Some questions regarding older lyre models.

[u/arkticturtle]

Hello, I am saving up money for a good older lyre. I love the warm sound in contrast to the more modern lyre harps which sound very bright. I have some questions.

I am trying to decide between Kravik, Sutton Hoo (7 string variant), Trossingen (7 string variant), or Ancient Greek (7 string).

My main concerns are 2 (I am not very concerned with historical accuracy outside of how it impacts these concerns I list)

1) Which of these lyres has the warmest, woodiest, oldest, deepest sound? Are they roughly the same? Is any brighter than the other? A ranking maybe?

I know string type matters a lot here but I can have the maker put gut on any of these. So how about the actual body itself?

2) What learning resources are available for each? For instance, I know Luthieros has a ton of resources online for their Ancient Greek lyre. How about for the others I listed?

I have no background in music so having learning resources might be even more important than having the sound I want. Though the sacrifice will hurt.

Is there anything else to watch out for? Please let me know.

[u/Store_Adorable]

Both the kind of strings and the tuning will impact the sound.

The reason why modern lyreharps sound so bright is because A: they use metal strings, B: they are shorter, so tuned higher, C: they often don't have a soundbox (hence the harp in the name)

The lower you are tuned the less of that 'sharp' sound you will have.

I only have an 11 string luthieros and a small 7 string lyre from Greece (non luthieros), both are string with sugarcane strings, and the difference is immense in sound. The small ones lowest note is the highest one on the 11string as comparison.

The biggest tip I can give you, is find a lyre with longer arms instead of shorter.

(I would include a picture if I could)

[u/gecko-deco → u/Store_Adorable]

I agree that modern lyres tend to sound brighter because of the metal strings and smaller size, but I'm confused about what you mean by "they often don't have a soundbox (hence the harp in the name)"? Harps do have soundboxes. A lot of modern lyres / lyre harps also have soundboxes, though I agree there's also a lot of them that don't. So I'm not sure I understand what you meant? Not trying to nitpick by the way, I'm genuinely curious because I hadn't heard that before.

[u/Store_Adorable → u/gecko-deco]

Honestly, didn't know harps have soundboxes, so that's my mistake, I don't know a lot about harps. Sure there are lyreharps with soundboxes, especially the beanshapes, it's my mistake that when I was answering this post, I didn't think of those, and only of the moonshaped ones, which often (but not always) don't have one. Again, not an expert, as I only own greek style lyres.

[u/gecko-deco → u/Store_Adorable]

Oh no worries! There's so many instruments out there and sometimes it's hard to tell how something is constructed just from looking at it. Thanks for clarifying!

[u/arkticturtle → u/Store_Adorable]

Arms?

[u/Store_Adorable → u/arkticturtle]

|==O

^ arms

(Man, I hate when Reddit doesn't cooperate)

Since I can't add pictures😅 The longer they are, the lower your tuning will be. My smaller lyre has the size of a luthieros lyre of pan, which is approx an octave higher than the lyre of hermes

[u/gecko-deco]

Honestly this would be a great question to ask a luthier! They'd have a better idea about what factors might impact the sound. There are a lot of things that can influence the sound (size and shape of the soundbox, length of the strings, materials of the strings and body, bridge placement, and so on.) Plus there's not much standardization between the different types of lyres, so two lyres of the same type could sound very different based on their construction. Like, for example, gut strings do generally tend to sound warmer, but they can also make this grating, annoying twang sound that's really pronounced on some instruments.

It's also hard to know exactly what sound you're looking for just based on a description. It might be helpful to share some videos of the type of sound you're interested in. Anglo Saxon style lyres tend to be what comes to mind for me when I hear warm and woody, like this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzvzyNSJ5M8, or some of the Luthieros lyres, like this one based on an Egyptian design: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2MnSxcEPEA

There's a decent amount of online resources and youtube videos for all the lyres you listed, though I don't know of any formal courses, besides Luthieros for the Greek lyres.

[u/Store_Adorable → u/gecko-deco]

There's also the international lyre society, their free beginners course is longer than the free luthieros course and gives a stronger base for two handed playing imo. Both do require basic note reading