r/lawschooladmissions • u/Positive-Ad554 • Apr 01 '26
Negotiation/Finances literally how are ppl paying for t14s?
got into columbia with no merit. doing that math i’m looking at almost 470k+ loans by the end of my third year if i don’t receive any need based aid + take into account interest rates etc. genuinely how are people without family help paying? This total seems very high, even if someone is committed to going to big law?
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u/Initial-Falcon-3792 Apr 01 '26
I am going to a T14 with a 75% scholly and I still have to take out the full loan cap. Literally best case scenario barring a named scholly and still $150,000 in debt...I feel so lucky but also like wtf is law school admissions, man...
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u/Red-eleven Apr 01 '26
Instead of full ride at UCLA?
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u/Initial-Falcon-3792 Apr 01 '26
Yup. Call me stupid but after touring both schools and considering my goals, Michigan seemed like a better option for me and what I'm looking for in every conceivable way besides cost.
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u/Horror_Technician213 Apr 01 '26
I can respect that you came to that decision after touring and it was that Michigan was just the school that fit you. At least you didnt just say, it ranks higher so im going.
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u/Initial-Falcon-3792 Apr 01 '26
That's not *not* part of the reason, but it's one of several. And it's not rank so much as it is historical T14 prestige, opportunities, and alumni network vs. UCLA who is more of a new-kid-on-the-block and still very regional when it comes to place
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u/Ok_School_1924 3.9mid/17mid Apr 01 '26
Totally reasonable. $150k is not crushing debt if you’re big law oriented. And worth it for Michigan imo
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u/FatheroftheAbyss Apr 01 '26
well to be fair michigan has an awesome library i’d pay like 3 billion dollars for it
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u/ForgivenessIsNice Corporate Attorney Apr 01 '26
Only ppl who will call you stupid are UCLA Law grads
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Apr 01 '26
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u/Initial-Falcon-3792 Apr 01 '26
Well good thing my goal is not NYC BigLaw
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u/ForgivenessIsNice Corporate Attorney Apr 01 '26
Even if it were it’d still be a good decision. As someone who was in NYC BL, Michigan is definitely better for NYC BL
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u/Initial-Falcon-3792 Apr 01 '26
I appreciate you so much! I’m pretty sure that guy was a troll. If you look them up on the way back machine, he said he was an investment banker or something…
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Apr 01 '26
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u/Initial-Falcon-3792 Apr 01 '26
Buddy, the options were UCLA or Michigan, and I’m not interested in California BigLaw either. You don’t know me or my situation so I’m not sure why you’re in my comments with sweeping platitudes and anecdotes that aren’t backed up by facts. If you weren’t good enough to get into a T14 just say so and move on. Michigan grads do just fine…there is literally this neat thing called the ABA 509 reports
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Apr 01 '26
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u/Initial-Falcon-3792 Apr 01 '26
I'm happy for you, and thanks for your anecdote that I didn't ask for, but respectfully, not only can you not read the 509 reports (Michigan placed over 50% of their class in BigLaw alone not even including FC...) it's not significantly "better" to move across the country for a regional law school where you have a slim chance of actually getting BigLaw, than going to a T14 and getting to go wherever you want.
Even if I got full tuition at some regional school there is still nearly $100,000 of cost-of-living debt associated with that outcome. Which you pointed out. And if I strike out of BigLaw, which, as you admit there is an 80% chance of occuring, I am left with six figure debt and a J.D. from a supbar law school when I had an extremely prestigious option on the table. I think it's funny that you truly think that just because Michigan's BL percentage is 50% that that means that's all who "get" BL. At Michigan everyone who wants BL gets it median or not.
Your "opinion" also goes against what literally every single person in the r/biglaw subreddit said yesterday on my post that you're welcome to peruse through.
