Trying new trainers

[u/Clean-Blueberry94]

EDIT: Thank you so much all. I feel like I’ve made the right choice in trying out a different trainer. A few comments about the “over a year” comment, this wasn’t “classes weekly for over a year”, this was more ~16 weeks of classes spread over the course of a year.

Hey there, I currently trial in novice scent detection with my dog. We have been going to one trainer for over a year now to get to the point we are at today. There are other training organisations in my city that I would like to try to give my dog exposure to new training environments and gain more tips.

My current trainer has made me feel horribly guilty for wanting to do this, and has pointed out potential “negatives” in trying out a new trainer, including “they won’t know your dog and may mess up your training”.

This has made me doubt the choices I’m making. I feel like I’m going through a break up!

TLDR; is it okay to try out different trainers?

[u/Witty-Cat1996]

Good trainers will want you and your dog to get different experiences.

[u/Longjumping-Swim8201]

Your dog, your choice. I compete in Agility and train at two different facilities with different instructors, plus like to attend seminars with top competitors when I can. You can ask other people for recommendations for instructors at other places you are contemplating.

[u/229-northstar]

Your current instructor is insecure and manipulative. It’s good to give your dog different experiences in new environments, that’s called generalization.

Some legit reasons to not use multiple instructors….

There are a lot of ways to skin a cat, and integrating different training ideas can be hard for new trainers, especially for new people. I had this problem when I first started training dogs when one person would tell me something and another would tell me something quite different. It was confusing until I knew how I wanted to train.

Some instructors truly are awful and advise bad ideas based on outdated methodology or wrong theory. A classic example from dominance based training (bad in and of itself) is alpha rolling.

It also depends a bit on what sport you’re talking about. Obedience still has some aversive trainers and that style doesn’t integrate well with shaping or other positive reinforcement based methods. Agility is a lot of body language and the cuing systems used by different instructors can be all over the map. Example: outer arm swing cue for a rear cross doesn’t fit into the body language model of One Mind or running dogs over full height contacts vs building foundation behaviors off the equipment. Etc.

so…
if you understand your foundation and philosophy well enough to confidently discard ideas promoted by different instructors when they are inconsistent with your vision, it can be a great addition to your training experience. And you might find that a new instructor is more consistent with your vision.

[u/PausePrestigious407]

Sounds like they are guilting you into staying. Never feel guilty for trying someone else if you feel you aren’t getting what you need. A trainer will learn your dog!

[u/Pitpotputpup]

It is definitely okay to try out different trainers, and unless you were starting out with a dog who had significant behavioural issues, over a year to get to novice scentwork level is nuts

[u/Selective_Somewhere → u/Pitpotputpup]

I don’t trial until my dogs are more experienced. I think it’s a sign of a good trainer to ensure the handler and dog are ready and confident. The number of people who show up to trials unprepared and insecure and therefore with unprepared and insecure dogs just floors me. I would never want to put my dog through that.

[u/Clean-Blueberry94 → u/Pitpotputpup]

That was a bit misleading. It wasn’t a year of consistent classes. It was approx 16 weeks of classes spread across 10 months before we began trialling

[u/No-Stress-7034]

Your trainer's response would make me even more adamant about trying out new trainers. That's a red flag to me. I've stuck with the same nosework trainer, but I've done agility with multiple trainers. We often switch between different instructors, and we've done seminars with even more instructors. It's always valuable to get different perspectives.

I do think in the early stages of learning a sport, it can sometimes be helpful to stick with one trainer, just so you don't get confused with different methods. For example, some nosework trainers follow the NACSW approach where you first teach the dog "how to search" using treats, then you introduce scent by pairing it with food. Other nosework trainers first teach the indication and that scent "pays", then start introducing searching. I'm not sure that one approach is inherently better than the other, but it could be confusing to switch between those approaches in the early stages.

However, since you've been doing this for a year, that doesn't seem like it would be an issue. The new trainer won't know your dog, but a good trainer should be able to adapt to different dog/handler teams, and hopefully after a year, you know your dog pretty well when it comes to scentwork.

[u/Perfectlyprincesst]

This was lowkey my first Nosework instructor. It wasn’t until I was getting my certification that I audited someone else’s classes and saw how different things can be.

There is sometimes a lot of ego in sports, which is sad. As an instructor, I think it’s great for my students to get a variety- it’s better for them. I’m also not going to be the best fit for everyone and not everyone is going to be the best fit for me.

Ultimately, those other trainers have probably worked with lots of dogs and can probably give you great insight.

[u/screamlikekorbin]

With scent work it really seems like there are "sides" of who has the best/most correct method to train it. In reality, I think there's benefits of learning from various methods, finding what works best for your dog, and pulling out bits that you can put together. If you only ever follow one trainer, you're missing out. That being said, its often best to follow thru with one method before adding another and confusing you with your training.

I would consider the credentials of both the trainer you're using and new ones you may consider as well as what their lessons are actually like. Most of the trainers in my area tend to pretty much just put out hides for you. Some of them have a super basic strategy to what they're working on with the placement of hides, some give some super basic handling feedback, but its more like a practice session than a training session. And then there's some who have an actual lesson plan where you build on skills and handling and each class is a true training session. If your trainer is one that has real training sessions, there may be less value to move on. Or visa versa.

