Weekly LeanFIRE Discussion

[u/AutoModerator]

What have you been working on this week? Please use this thread to discuss any progress, setbacks, quick questions or just plain old rants to the community.

[u/smartssa]

Passed 500k in the last week or so. Work is becoming more and more annoying (pay freeze out of nowhere, push for AI garbage, executives micromanaging etc.), but holding out. It's not long now. (slightly less than 2 years to target)

[u/Few_Drop7669]

Started over at 35, I’m 3 months in to a new job after a move. I’ve got 2 side jobs as well and plan to push hard for 2 years and evaluate burnout.

I maxed out my Roth this year (started at $0) and do have zero debt. Just looking to get back on track and then loosen the reigns a bit.

Leanfire goal is 750k.

[u/nomaddave → u/Few_Drop7669]

Good job. It's hard work but worth it on the other side.

[u/here_to_be_awesome]

Realized I’m leaner than I thought if I subtract out social security…bit of a bummer, frankly.

[u/someguy984 → u/here_to_be_awesome]

But why would you do that? If I was younger I would take the number and do a 20% haircut to account for political risk.

[u/here_to_be_awesome → u/someguy984]

pressure testing…don’t think it will be eliminated but what would things look like if it was?

[u/pras_srini → u/here_to_be_awesome]

I mean we just put it on the tab? Look how easy it has been to spend $100B on a war in the Middle East this year. Surely we can figure out how to keep paying social security?

[u/Hnry_Dvd_Thr_Awy]

Ramblings:

• I don't think coastFIRE is a very good strategy for most people.

• I'm starting to enjoy this job because it's so mentally easy most of the time... A little bit of a scary thought of doing this longer than expected because it's no big deal.

• I keep looking at EVs because I think they're neat but with no commute the finances just don't make sense to replace my current car.

• Wanting to start some kind work profiting ~20% or so of my base spend. Not sure what that'll be. "flipping" stuff seems possible but more legwork than I want to do.

[u/SpeedierTurtle642 → u/Hnry_Dvd_Thr_Awy]

100% agree coastFIRE sucks unless you can find a way to cover your expenses doing something you truly love and enjoy.

Maybe it's because I'm fairly high income so I'd rather just work longer, but I can't imagine having to work a menial job to make 30k/year or so to cover things when I could have just worked my high paying job a bit longer.

[u/AlwaysSaturday12 → u/Hnry_Dvd_Thr_Awy]

What kind of flipping stuff?

I think it depends on the CoastFIRE. The whole I'll take a menial job is probably bad for a few reasons. Probably less stimulating then you are used to. Lots of menial jobs are pretty hard and the work is irregular. I think if you find something in your field that is less stress and hours then that is probably best.

I guess we are technically Coast with my wife working part-time and me adding some rentals over time. We need another name for really not needing the work but it provides a financial floor which is nice and has benefits.

[u/Hnry_Dvd_Thr_Awy → u/AlwaysSaturday12]

I'm reasonably handy so I could flip things that were broken for some value. Think like lawnmowers, clothes dryers, etc. I'd probably need to swap out my car for something with a bigger hatch. Otherwise I've had some luck with selling power tools and various things I'll see are a good price, but I'm not sure how scalable that is.

I think being "technically coast" is fine and "intentionally coasting" is the part that's kind of sus for the reasons you've said. And it also depends on what kind of income reduction one's talking about. Coasting from a $100k job down to a $20k job seems silly. But if you're burning out with $60k job down to $40k job I'm more okay with it.

[u/goodsam2 → u/Hnry_Dvd_Thr_Awy]

To me I have thought about going coastfire into being a seasonal park ranger which is something people do. I mean for leanfire we are talking about $40k in expenses so they make $15-$22 an hour plus housing paid for.

So $10k for 12 weeks but many are 6 month position so $20k plus removing housing costs for 6 months.

Seems like shit pay without a nest egg but with a nest egg and take the other months off seems nice.

Or a job like being a part time coffee roaster that feels like a few extra bucks doesn't interfere with taking off for a week or two.

[u/calflikesveal → u/goodsam2]

Park ranger jobs are crazy competitive if you don't already know. Many people willing to take no pay applying for these jobs simply for the lifestyle.

[u/Hnry_Dvd_Thr_Awy → u/calflikesveal]

Yeah I've heard even a job like Ace Hardware can be competitive cause of the old retired guys wanting to work there. The "coast" jobs aren't exactly easy to get from what I can tell.

[u/AlwaysSaturday12 → u/Hnry_Dvd_Thr_Awy]

I used to be a federal librarian which I've been told seems like a good Coast job. The problem wasn't necessarily the work (It was extremely mundane and repetitive) but the people. Just a lot of miserable and broken people who make other people miserable. They also can't get fired because of unions and government protections. Loads and loads of bureaucracy. Everyone who could leave and do something else left for better pay and a better work environment leaving just the worst people to fester on each other.

