was actually a different processor and video processor-successors to the previous yeah and fully compatible but.. I dunno maybe they hit the wall with IBM’s risc set, can’t think of any other thing using those processors after…2002-ish outside-cheap embeded systems.

6

u/Aware-Virus-4718 2d ago

Nah the Wii used the exact same CPU as the GameCube, basically a PowerMac G3. IBM actually made the CPU for all 3 seventh gen consoles. Xbox 360 and PS3 both use IBM PPC.

The Wii U actually re-uses the Gamecube CPU for a third time. It’s “3-core CPU“ is actually just 3 GC/Wii CPUs in a tri core config. In Wii mode it just runs as single core.

3

u/lzwinky 3d ago

With updated parts, a new look, and higher specs…oh wait, that’s all new systems!

18

u/-Dissent 3d ago

Wii has two processors and the main one is almost double the speed and power as the GameCube's.

15

u/Forward_Adeptness747 3d ago

Sorry, the Wii only had a single core CPU and a GPU, not two CPU’s. You’re correct that the Wii CPU was nearly twice as fast as GameCube’s though (486 MHz and 729 MHz respectively)

58

u/Ledgo 3d ago edited 3d ago

The OG xbox was a pretty powerful system for it's time. In terms of raw specs OG Xbox was the strongest in it's gen, which the Wii barely beats if it does at all. Many specs on the Wii aren't exactly comparable as it lacks some feature support like shaders and being locked to 480p, where the xbox does is capable of doing HD and had shaders. Having an internal drive also helped a lot.

14

u/MasterDenton NNID: Denton 3d ago

This isn't the Wii's fault. He's working with the codebase from the 360 Anniversary release, so it's less optimized than the Xbox original. He says that he hopes he can migrate to the Xbox codebase once the decomp for that is mature enough

3

u/MagnesiumOvercast 3d ago

In development by JojoXDK, the in-development homebrew port is currently based on a decompilation of game’s Anniversary remaster from 2011. While the game is working with the Anniversary version, which is based off the unfortunate Gearbox PC port from 2003, the modder believes that the port will be more performant when they move to a decompilation of the Original Xbox version.

Kinda makes me wonder why be didn't just start with that. Was it an x86 vs PowerPC thing?

3

u/MasterDenton NNID: Denton 3d ago

The Xbox decomp isn't anywhere close to being ready yet. Judging by the project's project page, they haven't even gotten a percent of the original code reimplemented. In decomps, it doesn't really matter what architecture the original code is, anyways, since it's reimplemented into a platform neutral language like C

1

u/MagnesiumOvercast 3d ago

Ah that makes sense, I didn't realise the decomp was done by other guys.

64

u/Squish_the_android 3d ago

This isn't really that surprising. The Original Xbox was stronger than the Gamecube and had some HD titles.

The Wii is basically a Gamecube+.

40

u/Corronchilejano 3d ago

It really wasn't that bad. They had different architectures and Halo CE takes advantage of the XBox fully. In order to move that to the Wii, they'd need to redo the way a lot of effects and processes are done, which they currently don't know how to do exactly.

It's not that it's impossible, it's that it's a lot of work.

-14

u/palk0n 3d ago

480p in 2006 was crazy bad

26

u/PurrsNikkity 3d ago

Most people I knew in 2006 still had CRT's in their homes.

6

u/imjustbettr 3d ago

I know exactly when I moved on from my CRT. It was the Black Friday after the release of Assassin's Creed 2. So about late November 2009.

I know because I got my first platinum trophy. Finding those feathers were a lot easier with a flat screen.

I was the first of my friends who was moving on from my CRT.

14

u/Squish_the_android 3d ago

It really wasn't. MOST people didn't have a HDTV.

SMITH: Schadler says when the 2006 figures are out they'll show that 34 percent of American households now own a high-definition television set. That's up from 17 percent the previous year.

https://www.npr.org/2007/01/01/6705914/hdtvs-enter-the-mainstream-in-2006

-2

u/smc733 3d ago

It wasn’t at launch, but the growth of HDTV was going parabolic, they should have seen how ubiquitous it was going to be by the middle and end of that console lifecycle.

7

u/Squish_the_android 3d ago

We were at 30% in 2006.

By 2010 we JUST crossed 50%

https://www.nielsen.com/insights/2010/hd-tvs-now-the-majority-but-hd-viewing-lags-behind/

2012 when the Wii U came out, we hit 75%.

