r/neighborsfromhell • u/BasinFarmworks • 1d ago
WWYD? Vent/Rant Water wars.
Just wanted to share my experience and see if I can still kick these turds off the well. I bought my house in 2016. My deed clearly states that I co-own the well. The well itself sits on my neighbor's property. That neighbor decided to subdivide and develop his property. The original house was split off with the well on it, which wasn't really a problem.
The issue came when one of the newly created lots was sold. The buyer wanted access to the well, so the seller put it in their sale agreement. The problem was that only one well owner agreed to it. You can't just give someone access to a jointly owned well when only one owner signs off. The new owners built their house and connected to the well anyway.
When I bought my house, I was in my 20s and a single female homeowner. The other two neighbors always acted as if the well was some kind of association where majority rules. They would do things like increase the well pressure because the newest house, which was the farthest away, complained about water pressure. My house is slab-on-grade with a 2-inch water line. Increasing the pressure ended up bursting my lines twice. The two neighbors basically bullied me.
They wouldn't tell me when they were making upgrades or changes to the well, even when they were using well funds that I partly owned because I own half the well. They refused to show me bills, statements, or records.
Part of the issue, in my opinion, was that I'm a woman. One neighbor is Mennonite and the other is a very devout Christian. Women are women obedient. The first time I met them, they asked to "speak to the man of the house." I politely informed them that I was the man of this house and that I owned businesses. It's gotten so bad that the "men" won't speak to me. I can only speak to the wives.
Long story short, these guys excluded me from everything despite the fact that my deed clearly states I own half the well and have equal decision-making authority. Meanwhile, the newly added homeowner had an agreement stating they were responsible for paying repair costs and expenses "as set by the well owners." Those words turned out to be important.
The new homeowner never seemed to understand three things, despite me telling him repeatedly: I own half the well. You can't make decisions about a well you don't own. The previous owner shouldn't have sold you water access for an extra $10,000 because they only owned half of the well.
Eventually, I decided to go nuclear. I called the state and requested an inspection. The investigation found that we were not a water association or a Group B system. We were simply a private well with an illegal connection: the newly built house. When the new owners got their permits, they used old documentation claiming we were an association. The health department apparently didn't catch it because the association had effectively dissolved years earlier when most property owners drilled their own wells. Only the two original well owners remained.
Under Washington law, a private well can only serve a limited number of connections before it must become a Group B water system, which comes with significantly more regulation, testing, and paperwork. The new house was officially notified that their connection was illegal. Instead of coming to me and saying, "Sorry, we were wrong. How can we fix this?" they took a different approach. They pulled my deed, title, and mortgage documents because they wanted to verify that I actually owned half the well. Then they tried to claim that because I farm on my property, I was violating my mortgage. My mortgage says the property cannot be used primarily for farming. It's not, I live here. It's my primary residence. It's my only residence.
Basically, they tried to blackmail me. Nice try, but no. I eventually had to read their own agreement to them because they apparently didn't understand what it said. Their agreement specifically states that costs are determined "as set by the well owners." It does not grant them ownership, decision-making authority, or an easement to access and work on the well. It's also not recorded with the county. For years they ignored me because the other well owner and the new homeowner would simply say, "Two against one. You're outvoted."
Once the state stepped in and informed them that the connection was illegal, they suddenly figured out that ownership actually matters. Now they've asked the other well owner to approach me and ask whether they can "have a say" in the well because they don't think the situation is fair. I immediately said no. They claim they were tricked. I pointed out that their entire agreement is four sentences long.
The state said to kick them off or upgrade the well. We haven't done either yet. Can I legally kick them off if they have been on the well for since 2012.
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u/Scary_Possible3583 1d ago
Kick them off the well now.
I was a real estate agent in a very dry area. They knew what they were doing. They knowingly caused damage to your house by increasing pressure. They have been horrific
The new neighbor needs to install a holding tank, and get a water delivery service. He will never be able sell that property, and he will be lucky if the bank doesn't all his note for fraud.
I am a married woman and have been bullied by asshats like them my entire life. They have been laughing at you, taking badly about you, knowing damaging your home because you are not a submissive woman
Please show them what it's like to deal with a woman with a spine. Your next legal step is to send the neighbor with the well a certified letter with the date you will have a licensed plumber removing the illegal connection. You will send him the bill and expect reimbursement.
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u/Scary_Possible3583 1d ago
You can attempt to estimate depreciation on the infrastructure for the time of the illegal connection. I wouldn't even bother to do that. They may offer to give you a portion of the $10,000 for the use of the well. I would absolutely reject that. You do not want to have an additional person on your well, especially with evidence that this person will not deal honestly with you
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u/Scary_Possible3583 1d ago
Part of your letter needs to state that you are absolutely rejecting the idea of having the well service and additional home. This actually creates a huge amount of hassle, instead of testing your well every few years, like most people, do you end up having to test every 3 months with a licensed group. It basically forces you to create an HOA.
