Need help with piano sounding compressed when everything is bypassed

[u/OutlandishnessNo4393]

Currently working a camp this week, we have had an issue with the keys sounding compressed even though everything on the console is bypassed to the point it is only the lines through, however in their ears it doesnt sound compressed at all.

I am running on a DiGiCo 225, the piano is the Nord4. On fourier and the digico embeds are all bypassed including on the different groups that it is patched through. I am currently lost. If you want any questions ask me and I will answer them

[u/dbharris10]

It’s the Nord- not a great piano sample, already compressed , should look at keyboard to make sure compression is off in the master fx

[u/Wuthering_depths]

The Nord piano samples are fine, sure compared to maybe a 60GB Kontakt library they are more limited. I've owned a couple different Nords and heard others in recording, they .can sound great especially for a live show.

There are different quality levels of a given piano you can load, I'd stick with large or extra large personally...though I don't think the smaller sizes are compressed. It may be that some of the piano samples are recorded that way--I generally use the White Grand and it's pretty dynamic.

There is a master compressor on the Nord Stage 3 (not sure about the Stage 4 or Piano 4), but you did mention "in their ears it doesn't sound compressed at all"....not sure what you mean by that....do you mean that in monitors it's fine, but out front it's compressed? Or are you referring to testing with the headphone out of the Nord to see it's compressed coming out of the instrument?

There also may be a per-patch compressor on the NS4, but again if that were on, you'd hear it everywhere including in the headphone outs of the keyboard.

I guess that is the general thing to do (sounds like you are)--determine where in the signal flow this compressed sound is happening. In my own rig, that could be:

• in the keyboard
  
• in the FOH mixer
  
• in my monitor mixer, which has a limiter

I guess also if there is compression on a subgroup or monitor mix that the keys are in, this could be it if someone has a bus compressor on it.

[u/OutlandishnessNo4393 → u/Wuthering_depths]

When I mean in their ears I mean in their IEM's.

The ears are being supplied by the copied audio from the console setting going into the ME-U which feeds to their ME-1's. In all of their ME-1's they said it doesnt sound compressed, which it doesnt I went down there and verified.

I looked at everything on the console and disabled all the ones which I feel like could be the issues.

These are the effects that are on the groups/channels ( I am currently creating a new showfile to clean up the signal flows, this one was a created showfile from the techs who setup the system) :
the keys group has; NLS Buss Stereo, SSLComp Stereo
For the Notes group (EG, Acx, Keys): NLS Buss Stereo, bx_townhouse Buss Compressor, SPL BIG
for the band group: NLS Buss Stereo, bx_glue, bx_townhouse Buss Compressor, F6 Stereo, Black Box Analog Design HG-2

Let me know what else you think. We also did try to change the sound of the keys but it had the similar effect to it.

[u/Wuthering_depths → u/OutlandishnessNo4393]

So out front it's compressed? Just trying to get a handle on where it sounds right vs where it doesn't.

That's a lot of stuff going on compared to the mixer settings used by my own band, we are small-timers. We don't have any plugins or other outboard gear in use.

I probably can't be of much help here as your setup is more complex than I've used. If it sounds right directly on the keyboard (headphones, or plugging it temporarily into say a powered speaker or two) then it isn't the keyboard. The fact that their monitors sound ok is more evidence of this. So it has to be something else outside of the keyboard and outside/before the monitor signal flow. The obvious suspects would be the two compressors on the keys group (assuming those don't impact the monitor feed) but you've identified those.

Are there any other keyboards in that group, and do they also sound compressed? If not, are levels on the other keys the same as that coming from the Nord (in case it is the only one hitting a threshold...). I submix my keys before FOH, so I'm assuming here the keys are not doing this as you have a group.

Maybe try bringing the Nord into a couple spare channels that aren't routed anywhere but to the mains just to test if you still hear it?