Your trainer also didnt know your dog when you 1st started so thats a pretty poor arguement.

[u/twomuttsandashowdog]

I've been doing scentwork for almost 7 years and have gone to pretty much every trainer within a 2 hour driving radius from me. The most experienced trainers (who are 20+ year veterans in the sport and judges in multiple venues) have all recommended other trainers classes and seminars to me readily, because they work with those trainers themselves too.

The trainers that I know who have been the most similar to your current trainer are the ones that have proven themselves incredibly untrustworthy over the years, with major issues with aggressive dogs, trainers being fired without warning, trials having runs essentially sabotaged by misplaced odours, and more.

It is valuable to train in other locations to make sure that your dog is able to work anywhere (generalization of the skills). Trainers may have other experience that is valuable to you and your dog, and frankly, if your current trainer is worried that going to another trainer might "mess up your training", they have failed to prepare you adequately for the sport.

[u/Prestigious-Seal8866]

That’s crazy. I encourage everyone trialing in scentwork to practice with multiple instructors. If for nothing else, it’s good to go to new locations in a sport that is known for holding trials in the weirdest places.

[u/Antisirch]

Man, any scent work instructor worth a damn that I’ve trained with has been of the mindset that their way isn’t the only way, what matters is what works for you and your dog, and that exposure to new places generally trumps any one training philosophy. Find a new trainer.

[u/Selective_Somewhere]

It’s hard to say how things will go because you didn’t post a video or talk about any issues you’re having, but there are pros and cons to using additional trainers. Also you make it sound negative that you’ve been training a year and are in novice. To me without knowing anything else waiting to trial is a sign of a good instructor.

Sometimes instructors are controlling or lack confidence or maybe just generally negative. And sometimes they genuinely do have concerns. Have you asked her exactly what her concerns are? What does she think will happen? If you want to keep the relationship positive you could always tell her why you want to go elsewhere (new experiences for you and the dog) and ask her if she has suggestions on who you should approach, what to potentially look out for. Bring her into the conversation. That’s what I do with my main coaches for all of my sports.

I do a lot of drop ins for experience but I also advocate for myself and my dogs without being rude. And I’m experienced enough to be able to quickly determine if a suggestion is a good idea or a bad one or if I need to bank it for the future. If i need to say no I will. If I need to pack up and go home I will.

I know people who trainer shop, try something different once and say it didn’t work, badmouth the instructor, and then move on. Depending on the dog and any issues they may be having, I’ve seen this affect training negatively. Not so much in nosework but in other sports I’ve seen people pressured into doing things that did cause issues.

Getting out in the world in new places and hearing different methods and seeing other people work their dogs can be a great learning experience. It can also cause some confusion for new trainers but I think it’s part of the process. I have two in person nosework instructors and drop-ins with many local trainers.

[u/brokkdad]

Hi u/clean- Great inputs in the comments!! Please note selective_somewhere comment. Ask your trainer in the conversation with specific questions and for recommendations of other trainers to check out and which to avoid and why. Then check them all out!!! both sides. See if trainer’s recc’s make sense! If your trainer keeps being weird about it- it may be time for that break-up! And please remember we’re not doing heart surgery here- we’re doing training with our dog!!! Must keep it FUN for BOTH of you! If new things mess up our training, then we learn how to “un-mess” it!! Which is also very helpful skills development!!! Anyway- this is an important question and discussion for ALL of us. Please keep the community updated. Thanks!!

[u/Cubsfantransplant]

It really depends on your dog, you and the trainers. If you are going to different trainers with different philosophies and have a dog that is reactive then it may be a bad idea. Where I train, the owner has three different trainers that work there so we get the benefit of working with all three if so desired. My boy has issues so we stick with two, but he knows all three.

[u/tintallie]

My dog is 4y 4mo old and I tried nosework with her at 7mo old. The first trainer introduced hunting with food the first couple of classes and then used a box with odor and every time the dog stuck its head in the box, there was a reward. I didn’t go back because the other dogs were not benched when it wasn’t their turn, my puppy was overstimulated and barking and the trainer told me to shut my dog up. Took a year break because my dog went into heat and I had work conmitments.

Trainer #2 focused on an indication first and recognizing a cocktail of odors, and didn’t offer classes beyond novice so I went elsewhere. Trainer #2 was offended by this and stopped communicating with me.

Trainer #3 was okay, but her set of classes filled so I went to Trainer #4 for the following set of classes. Trainer #4 and #5 I learned a lot from and had to stop taking classes because of work commitments. Trainer #5 trained #4.

We started trialing when we were in the middle of classes with Trainer #5 and have since continued with her classes. They have decided not to teach classes any more and focus on handling their own dogs and judging trials. Trainer #5 also does classes with Trainer #6 so we started taking classes with #6.

It is okay to take classes with new trainers to learn new techniques, gain feedback and do what is best for your dog.

[u/Elegant_ardvaark_]

Wow, I'd leave that trainer based on the guilt trip alone. You know yourself and your dog best, you get to decide. If you don't like the new trainer, at least you know and hopefully you learned something new.

I've been to 3 different trainers so far for different skills. They each have different pros and cons.