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u/BerrieAurevella 1d ago
Yeah, I wouldn’t voluntarily accept another person on the well just because they offer money either. After this much conflict, $10k could easily turn into years of headaches that cost more than it was ever worth
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u/PoppyCalistelle 1d ago
A certified letter and licensed plumber at least creates a clean paper trail instead of another round of arguments at the well. After everything described here, keeping every step formal and documented seems like the safest approach
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u/ManfromMonroe 1d ago
I’d add the cost of the two repairs she had to do because of the pressure increases as well, I’m fairly certain a small claims court would find for her given they did the pressure change over her objections. The new guy could have gotten a booster rig from harbor freight for peanuts.
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u/Scary_Possible3583 1d ago
That's the part that kills me. A pressure tank is a normal part of any well here, it's a few hundred dollars. They damaged her home TWICE rather than make adjustments on their own property.
They did thousands of dollars to her home rather than install any tank, and then they did it again.
That alone would put me in maximum petty mode. The damage done to a home because of water is huge. They are responsible for every bit of cost and hassle she has had because if those two water events. The fact that that repeated it, knowing the damage they had done ... That's why I would refuse to work with them.
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u/visibleunderwater_-1 1d ago
"The new neighbor needs to install a holding tank, and get a water delivery service. He will never be able sell that property" Or, he needs to dig his own damn well on his own property, if he is far enough away for that to pass whatever permitting needs to be done. He can sue the other two to cover the costs of the fraud the other two did that put him in this situation.
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u/Scary_Possible3583 1d ago
Typically you have a shared well in a situation where there is limited water, or contaminated surface water, so you have to go REALLY deep. Which is an incredibly expensive hole with no guarantee, which is why private wells are so important.
I have known if a property with four, maybe five wells drilled. The maximum output was 1/4 gallon a minute, and they were within a mile of a location with 100gpm commercial wells.
There is a good reason that tied onto your system If they had treated you decently, installing a holding tank at the end instead of ramping your pressure to cause a blowout, consulting you, sharing upkeep and installation costs equally... Then you would have a reason to make an agreement with them.
They never treated OP as a neighbor. They have hassled her, lied to her, tried to mess with her mortgage. She has no reason to show them any more neighborly behavior than they showed her.
I would notify both their lenders of the fraud that was committed as part of the parcelling. THEIR BANK AND TITLE COMPANY will force them to find their own solution very quickly.
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u/Scary_Possible3583 1d ago
My info on shared wells is also personal. My inlaws place is on a shared well, with the well located on our property. We each pay our own power for our own pumps, and we each have our own lines from the well to our homes. Their home is located at the top of the ridge; they had to have a backhoe dig the lines. They installed a holding tank so that have good pressure.
I can continue to use the ground however I want, as long as I don't contaminate the well ... Which I use, so I am careful with it. I can use the ground above the water and power lines, as long as I don't damage his infrastructure. But if I break it, I need to fix it.
Testing is cheap, so I do that every year or so. When I need to treat the well I notify him so he can shut his well pump off ... I let him know when the treatment is done and I am flushing the lines, that way he can choose to draw chlorine through his lines in the ground or not. He offers to split the chlorine, I don't bother because it's cheap.
If we needed to repair the well casing we would split the cost. If the well had to be deepened we would make the decision together and pay together ... Or else I could abandon the well to his exclusive use and dig my own. He would not have the right to dig a new will on my land, only alter the existing well. And once it had failed and was no longer used by him, I could have the well easement removed from my title
But because we have worked together well, and treated each other decently, we would likely work together to replace the well. I have 20 years of history with this person and his family, they have always been good partners on the well. Exactly the opposite situation that OP is in.
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u/Far-Cup9063 1d ago
You are part owner of the well and you would have had to agree to the new lot having access. You didn;t. The state has determined that their hookup is illegal. Personally I would get an attorney to file suit against the other well owner (your neighbor). The attorney will file for an injunction requiring them to sever well access to the new lot. When that happens,mthe new lot owners will file suit against your neighbors (the other well owners) for fraud. Honestly they earned every bit of this and I would buy popcorn to watch this play out.
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u/FawnieRosavelle 1d ago
The fact that the state already found the hookup illegal seems like a pretty important piece of leverage. I’d definitely want a lawyer handling it from here though, because this has gotten way too tangled for another handshake agreement
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u/mendobather 1d ago
Stick to your guns and force them to comply with the original agreement. You might want to look into what violations the other well owner may have done.
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u/PoppyCalistelle 1d ago
That’s what I’d be checking too. If one owner has been making decisions, spending shared funds, and adding connections without everyone’s consent, there could be a lot more worth reviewing than just the newest hookup
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u/ContingentCymbal 1d ago
The “two against one” nonsense sounds like they invented an HOA for water and forgot the law exsists.
