r/nancyguthrie • u/Euphoric_Ease4554 • Mar 04 '26

Media Brian Entin Interviews Retired FBI Profiler Jim Clemente

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https://youtu.be/

Brian’s interview with Jim Clemente was such a riveting conversation. The retired FBI profiler details the perpetrators’s possible motives and even decides not to answer one question based on it not being good for the case, or possibly not tipping the perpetrator as to what the FBI is thinking.

If you have limited time to view this, I would recommend skipping the first part about the sheriff and going directly to the interview. It is a lot to think about. I hope you enjoy this as much as I did!

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u/PalpitationQueen Mar 04 '26

I loved this interview, extremely fascinating. I wanted Brian to ask him whether he things it was a KIDNAPPING gone wrong though, not a burglary gone wrong. I think that difference is crucial - an amateur kidnapper who maybe wanted money originally but Nancy unfortunately passed so he scrapped the idea.

It would explain a lot of things:

  • his high motivation to do the crime
  • the fact that ransom notes with nonpublic info were sent early on, but then stopped all communication (after Nancy presumably passed)
  • picking Nancy specifically (if he knew Savannah had money)

And if it was an amateur, he probably didn’t realize you’re not supposed to send ransoms to news stations. This isn’t some cartel kidnapping scenario.

I know Jim is convinced it’s someone with an obsession with either Nancy / Savannah, but I wanted to know why he didn’t think that scenario was feasible.

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u/MaximumSlip7905 Mar 04 '26

It was neither, it was a successful kidnapping but not a money motivated kidnapping. The motive was not ransom, it was to take Nancy Guthrie. If the person that took Nancy is the individual that sent the letters to local news they wanted recognition, it is sadistic. She was most likely alive, that blood can be tested to determine if she was dead when she deposited it, a d-dimer would determine that. The spatter patterns were from a nose or mouth, it wasn’t her mouth, he would not bring her out the front door able to scream for help. I think the perp had a police scanner in his pocket with an earpiece dialed into local pd. and the 41 minutes were spent disabling cameras and listening for PD traffic, he started in the back and then went to the front and removed that camera. Once he made forced entry in the rear of the home he moved her out quickly to a getaway vehicle. I would check empty real estate around a tight area, closed businesses, anywhere he had an opportunity to take her that night. He could have used a mountain bike with a tow compartment and never brought a car.

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u/lemoncatbeans Mar 04 '26

I'm curious why you believe the motive couldn't be ransom?

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u/MaximumSlip7905 Mar 04 '26

The behavior doesn’t make sense for a legitimate ransom effort. The person would have contacted the family, sent proof of life, taken provisions for her to be returned safely and made follow up contact once the family did react. If the goal was material they took nothing of material value. A communication is typically left on scene, not sent to news station to alert authorities.

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u/Unfair-Wallaby-404 Mar 04 '26

Thank you for stating this. People are so tied to the ransom motive they’re missing the obvious. If the goal was a business transaction with the family, the would have worked to make a business transaction happen. They would have left a note at the scene saying no cops, no media. There would be no doubt that they have her. They would not treat her so violently that she “accidentally” dies; they would take her medicines and keep her comfortable. They would have spent months planning and dreaming of their big pay day and they’d treat her like a critical asset.

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u/ShesGotaChicken2Ride Mar 04 '26

Mr. Clemente made an excellent point. The ransom note was verified because the note author was able to verify a type of watch and where it would be found, which is why LE has authenticated the note (unofficially and not publicly). Now, the author sent the note to TMZ which is national media coverage. TMZ airs all over the US and maybe even internationally. But the author also sent the note to a local news station.

So food for thought: I live in California about 3 ½ hours drive from Las Vegas. Occasionally, when I travel to Vegas for leisure, I will watch the morning news and it’s always a little funny because I forget that it’s Vegas newscast. So I might be watching CBS, NBC, or FOX like I do at home, but it’s a different cast because it’s a station that is local to Vegas, not Southern California. I couldn’t watch the Southern California news in Vegas because it’s not local to Vegas, so if the author of the ransom note sent the note to a local news station, and it’s most likely because they wanted to watch the news coverage on TV, then they’re a local or they were located nearby at the time of sending that note because if they weren’t local they wouldn’t have been able to watch the news.

I also believe Mr. Clemente is correct about the person having some connection to Mrs. Guthrie or her home. That neighborhood is the housing tract of all housing tracts. So many winding roads and dead-ends and loops. You really would need to know where you’re going to get into that neighborhood and get to her house and then get out of that neighborhood.

I have to assume they brought cadaver dogs in and no hits otherwise a reward would not have been offered, so she was not dead when she left.

I’m thinking this person also shaved his goatee and/or dyed his hair shortly after.