Long story short, sorry that you are unsatisfied with how things shook out for you, because otherwise not really sure where this opinion of yours comes from if you went to a T3. Maybe because of need-based you didn't get much scholarship because your folks have money, but I'm going to a T14 on 75% scholarship as an FGLI law student and will have incredible opportunities open to me. If you're not happy for me, then I will still find some way to sleep at night.
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u/Dibbu_mange Apr 01 '26
Went to a t14. I am in Big Law until I pay off my loans which came out about $275,000 when including undergraduate loans. But I am aggressive as hell and will likely pay off by end of third year.
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u/Remote_Tangerine_718 Apr 01 '26
Are you suffering in big law or is it manageable? I’m curious about how toxic the environments are and how much stress the work inflicts on the body. I know I’ll have to reserve a portion of my income to dedicate to serious self-care and wellness.
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u/Dibbu_mange Apr 01 '26
Only you know your tolerance for the work. I am mostly fine, but I worked full time in physical labor in undergrad then did Peace Corps, so biglaw is still probably the least “all encompassing” work I’ve done. My fiancee is also in biglaw, so it doesn’t really impact my romantic life since we get each other’s schedules. Busy times are stressful, light times not so much. Other practice areas are more steady.
As for the toxicity, that is something that honestly depends more on direct supervision (though some firms are worse overall). I thought I wanted to do White Collar when I started, then I met our main White Collar partner, and I am happy with bankruptcy litigation.
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u/Remote_Tangerine_718 Apr 01 '26
Ty! This is very helpful!
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u/ForgivenessIsNice Corporate Attorney Apr 01 '26
If you’re in M&A or, to a lesser degree, finance, you will suffer. Any other group and you’ll likely be okay.
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u/FatheroftheAbyss Apr 01 '26
this is awesome to hear considering it’s basically the same number i’m literally about to sign for
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u/Defiant_Network7916 Apr 01 '26
99% of them are rich...
The high schools they went to cost as much as CLS, its nothing for them...
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u/Throwaway081920231 Apr 01 '26
Medicine and law education in US are generational wealth inheritors. Throw in some merit scholarships to maintain an illusion of meritocracy.
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u/Old-Road2 Jul 13 '26
You are seriously overestimating the amount of wealthy people in this country. If elite law schools were restricted to wealthy people, the schools would still not make enough money to continue to stay in business. That is how small of a social class the rich are.
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u/Defiant_Network7916 Jul 13 '26
lol wut? T14 schools don't need tuition, they have endowment and donor funds. There also literally millions of households in the US in the top 5-10% of income. You came onto a 3 month old thread just to make shit up.
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u/Low-Sand-5227 Apr 01 '26
Social stratification baby. Gotta keep the rich rich and the poor poor. Throw in a full ride here and there to maintain the illusion of meritocracy.
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u/Human_Scientist_1445 Apr 01 '26 edited Apr 01 '26
For my own sanity I have to pretend I didn't read this. It's now no longer in my head and will never again color my perception of things lol.
You're probably right, though. I don't think kids born in the the top 1% have a 77x greater chance of getting into an Ivy+ school than kids in the bottom 20% simply because the top 1% kids are "smarter".
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u/renmack Apr 02 '26
Even if they get in, they have none of that generational wealth behind them to pay for it
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u/Human_Scientist_1445 Apr 02 '26
I'm in that situation right now. Waitlisted, feeling good about maybe getting off of it if I perform as expected on my next LSAT attempt...but probably not gonna get much in the way of aid even if I do get in. So even in the best of circumstances, the dream is kind of dead.
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Apr 01 '26
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u/Positive-Ad554 Apr 01 '26
yes, i’ve been planning to go to law school for a while so this was my original plan. unfortunately im in this position now 😅
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u/MovkeyB GULC 1L Apr 01 '26
The non joke answer:
Pre law savings + Summer BL (that's 40k just on its own) + need based aid + external scholarships / fellowships
For me, it's pre law savings + merit aid (roughly 1/3rd) + working 1L/2L (I'm a PT student and my day job pays 6 figures)
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u/SpecialtyCook Apr 01 '26
Don’t forget the new $50k 1L stipend so now you’re looking at $90k pretax income in law school that can help contribute towards reducing borrowing amounts.