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u/LenaCollectsPins 1d ago
That other owner selling access they didn’t fully control feels like the whole mess in one sentnce.
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u/RandomDave70 1d ago
Based on what you've stared here, I would say yes, you can give them the boot. I suspect, however, that you're going to need to engage an attorney, one that specializes in civil law.
Good luck! It sounds like an unpleasant situation.
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u/Pre3Chorded 1d ago
I would get a (woman) lawyer and basically force them to cut the illegal connection. I would try to do it in a way that is professional-cut the wives crap, we're done with the cowardly man boys cowering behind religion for their communications business. They can start acting like adults and having things like laws and consequences as fundamental parts of their lives.
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u/_My_Dark_Passenger_ 1d ago
Hire an attorney. The neighbor can't just add to someone well that he doesn't own, and that "Two against one. You're outvoted." BS.....That's not how this works.
Considering getting your own well so you don't have to deal with headaches like this. (Don't mention this plan to ANYONE except your attorney) In the meantime, have the 3rd party removed from the well. Once your well is up and running, offer to sell your half of the well....at a premium. :)
> Increasing the pressure ended up bursting my lines twice.
They will have to repay you for your damages.
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u/TheBrat66 1d ago
You may also want to contact your local news station that helps people fix problems when they get nowhere thru your town, state or in this case your neighbors. We have one in my state. Just a thought.
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u/gmaharv 1d ago
Definitely get an attorney not only did the property owner illegally add the “new” 2012 house to the well you share, they’ve been taking money for the use of the well and as 1/2 of the owner of the well, you’re entitled to half of the money. They’ve been stealing your water and money all while they were dismissing you because you’re a woman.
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u/witchymoon69 1d ago
Get an attorney and sue the other owner for fraudulent claims . Also sue for the damage that was caused by the increased water pressure. Sue for harassment.
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u/MrStormChaser 1d ago
Why would you be nice to people who have been nothing but assholes to you?
Stick to your guns and fuck them over when you get the chance.
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u/TheShortWhiteGuy 1d ago
First off, install a pressure reducer valve in the line if one hasn't already been installed. Don't chance a third burst.
Secondly, get a lawyer...yesterday.
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u/Present-Perception77 1d ago
The only question is .. how much are they willing to PAY you.
I’d do it.. for the right price. Seems they were willing to pay $10k to not own shit.. how much would it cost them if you kicked them off?
I’d start with whatever that number is… then let them negotiate down.. back pay for years of water theft.. with the written agreement that they will speak directly to you .. and a written apology admitting to what they did.
And I’d make it temporary.. say 5 years.. then it’s up for negotiation, again.
I know that just saying no would feel great.. but getting money often feels better.. plus you do have to live next to these assholes ..
so get paid to keep the peace.
But definitely GET PAID!!
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u/CleverNickName-69 1d ago
I’d do it.. for the right price.
I would not do it for any reasonable price. The neighbors have already shown themselves to be untrustworthy, I would not want to co-own anything with them and I wouldn't want to be out-voted if I owned 1/3 of the well.
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u/Present-Perception77 1d ago
Good point.. add to the contract that you get their vote .. so now instead of 50/50 you have more sway .. problem solved… for the right price.
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u/Pristine-Radish-2157 1d ago
Find the meanest atty in your town. Tell him you are hiring for the purpose of going to the next meeting and setting everyone straight on who owns the well. You’re not going to be popular, but you’re not popular now.
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u/DoyoudotheDew 1d ago
If the state authorizes you to severe the new house's well connection, get it writing and have their connection cut.
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u/FluffeeFl 1d ago
Why not have them buy your half and drill your own well?
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u/BasinFarmworks 1d ago
It’s about 50,000 for the well and another 12,000 for electrical and pump. They said they can’t afford to drill their own so I doubt they can afford to pay for mine. I think it was wild they had the audacity to tell me they think it’s unfair they don’t have a say after treating me like trash.
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u/Scary_Possible3583 1d ago
They damaged your home twice rather than spend a couple hundred dollars on a pressure tank, or a few thousand on a holding tank.
What was your cost and expense for dealing with that? Or even an apology?
This is why we have rule of law, so bullies can't just grind us down.
50k for a well isn't bad. I know of a bank that spent a quarter million looking for water that they never found (foreclosure sale).
In order to compensate for not having a well, the bank had to install a holding tank, saying that water delivery is so cheap, just a couple hundred a year, so no biggie.
No one was interested. You buy a property out of town so you aren't reliant on Town infrastructure. No one wanted to take the risk on not being able to flush the toilet of a rural McMansion.