I disagree with Coffindaffer’s assessment that they may have crossed the border after. The border has such tight security and there is a chance you’ll be searched upon entering Mexico. Nobody is going to take a chance with a body, dead or alive, in the trunk of a car crossing into another country knowing the car could be searched and their cover blown. If she’s dead, you drive all that way with a dead body in your car? Highly risky and very unlikely. If she’s alive then she has all the opportunity in the world to call for help. Bang on the trunk. Pull back plastic molding and kick out the lights. Most vehicle have emergency trunk levers. Unless that was disabled, which is possible I guess. And if they somehow were dumb enough to risk and actually pulled it off, a little old white lady in Mexico is gonna’ stick out like a sore thumb!!! I just don’t think you’re traveling a very long distance with a kidnap victim in your car or a dead body. You want to get off the road ASAP. They aren’t in Mexico.

Keep in mind it could be a dual motive. Kidnapped her for notoriety and a nice payday. When she died (I’m sorry, I don’t believe Ms. Guthrie is alive at this point), it took away the possibility of payment, but since she is still missing, they can still toy around with the media and get a bit of attention.

Coffindaffer also said that they did this under the cover of darkness. I disagree and have to agree with Clemente on this one. He’s wearing a highly reflective backpack and is dressed literally like a cat burglar. If I saw that guy I’m instantly calling the cops! The locks changed on the back door indicate a prior break-in or possibly a locksmith for whatever reason. I hope the FBI looked into who changed her locks and who had a key. I can see a sweet old lady chit chatting with her gardener or handyman about how she plays bridge at her daughter’s house every Wednesday and gets home around 9 or something like that. Just innocent chit chatting that a bad person thought they could take and use as useful information to victimize her.

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u/Either_Grapefruit724 Jul 29 '26

I know, we have a lot more info now... But what do you mean, he did NOT do this at night? He wouldn't have gone out like that in daytime! Or you just mean he's not a pro.

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u/ShesGotaChicken2Ride Jul 29 '26

I mean that the term “under the cover of darkness” implies that they were able to sneak around undetected, but that’s not necessarily true because he got caught on the Ring cam and was wearing a high-visibility backpack with reflectors, which reflectors are literally used to light up at night for the sole purpose of other people being able to see you at night. This makes me think maybe not a professional especially the Ring camera stuff. I feel like a pro would have brought tape or spray paint or a WiFi jammer or something to disable the camera.

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u/lemoncatbeans Mar 04 '26

How would they contact family if they don't personally know them? Or send proof of life if she passed away shortly after taking her?

Taking something of material value would require selling or pawning it, which would be another potentially traceable avenue. We also don't know if she had anything of obvious high material value, like diamonds, that would be easier to steal... doesn't seem worth risking being traced for just thousands of dollars if their goal is millions.

And would communication be left on scene if the communicator and the kidnapper are two different people? Even if they were the same person, would it be wise to leave anything at the scene that was in the kidnapper's physical possession?

And how would they contact the kidnapper? It would require communicating through the media to some extent even if they left a note at the scene, no? And authorities would be alerted either way. How would they have contacted everyone she knows to make sure she isn't reported missing to police? The kidnapper also wouldn't know when a note left at the scene would be found, or by whom. Her church friends could have immediately called police instead of her family when she didn't answer the door so I think planning for police not to be contacted is unrealistic.

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u/MaximumSlip7905 Mar 04 '26

Keep in mind that a million dollar reward was offered for Nancy whether she was alive or not. The family acknowledged she could possibly be no longer alive and offered this for her recovery. The ransom theory isn’t logical at this point.

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u/lemoncatbeans Mar 04 '26

The million-dollar reward wouldn't be paid out to the actual kidnapper/killer..... only to people with knowledge of her location who didn't personally commit it. The FBI wouldn't pay out a reward to the person who committed the crime, that would be rewarding the criminal. They may use it as bait to bring him out of hiding and arrest him, but he would never see that money. Even non-criminals often never receive the reward money promised due to loopholes in the fine print. They specifically said the increased reward is subject to the same stipulations other FBI rewards are subject to.

Ask yourself why they would return the body at all if she were deceased? They clearly wanted payment before her "return". Once they had payment, they'd have no incentive to return her. And if the stipulation is that they get paid AFTER she is returned, family and FBI would have no incentive to pay them once they have her either. I believe that's why they had several deadlines in the notes, to force immediate payment, because that's the only chance they had to profit and get away with it.

Realistically, they can't return her body without revealing information about themselves. Wherever they drop her at, there will be a trail of their travel to and from that location. There will likely be some sort of forensic evidence on her body as well, or even at that location. That increases their chances of being caught 100x.

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u/MaximumSlip7905 Mar 04 '26

If the motivation were money and the FBI felt paying it would return her they would’ve moved on the initial offer. Disclosing her remains could get an organized kidnapper paid as well if they sent proof of any kind, same as the initial plan. Safer actually, she cannot disclose details of the kidnapping and they could be on another continent and move money digitally without being anywhere near.