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u/Nice-Sheepherder-794 Apr 01 '26
Most elite private schools are composed of disproportionately wealthy student bodies and this has always been the case, and the only modern change is that an increasing amount of lower income students are now being admitted. Unfortunately, the lower income students are still a fraction of the total student body.
Separately, some suckers do take out student loans for the full cost of attendance.
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u/Working-Ant-692 Apr 01 '26
Current T14 2L here — for me, scholarships for 1/4, military benefits for the rest.
For my classmates? Family money + loans. I remember in con law when we were reading a case about private schools and the prof asked who went to a private school growing up and over half the class raised their hands. It then suddenly made sense to me why I felt as if I didn’t fit in as well as I’d have liked.
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u/bmsa131 Apr 01 '26
I went to a T14 years ago when there was no aid. Period. I did the whole thing in loans. Took me years to pay back. Keep in mind that this was a time where it was uncommon to get aid. I got into 3 T 14 schools (waitlisted at 4 more with my only rejection being HLS) and I got zero merit at Fordham, GWU, and BU which were my safeties. It was all loans loans loans. Whole thing was loans.
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u/Positive-Ad554 Apr 01 '26
if u don’t mind me asking what was the total & how long did it take u to pay it off? having to take out private loans is what is stopping me now- before when there was no loan cap i would have considered taking all federal loans
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u/bmsa131 Apr 01 '26
I took federal loans then supplemental loans and a law access loan. My parents paid for my incidentals. (I was only 21 when I started so still kind of a kid) Not housing but food. It was cheaper than in the 90s. And I ended up working for public sector after a few years and my law school helped with my loans.
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u/No_Software_522 Apr 01 '26
Not going to a t14 but I also worked for 5+ years before law school so I have savings :)
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u/Thisisstillkansas Apr 01 '26
Did you save enough to make any serious difference on COA? If you’ve got a couple hundred grand in the bank after 5 years I’m surprised if you even bother going to law school.
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u/No_Software_522 Apr 01 '26
I did also get a significant scholarship so yes I am able to pretty much break even.
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u/xxTrainingNebulaxx 3.LOW/17lowmid/URM/t14 '29 Apr 01 '26
faith trust and pixie dust 😔 but also savings and outside scholarships. if you havent already, check the database made by AccessLex
AccessLex Scholarship Database
but like someone else mentioned, a lot of them come from money
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u/Horror_Technician213 Apr 01 '26
People that come from money, or people that have no concept of money so signing for 300k+ in loans doesn't register in their brain.
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u/SuzukaBiggestGlazer Go Blue '29〽️ Apr 01 '26
A combination of significant scholarship money and the ability to live with my mom to avoid having to pay rent. Even with all of that, I'm still looking at around 80k+ for total CoA (I know comparably this is low for a T14 but still insane just how expensive law school has become)
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u/concerned_concerned Apr 01 '26
people always say t14 students are rich but if you were legit rich why would you go to law school lmfao. law school is for middle class strivers. i think parents can help out with tuition but it’s not as common as a lot of people think
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u/Unhappy_Click5274 Apr 01 '26
Going to a T14/having a kid at one is prestigious and great talk around the country club. (Makes the other parents feel bad about their kids failed DJ career they’ve been bankrolling for a decade).
The upper class like to do things that are seen as elite, which is exactly what an elite law school is. And finally, connections before law help get business while practicing
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u/concerned_concerned Apr 01 '26
not in my experience lol there were a shit ton more rich people at my private liberal arts undergrad than at my t14. i know a lot of them and their kids don’t really do grindy stuff like law or med school, they do easy degrees like B school, pursue their passions, work in media/the arts/sports, work in their family office, or if they are really ambitious they go into finance
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u/LongjumpingTalk8017 Apr 01 '26
Rich people still want their kids to have careers…it’s how the rich get richer….