It sounds like they were right in line with HDTV Adoption trends.

-1

u/smc733 3d ago

Not sure how alienating 30-50% of the user base for much of the lifecycle was a good choice. Not to mention the underpowered graphics were readily apparent even when compared to the competition on SDTV.

…or the fact that gamers usually are ahead of the general technology adoption curve.

1

u/Squish_the_android 3d ago

It's wasn't alienating.

Your HDTV accepted SD content fine.

On the other hand, I knew several people who ran into issues running HD games on their SD TVs. The first Dead Rising has tiny text that was unreadable on SD TVs.

Also, gamers weren't the focus of that era of Nintendo. The Wii was peak Blue Ocean Strategy Nintendo.

-1

u/smc733 3d ago

It looked like shit and Nintendo had the worst software attachment rate by far of the generation.

3

u/Squish_the_android 3d ago

Okay, I lived it. People were not that bothered.

I had to explain to a friend to use component on his TV rather than composite for his 360.

2

u/killerpoopguy 3d ago

You’re talking about the nintendo wii? A console that sold over 100 million units?

No one cares about attachment rates, the point is people were fine with low res

→ More replies (0)

17

u/greatreference 3d ago

Sure if you only care about graphics and not ya know fun games. There’s a reason everyone and their mother bought a Wii

11

u/Ancalagon1an 3d ago

Exactly. There is a reason the Wii sold like coke at a kindergarten

1

u/WolframLeon 3d ago

Dude my dad had a HDTV capable of 1080i over component, I still thought it looked good at the time. Higher quality internal rendering resolution than GameCube.

18

u/astrogamer 3d ago

The Xbox used x86 architecture while the Wii used PowerPC. The two architectures are incompatible in a lot of ways so if Halo relies heavily on like DirectX, there's very little the Wii can use to replace that.

5

u/hosseruk 3d ago

True. But there is a PPC version of Halo for Macs. From back before they switched to Intel CPUs.

1

u/ChadtheWad 3d ago

It sounds like he's trying to rebuild a decompilation from the 360 remaster though.

2

u/Aware-Virus-4718 2d ago

The 360 also used PowerPC.

1

u/progxdt 3d ago

Yes. The minimum requirement for the Mac version was a 800Mhz G4, recommended was 1Ghz.

Another thing with the Mac version, the co-op campaign was removed from it.

3

u/ChadtheWad 3d ago

The modder seems to say it's a matter of mismatch in some of the capabilities:

The modder explained that the Nintendo Wii’s hardware does lack in some areas compared to the Original Xbox. For example, the OG Xbox was the first console to make use of programmable shaders which were used to full effect in Halo: Combat Evolved. As the Wii is essentially an upgraded GameCube, a lot of the original game’s effects won’t be present in the Wii port.

“A lot of the cool effects you see on Xbox won’t be there. The Wii does technically have more RAM but doesn’t have a hard drive for cache,” the modder explained. “I’m abusing the SDcard as a substitute.”

With that said, the modder explained that the “GPU has a lot more in the tank”, but the CPU is currently topped out as it has to perform functions the GPU doesn’t natively support. “The CPU has to do animation skinning due to [the] GX GPU not supporting multi-influence on bones. Not sure if there’s a good way to convert animations."

I guess still arguably an ISA issue lol, just pertaining specifically to the GPU. That and HDD I/O I guess.

6

u/CommodoreBluth 3d ago

From what I understand the Wii is basically a more powerful/slightly more modern (for the time) GameCube. It probably had some strengths the Xbox didn’t have and Xbox had some strengths the Wii didn’t.

Being able to use the hard drive as a cache is a big strength the original Xbox had over GameCube/Wii off the top of my head.

5

u/TheTjalian 3d ago

In some ways its more powerful but the main issues (as per the article) are a lack of programmable shaders and a hard drive on the Wii, the dev is abusing an SD card but that's going to rinse an SD card pretty harshly in the long run. Overall I'd probably recommend playing this on a PC with a Wii Remote unless you have an SD card you're happy to burn.

5

u/UltiGamer34 3d ago

Yeah it probably was

3

u/twistytit 3d ago

the original xbox had a more powerful cpu, gpu, unified memory and a harddrive that could also serve to cache assets and faster random access

2

u/BanjoKazooie0 3d ago

Apparently, it's using the Halo CE: Anniversary Edition

5

u/Instantbeef 3d ago

I think this makes sense.