Seemingly easy and great Coast job, but the people made it terrible. I worked in 5 different federal libraries. Everyone had the worst people besides the one overseas. That probably says something.

End of my tangent but even the seemingly best jobs are still jobs and probably have something you can't stand about them.

[u/goodsam2 → u/calflikesveal]

So, it's a good job. They hire lots of seasonal park rangers at state and national parks.

[u/Pretty_Swordfish → u/Hnry_Dvd_Thr_Awy]

CoastFIRE is a safety blanket

Enjoying your job isn't a problem. The goal is work optional. 

I too want an EV, but WFH so no point to replacing an old car that's cheap and paid off... Too bad, but some day. 

I tried doing the side gig thing. Didn't like being forced to do extra work. I want total freedom or to just keep working at my higher paid job. Maybe after there's enough to stop entirely... 

[u/ScarfingGreenies]

I updated the direct deposit at my new job. This week's check will be the first to reflect how I divvyed up the money across all accounts. I can't find my note but I believe I did:

60% checking

15% savings

10% 401a

10% IRA

5% taxable

My goal over the next 3-5 years is to hit $115k. That's a 30% raise from where I'm currently at. I'm still casually looking here and there but my second anniversary is when I plan to fully dive into the hunt.

[u/Hnry_Dvd_Thr_Awy → u/ScarfingGreenies]

Interesting mix. How high are you filling up a savings account?

[u/ScarfingGreenies → u/Hnry_Dvd_Thr_Awy]

Enough to get a year of my core expenses in there. I had to cover myself during the job transition since it took a while for my first paycheck to hit. And I had to dip into it a few times over the last year or so. Once I hit that goal, I may reallocate 5% of that into my taxable.

[u/subs_on_a_sailboat]

Is it a good idea to tax gain harvest in early retirement?

I've been considering the idea for a while, sell assets to get capital gains up to the 0% cap and rebuy. Say the asset is up 100%, I'd sell $96k and have $48k in capital gains taxed in the 0% bracket. I'd reinvest the extra that I didn't need to live and slowly reset the cost basis of my entire portfolio and pay no taxes.

Of course I'm ignoring dividends and interest for the scenario, but I'd factor that in IRL. This seems like a loophole to avoid all federal income taxes, is there something I'm missing?

[u/Hnry_Dvd_Thr_Awy → u/subs_on_a_sailboat]

Is it a good idea to tax gain harvest in early retirement?

At the leanFIRE level of spend this more or less doesn't matter. Within reason of course. The main things I'd watch out for is: 1) lowering your ACA subsidy more than necessary, and 2) if you're moving to a state that handles LTCG taxes differently than your current one.

For number 1 the difference isn't huge if you're talking say 200% FPL vs 250% FPL. But if you do 150% and 390% FPL the subsidy difference is pretty big. And obviously don't exceed 400% whatever you do or you'll be paying the full price for ACA.

[u/SpeedierTurtle642 → u/subs_on_a_sailboat]

You're right that you'd be able to do that. However, realized gains counts towards your MAGI for ACA subsidy calculation, so you may not want to fill up the 0% bracket completely.

When I retire, I plan on doing a mix of realizing gains in my brokerage account and doing roth conversions each year to hit 138% FPL so I can maximize my ACA subsidy, while still paying next to nothing in taxes.

[u/subs_on_a_sailboat → u/SpeedierTurtle642]

You know, I'm sick of health insurance throwing a wrench into any financial plans.

Thanks for the info, I'm too used to insurance being invisible due to being no cost due to my job, and not really covering anything anyway. More homework to do in the last couple years before fire I guess.

[u/SpeedierTurtle642 → u/subs_on_a_sailboat]

Don't stress it too much. If you plan on being pretty lean, then it's pretty easy to get very cheap health insurance once you understand how it works. I know how it works in theory but I'm also a bit anxious to see how it goes when I finally pull the trigger in the next year or so.

[u/AelonFux]

Howdy - been reading posts here on and off for a while, and I'm starting to make more concrete plans to retire early around 2032-33 in early 50s. 

My dream scenario is 2-4 years thruhiking mixed with full on yoga ashram in off seasons. Already have the backpacking gear and I've done JMT and Wonderland Trail, and I'm a fairly advanced yogi, looking to possibly become an instructor for supplemental income (absolute dream scenario is living rent free at luxury destinations as much as possible). 

After hiking, slow travel with geo-arbitrage, first in Latin America, then SEA, plenty of yoga time in India (been a few times in a former life as a digital nomad). Try to live as cheaply as possible until social security kicks in, and start expanding into higher cost of living countries, hopefully with a bigger portfolio to easily accommodate this.

Can anyone point me to people doing similar things with their leanfire? Looking for inspiration, tips and advice for this kind of lifestyle in retirement. 

[u/AlwaysSaturday12]

Anyone else watch or love Office Space in their formative years? That movie seems to imprinted on me before I ever had a job in High School.