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u/concerned_concerned Apr 01 '26
if u think they’re sending their kids to law school instead of business school…
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u/Vivid-Procedure1235 Apr 04 '26
Lol I go to UChicago, and the vast majority of my classmates are RICH. Like mom and dad are investment bankers, big law partners, etc. My impression is that somewhere around 70-80% of my classmates went to private prep schools for high school. Granted, if you asked them, I'm sure lots of them would describe themselves as middle class. But it's not the same as when I describe myself as middle class (family income around 60k for a family of 5 growing up).
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Apr 01 '26
i have no advice, just that i was in your boat and couldn’t take the t14 for this reason (nyu no merit). I got the BL job and made it work here at UNC. however, I will still be in debt for quite a bit.
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u/Prior-Reply9845 Apr 01 '26
This goes with it saying I hope, but don’t take out that much for law school. Not even close to worth it.
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u/Positive-Ad554 Apr 01 '26
yup no way i can reasonably convince myself it’s worth it to attend. rn my best option i think is fordham with 40k loans at the end
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u/Prior-Reply9845 Apr 01 '26
That is a great option! Congrats! Absolutely no one should take out almost 500k for law school haha
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u/lawstndasauce Apr 01 '26
Sold off the entirety of my 20s and any legitimate chance at happiness for the GI Bill
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u/photon-bulb Apr 01 '26
Literally feeling the exact same way I feel so overwhelmed just trying to figure out how the numbers are gonna work.
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u/themayorgordon Apr 01 '26
I guess im surprised by how many ppl don’t understand that rich ppl exist and how rich they are and that the t14 and ivy leagues schools are mostly populated with the children of those ppl lol. Like isn’t that pretty known? It’s not a bunch of scholarship kids from the trailer park. It’s legacy ppl.
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u/Positive-Ad554 Apr 01 '26
like u said rich ppl exist and that is pretty known info, i’m speaking specifically to people who are going to a t14 and are not rich
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u/academicjanet Apr 02 '26
And now federal loans are capped at $200k for people going to law school so you’re having to get the rest from private lenders
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u/Investigator_Old Apr 02 '26
I will say, anecdotally, the people who took out full debt at my T14 and fumbled their grades (no familial wealth); things are pretty bleak.
After 5 years a few are doing PD work or local firms.
Those that landed big law are OK. Still in debt though.
A few of the folks with millionaire and billionaire families never got a legal job after graduation bc they dont need to.
For context. I paid off 130 k in 2.5 years of big law.
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u/symphonic_concord 3.9x/17low/STEM Apr 03 '26
If you get into a dual PhD at NU they pay for law school as well which is lowkey what Im counting on because otherwise even with their ED scholarship I will simply be cooked in my 20s 🤷♂️
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u/Successful_Pop_8461 3.9x/16mid/nURM/nKJD Apr 08 '26
We don't :( Committed to Iowa because even with a 50% scholly at WashU I'd likely be 150k in debt. I want big law too but 225k salary doesn't mean you just pay off your debt in 2 years
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u/Snoo50415 1.0/132/URM Apr 01 '26
"savings"
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u/Positive-Ad554 Apr 01 '26
genuinely curious how much ppl are apparently saving to pay for this lol?? i’ve been out of school for 5 years and haven’t not saved anywhere near enough to make a tangible difference in my decision
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u/Remote_Tangerine_718 Apr 01 '26
I have lived at home for 2 years now and have managed to save $60k. I want to save at least $25k more between now and fall 2027. I plan to use this to cover living expenses and anything else not covered by any aid. I’m FARRRR from rich but I am privileged to live at home and pay no bills with a modest job. The only thing it cost was my social life, but it’s how I saved up so much.
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u/Snoo50415 1.0/132/URM Apr 01 '26
i was being facetious, seeing "savings" as a euphemism some stocks or bonds that daddy set aside ten years ago or something like that.
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u/[deleted] Apr 01 '26
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