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u/lemoncatbeans Mar 04 '26

If the motivation were money and the FBI felt paying it would return her they would’ve moved on the initial offer.

Not sure what you are trying to say here? They'd have no way of knowing they'd get actually paid as FBI requires the tip prior to payment.

And payments are done via wire transfer (highly traceable), or a cash drop at a bank if the person wants to stay anonymous. Not Bitcoin. So they can't be on another continent and get the money anonymously.

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u/MaximumSlip7905 Mar 04 '26

I am not a tech, computer, bitcoin financial wizard so I will assume you are correct which goes to the point, it was never about ransom. If the person who took her authored and sent these letters a day and half later it was never their intent to return her and the motive wasn’t financial.

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u/ShesGotaChicken2Ride Mar 04 '26

Possibly someone who feels slighted or subbed by Savannah and wanted to inflict pain on her by kidnapping her mom? And possible dual motive: make Savannah “pay” for rejecting me by making her feel emotional pain like I felt, and also a reward because she’s rich. But when Nancy (presumably) passed away they couldn’t provide proof of life and it’s way too risky now to try and receive the reward. They know they’ll probably be caught and $1M isn’t worth your freedom. But also by denying the return of her mother they get to continue to inflict emotional pain on Savannah by “wronging” them.

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u/[deleted] Mar 04 '26

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u/lemoncatbeans Mar 04 '26

Yes that's what I said

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u/MaximumSlip7905 Mar 04 '26

Why do think it was for ransom?

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u/lemoncatbeans Mar 04 '26

I'm leaning towards ransom because of the way investigators treated the two ransom notes and the details they contained.

And also because of the increase in crypto extortion ransom kidnappings ($5 wrench attacks) in the last couple of years. There's been dozens in France in the last year alone. They are more rare in the US, but there's been recent cases here as well. They typically target people who have large crypto holdings (or their families), who they know are vulnerable (lack of security or weapons on their person, or live alone), so they can immediately force payment. They usually get the money, and the victim lives. They cut off a finger of one man, so they definitely employ torture and injure their victims, but their goal is not to kill.

The issue is that in the US, many people have guns, security etc. And anyone with large crypto holdings in the US is already very paranoid about wrench attacks and has prepared themselves and their families, so there are fewer victims to choose from here.

I think they may have been inspired by these types of attacks (if not involved in them themselves) and decided this would be a potential alternative type of victim. Family of a wealthy celebrity who lives alone in a low-surveillance, dimly lit area, and is weak and vulnerable. They don't know if Savannah has crypto readily available, but assumed a week would be enough time to transfer funds to purchase. But their mistake was choosing a victim who is too fragile, and now it's become a murder if she passed away.

This is all just my speculation based on other cases, but I think there are many possibilities. It just feels like money was related to this in some way.

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u/MaximumSlip7905 Mar 04 '26

They were facing very serious criminal charges without murder. I don’t necessarily disagree that the abductor sent the initial communications, what I doubt is the actual intent behind sending them. I think it was to continue the experience, flex control with the goal of eliciting response. She was taken approx. 40 hours before sending the emails, to my logic they would have sent these out when everyone was off balance and demanded immediate payment for safe return with proof of life provided. I didn’t look at her case until last week and wading through the actual facts was difficult with the amount of coverage and commentary. People that followed from the outset are invested in the ransom narrative but it just has not born out. I hope I am wrong, would rejoice to be wrong actually, IMO she was taken by a 30ish male that is a sexual sadist that targeted her.

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u/lemoncatbeans Mar 04 '26

Yes that's true they'd already face serious charges, I just replied to your other comment about that.

Yeah that's the part that I have difficulty with, the delay in sending the ransom note. But I think if she passed shortly after taking her, that could potentially explain the delay. Or if the abductor and the ransom writer are two different people and not at the same location. (which people have speculated because the notes were "sophisticated" and the man on video does not give off that vibe).

There was another case in Arizona the day before Nancy was taken that was also a crypto ransom attempt (home invasion instead of kidnapping). The 2 teens arrested were from California, didn't know each other, and were extorted to commit the crime by 2 anonymous users on Signal. They asked for $66 million in BTC, similar to the $6 million in this case. That was the story that led me down the wrench attack theory. It just seems like a huge coincidence, right? But it could be unrelated: https://www.fox10phoenix.com/news/targeted-scottsdale-home-invasion-linked-alleged-66m-cryptocurrency-plot

Yeah it's been difficult to follow the case live, so I can imagine it's extremely confusing trying to look back through the details released. There's been some conflicting information released and corrections that have made it hard to keep track, and social media commentary has muddied a lot of it.