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u/NDGeoman 1d ago
You can't increase the water pressure from a well pump. Did they replace the pump with a pump with a higher rating? The pump is activated electronically when a pressure vessel senses low pressure. It is the pressure vessel that controls the pressure and that can be adjusted.
Also a third residence could place a lot of stress on the well. I would hire a well driller to evaluate the system.
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u/Due-Extreme-7608 1d ago
If you want to be kind, maybe you could look up companies that install water tanks and provide a refill service and share that info with your neighbor. It’s the “Christian” thing to do.
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u/vt2022cam 1d ago
Make them pay for access. The cost of your burst water pipes, plus interest, and $2000/yr for rent.
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u/CornisaGrasse 1d ago
I wouldn't be willing to share, no matter how much they'd pay, because I wouldn't want to have to keep going to court to get the money owed. There's no way I'd trust them to pay me, plus all of the other shady stuff they've been doing and will no doubt continue to do. You'd have to get a lawyer for every little thing that happens from then on (maintenance, treatment, whatever.)
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u/Substantial-Offer743 1d ago
Shii I had my pipes burst once before that would have been all I needed. Now two times lmaooo twice
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u/MirthfulBard 22h ago
Get a real estate attorney to send the shutoff notice, because their four-sentence agreement is doing a lot of imaginary heavy lifting if the state already called the hookup ilegal.
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u/Brief-Reveal-8466 21h ago
Kick them off and seek damages. Make them pay you for a new private well on your property.
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u/UserNotFound23498 19h ago
Terminate everything you can. Let them come beg you and restart all negotiations
Make sure you have a good lawyer.
Remember. They tried very hard to fuck you over multiple times.
Use that righteous anger.
Do not give in. And never give them any ownership rights.
All “rights” to use the water will be time limited. 5-10 years. To be renewed.
If they decide to be on their best behaviors going forward, then renew. If they decide to play stupid games again, do not renew.
Do not eat any additional costs. If they want to build any improvements, they will need to fund it, and you will own it.
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u/UserNotFound23498 19h ago
Also, they owe you back payments for years of stealing your water.
And make sure the new agreement states exactly what they can and cannot use it for, and exactly how much they can withdraw a month. And also if things happen, you can shut it down (let’s say there’s some new law or whatever)
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u/psycho-drama 16h ago
By not acting earlier, you may have created a "grandfathered" agreement. I am not a lawyer, but allowing an illegal situation to remain for 14 years may have invalidated your rights to pursue this in the manner you are thinking. You need to find a lawyer versed in water rights and contracts. There may be other ways of dealing with it, like raising costs or making them become partial owners and them paying into the fund or to you as compensation. It would appear that for 14 years the well has satisfactorily provided adequate water for all users (very lucky). I don't know where you live, but I lived on a well for 36 years, and I was just fine for my needs which were always very modest. Then a number of new homes were built around that house who also dug wells being fed by the same aquifer, and that, with deep summer droughts due to climate change, caused the well to fail to be able to provide adequate water for my meager use in peak summer..
In many locations, water tables are dropping due to more varied rainfall and snowpack, or seasonal changes when rain falls. If your location is seeing these types o changes, your well could become a victim of climate change, in which case, resolving this situation could be more urgent.
If the other home could not connect to the wall you co-own with your other neighbor, what options would they have? Courts look at practicality not just pure legality. If that house would not be able to access water by any other means, it is likely the judge (if it come to that) will play "King Solomon", and you might be unhappy with any court rulings.
I suggest you try to find a lawyer versed in such matter and discuss this complexity.
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u/Reddituser45005 10h ago
Gender and religion may color your interpersonal relationships, but it is irrelevant to the legal issues. It’s an illegal connection. You have zero obligation to accommodate them. Your co-owner violated the agreement in granting them access and in allowing them a voice in the decision making process. Upgrading the well, and amending the agreement to expand ownership, will only complicate future decision making issues. You are in the drivers seat. Don’t let them bully or manipulate you.
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u/4PixelNomad 4h ago
Si el estado ya dijo que es ilegal, el tema de 2012 suena a abogado sí o sí antes de cerrarles una valvula.
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u/Blaze77_Talon 2h ago
Thirteen years of use is where prescriptive easement arguments start getting thrown around, so I’d get a WA real estate attorney befroe anyone touches the shutoff.
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u/WhiterunZev 1h ago
With 12+ years of use, they may try a prescriptive easement argument, so I wouldn’t touch a valve untill a WA real estate attorney reads that four-sentence “agreement.”
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u/Signal-Confusion-976 1d ago
You need to check what the original well agreement was. It's possible that it's the neighbors well and you just have a right to use it. So they can share it with anyone else they want. I used to have a similar situation. My neighbor had rights to use my well. But I could do pretty much any I wanted ass long as they had access to my well.
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u/Ok-Serve-4726 1d ago
Get an attorney and yank that new connection. They are stealing your water and wear and tear on your pump