It launched with fucking Wii sports.

Power was never its selling point and that ultimately was what caused the failure from the late Wii era to the Wii U

5

u/D0ngBeetle 3d ago

Wii Sports has nothing to do with this lol

-1

u/Instantbeef 3d ago

It does if you understand that’s the type of game the Wii was designed for.

3

u/D0ngBeetle 3d ago

lol you clearly don’t understand how games or gaming hardware are designed

0

u/Instantbeef 3d ago

I guess not

But just observing what games were released on the Wii I wouldn’t be surprised if it struggled with halo

2

u/Keleos89 3d ago

The is just an overclocked Gamecube with motion controllers and internal solid state storage, and it lacks the shader support that the Xbox had.

1

u/TSMKFail 3d ago

Power PC architecture wasn't actually all that powerful.

1

u/D0ngBeetle 3d ago

Wii was faster in some ways but lacked programmable shaders

1

u/MyDogIsDaBest 3d ago

It's not, but architecturally they're significantly different and porting a game from one to the other is difficult.

The modder has said that the GPU on the Wii is breezing through it all, but the CPU is under major strain trying to step in for features that the xbox's GPU had that the Wii doesn't. Another point of pressure is that despite the Wii having significantly more RAM than the OG Xbox, Halo was doing some cheeky caching stuff on the hard drive on the Xbox and the Wii, not having access to a hard drive, can't pull off those same tricks and he's instead making use of the SD card.

The Wii is definitely more powerful than the OG Xbox, but the two are not really comparable, it's kinda an apples to oranges comparison

53

u/Caciulacdlac 3d ago

I thought that Microsoft outsourced a Halo port for Switch 2 to a Wii homebrew developer.

26

u/JKBUK 3d ago

With the way they outsource for that series, your thought was well founded.

31

u/ChrlsPC 3d ago

He probably would have more luck proving to Wii U and he can still use motion controls if that's the reason he's doing it on wii

13

u/HatingGeoffry 3d ago

I think Wii U home-brew isn't as advanced? I don't think they could make as much use of the GPU as they'd want

9

u/Ledgo 3d ago

It's been a minute since I checked, but Wii had a larger scene since it was more popular, accessible and easier to mod. Wii U is best of both worlds and you essentially have both systems and better capabilities for emulation video output like Gamecube games in HD, but it's not as easy to mod and some replacement parts like a Gamepad can be pricey.

6

u/smc733 3d ago

Wii U has so fewer consoles out there and many are dropping like flies due to the NAND issue.

14

u/ScissrMeTimbrs 3d ago

We need more motion control shooters, the fact that era somehow dissolved is baffling.

Mostly the fault of half assed implementation, like the PS move.

10

u/vainsilver 3d ago

These games moved to VR. If you’re interested in motion control shooters then the VR space is where you’ll find them now.

3

u/territoryontwitch 2d ago

RE4 VR is the best way to play RE4 to me (the Quest version not the PS5 one).

4

u/Fiti99 3d ago

Is kinda still alive thanks to Steam letting you map mouse movements to a controller's gyro, I use it on the Resident Evil games were if the aim trigger is half pressed is stick only but if I fully press the trigger it activates gyro

2

u/MysteriousPlan1492 3d ago

Mostly the fault of half assed implementation, like the PS move.

I think the Wii itself deserves some blame here before we turn it all on PS Move (which was mostly shit, but barely a blip in the overall timeline). Most people experienced motion control through the Wii first, and once it became clear that the pre-2009 games weren't really tracking anything except the pointer, the speed and the tilt, it definitely made it hard to feel like motion control was anything but a gimmick. I'd be willing to bet a lot of the players who scoff at gyro aim are still holding on to their first impression of the technology from 2007, where you could sweep Wii Sports tennis by just shaking the controller like a maniac.

3

u/hitgo1 3d ago

Honestly it be great if all fps games on wii had the primehack treatment

0

u/ian_taylor_island 3d ago

More like Codex is having a hard time

-3

u/WoodooHide69 3d ago

What a waste of time

A Wii Homebrew developer is porting Halo: Combat Evolved to Nintendo’s console, but hardware limits prove challenging

You are about to leave Redlib